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ReidRansom posted:Doesn't make it OK. "I should be allowed to suck at my job because I'm a woman and a Jew". Wow, brilliant argument there, lady. Not my point. What I meant was that every politician who rises to the level of DNC chair is by definition going to be the type of person who will do anything to stay until they decide to go.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:16
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It's funny how black people say they care more about economic issues and jobs than any other political issue, but according to white forums posters, what they REALLY mean is that they care about antiracism and Black Lives Matter. gently caress what black people themselves say, it's what the white contrarians think they should be saying that matters.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:18
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greatn posted:Although, it turned out Hillary is 44 amounted to nothing so I wouldn't expect a Bernie is 45 movement to do much damage either especially with Bernie probably enthusiastically campaigning for her. You could run a STD as a candidate and so long as it had a R or a D after its name it would grab 40% of the vote
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Dec 18, 2015 21:18
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Zelder posted:Am I totally getting mixed up over here no sorry several linguistic heuristic databases are offline due to the ongoing audit, my bad. Fried Chicken posted:You could run a STD as a candidate and so long as it had a R or a D after its name it would grab 40% of the vote We know STDs are more popular among America than congress, but are STDs more popular among congress than congress is with America?
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Dec 18, 2015 21:18
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My fear, as a black man, is that the only way to get poor whites to the Democratic party is to promise or imply you'll gently caress over some minorities I don't know if that's true, and I'm probably being very cynical, but that's always been my fear
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Dec 18, 2015 21:20
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Eschers Basement posted:I'm responding to a person who said, "Why are you responding to minority issues when you should be responding to the issues of poor white people", so the historical context was already loving stripped. I don't know who pissed in your goddamned Cheerios this morning, but if you're taking umbrage that I'm not responding with nuance and detailed critiques to someone saying, "man I wish you guys would talk less about what those minorities want" and then to someone else saying "only we socialists ever knew what it was like to fight for the black man", I really don't know what to tell you. Economic issues are rhetorically related to racial issues in this country, and poor whites who are racist will never vote for them (hence the self hating poor people that are all over America). People correlate poverty with being nonwhite. If you listen to unironic racists, you'll find a lot of their language goes along the lines of "welfare queens", "being poor = being inferior", and mostly "our country would look a lot better on education/economic metrics if it weren't for those blacks".
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Dec 18, 2015 21:21
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Eschers Basement posted:I'm responding to a person who said, "Why are you responding to minority issues when you should be responding to the issues of poor white people", so the historical context was already loving stripped. I don't know who pissed in your goddamned Cheerios this morning, but if you're taking umbrage that I'm not responding with nuance and detailed critiques to someone saying, "man I wish you guys would talk less about what those minorities want" and then to someone else saying "only we socialists ever knew what it was like to fight for the black man", I really don't know what to tell you.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:21
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quote:So i need to vent, whoever is in charge of the DNC need to be fired, this Bullshit with a capital B. bernie and crew let them know months ago about this, and now they are getting on the rag about this, whoever is in charge is a loving screw up.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:22
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Do you desire DWS be fired, many do.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:23
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Zelder posted:My fear, as a black man, is that the only way to get poor whites to the Democratic party is to promise or imply you'll gently caress over some minorities Good news, Zelder: Those minorities don't have to be proper god-fearing African-Americans any more!
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Dec 18, 2015 21:24
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More unsourced, unattributed quotes please, they're very enlightening. It's very important to us to learn what one anonymous person on the Internet said, and it's clearly reflective of everyone that supports Sanders.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:24
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Zelder posted:My fear, as a black man, is that the only way to get poor whites to the Democratic party is to promise or imply you'll gently caress over some minorities That's been the easy way, sure, but as you know it is not the only one. The early labor movement had quite a bit of success uniting them under an economic message, as did the latter stage civil rights movement. It is very easy to point to a middle ground in economics. There is a roughly 2:1 difference in economic position between blacks and whites, so you can pitch a program that will have the added boost across communities.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:25
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I'd like to see DWS ousted and Sanders' campaign lose access to NGP/VAN for the cycle, Gail. Can't I have both?
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Dec 18, 2015 21:25
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http://www.ebony.com/life/the-state-of-black-family-survey-987 Known racists at Ebony Magazine believe that financial insecurity is the number one concern of black families, but what do they know compared to the all-knowing whites here?
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Dec 18, 2015 21:26
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Zelder posted:My fear, as a black man, is that the only way to get poor whites to the Democratic party is to promise or imply you'll gently caress over some minorities Are you open to defending Bill Clinton's omnibus and "tough on crime" policies?
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Dec 18, 2015 21:26
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Fried Chicken posted:If the Dems started organizing a chunk of poor and rural whites you would not see the existing blocks wiped from the table, they are too large. We're specifically reacting to people saying, "You guys need to talk about minority issues less." How do you not see the connection between talking about minority issues less and losing minority votes? Sure, they won't be wiped out, but they sure as hell won't vote in the numbers they did because if they don't think either side is supporting them, they'll stay home. I mean, Jesus, you're saying that we're not getting poor white votes because we're not talking poor white issues and yet someone if we don't talk minority issues we won't lose minority votes. And then you go off about patronizing liberals as if you assuming that minorities will inherently understand that their rights will be protected and they will get social justice as you specifically veer to capture the votes of people who voted for David Duke en masse twenty years ago and cheer Donald Trump today isn't completely loving patronizing itself.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:26
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Eschers Basement posted:We're specifically reacting to people saying, "You guys need to talk about minority issues less." How do you not see the connection between talking about minority issues less and losing minority votes? Sure, they won't be wiped out, but they sure as hell won't vote in the numbers they did because if they don't think either side is supporting them, they'll stay home. Because minorities care more about economic issues than "minority issues" you condescending racist.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:28
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Dead Cosmonaut posted:Economic issues are rhetorically related to racial issues in this country, and poor whites who are racist will never vote for them (hence the self hating poor people that are all over America). People correlate poverty with being nonwhite. Again, all of this is because of how it is organized around and against. People here are well aware of Atwater and the southern strategy, why aren't they able to make the leap that the organizing message is adopted by those in the organization rather than being intrinsic?
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Dec 18, 2015 21:28
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wrap it up clintonailures, Lessig has now come out in support of Bernie on the database issue
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Dec 18, 2015 21:28
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Crab mentality and racism are huge things for poor whites in this country because if there's one thing they can't stand about being poor is the idea that blacks might make more money than them.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:28
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I know you've had some success organizing in your state, so I'm curious about your take on how to appeal to poor, rural whites. I live in West Virginia, so I've watched the rightward shift over the past 15 years and to be honest I'm really not sure what it would take to bring these folks back into the party. Democrats had pull with labor, but the coal is gone and the people are upset and afraid (and secretly racist as all gently caress, I learned after Obama was elected). I'm not sure what it will take to reach them.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:29
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Gail Wynand posted:wrap it up clintonailures, Lessig has now come out in support of Bernie on the database issue The DNC is really bad at narratives, so it is rather funny to see you trying to make them seem good at it.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:31
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Fried Chicken posted:So you don't care about anything but having an other to hate. Cool, glad we cleared that up. Nah, if that were the case, you'd suffice. What I'd like to do is create a coalition of minorities and poor whites fighting for social and economic justice, but when people say "I'm sure once we fix economic injustice, social justice will sort itself out," I'm going to call you a goddamned idiot.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:31
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Realchat, I don't like DWS either, but Sanders' campaign done hosed up and they are taking the exact wrong approach
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Dec 18, 2015 21:35
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Radbot posted:Because minorities care more about economic issues than "minority issues" you condescending racist. I think I'll listen to what actual minorities are talking about rather than some white guy insisting that the minorities really support him, honest they do. But thanks.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:35
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Fried Chicken posted:Gosh you mean that since economic issues hit minority communities at r I don't think anybody in this conversation is saying "gently caress poor white people because they're categorically unable to make good decisions, let's never speak to them." What I (and I think Eschers Basement) are arguing against is the idea that the only way to talk about class is to talk about it to poor whites, and that this needs to be done instead of, rather than in addition to, continuing efforts on social reform. I'm sure many people believe this aforementioned strawman argument: Dead Cosmonaut posted:Does anyone else want to whitesplain how anti-racism was a core tenet* to the Democrat's ideology and how it was white people who liberated the black communities of America? I'm still waiting for that ridiculous answer. but as nobody in this this conversation said or believes that, I don't see how it has any relevance whatsoever to anything.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:36
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Luigi Thirty posted:What about a Lewinsky? I thought it was very clearly established what was involved in that.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:38
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Muscle Tracer posted:but as nobody in this this conversation said or believes that, I don't see how it has any relevance whatsoever to anything. uh duz posted:I thought it was very clearly established what was involved in that. Bill Clinton's dick?
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Dec 18, 2015 21:40
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Gail Wynand posted:Realchat, I don't like DWS either, but Sanders' campaign done hosed up and they are taking the exact wrong approach One time, when we were doing a celebrity fundraiser through the DNC, they delayed getting the mailing list out to us until 3 PM on the Friday before the Monday event. gently caress DWS.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:40
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Eschers Basement posted:We're specifically reacting to people saying, "You guys need to talk about minority issues less." quote:How do you not see the connection between talking about minority issues less and losing minority votes? Sure, they won't be wiped out, but they sure as hell won't vote in the numbers they did because if they don't think either side is supporting them, they'll stay home. Christ, the economic gap between black and whites is roughly 2:1 and move in tandem, so if you get overall (largely white) unemployment to drop from 10% to 5%, you get black unemployment to drop from 20%-10%. You think that isn't a big issue for the black community? Because the polls sure say it is. quote:I mean, Jesus, you're saying that we're not getting poor white votes because we're not talking poor white issues and yet someone if we don't talk minority issues we won't lose minority votes. quote:And then you go off about patronizing liberals as if you assuming that minorities will inherently understand that their rights will be protected and they will get social justice as you specifically veer to capture the votes of people who voted for David Duke en masse twenty years ago and cheer Donald Trump today isn't completely loving patronizing itself.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:41
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If I'm a democrat and I've just been told that LBJ and Bill were major racist assholes contrary to what I believed, does that make me a dispossessed cynical liberal?
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Dec 18, 2015 21:46
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ReidRansom posted:Doesn't make it OK. "I should be allowed to suck at my job because I'm a woman and a Jew". Wow, brilliant argument there, lady. Yeah, and considering the jews have been controlling the media and banks for decades the fact that she had to play the jew+woman card to keep her job means she's a lovely jew as well.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:48
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Grouchio posted:If I'm a democrat and I've just been told that LBJ and Bill were major racist assholes contrary to what I believed, does that make me a dispossessed cynical liberal? Really, it shocks you that the school teacher from Texas might be a bit racist? I've got bad news able the log cabin lawyer too....
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Dec 18, 2015 21:48
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Grouchio posted:If I'm a democrat and I've just been told that LBJ and Bill were major racist assholes contrary to what I believed, does that make me a dispossessed cynical liberal? are you white and male? your not wanted in the democrats if you are
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Dec 18, 2015 21:48
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quote:Will McAvoy @WillMcAvoyACN 3m3 minutes ago https://twitter.com/WillMcAvoyACN/status/677952718590230528
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Dec 18, 2015 21:48
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 Everything is branded with Star Wars. Everything.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:51
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Trabisnikof posted:Really, it shocks you that the school teacher from Texas might be a bit racist?
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Dec 18, 2015 21:52
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Dead Cosmonaut posted:I think it's appropriate now to cite someone far more credible than you are about race and concept idea of being pragmatic back in the 90s: The hell? What does mass incarceration have to do with anything? I'm going to try to figure out what you're trying to say here. 1) Civil rights legislation passed by Democrats in the 60s should be disregarded because they were secretly racist. 2) Republicans were just as effective on civil rights issues as Democrats. 3)? 3) Black people can't possibly get anything out of the political system. Also, mass incarceration. In fact, I think you're the one discounting the ability of the African American population to effect political change, which necessitates working with white dominated power centers. To just try to connect your point about mass incarceration to what we were discusing, here's what effective African American lobbying looks like. quote:Clinton's criminal justice reform speech in April, just over a month after she launched her campaign, has resonated with African-American elites. In it, she not only renounced her husband's tough-on-crime approach to drug sentencing, but called for the end of mass incarceration and said explicitly, "We have to come to terms with some hard truths about race and justice in America." http://www.usnews.com/news/the-report/articles/2015/12/11/for-hillary-clinton-the-african-american-vote-is-key The ability to push the needle and important people, and the Democratic party as a whole, to things you view as important. At this point I don't even know what you're arguing. I mean, what is this? "The black community will fight for its rights and racists will exist solely to entrench their own world views, and this is precisely what's wrong with the modern issue of race. People think you can legislate away their problems."
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Dec 18, 2015 21:52
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Nonsense posted:Everything is branded with Star Wars. Everything. Disney paid something like $4b for that IP. Got to make that back some how.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:52
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A Winner is Jew posted:Disney paid something like $4b for that IP. Got to make that back some how. $4b was actually a huge discount for the IP. Lucas thought it would be in better hands at Disney. It's thought of as easy money for Disney.
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Dec 18, 2015 21:53
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