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TKIY posted:Any reason not to run Mk3 shoulders on the Mk4 armour? Mk3 shoulders look better to me. Definitely no reason not to from a fluff perspective at least. You can always say your mans are wearing some legion-specific or field-modified man suits. If they look cool, roll with em
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Nov 11, 2015 02:53
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TKIY posted:Any reason not to run Mk3 shoulders on the Mk4 armour? Mk3 shoulders look better to me. Hell no. Mix and match to your heart's content. I have a bunch of Mk 3 pauldrons on my Mk 4 marines and they look good I think. Also, I got some headswaps from here: http://wargameexclusive.com/ There are a bunch of cheesecake-y type models there, but there are also a bunch of excellent Mk II, III and IV heads with crests to be had. Mine arrived today and I've used them to make tactical sergeants and veterans for my command squad. The quality is superb; I cannot recommend them highly enough. Fearless fucked around with this message at 03:57 on Nov 11, 2015 |
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Nov 11, 2015 03:42
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Great, thanks. I'm ordering Death Guard heads and shoulders so I figure if I can mix and match that's ideal.
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Nov 11, 2015 03:55
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BULBASAUR posted:The Red Admech Book and 161 of Book 5 (tempest). Write a post and I'll add it to the op.
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Nov 11, 2015 03:58
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Fearless posted:Hell no. Mix and match to your heart's content. I have a bunch of Mk 3 pauldrons on my Mk 4 marines and they look good I think. Also consider Avil's Spartan/Maximus helmets for a different twist, especially for those looking into 1k sons.
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Nov 11, 2015 04:35
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Mixing and matching is abhorrent and destroys my immersion. For people writing lists - Bulbasaurs advice about the troops is pretty solid. Either go for 20 men with Apothecary, ten men in a rhino, or go for alternative troops choices. 40k lib ru for people looking to get into the rules. Google it. Quick rundown on a key part of list building - RITES OF WAR. At first glance these are kind of like formations... Except balanced for the most part. You have bonuses and drawbacks. An example is the Salamanders one - Covenant of Fire. You get master crafted Melta weapons, vehicles get a 5+ save against Melta, and you can get Pyroclasts as non compulsory troops. Drawback? No deep striking, you have to take the same number of troops choices as you do heavy support and elites, etc. These change the way armies are built. A popular one is Pride of the Legion where you can take terminators as troops, but if they die you give up VP. My other bit of advice is don't get hung up on WAAC or min maxing. It is surprisingly difficult to make a dogshit list. Go with what is cool and fits the fluff. In my 2000 pt salamanders list I have around 800 pts sunk into a Spartan deathstar... In 40k that's madness, in 30k it's viable. Also 
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Nov 11, 2015 08:51
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Lord Twisted posted:
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Nov 11, 2015 09:17
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SteelMentor posted:Is it really that bad? I've played a few pure Knights armies in regular 40k, usually pointing enough Melta and Haywire at them while nabbing objectives under their feet is enough to grab a victory from them, though I must admit the two guys local who have the spare cash to run Knight armies are also dumb as rocks. Do the extra Knight varients make that much impact? From a purely balance perspective all 30k armies can take a single LOW (barring special FOCs) that are further restricted to be no more than 25% of your army. Knight Titans fit into this category along with things like Titans and Fellblades. Enter the knight army- you can bring as many as you like. They also run faster than 40k knights, have fun things like AP3 hellstorm flamers, and can be buffed further through their army list. Imagine playing a calth army, all ~1600 points of it, against 4 knights like that. e: You're absolutely right about knight players though. Stanyer69 is as dumb as a rock. Lord Twisted posted:Mixing and matching is abhorrent and destroys my immersion. This is a good fuckin post. Maybe we could put a list building post in the OP to help all the new heresy hams? Part of the fun/confusion are all the options. People are probably getting overwhelmed with choices for the first time since 3rd edition. BULBASAUR fucked around with this message at 09:33 on Nov 11, 2015 |
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Nov 11, 2015 09:26
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I'd be happy to say what my approach was at the beginning: I listened to Eye of Horus - I know people have said they swear a lot, but they have a good "Demystifying X" episodes, which are worth a listen. (PS: I'm the dude whose emails they read out in a frat boy voice). This can help get your head around the options. Next I got Battlescribe which also helps. --- Basically first pick a legion (I'm assuming you're playing Astartes here) Loyalist or Traitor? Then, what kind of playstyle? (1d4chan has a decent rundown here too). Then you need to think - what kind of army? Broadly: Mechanised? Footslogging? Artillery? Terminators? Jetbikes? etc. Then look at the basic Rites of War, and your Legion's Rite of War. Does this fit with your playstyle? Usually you'll find one which does! E.g. orbital assault gels with Sons of Horus, while Salamanders get a better kick out of their personal rite of war. From there, start with the core block. This is either troops, or whatever your rite of war specifies (e.g. 3 Terror Squads for Night Lords). Go from there... Remember there is usually no "wrong" choice, but each unit has to have a role. And remember if you're building a 2000 pt list there is the possibility of playing vs primarchs and cheaper Lords of War - there is the 25% rule which means this only opens up in 2500. My lists I started with Salamanders, as Salamanders are king poo poo and set stuff on fire. 2000 pts: quote:Using the Covenant of Fire Strategy? Move forward the two heavy vehicles and beat the gently caress out of things. Tacticals and Deredeo hold my table edge. 2500 pts: quote:
Now a LoW (Vulkan) is in play. Means my Spartan is obscene numbers of points, but also means I'm not using a Rite of War, so I swapped my Praetor for an awesome special character. Otherwise the strategy is broadly the same.
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Nov 11, 2015 09:54
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Bulbasaur, how does this look for an EC list? I tried to keep your 7 points in mind:quote:+++ EC test roster (2000pts) +++ The Legion Champion goes with the Phoenix Terminator Squad, Eidolon goes in the Palatine Blade Squad. I would probably force-reserve the Palatine Blades Squad per The Maru Skara ROW rule. They'd come on and use jump packs to get into cover, then get the extra inches for an assault the following turn. Everything else is pretty standard. I think the Kakaphoni squad is fluffy and cool, but it can be changed out if it's a known bad unit. BULBASAUR posted:At 2000 points I'd make sure your TAC list has: 1) I feel like there's enough shooty-ness to deal with hordes, otherwise I can run the Phoenix Guards or Palatine Blade Squad into them and just eviscerate a blob with attacks. 2) The Palatine Blades and Phoenix Guard are pretty well suited for managing marines in CC. The Kakophani, Contemptor, Land Raider and Sicaran help in this regard with volume of fire benefits. 3) Contemptor-Mortis, LR Proteus and Sicaran with Las sponsons can do this. Most units have Melta bombs in them. 4) The Palatine Blade Squad and Phoenix Guard are made for tying up deathstars, and Eidolon is no slouch in this regard either. 5) Melta Bombs and Las are my best bet here. The Sicaran can glance out AV15 with sponsons. I was tempted to swap the Sicaran for a flier with Las that could double as cover for AA and AV management. 6) The Tac support squad could potentially do this. I probably need to look at a Legion Reconnaissance Squad for this role as well. I'd probably have to give up the Kakaphoni for that. 7) Contemptor-Mortis pulls this one off. This being a first draft, I'm just trying to get a feel for what a list would look like and if I'm thinking about this the right way.
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Nov 11, 2015 10:17
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Have you realised a Proteus has no assault ramp so you can't charge out of it? It's why it's cheaper. I use mine for my pyroclasts who take charges rather than deliver them.
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Nov 11, 2015 11:10
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Kheres Contemptor massively benefits from a pod because of the short range. Which is to say, if you're footslogging the dread and want AA/DS protection then a Deredeo with Anvilus Autocannons is going to be a much more reliable unit.
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Nov 11, 2015 11:12
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Cythereal posted:Leman Russ is probably going to be a beatstick with some buffs to the army
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Nov 11, 2015 13:05
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I'm ok with the Kheres Contemptor, but Mango has a good point that as a dedicated vehicle or anti air hunting the dodo does it better. If you're sticking with the contents of the box though, the Kheres will work fine. I would give Sonic Shriekers to your tactical sergeant. That way you will basically win most mirror matches no questions asked. Kakophani are sadly a very mediocre unit against marines (they are decent against the other 3 armies though) but they are getting a buff in the next book so rule of cool can prevail here. I don't have my book handy, but aren't you missing your second troops choice? Support squads don't fulfill your mandatory requirements. If your ROW allows you to ditch tactical squads entirely then it's probably the right way to go. Take some veterans in a rhino instead and outflank them with the rest of your bros. Consider dropping the armored cremate as well. Until your meta has lots of melta I would ignore it as it's spendy and situational on a fast tank. It might make sense to keep it on the Proteus, but an extra 50 points can do other cool things. Your ROW is great so you are right on for taking advantage of it. That said, you need an anvil unit capping objectives in the midfield. You're also going to have a hard time dealing with armour as you have limited AT. I'd consider grabbing a seeker squad and either outflanking them in a rhino or putting them into your Proteus as your 'assassination squad' that shows up turn 2 and deletes some poor unit. Fluffy and cool. Other than this you have 2 deathstars- one glass hammer and another that has no assault vehicle ride. I'd look at those two along with your tac support squad and see how you can move things around to give you. You have a number of shenanigans you can pull with outflanking assault fliers or veteran tactical squads. 
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Nov 11, 2015 13:09
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So what's considered a good "deathstar" for Word Bearers? Beside the Gal Vorbak they don't have anything especially unique and while awesome the Gal are certainly defeatable and don't score.
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Nov 11, 2015 13:26
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PierreTheMime posted:So what's considered a good "deathstar" for Word Bearers? Beside the Gal Vorbak they don't have anything especially unique and while awesome the Gal are certainly defeatable and don't score. Probably Zardu Layak and a full Gal Vorbak. Zardu gets to pick his powers, so you can automatically get Cursed Earth and maintain a 4++. He's also naturally T5 like his daemon buddies. The biggest problem with deathstars is that a low points they're a big commitment, and at 2k and above points they are likely to get splattered by a 350 points Typhon.
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Nov 11, 2015 13:48
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http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2015/11/breaking-new-40k-minis-a-heresy-price-hike.html Bonkers if true
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Nov 11, 2015 14:01
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Someone somewhere mentioned that the higher price was likely the original price that was lowered by the time the set went up for order. The mag these prices are in was printed after the change, or somebody just hosed up. I wouldn't worry too much about it. (Also, 30 bux for an assassin? Yeah fuckin right.)
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Nov 11, 2015 14:17
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Imma go ask my local GW dude later.
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Nov 11, 2015 14:21
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Zephro posted:I'd kind of assumed Russ would be the mirror image of Angron, a one-dimensional wrecking ball in melee who does nothing else. I would be disappointed if Russ's rules reflected this to the exclusion of his legion's predatory cunning and tactical acumen.
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Nov 11, 2015 14:45
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JerryLee posted:I would be disappointed if Russ's rules reflected this to the exclusion of his legion's predatory cunning and tactical acumen. That might be their RoW.
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Nov 11, 2015 14:47
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muggins posted:http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2015/11/breaking-new-40k-minis-a-heresy-price-hike.html Mag most likely printed before the set was put up for pre-order, either way, it hasn't changed on the webstore.
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Nov 11, 2015 14:51
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It still scans in at the current price at my local GW. They recieve their product brief tomorrow, imma ask them there.
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Nov 11, 2015 16:24
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Here's a question for larger point value games which might be useful to put in the OP: How do the various Primarchs stack up against each other? What are their particular strengths and weaknesses? Are there any of them that run counterintuitive to what you might think?
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Nov 11, 2015 17:38
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BULBASAUR posted:I'm ok with the Kheres Contemptor, but Mango has a good point that as a dedicated vehicle or anti air hunting the dodo does it better. If you're sticking with the contents of the box though, the Kheres will work fine. Can you make the dodododo from a base Contemptor chassis, or are they based on a different platform? I wouldn't necessarily object to buying upgrade bits to make it into the better model. Plus I sort of like the idea of keeping the arms and then buying the EC legion-marked contemptor and making Ancient Rylanor. quote:I would give Sonic Shriekers to your tactical sergeant. That way you will basically win most mirror matches no questions asked. Kakophani are sadly a very mediocre unit against marines (they are decent against the other 3 armies though) but they are getting a buff in the next book so rule of cool can prevail here. I don't have my book handy, but aren't you missing your second troops choice? Support squads don't fulfill your mandatory requirements. If your ROW allows you to ditch tactical squads entirely then it's probably the right way to go. Take some veterans in a rhino instead and outflank them with the rest of your bros. Consider dropping the armored cremate as well. Until your meta has lots of melta I would ignore it as it's spendy and situational on a fast tank. It might make sense to keep it on the Proteus, but an extra 50 points can do other cool things. Rule of cool being what it is, they're a unit that can't be built out of the box, so I have no problem dropping them for the points for now. I thought I had sonic shriekers on all of the characters that could take them, since challenges are sort of a thing that EC does. I didn't realize that the Proteus didn't have an assault ramp, so thanks Lord Twisted for that tip. The EC ROW doesn't let you ditch manditory tacticals that I can see, I was trying to absorb both books worth of info at once, and I forgot that Tacticals are the only unit that can be taken, so I'll update that. I really love the look of the Sicaran, though I'm starting to think that it's points-sinky and may be limiting my options otherwise. quote:Your ROW is great so you are right on for taking advantage of it. That said, you need an anvil unit capping objectives in the midfield. You're also going to have a hard time dealing with armour as you have limited AT. I'd consider grabbing a seeker squad and either outflanking them in a rhino or putting them into your Proteus as your 'assassination squad' that shows up turn 2 and deletes some poor unit. Fluffy and cool. The Phoenix Guard have Implacable Advance, which (if it's the same as on the Sons of Horus Justaerin Terminators rule) allow them to score on objectives. So they were going to be the stalwart midfield unit with Eidolon. I'll check into Seeker Squads with a Rhino as an option. quote:Other than this you have 2 deathstars- one glass hammer and another that has no assault vehicle ride. I'd look at those two along with your tac support squad and see how you can move things around to give you. You have a number of shenanigans you can pull with outflanking assault fliers or veteran tactical squads. Thanks guys. First time I've had fun listbuilding for a GW game in a year!
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Nov 11, 2015 17:43
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koreban posted:Can you make the dodododo from a base Contemptor chassis, or are they based on a different platform? I wouldn't necessarily object to buying upgrade bits to make it into the better model. Plus I sort of like the idea of keeping the arms and then buying the EC legion-marked contemptor and making Ancient Rylanor. Different platform and loadout. I suppose you could load up a regular Contemptor with dual Autocannons and a Missile Launcher and run it as a counts as, but the Dorito is a pretty cool model in itself. http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-NZ/Deredeo-Pattern-Dreadnought?_requestid=690170
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Nov 11, 2015 17:49
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I finished some poo poo. One full Tac squad, finally done.  Seekers.  Next up, fill out the first Veteran squad and hold on to my butt for Calth.
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Nov 11, 2015 17:53
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 Those are amazing.
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Nov 11, 2015 17:58
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BirdieBedtime posted:I finished some poo poo. Alpha Legion? I see the free hand 3 headed hydra on the shoulder pad.
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Nov 11, 2015 18:29
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BirdieBedtime posted:I finished some poo poo. Digging your Ultramrines!
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Nov 11, 2015 19:55
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koreban posted:Can you make the dodododo from a base Contemptor chassis, or are they based on a different platform? I wouldn't necessarily object to buying upgrade bits to make it into the better model. Plus I sort of like the idea of keeping the arms and then buying the EC legion-marked contemptor and making Ancient Rylanor. The dodo is a different robit, so the Contemptor will need to be a mortis or Ancient Ownanor. Seekers in a outflanking landraider would be pretty neat, but it will be spendy. I think you should figure out what you want to do with your troops choices keeping in mind that they won't be outflanking anywhere. They'll be a big part of your army, and you'll probably want a 3rd scoring unit (I think some vets in a rhino might be a good choice here). You'll need some form of anchor to your list- I think a Sicaran, some troops, and a contemptor might work out. The tank is better in 40k than in 30k, but it's still solid that gives you a punch. Just resist putting armoured ceremite on everything. Then you also need to figure out what to do with your two HQs and how they plan to get there.
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Nov 11, 2015 20:17
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Stanyer89 posted:Alpha Legion? I see the free hand 3 headed hydra on the shoulder pad. These are obviously from the  legion
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Nov 11, 2015 20:51
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Mango Polo posted:These are obviously from the Disappointed that The Ultramarines isn't actually listed.
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Nov 11, 2015 21:08
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I think the best bit of misdirection the Alpha legion ever did was make people think they had infiltrated the Ultramarines.
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Nov 11, 2015 21:13
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Agreed, because everyone knows they're actually the Ultramrines
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Nov 11, 2015 21:29
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"No, Brother Johnathan, you are the Ultramarines." And then Brother Johnathan was an Ultramarine.
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Nov 11, 2015 21:39
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I've just ordered some death shroud and grave wardens because I'm a sucker for terminators. Thank God for comrade Forgeworldski. Is it safe to assume that terminators without deep striking pretty much require a transport?
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Nov 11, 2015 21:57
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What are those muskets the veteran marines are holding?
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Nov 11, 2015 22:14
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The rifles from the skittarii ranger kit.
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Nov 11, 2015 22:17
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xutech posted:What are those muskets the veteran marines are holding? Rifles from the Admech Skitarii rangers. Plentiful on bits sites/ebay/anyone you know who collects admech.
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Nov 11, 2015 22:22
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