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BI NOW GAY LATER posted:The establishment cares in so much as they want to win a national election some time. Don't try and act like the party wants meaningful results. Right they don't want meaningful results, which is why they are presenting and passing legislation to get meaningful results. Makes perfect sense.
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Jul 9, 2015 17:47
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Fried Chicken posted:His involvement is a plus for Bush. Every minute the camera is on him, every minute the media is talking his latest action, is a minute they are not focusing on and talking about someone who can actually beat Bush The polls since Trump entered the race seem to bear this out: 
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Jul 9, 2015 17:49
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Pinterest Mom posted:Donald! I knew this election was going to be great but I didn't expect it to get this good this fast
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Jul 9, 2015 17:49
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Slate Action posted:The polls since Trump entered the race seem to bear this out: This angers me and I desire Bush to collapse.
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Jul 9, 2015 17:49
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ToxicSlurpee posted:Their biggest issue is that they have absolutely no quality candidates. None. After watching the full CNN interview with Hillary, I feel much better about our chances this time. She visibly calculates almost every response, seems extremely stiff and uncomfortable with being challenged, and said several laughably untrue things. She's going to rattle hard on a debate stage.
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Jul 9, 2015 17:50
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Fried Chicken posted:Right they don't want meaningful results, which is why they are presenting and passing legislation to get meaningful results. Makes perfect sense. Let me know when comprehensive immigration reform is on their platform in a year.
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Jul 9, 2015 17:51
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Nonsense posted:This angers me and I desire Bush to collapse. Lol if you didn't know Bush was going to be the nominee since the start
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Jul 9, 2015 17:52
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TheDisreputableDog posted:After watching the full CNN interview with Hillary, I feel much better about our chances this time. She could literally execute a Fox News reporter live on air, and she'd still win in every cross-tab.
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Jul 9, 2015 17:52
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Fried Chicken posted:Lol if you didn't know Bush was going to be the nominee since november 5th, 2012
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Jul 9, 2015 17:53
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BI NOW GAY LATER posted:Let me know when comprehensive immigration reform is on their platform in a year. I love how you said something manifestly false and now rather than being an adult and saying "oops, I forgot about that" you are trying to pretend documented history didn't happen
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Jul 9, 2015 17:53
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BI NOW GAY LATER posted:The establishment cares in so much as they want to win a national election some time. Don't try and act like the party wants meaningful results. The establishment is firmly in the pocket of big business and they want cheap labor. More immigrants increases the labor supply. If the demand stays down then hey look we can suddenly pay less, horray! "More money for us, gently caress you" is still the perfect summation of what they want. Which goes at odds against their increasingly insane base that wants to build literal trenches full of more tires than have ever existed along the border because gently caress you.
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Jul 9, 2015 17:54
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TheDisreputableDog posted:After watching the full CNN interview with Hillary, I feel much better about our chances this time. Did you follow the 2008 primaries or watch the debates at all?
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Jul 9, 2015 17:55
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mintskoal posted:Did you follow the 2008 primaries or watch the debates at all? Oh where she got wiped because every message was a disconnected but carefully constructed poll triangulation rather than a believable narrative that exposed an underlying ideology? Yes.
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Jul 9, 2015 18:01
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TheDisreputableDog posted:After watching the full CNN interview with Hillary, I feel much better about our chances this time. I guess you see what you want to see. I see someone who's spent over 20 years being witch-hunted by the media because of her husband, remaining calm and collected in the face of someone who is trying to rattle her. Not once in 2008 did I see Hillary Clinton lose her composure on a debate stage, so if you're hoping for that, you're going to be sorely disappointed. Nonsense posted:She could literally execute a Fox News reporter live on air, and she'd still win in every cross-tab. Her numbers among liberals would skyrocket, that's for sure 
Fritz Coldcockin fucked around with this message at 18:08 on Jul 9, 2015 |
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Jul 9, 2015 18:06
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TheDisreputableDog posted:Oh where she got wiped because every message was a disconnected but carefully constructed poll triangulation rather than a believable narrative that exposed an underlying ideology? She lost an exceptionally close primary race to a once in a generation campaigner. Which, uh, *looks at Republican field* you ain't got. Fried Chicken posted:I love how you said something manifestly false and now rather than being an adult and saying "oops, I forgot about that" you are trying to pretend documented history didn't happen Was phone posting before, but: saying that Bush's immigration support represents the current Republican establishment is laughable (he was also something out an outlier even then.) My further contention was that if the establishment /really/ wanted it, it would have happened in 2013. It's not like Boehner couldn't have put up immigration w/o a Republican majority. Like it's pretty hard to say that the Republican Party supports immigration reform, when not a single one of their standard bearers will say so openly, or even continue to support previous positions. ToxicSlurpee posted:The establishment is firmly in the pocket of big business and they want cheap labor. More immigrants increases the labor supply. If the demand stays down then hey look we can suddenly pay less, horray! "More money for us, gently caress you" is still the perfect summation of what they want. I'll allow that the business wing of the party does support it, and that's obviously who's pushing this for Reince to do; but let's not at all pretend that the Republicans, given the presidency, would pass immigration reform, or that it will come up on their platform in a year. Alter Ego posted:Not once in 2008 did I see Hillary Clinton lose her composure on a debate stage, so if you're hoping for that, you're going to be sorely disappointed. She got a little fresh with Barack once or twice; but compared to McCain calling him "That One."
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Jul 9, 2015 18:11
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Nonsense posted:She could literally execute a Fox News reporter live on air, and she'd still win in every cross-tab. I'd vote for her over Bernie in the primary if she did this. I'd even settle for a CNN reporter.
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Jul 9, 2015 18:14
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BI NOW GAY LATER posted:I'll allow that the business wing of the party does support it, and that's obviously who's pushing this for Reince to do; but let's not at all pretend that the Republicans, given the presidency, would pass immigration reform, or that it will come up on their platform in a year. Yeah instead of immigration reform I'd imagine they'd be more about building more prisons and using prisoners as literal slave labor because gently caress it you don't even really have to pay them.
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Jul 9, 2015 18:19
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ToxicSlurpee posted:Yeah instead of immigration reform I'd imagine they'd be more about building more prisons and using prisoners as literal slave labor because gently caress it you don't even really have to pay them. Really, you'e doing them a favor if you think about it. They're being productive.
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Jul 9, 2015 18:22
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do you think corporate hitmans will take out bernie sanders like they did bobby kennedy 
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Jul 9, 2015 18:25
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Vox's trolling is p good. http://www.vox.com/2015/7/9/8922395/Joe-Biden-run-president
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Jul 9, 2015 18:26
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BI NOW GAY LATER posted:Was phone posting before, but: saying that Bush's immigration support represents the current Republican establishment is laughable (he was also something out an outlier even then.) quote:My further contention was that if the establishment /really/ wanted it, it would have happened in 2013. It's not like Boehner couldn't have put up immigration w/o a Republican majority. Like it's pretty hard to say that the Republican Party supports immigration reform, when not a single one of their standard bearers will say so openly, or even continue to support previous positions. quote:I'll allow that the business wing of the party does support it, and that's obviously who's pushing this for Reince to do; but let's not at all pretend that the Republicans, given the presidency, would pass immigration reform, or that it will come up on their platform in a year.
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Jul 9, 2015 18:28
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Vienna Circlejerk posted:I'd vote for her over Bernie in the primary if she did this. I'd even settle for a CNN reporter. 
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Jul 9, 2015 18:31
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Fried Chicken posted:so that the current republican establishment is the same crew as the Bush years, right down to his brother, and has pushed heavily on its "we need immigration reform" position in papers and statements from party leaders like Priebus and Romney, and, oh yeah, passed an immigration reform bill written by establishment figure Marco Rubio, but this means they are nothing like Bush and aren't pushing for the same goals. Gotcha. A bill which Marco Rubio has ran away from. Again, if they wanted it, they could have passed it and haven't. It's the very definition of lip service. But sure, continue to tell me how the Republican party is pro-immigration.
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Jul 9, 2015 18:34
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Lastgirl posted:do you think corporate hitmans will take out bernie sanders like they did bobby kennedy Maybe, but I'd imagine Donald might catch a Koch bullet if he keeps his antics up.
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Jul 9, 2015 18:40
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TheDisreputableDog posted:Oh where she got wiped because every message was a disconnected but carefully constructed poll triangulation rather than a believable narrative that exposed an underlying ideology? Yes, the ones where she gave carefully rehearsed replies to debate questions instead of going off the rails about Mexicans/Arabs/African-Americans/homosexuals/etc. I'm ok with that.
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Jul 9, 2015 18:42
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Slate Action posted:The polls since Trump entered the race seem to bear this out: The fun conspiracy theory is that's why he's in it in the first place. To distract from Bush! No one's talking about how bad it would be to have another bush, but instead laughing at the clown! Plus bush looks better by comparison. Regardless, he must know he never stood a chance in the first place, so why run?
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Jul 9, 2015 18:45
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Why is "carefully rehearsed" a desirable trait when delivery is obviously fake?
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Jul 9, 2015 18:48
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Because gaffes (perceived or otherwise) don't poll well? e: unless you're Trump, I guess.
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Jul 9, 2015 18:51
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pwnyXpress posted:Why is "carefully rehearsed" a desirable trait when delivery is obviously fake? I would way rather have a candidate that's not going to gently caress up, even if its "fake" compared to unpredictable and likely to say something really crazy or prone to misinterpretation. Biden's been a great VP, for example; but he'd be an ulcer for the DNC as the nominee.
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Jul 9, 2015 18:51
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RaySmuckles posted:Regardless, he must know he never stood a chance in the first place, so why run? Pride? Attention whoring? For the hell of it? One need not have rational reasons to run.
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Jul 9, 2015 18:58
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Slate Action posted:The polls since Trump entered the race seem to bear this out: the best part of this is how Kasich somehow seems to be running negative
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Jul 9, 2015 19:00
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pwnyXpress posted:Why is "carefully rehearsed" a desirable trait when delivery is obviously fake?
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Jul 9, 2015 19:02
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Between this clown ride and the NFL/NBA offseasons, non-entertainment entertainment has been at an all time high.
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Jul 9, 2015 19:08
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Nessus posted:Why is "natural delivery" a desirable trait in proposals for national policy? Sure if she's being asked what her favorite flavor of ice cream is, or about Chelsea's wedding or whatever, but even then. Because it says a lot about their political ideology, which they should always be forthcoming about. People who carefully hide their ideology behind words and are in constant fear of public perception tend to be crazy or paranoid.
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Jul 9, 2015 19:08
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Nessus posted:Why is "natural delivery" a desirable trait in proposals for national policy? Because convincing people that you're right and believe what you're saying is literally the job of a politician? Regardless if you're talking to constituents, the legislature, your own staff, etc.
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Jul 9, 2015 19:08
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No, I mean who cares how rehearsed her talking points are if they're just empty words to win an election, after which she can easily change her positions again?
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Jul 9, 2015 19:09
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gently caress You And Diebold posted:the best part of this is how Kasich somehow seems to be running negative As an Ohioan who grew up in his district back when he was a rep, I absolutely agree. I am so sick of this rear end in a top hat, I don't care how moderate he supposedly is, I am going to love watching him amount to nothing nationally.
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Jul 9, 2015 19:10
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Job Truniht posted:Because it says a lot about their political ideology, which they should always be forthcoming about. People who carefully hide their ideology behind words and are in constant fear of public perception tend to be crazy or paranoid. Given that she's spent the last 20+ years under constant media scrutiny for a litany of made up bullshit, I think her animosity and caution with the media is somewhat fair.
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Jul 9, 2015 19:10
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I'd probably arrest media people if I could for vague things. Hillary is a saint.
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Jul 9, 2015 19:11
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Job Truniht posted:People who carefully hide their ideology behind words and are in constant fear of public perception tend to be crazy or paranoid. Or running for office.
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Jul 9, 2015 19:13
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