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Xae posted:To an extent. Xae, the Correct Opinion is that Amazon is Bad.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:28
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American Psycho is a good book. I hear the movie's pretty good too.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:28
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Luigi Thirty posted:When you hear "there aren't enough programmers" from a tech company add "that want to work for $50k" to it. This is the case in just about any industry where there's a "talent shortage." Like there's a "pilot shortage" right now. Airlines can't seem to figure out why there aren't thousands of people willing to rack up near 6 figure student loans just to make <$30k for several years in the hope that maybe they can eventually move up to a position where they'll make enough to pay off their loans with a little left over for food. 
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Dec 14, 2015 17:30
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Theris posted:This is the case in just about any industry where there's a "talent shortage." Like there's a "pilot shortage" right now. Airlines can't seem to figure out why there aren't thousands of people willing to rack up near 6 figure student loans just to make <$30k for several years in the hope that maybe they can eventually move up to a position where they'll make enough to pay off their loans with a little left over for food. Add "teacher shortage" to that list. Literally the most important job there is but people don't want them to unionize and make more than dirt. And then we wonder why there aren't enough good teachers.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:33
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Augus posted:American Psycho is a good book. I hear the movie's pretty good too. Feed me an Iowa Voter.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:35
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Nostalgia4Infinity posted:Xae, the Correct Opinion is that Amazon is Bad. The correct opinion is realizing that Amazon is a large place with many people. Some of those people are lovely. It falls on Amazon to deal with those lovely employees. Amazon is not doing this. Thus, Amazon has employees bad mouthing it as a terrible place to work. A company is responsible for all of its employees, not just the good ones. Hth. Augus posted:Add "teacher shortage" to that list. Literally the most important job there is but people don't want them to unionize and make more than dirt. And then we wonder why there aren't enough good teachers. Also this. Remember to be a teacher you generally must have a bachelor's degree. So if you're lucky that's 30 - 40k student loan while making about that much a year while politicians tell everyone who will listen that you make too much money. When I saw that and saw the kind of abuse teachers get subjected to I said gently caress that and went for IT instead. Raerlynn fucked around with this message at 17:39 on Dec 14, 2015 |
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Dec 14, 2015 17:35
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Raerlynn posted:The correct opinion is realizing that Amazon is a large place with many people. Some of those people are lovely. It falls on Amazon to deal with those lovely employees. Amazon is not doing this. Thus, Amazon has employees bad mouthing it as a terrible place to work. So Amazon is bad. Got it 
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Dec 14, 2015 17:36
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I mean there is the whole "it's cheaper to hire an ambulance to treat workers who faint from heat exhaustion rather than buy air conditioning at the warehouse" aspect of Amazon, as well.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:38
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The fact Amazon released confidential HR information to the public as part of their PR fight is a little harder to blame on "a few bad apples"
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Dec 14, 2015 17:38
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Mr. Wookums posted:I'd like to think a super neglected IT department will burn companies in the long run like a cancer, but shareholders and upper management really don't give a poo poo. It most definitely does, though the employees generally eat the damage first. I've already lost one job because they were yanking funds from IT to give to sales... after two months of complaining about how bad offshore's code is. Upper management will happily mortgage their future for sweet sweet dollars. Consulting is where it's at right now, as the timeline usually goes: Hire someone out of college They get sick of doing the lion's share for laughable wages and move on Teach BA to code BA neglects it because they have "better things to do" (ie. Have no clue how to do it) Contract overseas because you can pay them less for less expectations Miss multiple deadlines and get poo poo code because overseas workers are exploited even worse Panic Hire consultant firm to fix it at twice normal fees Go out of business The big issue right now is getting in with a firm that actually makes software and isn't just interested in filling seats. Those are hard to find and finding one that gives a poo poo about anyone outside the people present at startup is even harder.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:39
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Dilbert was also a really good show. It was pretty hilarious.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:41
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Funny story about amazon versus sears from my undergrad days a while back . They were hiring fresh developer grads from my bachelors program. Amazon was paying 100k starting and sears 120k. Not only was sears paying 20% more but they were getting the absolute dregs.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:43
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Just FYI if tech workers ever unionize, they will be painted as racists and xenophobes trying to deprive hardworking foreigners from coming to America and enriching the fabric of our country. That's why things won't ever get better in that regard, anyone looking to strengthen worker protections will be attacked from the left as well as the right, good faith or not.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:48
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Chokes McGee posted:It most definitely does, though the employees generally eat the damage first. I've already lost one job because they were yanking funds from IT to give to sales... after two months of complaining about how bad offshore's code is. Upper management will happily mortgage their future for sweet sweet dollars. My personal experience has been pretty similar. Terrible decision-making in management, rushed implementation of software that nobody consulted with the users on so it never gets configured properly for business in the first place, then constant complaints from users which to go management and then go to IT on "why can't you voodoo our pile of poo poo to work perfectly?!" which results in IT working weekends and/or 60-80 hour weeks with little payoff because gently caress increasing head count in IT. Then you get a new acquisition, do another rushed implementation for that new system because nobody loving learns from past mistakes, rinse and repeat. If your IT group is more of a support role than making your actual product, people see you as a money sink and nothing more. But if your poo poo ever breaks, that's when they decide to pay attention (but still not spend any money to fix the cause rather than cracking the whip at you to fix the symptoms). EDIT: Radbot posted:Just FYI if tech workers ever unionize, they will be painted as racists and xenophobes trying to deprive hardworking foreigners from coming to America and enriching the fabric of our country. They won't be painted as racists because of depriving foreigners of job opportunities, they'll be painted as racists because 95% of IT workers are loving coddled white men who are constantly angry because of their job situation and terrible loving management.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:49
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Chokes McGee posted:It most definitely does, though the employees generally eat the damage first. I've already lost one job because they were yanking funds from IT to give to sales... after two months of complaining about how bad offshore's code is. Upper management will happily mortgage their future for sweet sweet dollars. Absolutely true. The other aspect that is frequently overlooked too is cybersecurity. Much like in older days where neglect of plant assets could lead to catastrophic damage, neglecting security can be equally damaging, from having company resources infected and stealing business secrets and assets to the complete compromise of the employees personal info. Sony, Anthem, and the OPM are all recent examples where subpar security lead to millions of people being compromised.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:50
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Raerlynn posted:Also this. Remember to be a teacher you generally must have a bachelor's degree. So if you're lucky that's 30 - 40k student loan while making about that much a year while politicians tell everyone who will listen that you make too much money. When I saw that and saw the kind of abuse teachers get subjected to I said gently caress that and went for IT instead. If you pay full price for college in America, you're doing it wrong. We charge so much in higher ed so that we can dissuade those who don't deserve to be there from attending, while also gouging foreign nationals to subsidize liberal arts programs. You can get a teaching degree from a 4-year public ivy for under $10k including housing pretty easily: get an associate's from your local junior college while in highschool (60 hours for free) max out your AP's and CLEP's (30 hours for $500 - $1,200), and spend a year in TeachForAmerica (15 hours granted due to experience). Use your education grant to pay for the remaining 15 credits, take out maximum direct subsidized staffird loans and invest them in a money market account or mutual fund for a year, graduate and pay back your loan in full while pocketing the interest.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:51
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Radbot posted:Just FYI if tech workers ever unionize, they will be painted as racists and xenophobes trying to deprive hardworking foreigners from coming to America and enriching the fabric of our country. I mean, they could avoid that by not making their union racist as gently caress but yea I guess if it's all middle class white dudes from the valley and google and poo poo yea they'd probably put a lot of hosed up 'no outsiders' poo poo in it like what happens when other industries become represented by their most privileged members.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:51
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The worst white/blue collar job is probably anything to do with telecom networks - even though you're supporting the core/only product, you will be treated as an IT-like cost center. Do never get into any other department besides marketing/advertising/sales. Tatum Girlparts posted:I mean, they could avoid that by not making their union racist as gently caress but yea I guess if it's all middle class white dudes from the valley and google and poo poo yea they'd probably put a lot of hosed up 'no outsiders' poo poo in it like what happens when other industries become represented by their most privileged members. What's going to happen is Zuckerberg, Page, et al will paint any union that doesn't automatically accept all H-1Bs as racist against Asians, for example, even if that union is race blind when it comes to admissions for citizen workers. Radbot fucked around with this message at 17:54 on Dec 14, 2015 |
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Dec 14, 2015 17:52
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Radbot posted:Nah, I don't think it even could be racist as gently caress - while Google has a hilarious gender imbalance, they've got strong (though inadequate) minority representation. What's going to happen is Zuckerberg, Page, et al will paint any union that doesn't automatically accept all H-1Bs as racist against Asians, for example. That would be a net negative for Zuckerberg because then they couldn't fire the H-1Bs at will.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:54
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Tatum Girlparts posted:I mean, they could avoid that by not making their union racist as gently caress but yea I guess if it's all middle class white dudes from the valley and google and poo poo yea they'd probably put a lot of hosed up 'no outsiders' poo poo in it like what happens when other industries become represented by their most privileged members. I bet you new startups and Bay area tech giants have great representation (at least racial representation) compared to the vast majority of larger/older businesses across the country with their respective IT groups.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:55
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computer parts posted:That would be a net negative for Zuckerberg because then they couldn't fire the H-1Bs at will. That's not what I'm saying. Any union in tech is going to be organized against H-1Bs, necessarily. This will be their downfall in the press/PR.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:55
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My Imaginary GF posted:If you pay full price for college in America, you're doing it wrong. We charge so much in higher ed so that we can dissuade those who don't deserve to be there from attending, while also gouging foreign nationals to subsidize liberal arts programs. This one neat trick Colleges don't want you to know!!!
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Dec 14, 2015 17:55
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computer parts posted:The solution many companies have with IT is to contract it out to a specialized organization that only does that. There's a distinction here between IT and the all encompassing "tech" umbrella. You're correct if you're thinking of IT as systems, network etc administration, and general upkeep. But there are a lot of coders (most, even) who do not have such roles, and who instead spend their time coding up new programs and concepts. Contracting that sort of role out is significantly more difficult. It's the difference between a mechanic and the person who designed the car.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:56
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Hollismason posted:This one neat trick Colleges don't want you to know!!! "Just" do TFA for a year! They definitely don't do everything they can to weed out people who only want to be there for a year.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:57
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Billionaires burned in 2012 are running the Super PACs themselves this time.quote:Instead they watched Rove’s infamous Fox News meltdown as their $117 million grubstake went up in smoke. To many of the billionaires it felt like a mugging. A few days after the election, New York hedge-fund manager Daniel Loeb, who’d helped finance Rove’s surge, tried to sue Crossroads and Fox News for misrepresenting the facts. “Loeb felt this was like an investment bank committing fraud on a road show,” a friend of his told me. After conferring with a securities lawyer, Loeb discovered that there are no investor protections in politics. He never filed a suit. (And Loeb declined to comment.)
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Dec 14, 2015 17:57
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Amergin posted:They won't be painted as racists because of depriving foreigners of job opportunities, they'll be painted as racists because 95% of IT workers are loving coddled white men who are constantly angry because of their job situation and terrible loving management. At least from my personal experience IT at most places is at least 50% South Asian these days.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:57
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Hollismason posted:This one neat trick Colleges don't want you to know!!! "Effort"? In Illinois, state law caps tuition and fees at all public higher ed institutions at 15 per semester and locks price in for your standard program course at enrollment in the institution. What that means is that students and their families have price stability in their educations and are incentivized to achieve more. If you can complete 30 credits for the cost of 15 in a semester, why not save yourself some big loving money?
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Dec 14, 2015 17:58
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Radbot posted:That's not what I'm saying. They don't have to be, inherently. H-1Bs are attractive because they are inherently disposable (or rather, because they can't get offers from other companies easily). If you make it hard to fire them, then they become much less attractive to hire in the first place. Shakugan posted:There's a distinction here between IT and the all encompassing "tech" umbrella. You're correct if you're thinking of IT as systems, network etc administration, and general upkeep. But there are a lot of coders (most, even) who do not have such roles, and who instead spend their time coding up new programs and concepts. Contracting that sort of role out is significantly more difficult. It's the difference between a mechanic and the person who designed the car. Most people use "software engineering" to describe the latter term, though that's not technically the right description either.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:58
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This is great news. More blowhard dilettantes who are convinced they know everything is exactly what I want to see in the GOP right now, personally.
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Dec 14, 2015 17:58
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I love that one episode of Dilbert where Dilbert gets hired by a rival company that is run efficiently and respects his skills as an employee. But he accidentally convinces them that it would be a good idea to set up a marketing department since they didnt have one before. So then the company cannibalizes itself and collapses entirely within a minute of setting up the marketing department. Dilbert is the bible of American business culture. It figures that billionaires got involved in politics only to find out that they have absolutely no idea how political campaigns and campaign investments work. Good, they deserve to lose millions from backing the wrong horse. Also does anyone actually know what a hedge-fund is yet? I don't understand it except for the fact that they have a lot of money. Augus fucked around with this message at 18:03 on Dec 14, 2015 |
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Dec 14, 2015 18:00
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Soon they'll discover its cheaper to own a newspaper and TV station with their SuperPAC than it is to purchase ads through them. If you're going to toss a couple dozen millions into an election, why not have your money see some return on itself?
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Dec 14, 2015 18:00
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Amergin posted:They won't be painted as racists because of depriving foreigners of job opportunities, they'll be painted as racists because 95% of IT workers are loving coddled white men who are constantly angry because of their job situation and terrible loving management. What IT departments are you familiar with? I'm the primary department interface to our IT team in a Fortune 500 company, and the majority of the folks I work with are not white. The vast majority are Indian, some are Southeast Asian. Most of them are citizens who, I'm guessing, would not like more H1-Bs to come in and gently caress up their sweet cushy job. Nice job assuming that every person who wants labor protections is a racist white person, though.
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Dec 14, 2015 18:03
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What is going on with the recent influx of amine avatars in this thread?
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Dec 14, 2015 18:05
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 ahahahah I want Trump to say the n word into a hot mic because I wanna see what happens.
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Dec 14, 2015 18:05
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zoux posted:
Trump is making 2016 a referendum on whether the islam of the arab world is compatible with American values. Hillary, meanwhile, still refuses to accept that this is going to be a foreign policy election, and is trying to steer the conversation back to domestic policy. Alas, poor Hillary; foreign policy toils for thee. Kasich offers all of Jeb!'s policies without a name that means failure. Well, any more than Ohio means failure.
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Dec 14, 2015 18:07
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Radbot posted:What IT departments are you familiar with? I'm the primary department interface to our IT team in a Fortune 500 company, and the majority of the folks I work with are not white. The vast majority are Indian, some are Southeast Asian. Most of them are citizens who, I'm guessing, would not like more H1-Bs to come in and gently caress up their sweet cushy job. Health insurance and oil & gas. Health insurance had one black guy for a team of 25 for infrastructure maintenance (all others were WASPy guys). The team I'm in now has three women, two of whom are Asian, out of 15 (the rest of whom are WASPy guys). I mean sure it's not 100% white but I give my team lead poo poo all the time when a spot opens up and the only folks in interviews are white dudes who look like Michelin man cosplayers. I told him one time to at least give a token interview to a Jamaal and he laughed and fidgeted nervously. EDIT: And this doesn't get into poo poo I get from coworkers because I dare to split duties with my wife like cooking and cleaning. "What, your wife doesn't cook for you?" is a weekly question I get from some random dudebro. Amergin fucked around with this message at 18:09 on Dec 14, 2015 |
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Dec 14, 2015 18:07
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Joementum posted:“If you’re a donor, you can say, ‘I want to see this money used for Iowa,’ ” one strategist told me. “It’s a way to entice donors. They look at it like fantasy football.” Putting money behind Jeb! is drafting a Kicker first in this scenario.
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Dec 14, 2015 18:08
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My Imaginary GF posted:If you can complete 30 credits for the cost of 15 in a semester, why not save yourself some big loving money? Because it means someone spending all their college years incredibly over-stressed; over-extending themselves and ultimately getting poorer grades as a result. So, such a system benefits those from higher socioeconomic status, who don't care about the cost so much, because they are able to take their time and do better overall. Poorer people on the other hand often have no choice but to rush though as quickly as possible (because it's all they can afford), performing poorly and having lower prospects upon graduation as a result. Having low caps on the overall cost, regardless of how long it takes, is a vastly superior system. quote:Most people use "software engineering" to describe the latter term, though that's not technically the right description either. Sure. Just wanted to make the point that this discussion as stated isn't necessarily just about what you or I might call "IT", because others might throw software engineers into that category due to a lack of familiarity.
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Dec 14, 2015 18:09
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My Imaginary GF posted:If you pay full price for college in America, you're doing it wrong. We charge so much in higher ed so that we can dissuade those who don't deserve to be there from attending, while also gouging foreign nationals to subsidize liberal arts programs. Doesn't solve the constant abuse from politicians, parents, and general budget fuckery that being a teacher subjects you too. Also not every high school offers AP, nor do all colleges recognize and credit AP courses with college credit. Also Stafford loan money is managed by the schools finance department, not the individual, so lol at committing what is likely fraud with federal education loans.
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Dec 14, 2015 18:09
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Raerlynn posted:Doesn't solve the constant abuse from politicians, parents, and general budget fuckery that being a teacher subjects you too. Also not every high school offers AP, nor do all colleges recognize and credit AP courses with college credit. Pretty much every public school will though.
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Dec 14, 2015 18:10
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