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Iretep posted:While Tau dish out superior fire power they have a big problem with logistics to my understanding. They need new ammo for their guns and they need supply lines for that. Also their weapons require experts to fix and they are prone to breaking since they are high tech. Imperial guards lasguns are pretty simple to get ammo for. Just throw the ammo catridge into a fire and after a moment its ready to be fired again. Lasguns also never break so they are incredibly reliable. Orks on the other hand just put trash into their guns. They also fix their guns with trash. Eldar can use the webway to get their ammo so its less of an issue for them. I don't think their weapons really break either since they just fire shruikens mostly. Shuriken weapons don't actually fire shurikens in the fluff - that's just the nickname the Imperium has for them. They fire tiny slivers of crystal accelerated to enormous speeds. And yeah, it's explicitly a point that the Tau can only afford and maintain their technological superiority because there are some Imperial worlds with more people than there are Tau in the entire species. There is not a single Tau weapon that would be cost-effective to produce and equip their troops with if their empire was a tenth the size of the Imperium. There are multiple Imperial forge worlds - worlds entirely converted into planet-size factories - that produce nothing but lasguns. Other forge worlds do nothing but produce bolter ammunition. Or flak vests.
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Aug 17, 2015 22:52
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The whole 'everything is canon' issue seems to stem from GW not actually wanting to say much of anything about the setting with certainty. All sourcebooks and novels are from an in-universe perspective fluffwise, so all contradictions can be sort of handwaved away as one of the authors being wrong, or just looking at things from a different perspective. So basically, the canonicality of the works is suspect mainly due to every source being subject to an unreliable narrator. I suppose it could be spun as a deliberate narrative choice, but I feel things are this way so that GW can change things on a whim and not even try and have to justify it. And so that they won't have to proofread So yeah, it mainly refers to contradictory accounts or basically anything within the official or semi-official written works, ie. "Is Ciaphas Cain REALLY the HERO OF THE IMPERIUM? Hmm makes u think." It is not an endorsement of some lovely felinid harem fanfics or whatever. Disclaimer: I don't actually know this much about 40K fluff, this is just what I could gather from prowling the internet for like 15 minutes. So it could be all super wrong.
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Aug 17, 2015 22:52
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Cythereal posted:The main point of the Tau narratively, in my opinion, is that they genuinely believe they're good guys and act like it. They think they live in a rational universe where reason, diplomacy, and the common good can prevail. GhostStalker posted:The Tau are naive as all hell, but that and their superior firepower makes me like them all the more. This is partly why the Tau are the faction I love to hate. I generally like to describe 40k as being a non-sequitur of violence and it's actually strong part of its appeal. Other franchises more rooted in reality often have to live with the unintended consequences of their elaborate action sequences - e.g. Nathan Drake is genocidal maniac who's killed thousands of human beings for baubles that he ends up losing half the time anyway even though he's definitely never presented as such. 40k just runs with those consequences, all of them, with the extra rule that the more elaborate and insane the action sequence the better. The setting is grimdark as all hell but mostly in so far as it enables it to be more fun - bigger battles with bigger heaps of bodies and ridiculous engines of war running amok. The Orks are obviously best suited for a setting like this but even the Eldar, the dying but advanced race, will throw down for a mid-shootout sword fight and send in screaming dudes in cloth armor even though their fancy advanced weapons could evaporate a target from a continent away. If the Eldar see a grotesquely impractical titan coming at them, they build their own even more impractical titan because they are totally down for an old-fashioned and fun skyscraper fight. The Tau didn't show up to have fun. They showed up to win. No melee, that poo poo's been dumb since WW2 and space age technologies have only made it dumber. Oh the enemy uses teleportation to close in? Eh, just give warriors jetpacks so they can shoot and scoot. Oh, the enemy can come at you with grotesquely monsterous titans? Eh, just shoot that dumb thing down using extended missile racks - high end missiles are are way cheaper to make than high end skyscraper robots. Oh, every other faction tries to achieve its goals through glorious conquest and glorious conquest alone? How about we make deals, treaties and compromises - “the supreme art of war is to subdue the enemy without fighting” after all. Etc, etc, etc. I like the Tau because they're unique, distinctive and a welcome addition to the setting but they're also the faction I personally dislike because they crashed a party with no intention of having fun. I can see their appeal though.
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Aug 17, 2015 22:55
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Blind Sally posted:Hahahaha, goddamnit, some of the fan canon stuff people have linked is hilarious. So what's the deal with all things in W40K being canon? Like, this LP is canon by existing? How does that work? Is it some GW ploy to keep their fans making awesome videos and songs? It's a lore thing. The publishing line of Games Workshop is Black Library. The Black Library is an in-universe literal library that exists at the heart of the Eldar Webway, which contains a copy of everything ever written. All of the tabletop games instruction manuals are supposed to be actual things actually written, in-universe, by the Imperium or other factions. All of the stories are recorded accounts of things that supposedly happened... and the things that conflict, like old rulesets and army changes and even army backgrounds? They exist too, as nothing the Imperium writes or records can really be trusted as truth as the Imperium routinely re-writes it's own history to suit the requirements of the day. How do they get away with that? DO YOU DOUBT THE EMPEROR'S WORD AS TRUTH!? HERETIC!?
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Aug 17, 2015 22:58
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Theantero posted:The whole 'everything is canon' issue seems to stem from GW not actually wanting to say much of anything about the setting with certainty. All sourcebooks and novels are from an in-universe perspective fluffwise, so all contradictions can be sort of handwaved away as one of the authors being wrong, or just looking at things from a different perspective. So basically, the canonicality of the works is suspect mainly due to every source being subject to an unreliable narrator. I suppose it could be spun as a deliberate narrative choice, but I feel things are this way so that GW can change things on a whim and not even try and have to justify it. And so that they won't have to proofread ^ This is the reason they do it, my response is how it's justified in universe.
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Aug 17, 2015 23:01
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hard counter posted:This is partly why the Tau are the faction I love to hate. It also produces fun little anecdotes like the times the Tau tried opening diplomatic relations with the Tyranids and Necrons. And that time their kroot allies tried eating flayed ones. Or when they encountered a Chaos cult that wouldn't shut up about Slaanesh, found a CSM they were all taking orders from and revering as a god, killed the CSM, and assumed that was Slaanesh they just killed. The thing is, the Tau show up to win but they can't. They're rational actors in an insane universe, a very local power in galactic terms that thinks because they've kicked over every castle in their sandbox they have what it takes to rule the whole playground.
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Aug 17, 2015 23:02
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I really want to like Tau but they don't feel properly fleshed out in the same sense as the other factions. They just seem kind of tacked on as an afterthought. It doesn't help that their aesthetics, which were my favorite part about them, especially the sleek, badass battlesuits got redesigned into weird ugly lumpy asymmetrical poo poo. Actually did the same thing happen with IG? I'm kind of out of the loop but what's with these ugly-as-gently caress Tauroxes and ~Astra Militarum~ bullshit?
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Aug 17, 2015 23:30
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Heaven Spacey posted:I really want to like Tau but they don't feel properly fleshed out in the same sense as the other factions. They just seem kind of tacked on as an afterthought. It doesn't help that their aesthetics, which were my favorite part about them, especially the sleek, badass battlesuits got redesigned into weird ugly lumpy asymmetrical poo poo. They decided to try to make the Guard's commandos into a separate army for some insane reason, then redesign their armor and give them the ugliest half tracks in existence.
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Aug 17, 2015 23:33
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Night10194 posted:They decided to try to make the Guard's commandos into a separate army for some insane reason, then redesign their armor and give them the ugliest half tracks in existence. The stormroopers are the Militarum Tempestus. The Astra Militarum nonsense is "But we can't copyright 'Imperial Guard'!"
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Aug 17, 2015 23:34
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habituallyred posted:Attack the Desert as the orks will be nothing without their leader. Also I must ask as to why the stealth veterans were not available for the unsuccessful attack. It seems like starting out with a force to invisibly capture points would be very useful. mcclay posted:drat Xenos, attack the bloody Orks before they launch a full out WAAAGH on our flanks! If I have to work with blue-skinned horrors I'd prefer to survive it. Dr. Snark posted:Head for the desert, mainly because the mountains near there contain one of the most fun missions in the game. And we get more Fire Warrior Bodyguards, which are horrifyingly powerful at range.  We move for the desert. This will give a chance to build up requisition, too, so it's a wise tactical move. As an aside, as long as a leader is stationed in a province adjacent to the one that is being attacked, they will be able to quickly move in to defend it. So expect to face see Warlord Gorgutz.Day 6   We've moved our forces back to the Panrea Lowlands. Anything to report? Nothing, Shas'o. There have been no enemy movements.Day 7  Back in Tash'n. Good. Mobilize the forces, we attack Agamar Desert at dawn. Shas'o, you may be interested in this report: Warlord Gorgutz has moved on the Ariel Highlands. The Orkz have defeated the Eldar. Interesting. And Taldeer? It seems she was able to escape. Our Pathfinder say she has returned to Tyrea. And there she'll stay, if I have anything to say about it.Day 8    Honour Guard, spread out, take the immediate strategic points. Shas'o! On it. I'll keep watch around the bend. The Orkz are aggressive and may already be on their way--  Roight, derez dey are! Gorgutz wuz roight, dem grey-skinz is movin' in on our territoriez. --huh. Oi, grey-skin! Up 'ere! A Wartrak. Basic Ork vehicle. It's fast, and can be upgraded with infantry disrupting bombs. Left alone or in groups they might be dangerous. Not to the Tau, though. Stealthsuits, move up! Activating jetpacks. Stormboyz can be a problem. Their jetpacks let them move in quick, disrupting our Fire Warriors. I haven't any Kroot trained up, yet, so this might prove challenging. Throwing an EMP. Uh, boss? Me Wartrak's not workin' no more? You git, youse lettin' da grey-skins muck up yer ride. The Warboss has detection technology! Let's put some distance between ourselves and the Ork blades. Wot's dis? You train up yer lil'shooa boyz in 'ere? Gotta say, deyz awfully fragile. Not worth da botha, you ask me. No one asked, barbarian! Why, ain't you da sensitive one. Leave this place, Ork, return to your peninsula! Ehh heh heh heh, I'd like to see yer makez me. Orkz are down, Shas'o. Bringing Tau guns to bear on Gorgutz. Let him have it!   Da boss is down! More Orkz, Shas'o.  Roight, youse boyz make a distraction. Youse boyz help me cover da boss's retreat. Running away, are we? Nah, we'z gonna come back an 'av annuva go at yer, grey-skin. Don't count as no loss, dat way. Your logic astounds me. That's a Big Mek, a secondary Ork commander. Slow, but brutal close-combat warriors. Unfortunately, they can teleport, meaning they're great at disrupting our Fire Warriors. Fire Warrior regulars, engage in melee. Hold them back so the Bodyguards can rain down plasma on them! We got'em. Move forward through the canyons. Stealthsuits, capture that point! Ork Listening Posts up ahead, Shas'o. Tread softly, all Ork buildings are armed with defensive turrets. They're held together with garbage, they'll go down fast enough. More Big Meks. I swear, we've encountered eight of them in this desert already! Focus plasma fire. Ah, youse ain't so tuff. Go on, boyz, push'em back! Shas'o? Fall back to the base. Lure them into our turrets. The patient hunter always gets their prize. Ahhh, maybe dis wuz a mistake? That took care of them. Back through the canyons! I want that Listening Post torn down. Their base has to be nearby.  Reinforcements keep coming from the north. Then that's where we shall go. We guessed right, looks like this must be the place. There's the headquarters. Tear down that trash heap, and let's be done with this. Shas'o Kais! We've done it! We've cut off Warlord Gorgutz from his headquarters! The War Council's tactics have now cut off both the Eldar and the Orkz from expanding their territory. As long as our defenses can keep them contained, they're going to be toothless for the duration of this war. We can kill them at our leisure. If we wish, we can assault Warlord Gorgutz again. Might be able to take the Ariel Highlands this time--but if we do so, he'll be able to retreat to his stronghold and could potentially start expanding his territory. Might be wiser to leave him be, for now. Instead, now might be a good time to take the Necron down a peg. The Western Barrens have two enemy bases, but your Honour Guard now includes two Fire Warrior Bodyguard teams. Between them and your Veteran Stealthsuits, you might be able to make a fast strike and eliminate at least one base before the two of them have the opportunity to overwhelm you. It sounds like a risky maneuver, Shas'o. I don't like it. The Hyperion Peaks are another opportunity, but it could prove to be a quagmire. The mountains are treacherous, making it nearly inaccessible. We could send in an army, but no resources to field a Cadre Command. Wait, what does that mean? Shas'o won't be able to reinforce his armies, but the Orkz will. If you move quickly and strike decisively, you can cut off their means of production before they can overwhelm you! Then we would own the means to field forward command bases. Our attacks would be that much more likely to succeed! Just imagine the benefits, O'Kais. Hmm. Maybe. I'd feel more confident if I had more Wargear going into the battlefield. What are our other options? There are many, Shas'o. Defense, of course, and we can always move through our territory to strike elsewhere. If we were feeling confident, though, we could strike at the Green Coast. It's Gorgutz's Stronghold, but if we eliminate it, we'd stop his Waaagh! in it's tracks. As always, the decision is left to the War Council.
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Aug 17, 2015 23:37
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Cythereal posted:The thing is, the Tau show up to win but they can't. They're rational actors in an insane universe, a very local power in galactic terms that thinks because they've kicked over every castle in their sandbox they have what it takes to rule the whole playground. There is a certain naivety I didn't get into but the Tau are definitely potent despite their size and immaturity. Their cause as it currently stands, is hopeless because of their galactic smallness and the ease at which they get taken advantage of but they're still the only fully-sentient faction whose ledger is in the green. The imperium likes to say we totally could have eliminated the tau, you guys, if it wasn't for those drat 'nids  but the idea holds less water when the tau later rekt the splinter tendril that was coming for them. Tau science can out-adapt the hive mind. The Tau seem to be responding to the insanity of the setting but not by becoming insane themselves. If the Tau continue advancing to their golden age of science, they're definitely in it to win it. The problem is surival, they gotta survive their society's coming of age and remain psyker-less embers in the warp.Night10194 posted:They decided to try to make the Guard's commandos into a separate army for some insane reason, then redesign their armor and give them the ugliest half tracks in existence. Not to mention give them edgy as hell backstories.
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Aug 17, 2015 23:37
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Night10194 posted:The Tau are one of my favorite parts of 40k. It's a shame GW missed their own point with them and kept sliding more into 'No really they're just evil fascists like everyone else' instead of 'No, these are the guys who A: Haven't hosed up yet and B: Might gently caress up later.' Of course since this is Games Workshop, Later will happen sometime before the heat death of the universe but not that much before. I think the Ethereal calling the shots and doing their thing for the Tau (and member races) plays into their naivete and definitely sows seeds for part B. Of course the only unequivocally 'good' race in 40k is the Orkz because all they want is a fight (and almost everyone else is a hypocrite so this isn't a very good metric.)
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Aug 17, 2015 23:44
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hard counter posted:Not to mention give them edgy as hell backstories. Oh, do tell 
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Aug 17, 2015 23:44
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EponymousMrYar posted:Of course the only unequivocally 'good' race in 40k is the Orkz because all they want is a fight (and almost everyone else is a hypocrite so this isn't a very good metric.) I'm a Necron fan, myself. Both the robo-undead and the cranky robo-Egyptian grandpas who want you to get off their lawn (their lawn being the Milky Way) have their appeal.
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Aug 17, 2015 23:46
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hard counter posted:Not to mention give them edgy as hell backstories. And they got rid of the old Kasrkin models, which were awesome. I liked the Kasrkin; they were basically just Space Navy SEALs/SAS/whatnot. Soldiers who'd done especially well in training and early operations selected for additional training and given more gear. That was all they needed.
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Aug 17, 2015 23:47
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The Pretty Borders faction demands an attack to Ariel Highlands. All territories shall be uniform blobs, no splinters allowed 
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Aug 17, 2015 23:52
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Felinids are definitely still a thing, and definitely haven't been exterminatus'd. If they were, /tg/ would've burned down by now.Night10194 posted:And they got rid of the old Kasrkin models, which were awesome. I liked the Kasrkin; they were basically just Space Navy SEALs/SAS/whatnot. Soldiers who'd done especially well in training and early operations selected for additional training and given more gear. That was all they needed. While the new stormtrooper fluff is moronic, I kind of like the British Commando look of the new models' heads, with the berets and everything. Pity the body armour looks like rear end. EponymousMrYar posted:I think the Ethereal calling the shots and doing their thing for the Tau (and member races) plays into their naivete and definitely sows seeds for part B. If GW weren't so afraid of advancing the timeline, I'd have some serious psyker poo poo go down on their human-held worlds since the Tau don't exactly have Black Ships collecting the buggers. EDIT: See, one thing newbies to 40K should realize is that for all its excesses and atrocities, the Imperium doesn't commit them for the sake of doing them. They're not the Party from 1984, for whom power is its own reward. The Imperium does what it does because they're genuinely convinced (with good evidence) that it's the best that could be done under the circumstances. quote:The Imperium isn't grim because things suck by choice and could be fine if a sensible person came along. That sensible person wouldn't survive fifty seconds of the reality. The Imperium is grim because every single poo poo decision, every single sacrifice, every single death, every single man woman and child suffering a poo poo life in the worst conditions imaginable, is the absolute loving best that can be done. It is a study of the worst happening to everyone and what part of your humanity must be sacrificed today just to stand a chance of survival, and all it asks is whether or not it would have perhaps been better to die. CommissarMega fucked around with this message at 23:54 on Aug 17, 2015 |
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Aug 17, 2015 23:52
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Hyperion Peaks won't get any easier to take. Might as well strike before the Orcs can fortify themselves there too much.
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Aug 18, 2015 00:21
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CommissarMega posted:While the new stormtrooper fluff is moronic, I kind of like the British Commando look of the new models' heads, with the berets and everything. Pity the body armour looks like rear end. The Sassy Berets are fine, it's the body armor and fluff that's awful. But then, 40k's fluff is...well, what happens when something is written as a parody, becomes its own thing, and then is written primarily by fanboys the studio doesn't have to pay much because they'd give anything to write for WARHAMMER. It's basically fanfiction now.
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Aug 18, 2015 00:28
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Now mind you, that doesn't mean that sometimes the lore doesn't have the imperium do really dumb poo poo for no reason. But most of that is on the hat of the Inquisition. Who are a necessary function for the Imperium, but also responsible for many of its problems. But as of the current lore and charts they're perfectly willing to align with the Tau and if push comes to shove the Eldar. Really if the three banded together with no in-fighting they could run pretty roughshod across the galaxy. But this isn't a setting that really allows for that (Mostly because the timelines never going to go past 41,999M) Going back to the Art of War comparison someone made? Well, Puretide (the guy who basically wrote the book on how to fight the Tau) has an Sun Tzu quote directly attributed to him, so yeah, pretty much. The thing is, most factions tend to have a 'Win Con' where they can truly turn it around. For the Imps it's The Emperor returning to life or a Primarch returning. Either of these things would be of huge benefit. Really though, they NEED Big E. For Chaos it's taking Cadia, that will kickstart a true Black Crusade. The Orks just want a Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh!, and they've got the biggest Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh!! ever in the brew. Tyranids just want to eat everything, etc.
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Aug 18, 2015 00:31
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The thing about Orks is, they don't even really want a win condition. They absolutely love the current state of the galaxy.
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Aug 18, 2015 00:33
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Onmi posted:Who are a necessary function for the Imperium The main people who will tell you this, of course, are Inquisitors. Right before they gently caress everything up again with their bullshit.
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Aug 18, 2015 00:33
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I'm pretty sure the state of the galaxy as it is right now is the win state for both Orks and Chaos. Maybe even Nids too, if they can't cannibalize. Think about how happy those Orks caught up in Kryptmann's gambit must be 
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Aug 18, 2015 00:40
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Night10194 posted:The main people who will tell you this, of course, are Inquisitors. Right before they gently caress everything up again with their bullshit. Honestly, I do think they are. You really do need someone with the stones to condemn a world to the flames when it's necessary. And yes, I meant that last part; for all that we talk about the =I= virus-bombing a world because they put milk in their tea, everything I've seen in the fluff indicates that Exterminatus really is the last resort. The threat of the Inquisition also serves to keep the Imperium's people both fearful and faithful.
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Aug 18, 2015 00:41
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CommissarMega posted:Honestly, I do think they are. You really do need someone with the stones to condemn a world to the flames when it's necessary. And yes, I meant that last part; for all that we talk about the =I= virus-bombing a world because they put milk in their tea, everything I've seen in the fluff indicates that Exterminatus really is the last resort. The threat of the Inquisition also serves to keep the Imperium's people both fearful and faithful. The joke with the Imperium is that it's an insanely inefficient, self-destructive mess that is the inheritor of constant, abject failures and traumatized by a bunch of terrible things it will do anything to avoid having happen again, even as its actions ensure they will happen over and over on a smaller scale and while a bunch of its powerful people spout a lot of nonsense about how necessary it is that they maintain absolute power even as they strangle everything. Much like the joke of Chaos is that it's actually more rigid and authoritarian than the Imperium and even more demanding of 'purity'. These things are why the setting is funny. At least to me. As others have said, 40k is pretty much whatever you make of it and that's key to why it sticks around. Speaking of logistically insane quagmires, we should attack the Hyperion Peaks Night10194 fucked around with this message at 00:50 on Aug 18, 2015 |
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Aug 18, 2015 00:47
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Night10194 posted:The joke with the Imperium is that it's an insanely inefficient, self-destructive mess that is the inheritor of constant, abject failures and traumatized by a bunch of terrible things it will do anything to avoid having happen again, even as its actions ensure they will happen over and over on a smaller scale and while a bunch of its powerful people spout a lot of nonsense about how necessary it is that they maintain absolute power even as they strangle everything. Much like the joke of Chaos is that it's actually more rigid and authoritarian than the Imperium and even more demanding of 'purity'. These things are why the setting is funny. Less funny when you realise that, however accidentally... It's still parodying British politics. But hey, black comedy works too, right? As to the next fight... As much as the Vespid Elders seem pretty tempting, I'd have to agree that Ariel Highlands seems the option most likely to succeed. Two bases is, as noted, a risk right now, and assaulting a stronghold at this point... Naaaaaaahhhhhh...
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Aug 18, 2015 00:51
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Night10194 posted:The main people who will tell you this, of course, are Inquisitors. Right before they gently caress everything up again with their bullshit. Clarification: The Inquisition in its INITIAL conception under Malcador the Sigillite was a necessary evil of the Imperium. The fact that said inquisitors have gone and hosed it all to high heaven is an unfortunate side effect of Inquisitors all being loving lunatics with too much power and not a single person with enough power and common loving sense to kick their asses into line. Just ask the Sensei, the Emperors human descendants. You would think they would be hailed by the Imperium and treated like demi-gods.Instead the Inquisition brands them mutants and slaughters them all. You see, an Inquisitor is never wrong. Everyone is a heretic before the inquisitor is wrong. Ask the Celestial Lions. And when it comes time for the Inquisiton to actually DO THEIR loving JOB?! well then you get the Abyssal Crusade.
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Aug 18, 2015 00:55
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Asimov taught these people nothing.
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Aug 18, 2015 00:58
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Onmi posted:Clarification: The Inquisition in its INITIAL conception under Malcador the Sigillite was a necessary evil of the Imperium. Oh, yes. A lot of stuff in the Imperium has understandable roots; you need an intelligence service when you have cults of horrible monstrosity all about and/or want to be anything halfway functional. Much like the enormous segmenting of their forces comes from wanting to avoid the possibility of another Horus Heresy. All of it makes sense, or at least can be tracked back to a sensible source, it's just all still a terrible idea and/or has gone so far off the reservation in 10 millennia of inertia as to go absolutely counter to where it was intended to.
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Aug 18, 2015 00:59
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Onmi posted:Clarification: The Inquisition in its INITIAL conception under Malcador the Sigillite was a necessary evil of the Imperium. The fact that said inquisitors have gone and hosed it all to high heaven is an unfortunate side effect of Inquisitors all being loving lunatics with too much power and not a single person with enough power and common loving sense to kick their asses into line. It is important to note that the book series the bolded bit comes from is the Inquisition War, the first book of which is prefaced with some scribe telling his boss, essentially, "We have no loving clue where this account came from, or if this Inquisitor ever existed, or if any of the things in this story ever actually happened, but on the off chance they did we need to lock this poo poo away and no one is allowed to read it ever".
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Aug 18, 2015 01:02
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RickVoid posted:It is important to note that the book series the bolded bit comes from is the Inquisition War, the first book of which is prefaced with some scribe telling his boss, essentially, "We have no loving clue where this account came from, or if this Inquisitor ever existed, or if any of the things in this story ever actually happened, but on the off chance they did we need to lock this poo poo away and no one is allowed to read it ever". Indeed. The other big conflict off hand (Mostly from Text-to-speech) is the Inquisition torturing and killing a prophet of the Emperor after he lead his corrupted planet to peace and overthrew the chaos corruption there. The Ecclesiarchy came down to check what was corrupted and what wasn't and the Inquisition hauls off the Prophet and kills him before the Ecclesiarchy can determine if he was even corrupted. Later the taint of chaos was found on some of his followers, so the Inquisition felt smug about it, but there was never any proof the Prophet himself was corrupt. And again, the Celestial Lions story. The Lions are a space marine chapter who go in to take out a corrupt planetary leader, the Inquisition decides "Well if the leader was corrupt, then the entire planet must be, time to glass the bitch." despite the Lions protests. Outraged, they send a message to the High Lords of Terra. The ship they sent as messengers are murdered. This does not deter them. So the Inquisition has them sent against an Ork war band, outnumbered, outgunned and with terrible positions, and then each of their apothecaries (These are the guys who recover the Gene-seed because that shits important and not able to be created easily) are taken out by 'Ork Snipers' including the last one, who was shot at close range. With a Laspistol. In the Head. The remaining 95 Lions contact the Black Templars Chaplain Grimaldus (who is an entire character in his own right) to administer their Last Rites. He tells them that if they kill the Ork War Boss, then they'll have restored their honor and be allowed to leave. They succeed with more casualties and the Templars send out a detachment of their own marines to help the Lions pick themselves back up. The Celestial Lions are a lesson for what happens if you question the Inquisition. In time, the Inquisition will learn what happens when you gently caress with a Space Marine. Especially since the Black Templars are Absolutely Pissed. And that's not even considering the Inquisitions managed to piss off the Space Wolves.
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Aug 18, 2015 01:13
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Hyperion peaks because the ability to create a forward base means that if you take things patiently and don't mind defending more often. You can have the resources to guarentee your attacks go off without a hitch!
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Aug 18, 2015 01:20
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Seeing as we're talking about the inquisition I might as well talk about their organisation. The big thing about inquisitors is that for all intents and purposes they are SPECTREs from Mass Effect with even more power and less moderation. There are 3 main types each with their own rules and weirdness; the ordo xenos, the ordo hereticus, and the ordo malleus. These are the ordo majoris but there are also a bunch of ordo minoris that grow and shrink as necessary. So most of the really batshit problems with the Inquisition is they have no internal mechanism for dealing with traitorous members of their organisation other than sending a different inquisitor at them. So the greatest power of any single inquisitor, who are allowed to basically dick around the galaxy doing their own thing as long as they do any mission their superiors tell them to, is to call in an exterminatus. However whilst a single inquisitor can call in the exterminatus they then need 2 others to agree for the order to be carried out. Importantly this means a single inquisitor on your planet is not that big a problem and is best solved by actually working with him so he can do his job and leave, now if you have 3 on your planet you're right hosed and should probably leave as soon as possible. This also brings up the difference between young and old inquisitors, which is that inquisitors get older they become more radical as they realise doing everything by the book is a very good way to get very dead very fast. ' Edit: Originally there was a paragraph here that mentioned the Inquisition as being part of the Ecclesiarcy. This was an error that has been pointed out to me and as such I have removed the entire paragraph. Thank you Omni. Onmi posted:The Inquisition is not apart of the Ecclesiarchy. They are considered the Officio Inquisitorus, and even have a minor Ordo Sanctorum that is focused on policing the Ecclesiarchy. This also leaves out the greatest Space Marines of all time, the Grey Knights, who are actually in this game as a special unit for the Space Marines faction. Who used to be cool and then Matt loving Ward got hold of them and they became awful in both fluff and crunch, but that's a tale best saved for a different post. Lord_Magmar fucked around with this message at 02:07 on Aug 18, 2015 |
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Aug 18, 2015 01:45
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A side note for any wondering about the difference between new necron fluff and old necron fluff, here's the basics. Old fluff: the Necrons are slaves of the C'Tan star-gods, who will one day wipe out all life to serve their masters' terrible hunger. New fluff: ...or they were, until the Necrons figured out a way to fight back, shattered their gods, and used the broken fragments as colossal living metal war-Pokemon. The Triarch and its Praetorians would like to stress that ALL THE C'TAN GOT BROKEN. Anyone suggesting that courtesy of infighting among the Dynasties, Nemesors who weren't careful enough about deploying their C'tan shards to combat zones where other shards might be deployed, Crypteks who thought 'nah, really, I got this,' technical failures in their stasis-prisons, and/or failures of the Triarch's vigilance there might still be entire worlds of Necrons enslaved to the omnicidal will of the C'Tan will be quickly and summarily executed. The fact you will be dissected and interrogated down to the last synapse beforehand regarding what you saw and where you saw it should not be considered in any way to suggest that the Triarch is aware they missed a couple, and are utterly loving terrified of the potential consequences.
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Aug 18, 2015 01:47
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Lord_Magmar posted:Seeing as we're talking about the inquisition I might as well talk about their organisation. The big thing about inquisitors is that for all intents and purposes they are SPECTREs from Mass Effect with even more power and less moderation. There are 3 main types each with their own rules and weirdness; the ordo xenos, the ordo hereticus, and the ordo malleus. These are the ordo majoris but there are also a bunch of ordo minoris that grow and shrink as necessary. So most of the really batshit problems with the Inquisition is they have no internal mechanism for dealing with traitorous members of their organisation other than sending a different inquisitor at them. The Inquisition is not apart of the Ecclesiarchy. They are considered the Officio Inquisitorus, and even have a minor Ordo Sanctorum that is focused on policing the Ecclesiarchy. Ze Pollack posted:A side note for any wondering about the difference between new necron fluff and old necron fluff, here's the basics. It should be mentioned the Necrons are the ones that created the C'Tan, by taking harmless energy creatures who ate radiation and shoving them into giant robot bodies consisting of living metal because "What? Wasn't that the first thing you would do if you found harmless energy creatures?" Onmi fucked around with this message at 02:02 on Aug 18, 2015 |
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Aug 18, 2015 01:51
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Onmi posted:The Inquisition is not apart of the Ecclesiarchy. They are considered the Officio Inquisitorus, and even have a minor Ordo Sanctorum that is focused on policing the Ecclesiarchy. Thanks for pointing out my error, I will cut out that part of the original post. On the point of C'Tan I won't go too far into it but the harmless energy creature was the reason the Necrons lived for 30 years at best and was kind of constantly making GBS threads radiation on their planet. This creature became the Nightbringer by the way so yeah, not so much harmless as mindless.
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Aug 18, 2015 02:06
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That the new fluff? I thought they still went with the 'C'tan offered the Necrons eternal life by shoving them into machines'. EDIT: Just checked my RPG books which use the newest fluff, and yeah, they say that it was the C'tan who offered the Devil's bargain, and the Silent King who organized the backstabbing.
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Aug 18, 2015 02:06
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Lord_Magmar posted:Thanks for pointing out my error, I will cut out that part of the original post. On the point of C'Tan I won't go too far into it but the harmless energy creature was the reason the Necrons lived for 30 years at best and was kind of constantly making GBS threads radiation on their planet. This creature became the Nightbringer by the way so yeah, not so much harmless as mindless. I thought the radiation that was killing them came from their sun, which the C'Tan found tasty because they eat Radiation. quote:The first C'tan was found "sucking" the energies of the Necrontyr planet's sun, the same sun that gave off enough hard radiation to make proto-Necrontyr life short, nasty, short, brutish, and short. Yup. They just ate the stars radiation because that's how they evolved. The Necron's had already decided they wanted to kill ALL life because their own was so poo poo, and decided to harness the C'Tan for that purpose. Which lead to some pretty awesome poo poo.
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Aug 18, 2015 02:12
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Ze Pollack posted:A side note for any wondering about the difference between new necron fluff and old necron fluff, here's the basics. There is one that we know of still alive, Lore-wise. A post WWIII Not-Yet-Emperor-Of-Man defeated a Space Dragon and imprisoned it on Mars. He's actually farily well-known but all but a few who know its name know the truth. They call it Omnissiah.
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Aug 18, 2015 02:12
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RickVoid posted:There is one that we know of still alive, Lore-wise. A post WWIII Not-Yet-Emperor-Of-Man defeated a Space Dragon and imprisoned it on Mars. He's actually farily well-known but all but a few who know its name know the truth. Void Dragon ahoy! As for the LP, go for the Hyperion Peaks, that Forward Base is shiny. GhostStalker fucked around with this message at 04:53 on Aug 18, 2015 |
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Aug 18, 2015 02:15
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