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illrepute posted:I'm currently studying abroad in Jordan and attempting to get an internship with an organization that handles matters concerning Syrian refugees. If I get in, I'd be happy to talk about the program and what the situation looks like from the Jordanian side. If you want any advice PM me. But if you're already there you probably know the lay of the land. Good luck.
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Sep 4, 2015 13:10
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illrepute posted:I'm currently studying abroad in Jordan and attempting to get an internship with an organization that handles matters concerning Syrian refugees. If I get in, I'd be happy to talk about the program and what the situation looks like from the Jordanian side. Yeah, keep us posted. I'm hoping to take an Arabic course in Amman next summer. I've also worked for a refugee resettlement agency in the U.S., and the plurality of our clients were Iraqi. So, if anyone has questions about Iraqis in the U.S. or resettlement in general feel free to ask.
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Sep 4, 2015 13:59
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SedanChair posted:Those parties and the "disillusioned natives" don't need a refugee crisis to hate foreigners. They hate integration as well. because you were saying things that were wrong and ignorant, and revealed a staggering lack of understanding of both the international institution of asylum, the european union and the current political situation as it's playing out refugees are not being stopped at the border of the EU. even the Hungarians, utterly poo poo as they are, are only going to send them back to Greece, which is the border of the EU. the problem, of course, is that Greece cannot afford to take on this burden, which makes your previous assertions that there are no problems with accepting "as many refugees as possible" entirely false and actually an apology for the poo poo you're trying to condemn. you're trying to reduce any actual discussion about this and the problematic aspects of it to racism, which is both false, pernicious and self-defeating. the current refugee situation in Europe is eminently manageable, but it needs a process and it needs a pan-european approach. it may also involve refugees going places they weren't intending to go, because basically everyone wants to go to Germany or Sweden at this point, and it is not only grossly unfair to make Germany and Sweden take on that whole initial cost, it is also likely to trigger a major political backlash. what needs to happen immediately is for Hungary to relent, and for some provisional revision to be made to the Dublin agreement, which is what Hungary is using at the moment to justify their hideous policies. what needs to happen in the medium term is some permanent replacement treaty to be drafted and implemented, and for Europe to start relief and assistance efforts in the countries bordering Syria. in the long term, measures must be taken to pacify the major refugee-generating situation in eurasia and africa, the most prominent of which are Afghanistan, Syria, South Sudan and Eritrea. The refugee crisis can only be resolved if the situations producing refugees are resolved. each of these necessary measures is very complicated and delicate, and require vigilant and vigorous public engagement to make it happen. in most of Europe, this is actually exactly what's happening - outside of Hungary, most governments are realising now that there is massive popular support for dealing rationally with this current crisis. oversimplifications, misinformation and intellectual laziness are actively detrimental to every step of this process, because raw popular outrage and will can so easily be misdirected and turned to the bad. we have to be both honest, realistic and pragmatic in order to try to do something lasting and rational about this situation. so when you start whirling up with silliness like you've done itt, i get cross. V. Illych L. fucked around with this message at 14:57 on Sep 4, 2015 |
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Sep 4, 2015 14:48
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Though I fear that the refugee crisis might instead end up being the world's saddest game of hot potatoes.
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Sep 4, 2015 15:40
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my dad posted:Though I fear that the refugee crisis might instead end up being the world's saddest game of hot potatoes. i doubt it. the major sluggers in europe are all committed, and they have the support of quite a lot of the periphery. the biggest opponent afaik is Poland, and obviously Hungary has placed everyone in a precarious situation, but those are non-entities compared to France and Germany the problem is that change in the EU is very difficult procedurally, and also that there needs to be an extensive follow-up after simply allowing people in
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Sep 4, 2015 15:44
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I really, really hope you're right. I mostly agree with your post, the best way to handle this (both for the refugees and the countries receiving them) would be a unified sheltering, care, and long-term integration plan the entirety of Europe would stick to. However, regarding this: V. Illych L. posted:even the Hungarians, utterly poo poo as they are, are only going to send them back to Greece, which is the border of the EU
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Sep 4, 2015 15:53
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V. Illych L. posted:because you were saying things that were wrong and ignorant, and revealed a staggering lack of understanding of both the international institution of asylum, the european union and the current political situation as it's playing out For someone who claims others are ignorant of refugee policy/facts globally you sure don't have much of a grasp yourself. " and for Europe to start relief and assistance efforts in the countries bordering Syria." Europe does contribute quite a lot to relief and assistance efforts in the countries bordering Syria that host refugees, which are Lebanon, Jordan, Iraq, and Turkey. Turkey and Lebanon take the most, which is nothing near what Europe have. This emergency response is run through the UN with orgs such as UNHCR, UNICEF, Save the Children, and many others, as well as local NGOs. EU governments and private and public donors provide grants to relief and assistance efforts in each of these countries acting through the UN emergency response plan, as well as the UNs own central emergency response fund, which is money gathered from all around the world on standby for emergencies. "in the long term, measures must be taken to pacify the major refugee-generating situation in eurasia and africa, the most prominent of which are Afghanistan, Syria, South Sudan and Eritrea. The refugee crisis can only be resolved if the situations producing refugees are resolved.'' The major-generating situation in eurasia and africa is a badly worded sentence, but I assume you mean "Where most refugees arriving in Europe come from" which are currently, in order; Syria, Kosovo, Afghanistan, Eritrea, Pakistan and Serbia. So you got a few, but South Sudanese do not go by boat or land to Europe, generally. They are mostly Internally Displaced People in South Sudan or refugees in neighboring countries. I'd say that's because they are landlocked and extremely poor so can't afford to travel to Europe. Lascivious Sloth fucked around with this message at 16:16 on Sep 4, 2015 |
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Sep 4, 2015 15:58
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my dad posted:I really, really hope you're right. Why is Hungary acting like this anyway? The refugees apparently just want to pass through to richer countries, and Hungary apparently doesn't want them to stay, so why not just let them pass through? Are other countries pressuring Hungary to police their borders and keep refugees/migrants out, or are they doing it for their own reasons?
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Sep 4, 2015 16:07
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Not that this isn't a good discussion, but there's a refugee thread now for more in depth discussion on the overall crisis.
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Sep 4, 2015 16:17
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Volkerball posted:Not that this isn't a good discussion, but there's a refugee thread now for more in depth discussion on the overall crisis. Ah awesome, thanks. Can move this discussion there then :P Back to conflict and politics in the ME!
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Sep 4, 2015 16:24
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Atrocious Joe posted:I think that if Brown Moses identifies that plane as Russian we'll find out along with the rest of the world when it goes up on Bellingcat. He's moved on from being D&D's unemployed mod to a spot on Putin's enemy list. It's probably not very necessary these days, but it is a good way to keep tabs on what the Egyptians and Israelis are doing. I think the people at MFO North Camp got a pretty good view of some of the fighting this year. The stations are small and lightly manned, but the soldiers there are armed enough to hold off an attack until backup arrives. A US outpost that I saw near Nuweiba in South Sinai looked a lot like a COP you would have seen in Baghdad- razor wire and prepared sandbag fighting positions, etc. That may be a low threat area even today, but they certainly weren't loving around even back then. That being said, a big attack on an MFO base is something that's got a lot of people anxious.
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Sep 4, 2015 17:02
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Lascivious Sloth posted:For someone who claims others are ignorant of refugee policy/facts globally you sure don't have much of a grasp yourself. response to this in the refugee thread
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Sep 4, 2015 17:23
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Putin has just announced that Bashar al Assad is ready to hold actual competitive elections and share power with his opposition. Whether that's true or too late is a whole different issue.
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Sep 4, 2015 18:10
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Al-Saqr posted:Putin has just announced that Bashar al Assad is ready to hold actual competitive elections and share power with his opposition. Whether that's true or too late is a whole different issue. This revolves around parliamentary elections, not presidential, so it's too little. I don't think you're going to see the "healthy opposition" lining up to legitimize a government run by Assad.
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Sep 4, 2015 18:14
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Volkerball posted:This revolves around parliamentary elections, not presidential, so it's too little. I don't think you're going to see the "healthy opposition" lining up to legitimize a government run by Assad. And that's just it. Who's going to legitimize Assad by participating in elections that have almost no chance of being fair?
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Sep 4, 2015 18:27
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Al-Saqr posted:Putin has just announced that Bashar al Assad is ready to hold actual competitive elections and share power with his opposition. Whether that's true or too late is a whole different issue. Considering that he's spent the last few years imprisoning and torturing his opposition, I'd say his chances of winning a competitive election are pretty good.
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Sep 4, 2015 18:51
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Bashar has always been good at saying things.
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Sep 4, 2015 19:41
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Things are happening in Suweida with the Druze:quote:Car bomb strikes Suweida hospital in S Syria, kills Druze leader Abu Fahd Al Ballous. Believe this is 1st assassination of Druze leader quote:"In January 2015, Bal’ous and other Druze fighters attacked a checkpoint in Suwayda manned by members of the air force intelligence service because they tried to draft a young Druze man into the Syrian Army. In February 2015, the three traditional religious leaders issued a statement disowning Bal’ous, and Jumblatt condemned the statement. However, the statement helped elevate Bal’ous’s status inside the Druze community as a leader of the camp that is opposed to the Syrian regime." https://twitter.com/markito0171/status/639859749627011072 quote:#Syria Regime cut off all communication in #Sweida It's unknown who carried out the attack right now, but here's a quick list of the possible groups in order of likely-hood: -It's certainly possible that Assad/the SAA or one of their allies did it to try to silence dissent against Assad. Assad has done/ordered stuff like this before, although doing it right now is kind of a bad idea, but that's never stopped him before. -It's also possible that it's an internal Druze conflict; I can't elaborate more since I'm not really familiar with internal Druze politics. -Less likely but also possible is that ISIL did it for unknown reasons, or just to cause general chaos. -Finally, there's always the  option that the FSA/southern rebels did it to turn to turn the Druze against Assad, but this is very unlikely since car bombs aren't the Southern Front's style, the guy who was killed was Anti-Assad, and the FSA doing something like this could backfire so goddamn massively against them.
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Sep 4, 2015 20:04
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Either ways, any opposition that was interested in a democratic society has long been killed or run out thanks to Assad, the only opposition left are either Bin Laden types who take orders from Riyadh, and the other being unholy fusion of Baathist police state and alqaeda barbarism. Not at all groups interested in anything resembling elections if they win.
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Sep 4, 2015 20:04
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fade5 posted:Things are happening in Suweida with the Druze: Wasn't Ballous the same Druze leader who recently announced his own Druze semi-insurgent group? I say "semi" because he basically said, "If you gently caress with us Druze in Suweida, we'll kill you whether you're a rebel or a loyalist." Edit: Yep, same guy. He created "Bayrak al-Fahd" (Banner of the Leopard) back in early August, and apparently called out Ali Mamlouk, Assad's security chief, in having orchestrated plots against Druze leaders in Suweida. How has the Southern Front been doing lately? pantslesswithwolves fucked around with this message at 22:21 on Sep 4, 2015 |
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Sep 4, 2015 22:13
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An interesting read on Oman that explores the reason for the lack of Omanis in Sunni and Shiite extremist groups: http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/8074584
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Sep 5, 2015 14:19
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Summary of what Russia has done in Syria the last few weeks, with opinions from US officials. http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/05/world/middleeast/russian-moves-in-syria-pose-concerns-for-us. quote:American officials acknowledge that they are not certain of Russia’s intentions, but some say the temporary housing suggests that Russia could deploy as many as 1,000 advisers or other military personnel to the airfield near the Assad family’s ancestral home. The airfield serves Latakia, Syria’s principal port city.
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Sep 5, 2015 15:54
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Man, the Saudi coalition is taking a licking (more/faster than I thought it would). http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/sep/05/uae-forces-retaliate-50-coalition-troops-yemen-missile-attack
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Sep 5, 2015 16:27
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an interesting take on what caused the Syrian civil war.. http://www.upworthy.com/trying-to-follow-what-is-going-on-in-syria-and-why-this-comic-will-get-you-there-in-5-minutes?g=4
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Sep 5, 2015 16:58
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Lascivious Sloth posted:an interesting take on what caused the Syrian civil war.. http://www.upworthy.com/trying-to-follow-what-is-going-on-in-syria-and-why-this-comic-will-get-you-there-in-5-minutes?g=4 Yup. The Syrians may be the first true refugees and victims from Anthropogenic Climate Change.
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Sep 5, 2015 17:50
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Pimpmust posted:Man, the Saudi coalition is taking a licking (more/faster than I thought it would). Sounds like an ammo dump got hit by a rocket attack and straight up exploded. Killed a bunch of people but not exactly as large a deal as it would be if the Saudis had lost a major battle. It definitely calls into question how they were storing the ammo.
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Sep 5, 2015 18:16
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Bait and Swatch posted:
But don't you think the influx of Republican Guard and "deep state" former Iraqi intelligence created that cold-blooded planning, or at least was a main facilitator? The most interesting thing about the Haji Bakr convo you informed folks were discussing is how he was apparently former Iraqi intelligence, and you tend to see a lot of articles going over that same phenomenon, from all the way up (Ibrahim al Douri, the former King of Clubs in that GW era card hit list), to the feet on the ground (some chucklefuck ruthless random former Iraqi army guy). EDIT: V. Illych L. posted:because you were saying things that were wrong and ignorant, and revealed a staggering lack of understanding of both the international institution of asylum, the european union and the current political situation as it's playing out The majority of refugees are actually being sent through, with Germany getting the majority. Shageletic fucked around with this message at 19:45 on Sep 5, 2015 |
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Sep 5, 2015 19:39
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CommieGIR posted:Yup. The Syrians may be the first true refugees and victims from Anthropogenic Climate Change. Well, doesn't this happen all the time? Like how the severe drought in Ethiopia kicked off the civil war there and led to the king being deposed and a communist regime installed. I mean, the upheavil was always there, but the banding of the citizens was really brought on by worsening economic/food/poverty related issues + brutality of the regime + no response to the natural disaster unfolding = revolution. Same with the French revolution, it was escalated in tension by the severe droughts in that time + the king not giving a poo poo + brutality for people wanting food and to not be poor.
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Sep 5, 2015 19:44
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Oh, and for anyone wondering about the high percentage of Eritreans in the migrant wave, Eritrea is a hellhole. A hellhole that grabs any men of adult age for the their brutal army, or disappeared by their only functioning institution, their secret intelligence. https://www.hrw.org/africa/eritrea
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Sep 5, 2015 19:48
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http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-34150364quote:The bodies of drowned Syrian boy Alan Kurdi and members of his family have been buried in Kobane in Syria after being transported there from Turkey. Alan's father crossed into Kurdish-controlled Kobane with the coffins. 
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Sep 5, 2015 20:07
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Shageletic posted:Oh, and for anyone wondering about the high percentage of Eritreans in the migrant wave, Eritrea is a hellhole. A hellhole that grabs any men of adult age for the their brutal army, or disappeared by their only functioning institution, their secret intelligence. https://www.hrw.org/africa/eritrea Very true. There's a reason its called the "North Korea of Africa". In a continent of hellholes its one of the worst. I don't blame anyone for escaping that place.
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Sep 5, 2015 20:17
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Pimpmust posted:Man, the Saudi coalition is taking a licking (more/faster than I thought it would). A missile attack on a military arms depot declared "cowardly," and immediately responded to by a wave of bombings on cities. 
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Sep 5, 2015 20:37
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Warbadger posted:Sounds like an ammo dump got hit by a rocket attack and straight up exploded. Killed a bunch of people but not exactly as large a deal as it would be if the Saudis had lost a major battle. It definitely calls into question how they were storing the ammo. The Saudis are the guys leaving burning Abram tanks behind their "offensives" whenever they decide it's a good idea to head into the hillier parts of Yemen, so I imagine their ammo storage is about as well thought out (as this whole campaign).
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Sep 5, 2015 21:24
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I watched this lecture on the Syrian civil war and the conclusions are troubling, I was hoping someone might have input on the presenter’s conclusions: Assumptions about the future of the war
The 5 things America MUST do
And the real kicker is that the final thing the presenter says is that actually we can’t DO most of those five things; we might be able to replace the Assad regime but something similar happened in Lebanon and they had a huge civil war (really hope I’m remembering the right country I’m typing this from memory, blame me not the lecturer); it’s questionable that we could stop the increasing influence of Iran; Iran will get nuclear weapons sooner or later; regarding ISIS “we can do a lot of destroying but that doesn’t mean we can destroy ISIS”; and we’ve been working for peace between Israel and the Palestinians and gotten nowhere. So yeah, pretty poo poo. 
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Sep 5, 2015 23:02
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Volkerball posted:Summary of what Russia has done in Syria the last few weeks, with opinions from US officials. seems like Russia is gonna spread itself thin with them fighting in the Ukraine and now/soon Syria.
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Sep 5, 2015 23:07
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Dapper_Swindler posted:seems like Russia is gonna spread itself thin with them fighting in the Ukraine and now/soon Syria. Being the largest country on the planet might help. I mean, yes, their military is a shadow of its former self, but in terms of the countries that could conceivably fight wars on multiple fronts, they've got to be pretty high up the list.
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Sep 5, 2015 23:15
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Darth Walrus posted:Being the largest country on the planet might help. I mean, yes, their military is a shadow of its former self, but in terms of the countries that could conceivably fight wars on multiple fronts, they've got to be pretty high up the list. For projecting military power, Russia is fourth behind the US, UK and France. China and India are still very much regional powers.
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Sep 5, 2015 23:22
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Jack B Nimble posted:I watched this lecture on the Syrian civil war and the conclusions are troubling, I was hoping someone might have input on the presenter’s conclusions: Yeah. I have a bad feeling that this is just the beginning and this stuff is gonna spread all over the middle east.
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Sep 5, 2015 23:24
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Jack B Nimble posted:I watched this lecture on the Syrian civil war and the conclusions are troubling, I was hoping someone might have input on the presenter’s conclusions: What's so bad about Iran with nukes? Israel has them, Saudi Arabia has them and the UAE and Qatar could probably buy them off Pakistan too
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Sep 5, 2015 23:28
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Loving Africa Chaps posted:What's so bad about Iran with nukes? Israel has them, Saudi Arabia has them and the UAE and Qatar could probably buy them off Pakistan too KSA is not a nuclear power. Unless I'm missing something.
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Sep 5, 2015 23:50
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