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blah_blah posted:The 'sharing economy' is still a tiny proportion of tech/SV. Uber, et al are a tiny proportion of Silicon Valley? By what metric?
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Sep 14, 2015 23:04
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Necc0 posted:I just realized many in D&D may not have seen these which should be considered essential viewing for this thread: On the one hand, we live in the cyberpunk nightmare world. On the other hand, "Uber has effectively become the vascular system for business." 
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Sep 14, 2015 23:08
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Radbot posted:Uber, et al are a tiny proportion of Silicon Valley? By what metric? Uber + Lyft + Airbnb + Taskrabbit + literally every sharing economy startup combined are probably under 100B in combined valuations (and that's inflated $ VC valuations with a whole laundry list of preferences and guarantees in exchange for the inflated number, not the lower, 'true', valuation that those companies would be valuing their stock internally at). Apple + Google + Facebook alone are around 1.35T in market cap. blah_blah fucked around with this message at 23:23 on Sep 14, 2015 |
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Sep 14, 2015 23:17
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quote:Uber + Lyft + Airbnb + Taskrabbit + literally every sharing economy startup combined are probably under 100M in combined valuations (and that's inflated $ VC valuations
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Sep 14, 2015 23:18
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Cicero posted:I'm guessing you meant 100B here? Only off by 3 orders of magnitude.
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Sep 14, 2015 23:23
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blah_blah posted:Apple + Google + Facebook alone are around 1.35T in market cap. Apple, Google, and Facebook aren't startups. apple is the only technology company in that list as well, el goog and fb are advertising companies that happen to offer other products; similarly, amazon is a server rental company that also sells toilet paper and books
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Sep 15, 2015 00:35
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uncurable mlady posted:Apple, Google, and Facebook aren't startups.
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Sep 15, 2015 00:52
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LookingGodIntheEye posted:Next thing you know you're gonna tell me newspapers are ads with filler written in the middle, governments are tax collectors with guns, and capitalism is a ponzi scheme. ron paul 2012
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Sep 15, 2015 01:01
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uncurable mlady posted:Apple, Google, and Facebook aren't startups. quote:The 'sharing economy' is still a tiny proportion of tech/SV. quote:Uber, et al are a tiny proportion of Silicon Valley? By what metric?
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Sep 15, 2015 01:18
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Necc0 posted:I just realized many in D&D may not have seen these which should be considered essential viewing for this thread:
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Sep 15, 2015 04:31
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rudatron posted:Kill all marketers. Kill them, throw their bodies in an unmarked mass grave, burn them, bury them, and then kill the people who killed and buried them, just to be safe. 
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Sep 15, 2015 04:49
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Necc0 posted:I just realized many in D&D may not have seen these which should be considered essential viewing for this thread: These videos also make me wonder why turning us all into serfs is necessarily the future of business. The companies that dominate get ridiculous returns from their workers, and I don't see how that can be accomplished with non-competitive, unskilled 1099 wage slaves:  America Inc. fucked around with this message at 06:51 on Sep 15, 2015 |
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Sep 15, 2015 06:39
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LookingGodIntheEye posted:I wonder how long it will take for a company to be worth more than the US GDP. The question arises then of "who will buy the next iPhone" but I'm sure the system is infinitely sustainable.
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Sep 15, 2015 07:11
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Nessus posted:The idea is that only the absolute top performing best of the best people will work at Apple, say. This will in large part be determined by their social connections and cultural similarities to the hiring managers, rather than some objective proof of coding ability, but shhhh. The rest of us will work at Foxconn, or make like Dalereed said and "lay down in the street and die." Reading about this and other issues like global warming make me more FYGM than anything else.
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Sep 15, 2015 07:17
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Nessus posted:The idea is that only the absolute top performing best of the best people will work at Apple, say. This will in large part be determined by their social connections and cultural similarities to the hiring managers, rather than some objective proof of coding ability, but shhhh. The rest of us will work at Foxconn, or make like Dalereed said and "lay down in the street and die." Well then you can enter the stage that was described in that infamous Citigroup research paper from 2005 about the US slowly turning into what they called a plutonomy, with businesses mostly focusing on a tiny, but very wealthy, group of people. So golden iphones for the rich and iphone 3310's for the poor.
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Sep 15, 2015 08:03
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Charlie Mopps posted:Well then you can enter the stage that was described in that infamous Citigroup research paper from 2005 about the US slowly turning into what they called a plutonomy, with businesses mostly focusing on a tiny, but very wealthy, group of people. So golden iphones for the rich and iphone 3310's for the poor.
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Sep 15, 2015 08:06
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LookingGodIntheEye posted:Does knowledge of this actually empower anyone to act? It makes me drink and appreciate the Luddites a bit more
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Sep 15, 2015 08:33
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Nessus posted:You could probably do this but you need the poor to be "poor" not "totally loving broke." It might work better if we get a GMI going on or something. America Inc. fucked around with this message at 08:55 on Sep 15, 2015 |
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Sep 15, 2015 08:52
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LookingGodIntheEye posted:This is the most reasonable solution. Automation is ultimately going to force us as a society to face this issue, and GMI looks quite reasonable compared to mass poverty, serious population control, or revolution. and it won't happen because we live in a society that idolizes greed and despises the poor for existing
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Sep 15, 2015 11:30
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I think this deserve to be posted. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XdEuII9cv-U https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cCvf2DZzKX0
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Sep 15, 2015 12:01
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Condiv posted:and it won't happen because we live in a society that idolizes greed and despises the poor for existing America Inc. fucked around with this message at 12:45 on Sep 15, 2015 |
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Sep 15, 2015 12:02
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I think its interesting that Lanier brings up the idea of paying consumers for providing personal information and creating content for software companies, because Valve (the most obvious example I can think of, not trying to be puerile) does something quite similar, paying people for creating in-game items which sell at a price. I wonder how people can actually make a reasonable living off that work alone though, or how to picture an economy that has millions of people selling their private info, selling 3-D print blueprints, making TF2 hats, and selling stuff on Etsy. I have doubts about the sustainability of such a model. Almost veering into Eripsa territory. I also wonder if the dynamics of power between consumers and companies would change in a significant way compared to now.
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Sep 15, 2015 12:57
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LookingGodIntheEye posted:I think its interesting that Lanier brings up the idea of paying consumers for providing personal information and creating content for software companies, because Valve (the most obvious example I can think of, not trying to be puerile) does something quite similar, paying people for creating in-game items which sell at a price. It would depend on how open they made the market. As it currently stands with your Valve example very few artists make it through but those who do get paid big bucks. Obviously you're gonna follow a basic supply/demand curve with this where the more artists you let in the less all of them will get paid barring a few 'rockstar' modelers
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Sep 15, 2015 14:19
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tsa posted:It's really apparent most people don't have a clue what they are talking about. Any sort of autonomous vehicle didn't really exist even 10 years ago, the internet pretty much didn't exist 20 years ago, this poo poo takes time but it's coming way faster than people here think. And also plenty of instances where auto-pilots fail or click off because they encounter a situation they can't handle leaving the helm in control of pilots who have increasingly less experience with the controls. It's a debatable issue at the least how to improve safety from where we are (meaning more day-day hands on control by pilots or less). Though pilotless planes are clearly not ready yet.
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Sep 15, 2015 14:28
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LookingGodIntheEye posted:I wonder how long it will take for a company to be worth more than the US GDP. Capital is really bad at planning for the future. It isn't making serfs of us deliberately, that's just what seems to be the most lucrative thing to do. That slavery is actually less productive long-term involves the kind of proofs that Capitalism isn't capable of comprehending. When we set free entities that are solely motivated by Capital, we shouldn't be shocked by their actions. The only thing keeping us from a thriving market in babies is the dead hand of government.
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Sep 15, 2015 15:03
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Peztopiary posted:Capital is really bad at planning for the future. It isn't making serfs of us deliberately, that's just what seems to be the most lucrative thing to do. That slavery is actually less productive long-term involves the kind of proofs that Capitalism isn't capable of comprehending. When we set free entities that are solely motivated by Capital, we shouldn't be shocked by their actions. The only thing keeping us from a thriving market in babies is the dead hand of government. The government is the only thing keeping us from a lot of bad things.
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Sep 15, 2015 15:19
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DolphinCop posted:you accidentally stumbled upon the entire intent and purpose of the tech industry in its present form- allowing middle class people to imitate the privileges available to upper class people on the backs of the labor of the poor. basically everything involving the use of a private servant, from freshly prepared meals to chauffeuring to pet care. yes, there is an "uber for dog walking" btw Also why lots (most?) of tech people are Libertarian. They don't understand economic coercion, only authoritarian force, and, hey, no one's forcing you to work for Uber!
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Sep 15, 2015 15:46
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http://www.amazon.com/Social-Anarchism-Lifestyle-Unbridgeable-Chasm/dp/187317683X/ I'm waiting for my copy of this to come in. Unfortunately none of Murray Bookchin's writings are available electronically. Here is a 1983 documentary about American Anarchism where you can see the roots of today's market anarchist "libertarian" rhetoric.
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Sep 15, 2015 16:16
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Noam Chomsky posted:Also why lots (most?) of tech people are Libertarian. They don't understand economic coercion, only authoritarian force, and, hey, no one's forcing you to work for Uber! No not all tech people are libertarians. A lot of people are confusing "tech people" with startup culture which are distinct groups. The startup folks are more likely to be the semi-libertarian types and even then it's not close to "most". The grandfathers working at places like GE and IBM have nothing to do with those people (the average engineer age at my company is at least 50).
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Sep 15, 2015 16:35
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asdf32 posted:No not all tech people are libertarians. A lot of people are confusing "tech people" with startup culture which are distinct groups. The startup folks are more likely to be the semi-libertarian types and even then it's not close to "most". I'm IT consultant. I'm aware.
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Sep 15, 2015 16:49
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tsa posted:Air France 447 would have made it if the pilots just would have... done literally nothing. Yeah, frozen pitot tubes had nothing to do with this. Statements like these really bring home the point that folks in your industry really don't understand the amount of safety needed to make this poo poo work in the real world. These problems aren't easy to solve, and if you gently caress them up people die. Your industry is so accustomed to the standards of releasing beta software as "final" and expecting people to patch things up once enough people use them. Vehicles aren't a copy of Windows or WoW - your industry has a lovely culture of safety and it's going to get people killed if folks like you don't wake up and take it seriously.
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Sep 15, 2015 17:10
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXDgmW3E3_I
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Sep 15, 2015 17:17
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Solkanar512 posted:Yeah, frozen pitot tubes had nothing to do with this. Statements like these really bring home the point that folks in your industry really don't understand the amount of safety needed to make this poo poo work in the real world. The idea is to destroy regulations so you can apply the current software product lifecycle to things like automated cars and just shrug accidents off as "feedback for our next iteration!"
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Sep 15, 2015 17:53
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Peztopiary posted:Capital is really bad at planning for the future. It isn't making serfs of us deliberately, that's just what seems to be the most lucrative thing to do. That slavery is actually less productive long-term involves the kind of proofs that Capitalism isn't capable of comprehending. When we set free entities that are solely motivated by Capital, we shouldn't be shocked by their actions. The only thing keeping us from a thriving market in babies is the dead hand of government. This isn't any more true than pointing to Venezuela as an example of why Socialists can't plan ahead since they won't eliminate the gas subsidy.
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Sep 15, 2015 17:53
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Noam Chomsky posted:I'm IT consultant. I'm aware. Then why are you so wrong then?
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Sep 15, 2015 18:01
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Bip Roberts posted:Then why are you so wrong then? About? You have to admit lots of people in startup culture, if not most, are libertarians or libertarian-leaning, whether it's self-stated or not.
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Sep 15, 2015 18:07
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Solkanar512 posted:Yeah, frozen pitot tubes had nothing to do with this. Statements like these really bring home the point that folks in your industry really don't understand the amount of safety needed to make this poo poo work in the real world. The aircraft industry is using control laws developed 50 years ago. In no way is any of this "cutting edge".
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Sep 15, 2015 18:11
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Mrit posted:When you are running Office, and it crashes once a year, no one cares. I think this is the reason we never can have truly automated cars. We have have low involvement operator cars. Even if the human is twiddling about doing other things there will always be the need for a human operator. Would you ever trust a drone airline? The modern railed street car still has an operator. What comes with learning intelligence is the need to make mistakes, tough to trust a machine to make mistakes with lives.
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Sep 15, 2015 18:15
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Solkanar512 posted:Yeah, frozen pitot tubes had nothing to do with this. Statements like these really bring home the point that folks in your industry really don't understand the amount of safety needed to make this poo poo work in the real world. please tell me tsa is not in my industry, i like to sleep at night otherwise i agree with your post, software is held to a ridiculously low standard when it comes to quality. we needed some kind of certification system for programmers a long while back (or at least mandatory security auditing of important programs, jfc).
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Sep 15, 2015 18:19
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Job Truniht posted:The aircraft industry is using control laws developed 50 years ago. In no way is any of this "cutting edge". What's your point?
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Sep 15, 2015 18:20
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