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I think most of the republican candidates are pretty racist, but that's a minor quibble
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Aug 18, 2015 19:56
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Mirthless posted:Jesus Christ! I hope his parents are loving ashamed. His father is/was a civil engineer and his mother was a nuclear physicist, both lecturers at a college in India before immigrating to the U.S - and they came to the U.S. while his mother was pregnant with him, in case you needed any further evidence of his hypocrisy. He wants to end the very loving birthright citizenship that allowed him to become a citizen.
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Aug 18, 2015 20:00
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Zelder posted:Naw some people are through the looking glass, like thinking that trump will push hard/get single payer if he's president I think most progressive people in this thread see Trump for what he is, though. Basically, some charismatic rear end in a top hat CEO/GM that's hired to "turn the company" around and the new CEO/GM promises the world and most of what he's saying on the surface sounds good. Time passes, and nothing gets really better and in fact most things get worse. Then a few years later, the company goes completely under and the rear end in a top hat CEO skips out with a golden parachute. That's who Trump is, don't be fooled into thinking differently.
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Aug 18, 2015 20:01
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babypolis posted:i see a rising level of positive comments as the thread goes on and some people hauling him as some kind of political mastermind. who knows, maybe hes that smart. i think he certainly has a shot at the presidency. but hes also a loving piece of poo poo who deserves no respect, and would create untold suffering if elected. i think hes serious about what he says and also racist as gently caress which shows a lot of ignorance Yeah I don't think people are disagreeing with any of this as much as you think they are I don't think Trump would be good for this country or that he is a good person. I also don't think that about anyone running for president on the GOP side except maybe Kasich. I just find the implication that he's stupid to be naive and detrimental to fighting him. Dubya similarly exploited the assumption he was dumb and liberals spent eight years feeling smug about it while he drove the country into the ground. Underestimating your opponents can only help them.
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Aug 18, 2015 20:01
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gently caress You And Diebold posted:Trump should privatize the military He shares the same platform of making America great again as senator Armstrong so trump definitely should do this
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Aug 18, 2015 20:08
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i look forward to my short violent life under immortan don
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Aug 18, 2015 20:11
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Donald Trump is a fascist piece of poo poo and finally someone in the media is calling him out on it: For Mexicans, Trump’s bid is getting scarier https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...f363_story.html quote:“What he says makes me laugh, but it’s a nervous laughter,” said Gustavo Vega Canovas, a professor at the international studies center of the prestigious College of Mexico. “His comments sound to me like Germany in the 1930s, when they made Jews responsible for everything that was happening.”
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Aug 18, 2015 20:14
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a shameful boehner posted:Who wants to hear about Scott Walker's plan to replace Obamacare? Sample response of the conservative commentariat: https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/right-turn/wp/2015/08/18/walker-unveils-health-care-speech-new-message/ Basically, not that original, unpaid for, betrayal of image.
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Aug 18, 2015 20:17
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a shameful boehner posted:Who wants to hear about Scott Walker's plan to replace Obamacare? This is actually a good idea in combination with the current system. In each state there is a certain cost for a bronze plan at each age. Just give everyone a refundable tax credit for that amount. This is actually an expansion of Obamacare! Except he's going to demolish the current system give everyone a flat amount that won't cover a month's premium but hey maybe everyone will think he'll do the first thing and be tricked into voting for him!
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Aug 18, 2015 20:18
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Here's the deal, guys: All the Republicans except Trump are worse versions of Mitt Romney the candidate. I think Roger Ailes sees this. And also, money can actually make only so much of a difference (which is often a lot) and you get to a point where you're spending so much money you're wasting it. So let's say there's Scott Walker in the general and he has a PAC with like 2 billion or some freaking crazy number. He'll probably do about as well as Romney, in that he won't win.
Dahbadu fucked around with this message at 20:46 on Aug 18, 2015 |
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Aug 18, 2015 20:21
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As far as accuracy goes that isn't a terrible throw since it beans the kid in the face, but good god what a horrible spiral. America will not stand for a quarterback who throws like he's got a busted hand.
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Aug 18, 2015 20:22
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FAUXTON posted:As far as accuracy goes that isn't a terrible throw since it beans the kid in the face, but good god what a horrible spiral. America will not stand for a quarterback who throws like he's got a busted hand. But I was looking forward to president Tebow.
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Aug 18, 2015 20:24
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trump getting the nom means sanders gets 100% of the hispanic vote and it's gg
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Aug 18, 2015 20:24
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Mirthless posted:It's worth noting that Rosa Parks was chosen to represent the bus boycott because she looked "more middle class" over Claudette Colvin and was an adult. Nevermind that the poor and the young are the ones more likely to use buses.  Please, never ever get involved in activism of any sort, with the exception of movements I hate and want to fail.
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Aug 18, 2015 20:26
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I wish people would stop thinking Kasich is a good guy because of a couple rare moments of humanity in the blood circus that was the GOP debate. He's still a garbage person.
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Aug 18, 2015 20:30
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Dogstoyevsky posted:For fun, and because I hate when people lol at Clinton's favorability numbers out of context, here's everyone's favorability numbers that I could find on the HuffPo tracker (this is why Biden is here but not Chafee). To add to those numbers is the Undecideds/No Opinion. Of the people whose Undecided/No Opinion groups is less than their Favorability and Unfavorability are Hillary, Biden, Trump, Jeb!, Hucakbee, Christie and Paul. Most people have an opinion of them, one way or another which is probably better than none at all. Cruz is the only one whose Unfavorable rating is larger than both the Undecided and the Favorable rating so his prospects may be dwindling unless he can get those who're still on the fence about him to fall on his good side. Everyone else still has a ways to go to get an opinion formed about them. Kasich, Carson and Sanders (in decreasing order) have the most to do, but at this point, it's probably not a big deal if their name isn't out all that much yet. Nearly half are undecided for both Kasich and Carson.
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Aug 18, 2015 20:30
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GlyphGryph posted:
thats 100% true
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Aug 18, 2015 20:32
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Dahbadu posted:I think most progressive people in this thread see Trump for what he is, though. Basically, some charismatic rear end in a top hat CEO/GM that's hired to "turn the company" around and the new CEO/GM promises the world and most of what he's saying on the surface sounds good. Time passes, and nothing gets really better and in fact most things get worse. Then a few years later, the company goes completely under and the rear end in a top hat CEO skips out with a golden parachute. That's who Trump is, don't be fooled into thinking differently. whoa for a second I thought you were talking about Fiorina at HP, then I remembered it was doing fine when she showed up
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Aug 18, 2015 20:33
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GlyphGryph posted:
He's absolutely right. I also believe Claudette had some children out of marriage, which was held against her. Rosa Parks was, for lack of a better term, the perfect victim. Edit: though I wouldn't really say ""the upper classes"will victimize the poor" is an entirely fair assessment of what he's taking about, the facts are true
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Aug 18, 2015 20:35
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GlyphGryph posted:
It's called pragmatism, friend. Proper activists do what is necessary to achieve their goals, not just what feels good.
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Aug 18, 2015 20:36
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Sheng-ji Yang posted:thats 100% true The individual sentences are all true (although not 100% true, since they leave out things that are kind of important). The conclusion they seem to be drawing, on the other hand, is just incredibly stupid. Vox Nihili posted:It's called pragmatism, friend. Proper activists do what is necessary to achieve their goals, not just what feels good.
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Aug 18, 2015 20:37
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GlyphGryph posted:The individual sentences are all true (although not 100% true, since they leave out things that are kind of important). The conclusion they seem to be drawing, on the other hand, is just incredibly stupid. What conclusion are you reading, here?
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Aug 18, 2015 20:38
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stoutfish posted:trump getting the nom means sanders gets 100% of the hispanic vote and it's gg  Unfortunately, I don't think this will be the case. Keep in mind this is all hypothetical predictions and stuff, but I would say: Trump would get a percentage of the hispanic vote that Republicans have historically gotten, adjusting for trendlines. Maybe a little bit more compared to any other Repub that would have been in his place. Trump would also energize the electorate that don't see a problem voting for Republicans (not necessary Repubs, but people that don't see Repubs as the problem and don't think a vote for the GOP is a problem in and of itself) in a way we haven't seen for a long time.
Dahbadu fucked around with this message at 20:44 on Aug 18, 2015 |
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Aug 18, 2015 20:39
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Vox Nihili posted:What conclusion are you reading, here? That sentence 1 is problem that causes sentence 4, and was wrong because of sentence 2 and 3. Maybe I'm wrong to have read condemnation into it, but I guess I don't know what else it was trying to say since otherwise it's just repeating what others had already said. That sentence 2 is even brought up at all just seems pretty stupid, since it's... entirely irrelevant. It doesn't matter who did/didn't ride buses, it matters who had the power to change the circumstances. Like it doesn't even make any sense in the context of sentence 4 alone, forget among the other bits. GlyphGryph fucked around with this message at 20:43 on Aug 18, 2015 |
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Aug 18, 2015 20:41
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Vox Nihili posted:What conclusion are you reading, here? That the upper classes will disenfranchise the poor. Which is totally true but I'm not sure how well it applies to that situation in the civil rights movement
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Aug 18, 2015 20:41
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So Santorum is stealing Rand's schtick now?
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Aug 18, 2015 20:44
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Vox Nihili posted:What conclusion are you reading, here? It seems kind of like a condemnation of pragmatism And also weirdly close to condemning the civil rights movement, and indeed Rosa Parks personally, as an agent of class disenfranchisement
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Aug 18, 2015 20:44
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Zelder posted:That the upper classes will disenfranchise the poor. Which is totally true but I'm not sure how well it applies to that situation in the civil rights movement Zelder posted:Edit: though I wouldn't really say ""the upper classes"will victimize the poor" is an entirely fair assessment of what he's taking about, the facts are true
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Aug 18, 2015 20:45
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So, I'm seeing the following outcomes when it comes to the 2016 election: 1) Trump flares out ("quits on his own terms"), ending up with one of the GOP hopefulls (likely JEB!) boring the base to sleep even as they try to work up excitement for him, end result is likely a repeat of 2012. 2) Trump stays in, but is forced out of the GOP and runs third party, voter base is split, commence laughter as GOP vote is hilariously gutted. 3) GOP grudgingly accepts Trump as their best candidate causing moderates/wall street money to jump ship to Hillary because she likely won't rock the boat (and their paychecks) too much. Result is worse for the GOP than 1 but not as hilariously humiliating as 2. 4) The stars align and both Trump and Bernie secure the party nominations. Results: I have no loving clue and I'm not sure if I want on this wild ride, but it'll sure be exciting while it lasts. Obviously 1-3 assume Hillary leads/takes the Dem nomination. Is this about what the rest of the thread thinks are the likely outcomes?
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Aug 18, 2015 20:45
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GlyphGryph posted:That sentence 1 is problem that causes sentence 4, and was wrong because of sentence 2 and 3. Maybe I'm wrong to have read condemnation into it, but I guess I don't know what else it was trying to say since otherwise it's just repeating what others had already said. My reading was that the people that need to be persuaded are lovely and require lovely tactics, not that the activists themselves are personally blameworthy.
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Aug 18, 2015 20:46
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The moral of Rosa Parks: If you want a successful civil rights movement in America, you have to know how to manipulate the whites who will otherwise just not give a poo poo.
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Aug 18, 2015 20:47
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Dahbadu posted:Trump would get a percentage of the hispanic vote that Republicans have historically gotten, adjusting for trendlines. Maybe a little bit more. i dont see how you are coming to this, trump right now is a massive joke among hispanic people. hed be lucky to get near romney's numbers, and has no loving hope of getting bush's 40% of the hispanic vote.
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Aug 18, 2015 20:51
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Sheng-ji Yang posted:i dont see how you are coming to this, trump right now is a massive joke among hispanic people. hed be lucky to get near romney's numbers, and has no loving hope of getting bush's 40% of the hispanic vote. He I believe that you'll find Trump is going to win the Hispanic vote and the regular vote. He's very popular among the Hispanics. (From the CNN-poll, it didn't actually mention hispanics, but it shows he's doing just as good as Bush among non-whites in terms of approval ratings.) GlyphGryph fucked around with this message at 20:55 on Aug 18, 2015 |
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Aug 18, 2015 20:53
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Sheng-ji Yang posted:i dont see how you are coming to this, trump right now is a massive joke among hispanic people. hed be lucky to get near romney's numbers, and has no loving hope of getting bush's 40% of the hispanic vote. I'm not saying he's going to get 40% of Hispanic vote, dude. I'm saying that he'd get about as much of the Hispanic vote as any other generic Repub in his place (and possibly a little more) vs. Sanders. Is that 20%? I don't know.
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Aug 18, 2015 20:55
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Pavlov posted:The moral of Rosa Parks: If you want a successful civil rights movement in America, you have to know how to manipulate the whites who will otherwise just not give a poo poo. It's called the 80s crime wave.
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Aug 18, 2015 20:57
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Why are you projecting Trump against Sanders. They are not in the same primary.
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Aug 18, 2015 20:58
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euphronius posted:Why are you projecting Trump against Sanders. They are not in the same primary. Because I was responding to a hypothetical Trump vs. Sanders statement.
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Aug 18, 2015 21:00
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Dahbadu posted:I'm not saying he's going to get 40% of Hispanic vote, dude. I'm saying that he'd get about as much of the Hispanic vote as any other generic Repub in his place (and possibly a little more) vs. Sanders. Is that 15%? I don't know. romney got 27%, george bush got 40% in 2004. id say trump would be very very lucky to get half of that if he ends up the nominee (lol). hes certainly not going to see a maintenance or growth of GOP support among hispanic people. if anything he has probably hurt their support of the GOP even if hes not the nominee.
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Aug 18, 2015 21:00
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Sheng-ji Yang posted:romney got 27%, george bush got 40% in 2004. id say trump would be very very lucky to get half of that if he ends up the nominee (lol). hes certainly not going to see a maintenance or growth of GOP support among hispanic people. if anything he has probably hurt their support of the GOP even if hes not the nominee. Then how do you explain his 29% approval rating among non-whites? Which minority vote IS he attracting?
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Aug 18, 2015 21:02
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GlyphGryph posted:Then how do you explain his 29% approval rating among non-whites? Which minority vote IS he attracting? measuring minority vote split between 17 candidates in a 300-person poll for the republican nomination means it will all be statistical noise. there would have been roughly 30 minorities polled in that scenario
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Aug 18, 2015 21:04
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