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Yardbomb posted:Forgot to mention, There's an audio clip where you hear her actually being raped in the bar scene in the game files. EDIT: You can hear them here. Ekster fucked around with this message at 18:32 on Aug 29, 2015 |
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Aug 29, 2015 18:29
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Danaru posted:Is this that game where the devs flipped the gently caress out telling all gamers to die on twitter, and how it was everyone's fault but theirs that the gameplay was awful? I remember seeing the freak out but never actually saw what game it was based around. yes
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Aug 29, 2015 18:32
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Ekster posted:There's an audio clip where you hear her actually being raped in the bar scene in the game files. I guess I should at least be thankful that teen gangrape was too far even for David Cage to include in the end 
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Aug 29, 2015 18:32
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ok, is there a good LP to Beyond (i know there was a goon LP but it was really terrible and weird and there was drama involved?) and what is the basic storyline again? i know Helen Paige is a super secretive psychic agent but that's about it
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Aug 29, 2015 18:34
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Ekster posted:There's an audio clip where you hear her actually being raped in the bar scene in the game files. why would you seek this out and link it
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Aug 29, 2015 18:35
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The Saddest Rhino posted:ok, is there a good LP to Beyond (i know there was a goon LP but it was really terrible and weird and there was drama involved?) and what is the basic storyline again? i know Helen Paige is a super secretive psychic agent but that's about it Two Best Friends have an LP that's them laughing at it/rightfully making GBS threads on David Cage nearly the whole time. I'd highly recommend it.
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Aug 29, 2015 18:36
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poptart_fairy posted:why would you seek this out and link it hey man don't poo poo on tcrf they got a difficult job
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Aug 29, 2015 18:37
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poptart_fairy posted:why would you seek this out and link it Because I want you all to suffer as much as I did.
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Aug 29, 2015 18:37
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Yardbomb posted:Two Best Friends have an LP that's them laughing at it/rightfully making GBS threads on David Cage nearly the whole time. I'd highly recommend it. nice i'll check that out Ekster posted:Because I want you all to suffer as much as I did. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1LzruO-eUU
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Aug 29, 2015 18:41
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I'm glad we could all bond here today over the impressive horror that is David Cage's writing. 
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Aug 29, 2015 18:54
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cage doesn't explain the origami figures left behind because he thinks that a macguffin is a thing you can put into the story that you don't explain and you can do it one per story. I'd argue sam barlowe (shatmemz/herstory) is also a bad writer but I'm mostly importing my opinions from voidburger. It's frustrating to me that these are the games celebrated as being deep stories when they'd be laughable if presented in any other medium and they don't really have the interactivity to excuse that. e: no ones going to start screaming at me for disliking those games from secondhand experience, right? i admit they might be fun games to play but cage is a terrible writer. being careful because in another thread some guy started screaming his lungs out at me for not liking chrono cross for killing all the cool chrono trigger guys despite not having played the game Hemingway To Go! fucked around with this message at 19:04 on Aug 29, 2015 |
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Aug 29, 2015 19:00
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Ekster posted:There's an audio clip where you hear her actually being raped in the bar scene in the game files. I was surprised this didn't happen in the game since everything else about that scene was setting up, uh, Silent Witness I think is the movie name? An homage like that is right up David Cage's alley.
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Aug 29, 2015 19:10
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Acne Rain posted:e: no ones going to start screaming at me for disliking those games from secondhand experience, right? i admit they might be fun games to play but cage is a terrible writer. being careful because in another thread some guy started screaming his lungs out at me for not liking chrono cross for killing all the cool chrono trigger guys despite not having played the game no your post pretty much hit the nail on the head about what a failure "cinematic" games are. there's barely any game to play.
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Aug 29, 2015 19:14
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The Saddest Rhino posted:Madison (David Cage likes White Lingerie)  
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Aug 29, 2015 19:18
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Acne Rain posted:It's frustrating to me that these are the games celebrated as being deep stories when they'd be laughable if presented in any other medium and they don't really have the interactivity to excuse that. I mean, you can complain about plot holes and characters not being very fleshed out as much as you want, but the average person isn't judging the quality of a story based on those things, they're basing it on emotional experience. And Heavy Rain is pretty intense with its emotions. I think this rule applies to other mediums as well, honestly.
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Aug 29, 2015 19:18
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Neo Rasa posted:I was surprised this didn't happen in the game since everything else about that scene was setting up, uh, Silent Witness I think is the movie name? An homage like that is right up David Cage's alley. Well, given that Aiden nearly chokes a kid to death for rubbing Jodie's face in with snow, it would've been really weird if Aiden didn't intervene. EDIT: Note that Ethan literally pulls out a gun in that scene and shoots himself. It's amazing.
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Aug 29, 2015 19:19
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 Jesus loving christ
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Aug 29, 2015 19:19
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Acne Rain posted:I'd argue sam barlowe (shatmemz/herstory) is also a bad writer but I'm mostly importing my opinions from voidburger.
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Aug 29, 2015 19:25
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Acne Rain posted:It's frustrating to me that these are the games celebrated as being deep stories when they'd be laughable if presented in any other medium and they don't really have the interactivity to excuse that. There's an ongoing problem at the moment concerning that. Interactive storytelling requires a different approach than any other kind, since it needs to cover a lot of different potentialities; there's a good example of this in Until Dawn, with how entire conversations can change depending upon what clues you have and haven't found. In an interactive work, you cannot depend on the player to have found everything (and probably shouldn't design the game as if they have, lest you be seen as having spoon-fed it to the player), you can't assume they have. It's why a lot of questions about plot holes in even relatively simple games can often be answered by citing some random detail that the player simply happened to miss. In a real way, people are still honing this as a skill and process, and one of the reasons people talk about David Cage at all is because he's willing to hang his rear end out there for it. I don't like his games at all, but he's basically building an entire career out of being the ambitious negative example. He's loving up so you don't have to. As such, I think it's important to not compare interactive story games to what happens in any other medium, because it's very different. A movie, book, play, television show, or more linear game can indulge itself in simply being a point A to point B ride; an interactive story has to account for a lot of other factors based upon choices, style of play, and the player's reflexes or skill level, and it has to do so to a certain extent lest it be perceived as too linear. It also has to overcome this bizarre stigma from the gamer community for being "not a game" or a "walking simulator," because there are a lot of stupid, mouthy people who resent being made to think about anything besides kill counts or inventory management. Remember, this is still a very young art form, relatively speaking. We're only about twenty to thirty years in, and even movies are over a century old. When it comes to video game storytelling, unless a developer actively rips off film and TV's toolset, this is the silent era.
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Aug 29, 2015 19:28
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Groovelord Neato posted:i mean that would be a more interesting premise so i don't see why you'd even question that. gone home has stupid red herrings about this creepy old guy into the occult or whatever and sets it during a dark and stormy night when it's a coming of age story about young love and a family drifting apart. It'd be a more gruesome premise, or at least a more acceptably mainstream one. It wouldn't automatically be more interesting. You'd still be exploring a particularly nasty crime scene long after the fact, when there's no risk of personal danger; you'd just be digging up tissue samples and bullet holes rather than SNES cartridges and shampoo bottles. A lot of the complaints about Gone Home, aside from its high price tag, seem to be coming from a bizarre, shallow place in the complainant's mind, where it suddenly isn't a game unless it checks off at least one of the complainant's boxes. When you get right down to it, Gone Home is The 7th Guest, except the "puzzle" is "Where is everybody?"
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Aug 29, 2015 19:40
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the game in my av/user name tells a story better than any of those "story games" because it does so understanding the medium of video games is different than a book or movie. these story games want to be books/movies.
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Aug 29, 2015 19:42
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It's exacerbated by Gone Home being first person and not focusing on the checklist of "guns? killing people? horror gore?" Remember even METROID PRIME got flak for just being some baby game and not a real person's video game or whatever before it came out.
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Aug 29, 2015 19:42
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When is someone going to make another game that lets you pick up and examine practically every single object in a series of rooms in painstaking detail. Because I would buy and play the poo poo out of it.
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Aug 29, 2015 19:48
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FruitPunchSamurai posted:When is someone going to make another game that lets you pick up and examine practically every single object in a series of rooms in painstaking detail. Because I would buy and play the poo poo out of it. Cradle looks like it is that.
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Aug 29, 2015 19:50
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FruitPunchSamurai posted:When is someone going to make another game that lets you pick up and examine practically every single object in a series of rooms in painstaking detail. Because I would buy and play the poo poo out of it.
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Aug 29, 2015 19:53
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Groovelord Neato posted:the game in my av/user name tells a story better than any of those "story games" because it does so understanding the medium of video games is different than a book or movie. these story games want to be books/movies. Nah, son. The only way in which that criticism has merit is if the game isn't taking advantage of its interactivity. Otherwise, you're gatekeeping out of personal dislike, and that's you being intensely stupid. When a game deliberately makes its story its point, as opposed to the story being something wrapped around the actual point, you want to give the player the ability to change or dig into that story. In Telltale games, you can change your protagonist and his/her reactions to the story unfolding around them; in Gone Home, the story's already happened, but you have to figure it all out for yourself at your own pace through deduction; in Until Dawn, you change the story itself through your choices. All are valid; none would be dramatically improved by being a book or a movie, because that essential interactivity would be gone. Neo Rasa posted:It's exacerbated by Gone Home being first person and not focusing on the checklist of "guns? killing people? horror gore?" Remember even METROID PRIME got flak for just being some baby game and not a real person's video game or whatever before it came out. Yeah, I'll never understand the impulse for people to want to limit the things they enjoy.
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Aug 29, 2015 19:56
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Wanderer posted:Nah, son. The only way in which that criticism has merit is if the game isn't taking advantage of its interactivity. Otherwise, you're gatekeeping out of personal dislike, and that's you being intensely stupid. lmao what. nah what I said was right on the money but I guess I can see why walking simulators keep getting made if people just want barely interactive movies or the video game equiv of choose your own adventure books (which i guess are sorta related). the story already occurred in dark souls btw
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Aug 29, 2015 20:03
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Groovelord Neato posted:lmao what. nah what I said was right on the money but I guess I can see why walking simulators keep getting made if people just want barely interactive movies or the video game equiv of choose your own adventure books (which i guess are sorta related).
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Aug 29, 2015 20:07
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Acne Rain posted:cage doesn't explain the origami figures left behind because he thinks that a macguffin is a thing you can put into the story that you don't explain and you can do it one per story. That's not what a macguffin means. And you gave no argument why you dislike Sam Barlows writing (which I do think have problems too). Also your weird defensiveness is weird af
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Aug 29, 2015 20:07
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Wanton Spoon posted:I would not have liked Gone Home if it had been a book or a movie. It's just exploring a house and reading documents, but there's a difference between being able to do that yourself and watching someone else do it. i wouldn't have liked heavy rain as a book or a movie but that still doesn't make it a good or well made video game.
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Aug 29, 2015 20:11
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Groovelord Neato posted:i wouldn't have liked heavy rain as a book or a movie but that still doesn't make it a good or well made video game. My point is that I did like it as a game, even if you didn't like it as any of those three things. It doesn't need to be transformed into a movie just because you don't like it as a game. It doesn't work as it is unless it's a game. Is part of the issue here just terminology? Would it help if we didn't call them "video games"? The only reason we call them that is because they grew out of video games, but it's true that they don't focus on the "game" aspect as much as most video games do. They're not movies either, though, and wouldn't work better as movies.
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Aug 29, 2015 20:16
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my real reason for disliking it is it wasn't worth 20 bucks. i guess we could just call them simulators. flight simulators aren't really games or even fun except for plane spergs.
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Aug 29, 2015 20:20
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That's fair
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Aug 29, 2015 20:20
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Lol
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Aug 29, 2015 20:21
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Groovelord Neato posted:lmao what. nah what I said was right on the money but I guess I can see why walking simulators keep getting made if people just want barely interactive movies or the video game equiv of choose your own adventure books (which i guess are sorta related). Every video game is equivalent to the "Choose Your Own Adventure" books. It's simply that the choice is usually "Do I fail my current objective?" (where "objective" typically means your own personal survival, but it may change) and you make it five thousand times in a row. You're scrambling to try to dismiss a genre built around emergent gameplay and player choice based upon your own biases, mostly because you seem to be pretty dumb. There's no merit to your position on this, and the faster you realize that, the better off you're going to be.
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Aug 29, 2015 20:22
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Wanderer posted:Every video game is equivalent to the "Choose Your Own Adventure" books. It's simply that the choice is usually "Do I fail my current objective?" (where "objective" typically means your own personal survival, but it may change) and you make it five thousand times in a row. edit: oh i got trolled gg i am dumb Groovelord Neato fucked around with this message at 20:32 on Aug 29, 2015 |
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Aug 29, 2015 20:26
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The Saddest Rhino posted:That's not what a macguffin means. And you gave no argument why you dislike Sam Barlows writing (which I do think have problems too). Also your weird defensiveness is weird af http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/19/interview-spoiling-heavy-rain-with-david-cage/ quote:How about the Origami figure in Ethan's hand when he wakes up? I can't explain that.
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Aug 29, 2015 20:37
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Groovelord Neato posted:my real reason for disliking it is it wasn't worth 20 bucks. You could've just opened with this and saved everyone the headache of reading your posts.
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Aug 29, 2015 20:58
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Isn't a MaxGuffin supposed to be an item that drives the plot? In that case the origami isn't a MacGuffin, they are just objective markers. The game doesn't have a solitary thing they are chasing, beside the kid himself
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Aug 29, 2015 21:02
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DreamShipWrecked posted:Isn't a MaxGuffin supposed to be an item that drives the plot? In that case the origami isn't a MacGuffin, they are just objective markers. The game doesn't have a solitary thing they are chasing, beside the kid himself ding ding ding, a macguffin is the thing everyone wants. you know more about writing than david cage.
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Aug 29, 2015 21:03
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