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Xandu posted:http://foreignpolicy.com/2015/06/05/sick-beats-and-sykes-picot-a-wa-band-yemen-israel-middle-east-music/ It's not representative. Mizrahim are way, way more anti-Arab than Ashkenazim. My old boss used to play Egyptian pop music. Every other word was "habibi."
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Jun 9, 2015 01:14
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A quick google search tells me habibi means sweetheart or close friend. Forgive my ignorance but what part of that is bad.
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Jun 9, 2015 04:55
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I think he is using his boss as an example of Ashkenazi who doesn't hate Arabs?
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Jun 9, 2015 05:10
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Ultramega posted:A quick google search tells me habibi means sweetheart or close friend. Forgive my ignorance but what part of that is bad. Beloved. Very famous example of what he means: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLJA-srM_yM
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Jun 9, 2015 10:36
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Disinterested posted:Beloved. Actually, 'my beloved (masculine).'' The -i suffix is first-person singular possessive. Feminine is 'habibati.'
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Jun 9, 2015 11:24
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So Israeli politics got fun today. Last night a TV report aired with accusations that Oren Hazan, a Likudnik who just got into the Knesset under the wire and somehow managed a deputy Knesset speaker's chair has a history, from his time running a Bulgarian casino, of big pimpin' and medium snortin'. quote:The report also quoted two Israeli tourists and a casino employee who confirmed that Hazan would pimp prostitutes for his guests. I mean, really, how could you ever think something like that of this guy? It's just a coincidence he also ran a strip club. In Bulgaria. On a beach resort. Full of Israeli tourists. Totally not a gangster. Nopes.  He was promptly taken off rotation for chairing the Knesset, to which he then did what anyone ethically would do, which was to threaten to expose dirt on the guy who took him off rotation. quote:Following Edelstein’s announcement, Hazan phoned the speaker and threatened to find information about him and expose it publicly, an aide to Edelstein told Agence France-Presse. What makes this really interesting? Well, remember the margin of error Bibi's government has? That's right. One vote. Which, by law, Oren Hazan still has. This could literally bring down the coalition. Well, it would if it wasn't for Herzog falling all over himself being decent and giving Likud cover needed to get rid of their gangsta rappers. quote:“This afternoon Knesset Speaker Yuli Edelstein approached me,” Herzog wrote on Facebook. “He, as I and many others, felt great embarrassment over the reports. He made it clear that he intended to suspend Knesset member Hazan from his official roles in the Knesset [as deputy Knesset speaker] and asked me personally in his role of being responsible for the respect for the Knesset of Israel to allow a sort of short ethical safety net, in order to fully carry out the clarification in the matter without enabling the claim of threats that could influence the process. Thus is politics in today's Israel. Lum_ fucked around with this message at 01:43 on Jun 10, 2015 |
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Jun 10, 2015 01:39
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It's funny how when confronted with a career ending expose' he essentially goes "expose me and i'll expose you".
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Jun 10, 2015 03:00
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Miltank posted:I think he is using his boss as an example of Ashkenazi who doesn't hate Arabs? No, my boss was Egyptian. Ultramega posted:A quick google search tells me habibi means sweetheart or close friend. Forgive my ignorance but what part of that is bad. It's just cheesy.
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Jun 10, 2015 03:03
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From the 2016 Primaries thread:Joementum posted:Bernie gets asked about his dual citizenship with Israel, which he denies having. Time for Bernie Birthers! Bernthers.
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Jun 10, 2015 19:39
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Even if he did so what? Wasn't Ted Cruz not born in the contiguous united states and he's running for office as well?
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Jun 11, 2015 03:54
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Ultramega posted:Even if he did so what? Wasn't Ted Cruz not born in the contiguous united states and he's running for office as well? Apparently Cruz renounced his Canadian citizenship in 2014, which he had only discovered a year earlier, half-way into his first year in office.
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Jun 11, 2015 04:49
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Absurd Alhazred posted:From the 2016 Primaries thread: It's a weird story because the only place alleging that he has dual citizenship is an anti-Semitic Facebook page, beyond the question being completely inappropriate to begin with.
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Jun 11, 2015 05:16
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Kim Jong Il posted:It's a weird story because the only place alleging that he has dual citizenship is an anti-Semitic Facebook page, beyond the question being completely inappropriate to begin with. It bothers me because I've been dreading for some time that the tide would turn from "REAL Americans stand with Israel" to "hey, are these Jews real Americans or are they just Israeli agents?", and here it is. I hope it's nothing more than a fluke. ETA: Especially with this going on. Absurd Alhazred fucked around with this message at 05:21 on Jun 11, 2015 |
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Jun 11, 2015 05:19
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Kim Jong Il posted:It's a weird story because the only place alleging that he has dual citizenship is an anti-Semitic Facebook page, beyond the question being completely inappropriate to begin with. Is this some right-of-return thing? It'd be nice if that got some airtime.
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Jun 11, 2015 07:00
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Harik posted:Is this some right-of-return thing? It'd be nice if that got some airtime.  It's a barely-veiled-accusation-of-dual-loyalty thing. Especially weird because Diane Rehm is usually a competent interviewer and pulling some crazy poo poo off of a Facebook page is just a bizarre way to come up with questions to ask a presidential candidate.
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Jun 11, 2015 09:43
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It's a call in show, she also takes questions from Facebook, Twitter and email
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Jun 11, 2015 12:14
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Absurd Alhazred posted:It bothers me because I've been dreading for some time that the tide would turn from "REAL Americans stand with Israel" to "hey, are these Jews real Americans or are they just Israeli agents?", and here it is. I hope it's nothing more than a fluke. Eh not really, there have been idiots saying things like that forever. They are ignored here, and jailed in Canada and Europe because those countries don't have real civil liberties  It's a horrible gaffe for a NPR host to make though, and the ADL will probably make her do major repentance at minimum.
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Jun 11, 2015 13:14
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"Today on the Diane Rehm show, does jet fuel burn hot enough to melt steel beams? I ask our panelists, Alex Jones, David Duke and Paul Craig Roberts!"
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Jun 11, 2015 15:19
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Absurd Alhazred posted:It bothers me because I've been dreading for some time that the tide would turn from "REAL Americans stand with Israel" to "hey, are these Jews real Americans or are they just Israeli agents?", and here it is. I hope it's nothing more than a fluke. I mean, I think after an Israeli American literally stole secrets from the government and gave them to Israel and nothing happened (other than his jailing) I don't think you have to worry about that.
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Jun 11, 2015 15:23
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Absurd Alhazred posted:It bothers me because I've been dreading for some time that the tide would turn from "REAL Americans stand with Israel" to "hey, are these Jews real Americans or are they just Israeli agents?", and here it is. I hope it's nothing more than a fluke. While I do agree that this would be horrible, I don't think it's the worst thing to question wether a presidential candidate considers themself an israeli as well, seeing as we're reaching a point where Iran is cooling down (and they're on their way to being our ally) while Israel is becoming more radical, burning more international ties, and trying to sabotage american alliances. Keep in mind that I'm phoneposting and haven't watched the NPR segment, so for all I know the question was like far more bigoted than I'm thinking.
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Jun 11, 2015 15:26
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Neurolimal posted:Keep in mind that I'm phoneposting and haven't watched the NPR segment, so for all I know the question was like far more bigoted than I'm thinking. It was pretty bigoted and Sanders justifiably lost his poo poo. It wasn't even phrased as a question, but a statement of fact. quote:Diane Rehm: Senator, you have dual citizenship with Israel.
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Jun 11, 2015 15:29
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It's just ridiculous that she would read something inflammatory off a Facebook comment and never do the slightest bit of research.
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Jun 11, 2015 15:29
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Even if he did have dual citizenship I don't get why you'd bother asking him about it. I have Polish, Canadian, and American citizenships. There's really not that much of a story behind any of them, other than I guess you can ask me about trips I've taken to Poland/Canada/the USA  .
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Jun 11, 2015 16:14
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I think it is a fair concern when choosing a chief executive.
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Jun 11, 2015 16:17
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Miltank posted:I think it is a fair concern when choosing a chief executive. If she had a substantial reason to think that he had another citizenship he was hiding, sure. Working off of a list in a fw:fw:fw: chainletter questioning the loyalty of every Jew who dares be in a prominent government position? Absolutely not. Might as well have asked Obama about his Muslim faith that he's been hiding.
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Jun 11, 2015 16:22
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computer parts posted:I mean, I think after an Israeli American literally stole secrets from the government and gave them to Israel and nothing happened (other than his jailing) I don't think you have to worry about that. Neurolimal posted:Iran is cooling down (and they're on their way to being our ally)  No. Seriously, who told you that? Iran sees themselves as being in direct competition with the US and Saudi Arabia for regional hegemony. They are right now fighting a proxy war with Saudi Arabia (supported by America) in Yemen, are propping up the Assad regime in Syria, and spent the latter half of our involvement in Iraq undermining our efforts there in order to increase their influence in the new Iraqi government. Both Iran and Saudi Arabia see it as a zero sum game, which in Iran's case means that they think anything which compromises American and Saudi influence is inherently beneficial to them.
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Jun 11, 2015 16:23
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Imagine if it was Daniel Inouye running for President, and someone asked about whether he had mixed loyalties. Or hell, people wondered if a Catholic would be beholden to the Pope above American interests back when JFK was elected. It was bigoted then, and is bigoted now, and will remain bigoted no matter how grotesque the Israeli government becomes.
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Jun 11, 2015 16:30
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Absurd Alhazred posted:If she had a substantial reason to think that he had another citizenship he was hiding, sure. Working off of a list in a fw:fw:fw: chainletter questioning the loyalty of every Jew who dares be in a prominent government position? Absolutely not. Might as well have asked Obama about his Muslim faith that he's been hiding. I think Milktank's post was in response to me saying "even if he did have Israeli citizenship, what of it?", not that "secret Israeli citizenship is a fair concern when choosing a Jewish chief executive". And I guess I have a bit of a bias here, but I still say I don't see the issue of a president/head of state/whatever having multiple citizenships. I guess you might be worried citizenship will bias the person in favor of the nations they have additional citizenships with but from personal experience I can say I'm not all that crazy about Poland despite having citizenship.
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Jun 11, 2015 16:32
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DrProsek posted:And I guess I have a bit of a bias here, but I still say I don't see the issue of a president/head of state/whatever having multiple citizenships. I guess you might be worried citizenship will bias the person in favor of the nations they have additional citizenships with but from personal experience I can say I'm not all that crazy about Poland despite having citizenship.
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Jun 11, 2015 16:52
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Absurd Alhazred posted:It bothers me because I've been dreading for some time that the tide would turn from "REAL Americans stand with Israel" to "hey, are these Jews real Americans or are they just Israeli agents?", and here it is. I hope it's nothing more than a fluke. I don't think it's an Israel thing specifically, though, nor is it something that's going to spread to the population at large - JFK faced similar concerns about split loyalties due to his Catholicism, and I'm sure we all remember the accusations President Obama faced during the campaign. It's am easy, low-effort attack against a candidate that's guaranteed to take hold among conspiracy theorists who were already inclined to believe that prominent US figures are actually ethnic sleeper agents for some foreign country, as well as racists looking for any excuse to reject a left-leaning candidate for not being a pure TRUE AMERICAN.
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Jun 11, 2015 17:08
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Dead Reckoning posted:What exactly were you expecting to happen? We haven't sanctioned China despite their many provable acts of espionage, industrial and otherwise. Israel is substantially less important to the US than China, and we do criticize China all the time about acts of espionage (including the most recent event where they stole people's identification).
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Jun 11, 2015 17:20
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Welcome to the Diane Rehm show.
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Jun 11, 2015 17:27
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Main Paineframe posted:I don't think it's an Israel thing specifically, though, nor is it something that's going to spread to the population at large - JFK faced similar concerns about split loyalties due to his Catholicism, and I'm sure we all remember the accusations President Obama faced during the campaign. It's am easy, low-effort attack against a candidate that's guaranteed to take hold among conspiracy theorists who were already inclined to believe that prominent US figures are actually ethnic sleeper agents for some foreign country, as well as racists looking for any excuse to reject a left-leaning candidate for not being a pure TRUE AMERICAN. Well, it's one thing to have conspiracy theorists talk about these things; it's another thing for a nationally-recognized media figure to blithely run with it in an interview.
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Jun 11, 2015 17:35
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Dead Reckoning posted:Even if we take you at your word that you consider citizenship a mere flag of convenience, (which raises troubling questions itself,) let's say that during President Prosek's term, Russia starts getting handsy with Poland. Do you think it would be reasonable for people to question whether the fact that you were a Polish citizen was influencing your decision making? Do you think it likely that Poland would try to use your citizenship as leverage to influence you? If someone was born in a country, lived there their entire lives, and spent enough time working in the government to develop the background and experience you need to run for head of state, then no, I don't think it's reasonable to assume they are influenced by the fact their parents are from another country. What do you think having citizenship with another country entails exactly?
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Jun 11, 2015 22:05
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Absurd Alhazred posted:Well, it's one thing to have conspiracy theorists talk about these things; it's another thing for a nationally-recognized media figure to blithely run with it in an interview. As for the Kennedy issue, it was sufficiently prevalent that he had to make a relatively famous speech about it: http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=16920600 And the secret religion of Barack the Islamic Shock was certainly something given far more countenance in "serious" media outlets than it should have been. Which is just to say that this is dumb, and those two examples were also dumb, but hopefully the Sanders thing doesn't have the political half-life the other two did.
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Jun 11, 2015 22:19
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DrProsek posted:If someone was born in a country, lived there their entire lives, and spent enough time working in the government to develop the background and experience you need to run for head of state, then no, I don't think it's reasonable to assume they are influenced by the fact their parents are from another country. What do you think having citizenship with another country entails exactly?
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Jun 11, 2015 22:44
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Remember when the IDF bombed those kids on the beach last year in full view of a hotel full of journalists? Turns out it was just an honest mistake, complete with details that directly contradict what everyone who was there clearly saw happen. Good stuff.
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Jun 12, 2015 00:08
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The best is when you see it re-aim and finish the kids off. Like yes, that was called out, someone approved it, re-aimed, gave the order, etc. "by accident."
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Jun 12, 2015 02:24
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It's not really aimed at people who have the capability to question Israeli info. Its just there so appeal-to-authority types can paste it into discussions as a counter point and keep the discussion flaming away. Its a lot easier than trying to argue that kids shouldn't be playing football in a warzone on a random beach we declared a warzone. ...If only they taught basic source analysis in schools. E: Would be interested to know how that incident and the (I'm assuming) still festering ruin of districts like Shujaiyeh is covered in Israel from any Israeligoons? Also just saw this, sorry if its been posted already: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jun/10/gaza-salafists-problem-hamas-islamic-state-isis Could just be alarmism but it follows a despressingly familiar trajectory and stuff like this : "They are personally serious,” said the Gaza analyst Omar Shaban. “They are serious in how they see themselves. But are they a serious phenomenon in Gaza? I don’t believe so. Salafist groups in Iraq and Syria are serious because they are strong and face a weak enemy. Here in Gaza it is the reverse. They are weak and face a very strong enemy.’" For how long are they going to be facing a strong enemy? Last I heard Gaza was mostly a ruin, one or two more sessions of mowing the lawn and we'll have a mini-Iraq power vaccuum. Communist Thoughts fucked around with this message at 08:13 on Jun 12, 2015 |
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Jun 12, 2015 08:05
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Dead Reckoning posted:Wait, are you talking about citizenship, or eligibility for citizenship? Usually acquiring a second citizenship is a formal process that you apply for and often involves swearing some sort of oath affirming the rights and duties of a citizen. It makes you eligible to hold a passport from that country and vote in their elections, and in some places makes you obliged to perform military service. It's considered a fairly serious expression of preference, affiliation and fealty towards a country, which is why it's an adjudication criteria for national security positions in the United States. There are plenty of politicians who have been eligible for foreign citizenship through their parents, but very few who have actually held another country's passport or voted in their elections. I don't know about Israel, but in the U.S., Canada, and much of the Americas, you are technically a citizen just from being born there--no paperwork required. As an example, I was born in Canada to an American mother. I have had US and Canadian citizenships since the moment I was born. I now live in the U.S., and with some difficulty was able to get a security clearance because having citizenship by circumstance of birth is a mitigating factor (whereas being a naturalized Canadian would likely have disqualified me unless I renounced citizenship). I did have to let me Canadian passport lapse. My only documents establishing citizenship are my birth certificate and a U.S. State department form acknowledging birth of an American abroad. In any case, and Israeli-American who chose to become an Israeli citizen after birth would certainly receive some scrutiny for a security clearance, and I think it would be fair to question that were they to run for president of the U.S. But it's quite possible for people to have citizenship that they don't know about, since it rarely needs to be affirmed if it was established at birth, either through your parent's citizenship or jus soli. Tetraptous fucked around with this message at 13:13 on Jun 12, 2015 |
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Jun 12, 2015 13:09
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