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echronorian posted:Biden V Trump in a Presidential debate would be the greatest Presidential debate of my lifetime. It sounds so amazing. Very unlikely and all that, but you can't say you wouldn't want to see Biden and Trump going at each other. Biden did extremely good in the VP debate in 2012 (and 2008 he held back like he should have). Although in the 2008 primaries in a 2007 debate I believe he was the most vocal critic of Obama saying he'd go into Pakistan to kill Bin Laden, and we know how that turned out now. Anyway I doubt Biden will run unless Clinton were to drop out for some reason. He has none of the framework built.
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Aug 24, 2015 03:39
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Absurd Alhazred posted:If Biden splits the establishment vote, won't that help Bernie? Yes. I think most assumed scenarios where Biden enters are where Clinton dies/melts down, though, to prevent that.
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Aug 24, 2015 03:44
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Dahbadu posted:Honestly, I don't think there's much difference except people are starting to realize that the game is rigged and they're pissed. I'm not sure it's reached a critical mass, but it gets a lot closer each cycle. When you combine that with two candidates that are true aberrations in American politics at this level, things that were important in past elections may not be as important in this election. --A bull moose party supporter, 1912
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Aug 24, 2015 03:46
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LOL the music makes this. https://instagram.com/p/6NbVyEmhdB/?taken-by=realdonaldtrump
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Aug 24, 2015 03:47
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Evil Fluffy posted:I've always wondered what paying off the debt completely would mean for US and global economies, or if the world would basically keep on truckin' minus the "China owns the US via DEBT! Trump's also come out in favor of increased infrastructure spending, lol. Boosted_C5 posted:This is where a LOT of us in the GOP stand. As a Sanders-supporting socialist I support this proposal. I remember looking up the Canadian tax rates when I was rebutting the notion that single-payer wouldn't work here, and iirc, those making under $25k/year or so paid no federal taxes (and received single-payer without having to pay premiums). I think it's a crime that FICA is levied on dollar one of income, making it the most regressive facet of the US tax system (especially given that FICA phases out completely at over $110k or so).
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Aug 24, 2015 03:48
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" non-issue.
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Absurd Alhazred posted:If Biden splits the establishment vote, won't that help Bernie? only if sander supporters are locked in (which tbh 75-80% are)
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Aug 24, 2015 03:49
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Absurd Alhazred posted:If Biden splits the establishment vote, won't that help Bernie? There's some debate (and varied polling) as to whether Hillary or Bernie would be hurt more if Biden runs, mainly because of the anti-Hillary vote that isn't as comfortable with an old Jewish socialist. But Biden's got some serious electability issues himself, ranging from his youthful indiscretions with plagiarism to his dirty-uncle touchy-feely crap with preteen girls in official photo ops.
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Aug 24, 2015 03:52
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Willa Rogers posted:I think it's a crime that FICA is levied on dollar one of income It has to be. Otherwise you can't call SS and Medicare anything other than welfare with a straight face. BUT with 0% income tax on income up to a certain level, and keeping EITC, you'd have people ending up with a negative federal income tax effective rate. Also the great part of the plan (or something similar but more brilliant than mine) is that low corporate rate. WE'D become the world destination for corporate outsourcing. gently caress you Bahamas, Bermuda, Cayman Islands, etc.: http://www.forbes.com/pictures/gg45ehmhi/bahamas/ It also counters the "YOU'LL KILL INVESTMENT" argument that will come form proposing eliminating separate treatment of cap gains. Yeah, they'd be taxed a little higher at a flat 25% rate, BUT the corporations you're investing in will be sitting a lot prettier with a flat 12% corporate income tax to help fund ss/medicare. Boosted_C5 fucked around with this message at 03:56 on Aug 24, 2015 |
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Aug 24, 2015 03:53
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Raskolnikov38 posted:only if sander supporters are locked in (which tbh 75-80% are) Biden is the establishment candidate that can not only win but comes with a poo poo ton less baggage and has the charisma to carry his campaign. Anyone that isnt a completely delusional poor dude from San Francisco who is riding the Ron Paul 2.0 train can be talked into a Diamond Joe run. Plus, Biden makes a real good fit for one of the Castros, or if he is feeling super saucy Jill Stein. TBPH he's the only Dem that could talk around Trump, and that is a growing concern. Willa Rogers posted:But Biden's got some serious electability issues himself, ranging from his youthful indiscretions with plagiarism to his dirty-uncle touchy-feely crap with preteen girls in official photo ops. dude pulled a biker chick onto his lap right in front of her man, it has nothing to do with "preteen" and everything to do with Biden being a hugger. Youre gonna get hugs.
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Aug 24, 2015 03:54
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Boosted_C5 posted:It has to be. Otherwise you can't call SS and Medicare anything other than welfare with a straight face. What would the tax rate be for capital gains and dividends under the Carson/Huckabee/GOP flat tax plans?
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Aug 24, 2015 03:57
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Boosted_C5 posted:It has to be. Otherwise you can't call SS and Medicare anything other than welfare with a straight face. Yah, paying FICA on dollar one would be ok with no federal tax up to $25k, especially if the negative tax were refundable, like the EITC.
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Aug 24, 2015 03:57
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Spaceman Future! posted:Biden is the establishment candidate that can not only win but comes with a poo poo ton less baggage and has the charisma to carry his campaign. Anyone that isnt a completely delusional poor dude from San Francisco who is riding the Ron Paul 2.0 train can be talked into a Diamond Joe run. Plus, Biden makes a real good fit for one of the Castros, or if he is feeling super saucy Jill Stein. TBPH he's the only Dem that could talk around Trump, and that is a growing concern. As to your first point, I forgot to mention his baggage of sponsoring that horrible BK bill and supporting most of its provisions. And I wasn't referencing biker chicks but actual preteens, like the ones he's been macking on for the last couple years.  eta: 
Willa Rogers fucked around with this message at 04:44 on Aug 24, 2015 |
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Aug 24, 2015 03:59
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Biden wouldn't be that different from a hillary presidency, but on the plus side he's far less hawkish and conservative-neoliberal on foreign policy than hillary, and he has baggage with Bibi Netanyahu (this is a plus) compared to hillslaw's unwavering support and plans for making BDS illegal/enforcing current restrictions on boycotting Israel. I'd be happier with Biden, but I still vastly prefer a non-establishment candidate like Bernie. I'd at least vote for Biden over Trump so he's got that going.
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Aug 24, 2015 04:00
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Willa Rogers posted:As to your first point, I forgot to mention his baggage of sponsoring that horrible BK bill and supporting most of its provisions. America is ready for a pedophile president.
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Aug 24, 2015 04:02
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Considering Spaceman's obsession with Ron Paul I'd like him to express what about the Ron Paul push was shameful/he did not like, and how those aspects apply to Sandstorm. Because if the only aspect he can think of is "they supported a non-establishment candidate" then that's a rather depressing reason to oppose bernie.
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Aug 24, 2015 04:02
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Neurolimal posted:Considering Spaceman's obsession with Ron Paul I'd like him to express what about the Ron Paul push was shameful/he did not like, and how those aspects apply to Sandstorm. Ron Paul makes a wonderful shorthand for idiots chasing political lost causes and the butthurt. Self identify much? Neurolimal posted:Because if the only aspect he can think of is "they supported a non-establishment candidate" then that's a rather depressing reason to oppose bernie. ah, Ill take that as a big fat YES then.
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Aug 24, 2015 04:04
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Spaceman Future! posted:Ron Paul makes a wonderful shorthand for idiots chasing political lost causes and the butthurt. Self identify much? I dont know if Bernie will win. What I do know is that I will not let my apathy win. Bernie is the best leader we could have out of the presidential pool, so I will back him. The primaries is too early of a time to begin settling for lesser evils.
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Aug 24, 2015 04:06
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Neurolimal posted:I dont know if Bernie will win. What I do know is that I will not let my apathy win. Bernie is the best leader we could have out of the presidential pool, so I will back him. Apathy has nothing to do with the state of the parties at the executive level, if you want change it needs to be incurred at the local level and pushed up. Voters like you are just the lazy ones who think there's a big candy red button where you can skip the step of your own involvement in piddly local races and make big impossible things happen without any effort at all. Thats not apathy, that's just refusal to participate in the process in any meaningful way.
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Aug 24, 2015 04:09
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Spaceman Future! posted:Apathy has nothing to do with the state of the parties at the executive level, if you want change it needs to be incurred at the local level and pushed up. Voters like you are just the lazy ones who think there's a big candy red button where you can skip the step of your own involvement in piddly local races and make big impossible things happen without any effort at all. Thats not apathy, that's just refusal to participate in the process in any meaningful way. You seem to be assuming a lot about Neuroliminal.
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Aug 24, 2015 04:13
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white progressives saying "donald trump has good ideas" is why bernie sanders has no minority support hth
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Aug 24, 2015 04:15
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Spaceman Future! posted:Apathy has nothing to do with the state of the parties at the executive level, if you want change it needs to be incurred at the local level and pushed up. Voters like you are just the lazy ones who think there's a big candy red button where you can skip the step of your own involvement in piddly local races and make big impossible things happen without any effort at all. Thats not apathy, that's just refusal to participate in the process in any meaningful way. First of all, Sanders is the direct result of that strategy. He's a socialist that climbed his way up to Vermont's incumbent senator, and has placed himself in a position to run for president in a time where public support of individual socialist policies could not be higher. The end result of the local elections strat is not "sit pretty and wait for an establishment candidate who wont lie about supporting financially left policies", it's to get those local fuckers into the big races. Second, If the UK can elect an outright socialist opposition leader, even as his entire parties politicians tries to tar and feather him as "unelectable", "too radical", and "if you vote for him you're letting the tories [UK republicans] win forever!", then we can at least try our damnedest to do the same. 2015-2016 is the year of socialist populism, and it's time we made a go at jumping on that wave.
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Aug 24, 2015 04:21
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WhiskeyJuvenile posted:white progressives saying "donald trump has good ideas" is why bernie sanders has no minority support hth  It must suck for you to support someone whose policies are to the actual right of some of Trump's
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Aug 24, 2015 04:25
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Neurolimal posted:First of all, Sanders is the direct result of that strategy. He's a socialist that climbed his way up to Vermont's incumbent senator, and has placed himself in a position to run for president in a time where public support of individual socialist policies could not be higher. The end result of the local elections strat is not "sit pretty and wait for an establishment candidate who wont lie about supporting financially left policies", it's to get those local fuckers into the big races. Have you been in touch with your local and state legislators? Do you know who you're voting for, and why? Do you realize how many important decisions are made at those levels?
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Aug 24, 2015 04:25
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self-ID'd "socialist" whiskey juvenile: "trump's wanting to tax hedge-funders is why black voters don't like him, as opposed to the months'-long clinton-supporters' rovian narrative that bernie hates black people"
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Aug 24, 2015 04:29
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Absurd Alhazred posted:Have you been in touch with your local and state legislators? Do you know who you're voting for, and why? Do you realize how many important decisions are made at those levels? Yes, I do and have. That doesn't mean we should let up opportunities to enact change on a large scale as well. You can plant a tree and protest a forest clearing.
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Aug 24, 2015 04:29
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I would much rather have a socialist doing Harry Reid's job than be President tbh, it's sad that's not even close to happening.
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Aug 24, 2015 04:30
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Neurolimal posted:Yes, I do and have. That doesn't mean we should let up opportunities to enact change on a large scale as well. You can plant a tree and protest a forest clearing. Very good.
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Aug 24, 2015 04:30
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Willa Rogers posted:As to your first point, I forgot to mention his baggage of sponsoring that horrible BK bill and supporting most of its provisions. the girl on the bottom looks like a 40 year old 12 year old
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Aug 24, 2015 04:30
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Boosted_C5 posted:It has to be. Otherwise you can't call SS and Medicare anything other than welfare with a straight face.
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Aug 24, 2015 04:33
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Mitt Romney posted:What would the tax rate be for capital gains and dividends under the Carson/Huckabee/GOP flat tax plans? Huckabee's would technically be zero because his plan is a universal sales tax that replaces all other forms of taxation. I forgot how much Carson expects corporations to tithe. It wasn't much.
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Aug 24, 2015 04:38
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spacemang_spliff posted:the girl on the bottom looks like a 40 year old 12 year old getting macked on by an old guy when you're 12 has that effect.
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Aug 24, 2015 04:41
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If Biden gets in the race, are we assuming Hillary drops out? It seems to me that a three way race with two establishment democrats on the conservative side would be a dream scenario for Bernie.
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Aug 24, 2015 04:43
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NotWearingPants posted:If Biden gets in the race, are we assuming Hillary drops out?
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Aug 24, 2015 04:45
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FlamingLiberal posted:Why would she drop out? if she actually did something hella illegal with emails so she wont drop out. probably.
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Aug 24, 2015 04:46
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another strike against biden (tho prolly not for younguns who don't remember this) is his disgraceful conduct during the confirmation hearings and vote in favor for clarence thomas to scotus. in sum, biden: 1. voted in favor of stripping bankruptcy protection for medical bill-havers, homeowners, military members serving overseas. 2. voted to confirm clarence thomas after trying anita hill for the crime of being sexually harassed at work. 3. can't keep his hands off preteen girls. yah, super-cool candidate for a party running against "the war on women" 
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Aug 24, 2015 04:50
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Nessus posted:I agree completely, and look forward to your proposal on what aspect of our massive military we should cut. Personally I'd say we should favor the Navy over the other services. abolish the marines
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Aug 24, 2015 04:52
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FlamingLiberal posted:Why would she drop out? I don't know! But if she's not dropping out why would Biden get in? He's like a Hillary clone only without her massive support in the deep south. Where the hell would he get votes from? Delaware?
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Aug 24, 2015 04:53
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NotWearingPants posted:I don't know! Commandeer all the corporations listed in Delaware. 
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Aug 24, 2015 04:55
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Willa Rogers posted:
I'm probably voting Bernie in the primary but ok
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Aug 24, 2015 04:55
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Willa Rogers posted:self-ID'd "socialist" whiskey juvenile: "trump's wanting to tax hedge-funders is why black voters don't like him, as opposed to the months'-long clinton-supporters' rovian narrative that bernie hates black people" white progressives being the kind to say "wow, trump sounds so reasonable" when trump is, in fact, irl racist is a problem that has existed before the 2016 cycle
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Aug 24, 2015 04:57
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