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OSU_Matthew posted:Edit: one last question just to confirm... I have a Square D QO panel. Am I on the right track to purchase combination AFCI dual function breakers (amp/pole dependant) to swap them out? Eg: Dual function breakers combine both AFCI and GFCI protection. Those are brand new and I've seen a few reports of them being overly sensitive. The only places that require both AFCI and GFCI protection now are kitchens and sometimes laundry areas. Both of those could still be served with AFCI breakers with GFCI outlets. It's up to you. You might be confused with AFCI terminology. The first types of AFCI were the branch/feeder type. They're obsolete and aren't allowed for installations any more. In fact, there were a few branch/feeder AFCI with GFCI breakers made. Again, their AFCI portion isn't up to modern code. Now, the modern type is the combination AFCI. It offers better protection than the older branch/feeders and companies just recently figured out how to cram GFCI protection into the same device.
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Jul 24, 2015 21:30
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Bad Munki posted:Sure, IF the existing wires aren't stapled in, and IF there aren't too many bends, and IF any holes they pass through are roomy enough, and IF it doesn't just get bound up for no good god drat reason, you can tie the new wire to the end of the old one, and as you pull the old wire out at one end, it draws the new one through. Or, more likely to succeed, draw a bit of nylon cord through when pulling the old wire, as that'll pass through holes and bends and such more readily. Then use that cord to pull the new wires. Tip: when pulling new wires through with a cord, ALSO pull more cord through, so you end up with a run of cord+wire, in case you need to pull anything else. Good luck.  OSU_Matthew posted:Cat5e can theoretically handle gigabit speeds, cat 6 is officially rated for it. Of course, most places in America don't actually have gigabit service from their ISP, so it's largely a moot point for now. Only place you'll see gigabit speeds is on local equipment, eg if you're running a file server on your LAN.  . Wikipedia says plain ol cat5 is capable of the same speed but everything else seems to say you need 5e for gigabit, I'll test it out once I get some stuff in there. And yeah this is all for the LAN.Worst case I'll just run some wires cleanly along the walls where necessary (and if close enough I'll just use gigabit switches to at least be fast between that stuff), but I'll definitely think about the powerline adapters. Last I looked into them they were only 200mbps so I never bothered before, but 500mbps would be fine.
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Jul 25, 2015 02:22
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japtor posted:Notice how I specifically left off the "e" As someone who does this for a living I'm going to tell you that you have a 90+ percent chance of whatever less than 5 year old homeowner grade poo poo you own running at gig-e speeds with no problems at typical residential length runs on cat 5<NOE> unless they really brutalized it. And most times that happens at the panels and pockets, so if there's enough slack you can fix it (way too much untwisted length, bad punch downs, lovely block/jacks) without pulling new cable.
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Jul 25, 2015 02:50
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Oh sweet. In case I need to replace stuff what should I search for, is it all just keystone jacks or do the patch panel jacks have some other form factor/name?
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Jul 25, 2015 05:44
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That depends on the patch panel. Some have jacks built in, some are just empty plates which keystone jacks snap into. Speaking from experience, I would skip the ones that keystones snap into. Jacks in those tend to snap out just as easy as they snap in.
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Jul 25, 2015 05:58
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OK, wiring thread...I asked about a motion sensor a few weeks ago and someone sggested this: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001U3Z46Q?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00 I finally got around to ordering it and now I'm unsure how to do the wiring? Here is the wiring diagram in the manual:  And here is the wiring in my fixture looks like:  So there's a white and a red wire coming out of the ceiling attaching to a white and black wire respectively. Obviously I'm thinking the white goes to white and the red goes to black, but what about the additional red wire that comes out of the fixture and attaches to the white wire but goes thorough a "load" first?
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Jul 25, 2015 19:26
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Sleepstupid posted:OK, wiring thread...I asked about a motion sensor a few weeks ago and someone sggested this: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001U3Z46Q?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00 All whites together. There's a black from the fixture that goes to the red on the motion sensor. The red coming out of the ceiling goes to the black on the motion sensor.
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Jul 25, 2015 19:45
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babyeatingpsychopath posted:All whites together. Awesome, thank you sir/madam! Edit: Install was a success! Sleepstupid fucked around with this message at 15:02 on Jul 27, 2015 |
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Jul 25, 2015 21:07
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Just bought a UPS for my computer & modem. Every time I turn the PC on (or it comes back from sleep or hibernate) it trips the GFCI. Any way to make it not do this besides removing the GFCI?
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Jul 28, 2015 20:19
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oldskool posted:Just bought a UPS for my computer & modem. Every time I turn the PC on (or it comes back from sleep or hibernate) it trips the GFCI. Your UPS is shunting switching noise to the ground prong. Get a better UPS. If your computer never tripped the GFCI before, then it's absolutely the UPS at fault.
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Jul 28, 2015 20:27
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At some point I'll need to start figuring out the details of how I'm going to wire up the workshop I'm building. Aside from reading the building code, are there any other recommended resources? Super-high-level thinking at the moment is put a 60-amp breaker on my main panel, run that out to a sub panel, put the following circuits on the sub-panel: * 15-amp lights * 20-amp for half the workshop's outlets * 20-amp for the other half * 30-amp for a 220v circuit That's all approved already by the planning board, but I need to figure out specifics, stuff like what gauge of wire to use for each circuit and for the run from the main panel to the subpanel, how exactly outlets get wired up, how to properly dig the trench the run will be using (and how to protect the trench once dug), how to run wire inside the workshop, etc. Surely there are books that set this stuff out; I'm just looking for a recommendation on one. My electrical experience is next to zero; the most advanced stuff I've done is replacing light fixtures and wiring up dead-simple signal (TTL) lines for robots.
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Jul 28, 2015 22:03
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If you're going the permit/inspection route (edit: and please do), then every part of the work has standards set by the NEC, and possibly extra per your municipality. It may save you some headache to enlist someone locally who is familiar with the code, and good work practice.
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Jul 28, 2015 22:26
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Yes, this is going to be permitted work. I was hoping however that I could do all of the grunt work myself (like digging the trench, running conduit, hooking up basic outlets, etc.), have a contractor come in and make certain I haven't done anything dumbassed and/or do any complicated bits I'm afraid to tackle myself, and then have the inspector come in. Partially this is an attempt at a cost-saving measure, partially this is a subject I want to learn about.
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Jul 28, 2015 22:33
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You absolutely can, and I would suggest doing as much and learning as much as you can. But there are a lot of details that having a knowledgeable person on hand for, will be very helpful to you. Wouldn't you rather be shown the right way, than try to self interpret the code? Everyone who has done electrical work has failed inspection and/or had to rip out and redo, you don't want that headache on your first electrical job. That's just my opinion, others here feel free to disagree. Also I just peeked at your thread and see you're in California. Very good possibility you will have supplemental local standards to abide by. angryrobots fucked around with this message at 22:49 on Jul 28, 2015 |
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Jul 28, 2015 22:44
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Yeah, certainly I don't want to fail inspection. That's just a waste of everyone's time. So what I'm asking for is resources I can use to learn how to do it properly. Hiring someone to come over and teach me is one possible approach, but it seems likely to be more expensive than a book / some YouTube videos / etc. Plus my experience with talking to experts in the past is that they don't necessarily make good teachers; they'll know what to do, but they do a crappy job of explaining why, which is just as important IMO. Granted I'm the guy with no experience here, so feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. But my hope was that I could learn enough that I could just hire someone to come in, look at what I've already done, go "yup, that looks correct", and then finish off the tasks I didn't feel up to handling. Re: California, I'll certainly be reading the code before I start work on the wiring. I did that for the construction aspect of the project, after all. But some basic education would be helpful for understanding the code, just like how I bought some books on house construction before I started reading the code for how the workshop could be built.
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Jul 28, 2015 22:51
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Qwijib0 posted:
Okay I'm back with a new question about my dumb costume project. I used the above diagram and the switch works..... sometimes. I can switch between the wires once before the inverter shorts out and turns off. Does anyone know what could be causing this? Should I use an inverter without an on/off switch? It will be pretty embarrassing to press a button and have half of the wires switch and the other half turn off. Here is a video of what's going on since I can't explain it eloquently: https://youtu.be/cny6Fkv7pes
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Jul 28, 2015 23:03
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TooMuchAbstraction posted:Yeah, certainly I don't want to fail inspection. That's just a waste of everyone's time. So what I'm asking for is resources I can use to learn how to do it properly. Hiring someone to come over and teach me is one possible approach, but it seems likely to be more expensive than a book / some YouTube videos / etc. Plus my experience with talking to experts in the past is that they don't necessarily make good teachers; they'll know what to do, but they do a crappy job of explaining why, which is just as important IMO. Really, if you read the code book, you'll be fine. Outbuildings are fairly straightforward, but they may be residential still. Check the OP and download the NEC, then talk to the people who grant your permit and see what other codes are used in your jurisdiction. The guy who say s "yup, that looks correct" is the inspector; there shouldn't be anything that you can't handle in this kind of operation if you've already built the rest of it by yourself. In general, you're going to be running a subpanel from your service. You figure out what amperage you want in your building (and this isn't just adding up all the breakers) and that tells you what wire size to use. The wire size you use tells you what size breaker you need in your main panel and what size ground wire you need. Your jurisdiction tells you if you need any additional grounding in your subpanel. Your wire size also tells you the minimum diameter conduit you're allowed to use. You then lay out all your devices (receptacles, lights, switches, panels, etc) and submit those plans to the permitting department, who grants you a permit after various bureaucratic nonsense. You then buy everything and install it. Trench, put in two oversize conduits. The code is probably going to tell you a minimum 1" sch40 PVC for your feeder wire, and most people who've done this are going to recommend just putting 2 2" conduits in. You'll have extra space for later, it's easier to pull wire, and the absolute hardest part is digging the trench anyway. Pull your feeder wire with a pull string. Leave a pull string in that pipe with your feeder wire, and put a string in the other pipe while you're there with the vacuum. Drive your ground rod (if required). Install your subpanel and its breakers. Don't put in the bonding screw. Make sure you're running the extra neutral wire to all your light switches; even if you don't need it now, it's probably code and a motion sensor or lighted light switch is always an option later. Hang your lights, wire them up. Install your receptacles: it's almost certainly code for these to be GFCI, so get the GFCI breakers if you've got more than 2 outlets per side as it's going to be cheaper. You should be able to do everything in NM-B cable (Romex) as long as you pay a little bit of attention to drilling holes in studs and whatnot. Wire up your branch circuits to the subpanel. Then the fun part: Turn off your main breaker, open that panel up, install your new subpanel breaker, wire it up, turn on the main, turn on your sub, turn on everything in the outbuilding and be amazed that everything worked literally the first time.
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Jul 28, 2015 23:14
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Deadite posted:Okay I'm back with a new question about my dumb costume project. I used the above diagram and the switch works..... sometimes. I can switch between the wires once before the inverter shorts out and turns off. Does anyone know what could be causing this? Should I use an inverter without an on/off switch? It will be pretty embarrassing to press a button and have half of the wires switch and the other half turn off. That's really odd. That circuit should work. Will that one inverter power both of those strings at the same time? It's possible that one relay is closing more quickly than the other and causing the inverter to go into over-current mode. Try putting that red wire on your diagram to the NC contact of the upper relay and see if that works.
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Jul 28, 2015 23:20
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babyeatingpsychopath posted:Really, if you read the code book, you'll be fine. Outbuildings are fairly straightforward, but they may be residential still. Thanks for this and the other info. I guess I'm mostly just looking for a primer? I know when I first tried to read the construction code I was constantly trying to find definitions for jargon terms (like what the heck a bonding screw is), and it wasn't until I'd read some more naturally-written texts that I actually understood what was going on. FWIW because I'm not planning on putting up drywall, all of my interior wire runs have to be in conduit as well, according to the planning department.
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Jul 28, 2015 23:50
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babyeatingpsychopath posted:Install your receptacles: it's almost certainly code for these to be GFCI, so get the GFCI breakers if you've got more than 2 outlets per side as it's going to be cheaper. You do realize that GFCI receptacles can and will protect any devices downstream of them, right? GFCI breakers are hilariously expensive compared to receptacles for no real reason. Only time they really make sense on 120v/20a receptacle loads is when the receptacle is not readily accessible.
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Jul 29, 2015 00:03
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babyeatingpsychopath posted:That's really odd. That circuit should work. Will that one inverter power both of those strings at the same time? It's possible that one relay is closing more quickly than the other and causing the inverter to go into over-current mode. So I tried the NC contact and that didn't work. I had the same issue as before. Luckily, I have some 12v inverters without on/off switches lying around and using one of these in place of the 9v dimmer inverter seems to work. I used a 9v power supply with the 12v inverter, so hopefully I can still use 9v batteries in the costume. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BoKbxUAn4x4
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Jul 29, 2015 00:35
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TooMuchAbstraction posted:Thanks for this and the other info. I guess I'm mostly just looking for a primer? I know when I first tried to read the construction code I was constantly trying to find definitions for jargon terms (like what the heck a bonding screw is), and it wasn't until I'd read some more naturally-written texts that I actually understood what was going on. The NEC handbook (which is like $120 I think) is much easier to understand and follow than the code. It has diagrams, explanatory paragraphs and examples beneath the actual code language, and references to other parts of the code. I really can't imagine trying to learn the code from scratch just by reading the legally adopted language.
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Jul 29, 2015 04:57
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You can get the NEC online for free if you sniff around a bit. NFPA really doesn't like admitting this, but no US body (from locality up to federal) is allowed to consider something legally binding if it cannot be accessed at no charge. Most cities/counties/states (depending on what level of government sets what code revision they follow) will have the appropriate revision (it's updated every three years, current is 2014, you're most likely under 2011 or 2008) as a PDF on their website. If the appropriate level of government is doing it right, it's a PDF that's jiggered so you can't save it or print it, but that'll be enough to get you the basics of what you need. If you want to make absolutely sure you do not fail an inspection, a good way to make sure is to ask an electrician to listen to you and sanity check your plan, with the understanding that they're not going to get Yelled At if you gently caress something up. Depending on the electrician, this will cost you somewhere between a decent six-pack and an hour of labor. If they ask you to pay more, walk away. You'll have more success if you're already done the math on what load you're going to be using (again, it's not just adding up the amperage of the breakers, but won't take more than five minutes or so to work out, the NEC gives you a worksheet). Your local inspector may also do this for you, but don't count on it.
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Jul 29, 2015 06:02
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The NEC handbook (not free) is not the same as the NEC (public source because it is government legislation).
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Jul 29, 2015 06:41
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PopeCrunch posted:You can get the NEC online for free if you sniff around a bit. The 2014 NEC is linked in the OP. Archive.org has it.
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Jul 29, 2015 09:40
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Yikes, okay. That handbook sounds like exactly what I was looking for, except way more expensive than anticipated, probably because it covers the entirety of the code. Maybe I should just go on Amazon and look for a "basic house wiring" book or something. All's I need is enough grounding (so to speak) in the subject that I'll understand what the code is talking about.
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Jul 29, 2015 14:40
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TooMuchAbstraction posted:Yikes, okay. That handbook sounds like exactly what I was looking for, except way more expensive than anticipated, probably because it covers the entirety of the code. Maybe I should just go on Amazon and look for a "basic house wiring" book or something. All's I need is enough grounding (so to speak) in the subject that I'll understand what the code is talking about. I was typing some smart rear end response but decided to just advise you to check your library. If they don't own it they can get it through a library loan.
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Jul 29, 2015 16:04
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TooMuchAbstraction posted:Yikes, okay. That handbook sounds like exactly what I was looking for, except way more expensive than anticipated, probably because it covers the entirety of the code. Maybe I should just go on Amazon and look for a "basic house wiring" book or something. All's I need is enough grounding (so to speak) in the subject that I'll understand what the code is talking about. When I rewired my entire house from scratch (including new service panel) before I became an electrician, I used the Black and Decker Complete Guide to Wiring. It's full of great pictures. Then I opened up the code book and actually read the relevant sections for code calculations. The code book isn't that bad, honestly, and the new versions are much clearer than the old. Back in the early days of this thread, people would say "I'm trying to install an X-amp subpanel Y-feet away, and I'm using Z wire. Is that right?" and the pros here (myself included) would run the numbers and give the yes/no.
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Jul 29, 2015 16:04
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XmasGiftFromWife posted:I was typing some smart rear end response but decided to just advise you to check your library. If they don't own it they can get it through a library loan. Dur, this is a good idea.  I keep forgetting libraries are a thing.babyeatingpsychopath posted:When I rewired my entire house from scratch (including new service panel) before I became an electrician, I used the Black and Decker Complete Guide to Wiring. It's full of great pictures. Then I opened up the code book and actually read the relevant sections for code calculations. The code book isn't that bad, honestly, and the new versions are much clearer than the old. Awesome, thanks for the recommendation. quote:Back in the early days of this thread, people would say "I'm trying to install an X-amp subpanel Y-feet away, and I'm using Z wire. Is that right?" and the pros here (myself included) would run the numbers and give the yes/no. And I'll probably do something similar once I've done my research. At the moment I wouldn't even know what's vaguely close to reasonable, so I'd just be wasting y'all's time.
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Jul 29, 2015 16:47
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I'm trying to create an electrical fire, but I'm having trouble selecting the right gauge wire to properly heat up to wood burning temperature without melting or otherwise burning itself out. I've got a 20 amp 120v circuit AC circuit, and I want to create a wood-lighting wire that is 1 foot long per side, connected to a lightbulb drawing 60 watts. Any pointers?
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Jul 29, 2015 17:25
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baquerd posted:I'm trying to create an electrical fire, but I'm having trouble selecting the right gauge wire to properly heat up to wood burning temperature without melting or otherwise burning itself out. I've got a 20 amp 120v circuit AC circuit, and I want to create a wood-lighting wire that is 1 foot long per side, connected to a lightbulb drawing 60 watts. Any pointers? Buy an electric charcoal starter. http://m.lowes.com/pd/Master-Forge-550-Watt-Electric-Charcoal-Starter/4482518 EvilMayo fucked around with this message at 18:51 on Jul 29, 2015 |
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Jul 29, 2015 18:47
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baquerd posted:I'm trying to create an electrical fire, but I'm having trouble selecting the right gauge wire to properly heat up to wood burning temperature without melting or otherwise burning itself out. I've got a 20 amp 120v circuit AC circuit, and I want to create a wood-lighting wire that is 1 foot long per side, connected to a lightbulb drawing 60 watts. Any pointers? Whoa whoa whoa, this is the don't burn your house down thread.
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Jul 29, 2015 19:01
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babyeatingpsychopath posted:Your UPS is shunting switching noise to the ground prong. Get a better UPS. If your computer never tripped the GFCI before, then it's absolutely the UPS at fault. I unplugged everything to swap in a new video card, and after plugging it all back in it didn't trip v  v
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Jul 29, 2015 20:42
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XmasGiftFromWife posted:Buy an electric charcoal starter. But that's no fun plus it costs money. I really need a DIY solution here. I'm thinking 30 gauge or so to start with. If I don't get enough heat though, the correct way to draw more amperage is to hook up more bulbs in parallel, right?
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Jul 29, 2015 22:08
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baquerd posted:I'm trying to create an electrical fire, but I'm having trouble selecting the right gauge wire to properly heat up to wood burning temperature without melting or otherwise burning itself out. I've got a 20 amp 120v circuit AC circuit, and I want to create a wood-lighting wire that is 1 foot long per side, connected to a lightbulb drawing 60 watts. Any pointers? Running it in series with a 60 watt light bulb isn't going to leave you with nearly enough power to get anything to light on fire. Look into nichrome wire. Nichrome is much more appropriate for a starter element, and because of that you'll have a much easier time finding information about how to do it correctly (Wikipedia even has a table that tells you how much current you need).
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Jul 29, 2015 22:33
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Zhentar posted:Running it in series with a 60 watt light bulb isn't going to leave you with nearly enough power to get anything to light on fire. Thanks, I'll check where I can get some of that and check the tables. Should make an interesting demonstration.
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Jul 29, 2015 22:57
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baquerd posted:Thanks, I'll check where I can get some of that and check the tables. Should make an interesting demonstration. Yeah, nichrome. Back-of-envelope says you need #30AWG or ~.010" diameter to give you 18A in 1ft of wire. That's about 2,000W and should get up around 2100°F in free air. Good luck, and don't burn your house down.
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Jul 29, 2015 23:15
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This is probably a dumb question, but I recently had a huge air conditioner + heater unit go out. The unit is plugged into a 250V-30A socket with a 6-30R receptacle (looks a lot like the link, says 250V, says 30A, tracks Fredrich's information for the old AC unit). http://www.amazon.com/Leviton-061-05372-000-Power-Receptacle-Flush/dp/B000P9UZ92/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1438282029&sr=8-1&keywords=6-30r I'm having a hell of a time finding a replacement unit with a 6-30P plug that won't cost a zillion dollars, and frankly don't need to have 700 sq ft capacity as the relevant apartment is < 500 total (this link is basically the corresponding new unit I believe). http://www.amazon.com/Friedrich-EM1...8-1&keywords=em Are 6-15P units compatible, since they need less power, or is that just going to fry a 6-15P AC unit? EDIT: I guess those aren't physically compatible anyway and would require some sort of adapter / patch cord? ulmont fucked around with this message at 19:47 on Jul 30, 2015 |
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Jul 30, 2015 15:46
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ulmont posted:This is probably a dumb question, but I recently had a huge air conditioner + heater unit go out. The unit is plugged into a 250V-30A socket with a 6-30R receptacle (looks a lot like the link, says 250V, says 30A, tracks Fredrich's information for the old AC unit). First off, your links are broken. Second, if this is an apartment, why isn't the landlord taking care of it?
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Jul 30, 2015 19:32
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kid sinister posted:First off, your links are broken. Second, if this is an apartment, why isn't the landlord taking care of it? Links are fixed - I'm blaming SA. I own the house (this apartment is not rented out though). http://www.amazon.com/Leviton-061-05372-000-Power-Receptacle-Flush/dp/B000P9UZ92/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1438282029&sr=8-1&keywords=6-30r http://www.amazon.com/Friedrich-EM1...8-1&keywords=em
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Jul 30, 2015 19:48
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