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Cultural Imperial posted:Cool story bro. I guess you didn't get the memo that Obama has been one of the most ardent practitioners of neo liberal economics since loving Reagan It says a lot about the state of things that neoliberal economics would still be more left-wing than Harper's permanent tar sands and Alberta boner.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 04:31 |
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# ? May 30, 2024 13:07 |
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Cultural Imperial posted:Cool story bro. I guess you didn't get the memo that Obama has been one of the most ardent practitioners of neo liberal economics since loving Reagan Cool
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 04:47 |
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Morroque posted:Is it obvious within Alberta that this is in direct reaction to Bill 6? Not really. Facebook had to shut down a group that did nothing but talk about raping her before Bill 6 was even tabled. Crazies don't need a good reason, just a good excuse, and Rebel Media is great at finding excuses. Morroque posted:This must've worked out nicely for the Wild Rose. The NDP once again is left holding a goblet poisoned by just how badly the Tories screwed up beforehand. That's what I thought but the WR have spent most of this week burning bridges. Ron Orr is a one man disaster, their comms team regularly trashes journos and refuse to give comments, and the WR - PC merger talk went over like a brick. They have a few years to shape up but it's kind of amazing.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 04:54 |
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vainman posted:That's what I thought but the WR have spent most of this week burning bridges. Ron Orr is a one man disaster, their comms team regularly trashes journos and refuse to give comments, and the WR - PC merger talk went over like a brick. They have a few years to shape up but it's kind of amazing. To be fair, the Wildrose Party is made up largely of people who thought the PCs were too progressive, and then further whittled down to the real crazies by Danielle Smith leading the few sane people back to the PCs (with the most unfortunate timing imaginable). Expecting them to do something other than retarded poo poo is absurdly hopeful.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 05:01 |
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PT6A posted:To be fair, the Wildrose Party is made up largely of people who thought the PCs were too progressive, and then further whittled down to the real crazies by Danielle Smith leading the few sane people back to the PCs (with the most unfortunate timing imaginable). Expecting them to do something other than retarded poo poo is absurdly hopeful. Yeah, I have to agree. I'm just kind of impressed at how quickly the wheels are falling off.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 05:04 |
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M.McFly posted:Before you post anything you should have to write one nice thing about the Liberals. Okay, pretend I started it with "One nice thing about the LIberals was the 1969 White Paper, work of art imo. They kept it in their back pocket for 44 years too until finally renouncing it in June 2014, a whole year before swinging 180 degrees in the opposite direction with this full TRC/UN thing... "
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 05:06 |
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vainman posted:Yeah, I have to agree. I'm just kind of impressed at how quickly the wheels are falling off. The free market already dictated they should use the least number of lug nuts possible to save money, and then the only people who knew how to use a torque wrench crossed the floor.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 05:36 |
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Melian Dialogue fucked around with this message at 05:33 on Feb 2, 2016 |
# ? Dec 15, 2015 06:13 |
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vainman posted:Yeah, I have to agree. I'm just kind of impressed at how quickly the wheels are falling off. Look at Kansas. That's a pretty good example of how quickly poo poo goes downhill when Tea Party type parties get ahead. Now look at the US congress. Idiot implosion always seems inevitable. The only difference between the Wild Rose and the GOP is that the GOP has a PC wing trying desperately to message control while the Wild Rose have no filters.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 12:36 |
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Stretch Marx posted:Look at Kansas. That's a pretty good example of how quickly poo poo goes downhill when Tea Party type parties get ahead. Now look at the US congress. Idiot implosion always seems inevitable. The only difference between the Wild Rose and the GOP is that the GOP has a PC wing trying desperately to message control while the Wild Rose have no filters. Trump may finally split the party though, it's been both amazing and terrifying to watch his ascent on the backs of these crazies
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 13:25 |
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Wherein The Rebel proves they're hip with the times.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 13:42 |
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She was also a libertarian canidate in Vancouver.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 14:39 |
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quote:A good Tuesday morning to you. It's 10 days until Christmas so time is short. Let's jump right in.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 15:10 |
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Ron Paul Atreides posted:Trump may finally split the party though, it's been both amazing and terrifying to watch his ascent on the backs of these crazies Oddly enough, if that happens and the Democrats don't break up for any reason then you're going to have a Fascist Party, a Center-Right Party, and a Center-Left party. And I bet their elections will end up exactly the same as ours but only in reverse.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 15:12 |
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Edit: One nice thing about the Liberals is their accountability and transparency. http://www.cbc.ca/beta/news/politics/syrian-refugees-welcome-kits-1.3363962 quote:The government is taking "exceptional measures" to provide welcome kits to Syrian refugees, but the suppliers of goods and services will be kept secret for security reasons. Postess with the Mostest fucked around with this message at 16:52 on Dec 15, 2015 |
# ? Dec 15, 2015 16:50 |
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I was also a bit confused by that. Is Parka Dave's Parkas really in danger of protests because we sole-sourced some coats? What are they going to say when Ambrose accuses them of cronyism? Also, things like canned food have lot numbers so you can totally trace the suppliers back that way.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 16:58 |
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A co-worker remarked that he saw that the refugees were out BUYING FURNITURE with a GOVERNMENT-ISSUED CREDIT CARD and he was very upset by this fact. I think it's probably a good idea not to disclose which suppliers are providing for refugees.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 16:59 |
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OLP.gif
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 16:59 |
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sliderule posted:A co-worker remarked that he saw that the refugees were out BUYING FURNITURE with a GOVERNMENT-ISSUED CREDIT CARD and he was very upset by this fact. Your co-worker sounds like an rear end in a top hat and the rest of us have the right to know who's getting this spent tax money.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:02 |
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Anyone see the press conference where Wynne talks about using the LCBO to sell weed and John Tory is trying his drat hardest not to burst out laughing?
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:05 |
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flakeloaf posted:Your co-worker sounds like an rear end in a top hat and the rest of us have the right to know who's getting this spent tax money. Who gives a poo poo. Racist assholes are going to overreact, like his/her coworker, and does it really matter where they bought the gloves for the welcome kits. Who the gently caress cares.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:08 |
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flakeloaf posted:Your co-worker sounds like an rear end in a top hat and the rest of us have the right to know who's getting this spent tax money. Do we get full disclosure on, say, what vendors CSIS/CSEC/RCMP use and how much they spend? Do you think it's more or less important that we get this disclosure versus refugee grocery spending?
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:09 |
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sliderule posted:A co-worker remarked that he saw that the refugees were out BUYING FURNITURE with a GOVERNMENT-ISSUED CREDIT CARD and he was very upset by this fact. Are you telling me that these refugees actually want furniture? We can't afford that sort of extravagance! Sleeping bags (used) on the floor, ONLY! Next you'll be telling me they want refrigerators and stoves or something! Madness! (It's a joke, in case that's not clear)
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:10 |
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CLAM DOWN posted:does it really matter where they bought the gloves for the welcome kits. Who the gently caress cares. If we bought them from a friend of the party who's selling them for triple the retail price, I'd say it matters a great deal. What possible security threat can come from knowing the name of the place where we bought clothes?
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:13 |
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I know somebody who was upset that we were spending money on refugees at all, but is okay with the new 250 million dollar Winnipeg Police Headquarters and 250 thousand dollar tactical armoured vehicle because it's important to have due to the increasing frequency of radical attacks.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:16 |
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flakeloaf posted:If we bought them from a friend of the party who's selling them for triple the retail price, I'd say it matters a great deal. What possible security threat can come from knowing the name of the place where we bought clothes? Because the aforementioned racist assholes would boycott and protest and threaten stores and companies and owners, who are helping with this. If a glove costs $3 instead of $1.99, I really don't give a poo poo. You're ridiculous for giving a poo poo about this. Do you want to know the details of every single government contract too?
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:20 |
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CLAM DOWN posted:Because the aforementioned racist assholes would boycott and protest and threaten stores and companies and owners, who are helping with this. If a glove costs $3 instead of $1.99, I really don't give a poo poo. You're ridiculous for giving a poo poo about this. Do you want to know the details of every single government contract too? Yes, that's generally how transparency is supposed to work, and I think you're ridiculous for believing that the racist morons who would boycott and protest businesses for having the temerity to help people wouldn't be immediately shouted down by the much larger percentage of the population who aren't jerks. Placating them is stupid and should not be a priority.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:22 |
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sliderule posted:Do we get full disclosure on, say, what vendors CSIS/CSEC/RCMP use and how much they spend? Do you think it's more or less important that we get this disclosure versus refugee grocery spending? The RCMP actually does? https://buyandsell.gc.ca/procurement-data/award-notice/PW-14-00662406-001 An example with the value and supplier for new body cams Full list of procurements http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/pubs/cm-gg/app-ann-eng.htm#table1 RCMP is looking to spend $669,000 on shotgun slings? "We're not releasing the supplier of refugee welcome packages for security reasons" might possibly make sense somewhere if they explained why. "We're not releasing the cost of refugee welcome packages for security reasons" will never make sense. The argument "Yeah well, I know a guy who doesn't like refugees" does not make it make sense.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:22 |
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flakeloaf posted:Yes, that's generally how transparency is supposed to work, and I think you're ridiculous for believing that the racist morons who would boycott and protest businesses for having the temerity to help people wouldn't be immediately shouted down by the much larger percentage of the population who aren't jerks. Placating them is stupid and should not be a priority. Over a cost as insignificant as this, it's absolutely worth avoiding that. I ask again, do you demand to see contract details for every government purchase? Why is refugee care so impotrant?
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:24 |
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Kraftwerk posted:Anyone see the press conference where Wynne talks about using the LCBO to sell weed and John Tory is trying his drat hardest not to burst out laughing? Do not read any of the comments on this.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:25 |
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CLAM DOWN posted:Over a cost as insignificant as this, it's absolutely worth avoiding that. I ask again, do you demand to see contract details for every government purchase? Why is refugee care so impotrant? Whether I demand the details of all contracts or not has no effect on whether they should be available for someone to inspect, if they choose. Refugee care isn't what's important in this discussion, knowing where our government money is going *is*. The government is hiding that information, the reason given for hiding that information sucks, and we're right to question it. Forgive me if I need more to go on here than "Because security". Saying the cost should escape scrutiny because it's "insignificant" means it's okay if our money is shoveled into a pork barrel as long as the shovel is small.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:28 |
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What if they revealed the costs, to make sure we're not getting screwed, but didn't release the names of the vendors? There's still the spectre of cronyism, but it would at least satisfy people that our money isn't being wasted. Frankly, I don't really give a poo poo one way or the other.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:30 |
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So I hear now that the government wasn't organized and we're procuring hotels for refugees from now till the end of February, 80 million dollars, and each refugee is getting $61 for food each day, wish I could spend $61 a day on food.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:31 |
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flakeloaf posted:Yes, that's generally how transparency is supposed to work, and I think you're ridiculous for believing that the racist morons who would boycott and protest businesses for having the temerity to help people wouldn't be immediately shouted down by the much larger percentage of the population who aren't jerks. Placating them is stupid and should not be a priority. We should stop placating criminals and disclose police movements. The larger percentage of the population that isn't criminal will openly rebuke the criminals, and that's good enough. It doesn't matter that many people decry the firebombing of a mosque. It still happened. Likewise, the retribution that occurs towards those who help refugees will still happen. Isn't limiting harm a good thing? I mean, we already know that the Liberal spending practices are corrupt as gently caress, but there's sweet gently caress all we can do about it. What's the point of forcing them to be open about it where there is a risk of real harm in revealing the information?
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:33 |
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Do it ironically posted:So I hear now that the government wasn't organized and we're procuring hotels for refugees from now till the end of February, 80 million dollars, and each refugee is getting $61 for food each day, wish I could spend $61 a day on food. http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canada/government-hotel-bill-for-refugees-expected-to-near-80-million-by-march posted:Between now and March, Ottawa needs 300 rooms daily in each of the two cities to house about 600 refugees per night, according to a notice posted Friday on a government procurement website. Okay so they can reveal where the refugees are staying and the cost on their procurement site but they can't reveal the welcome package makers or cost for security reasons? Please someone argue me on this, it's too easy.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:34 |
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flakeloaf posted:Whether I demand the details of all contracts or not has no effect on whether they should be available for someone to inspect, if they choose. Refugee care isn't what's important in this discussion, knowing where our government money is going *is*. The government is hiding that information, the reason given for hiding that information sucks, and we're right to question it. Forgive me if I need more to go on here than "Because security". What PT6A asked. Or would it somehow anger you more if they bought pants for the refugees from Sears instead of The Bay? I cannot comprehend your outrage over this.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:34 |
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sliderule posted:It doesn't matter that many people decry the firebombing of a mosque. It still happened. Likewise, the retribution that occurs towards those who help refugees will still happen. Isn't limiting harm a good thing? Rapes will still happen, so the most valid harm-reduction tactic is to tell women not to use the subway. CLAM DOWN posted:What PT6A asked. Or would it somehow anger you more if they bought pants for the refugees from Sears instead of The Bay? I cannot comprehend your outrage over this. No outrage, just confusion. Invoking national security to hide the name of a grocery store seems weird, is all. flakeloaf fucked around with this message at 17:41 on Dec 15, 2015 |
# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:36 |
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Also, given that I think public opinion is in favour of helping refugees (even if the loudest people are firmly in the anti-refugee camp), revealing the sources could be seen as a form of advertising/promotion, which could attract criticism in and of itself.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:37 |
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PT6A posted:Also, given that I think public opinion is in favour of helping refugees (even if the loudest people are firmly in the anti-refugee camp), revealing the sources could be seen as a form of advertising/promotion, which could attract criticism in and of itself. Now THAT's a good reason. Still doesn't count as "security" but it makes a lot of sense in its own right.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:40 |
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# ? May 30, 2024 13:07 |
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flakeloaf posted:"She was asking for it". Okay, so full disclosure of everything all the time even when it might harm someone? You would be okay demanding that the police document undercover operations in real time? I mean, those undercover cops don't need the protection of secrecy. We should just let them get killed and then prosecute the murderers.
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# ? Dec 15, 2015 17:41 |