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Joementum posted:They hoped to shoot 2000 pounds of meat, even though they knew they could only carry 500 pounds back.  200 lbs. actually
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Jan 6, 2016 05:46
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Kazak_Hstan posted:Just adding on here, I worked a detail last August with one of the tactical teams that staffed the Bundy standoff. They were pissed. Not at the prospect of their lives being jeopardized over some cows, but because they were denied the opportunity to respond to an overt armed challenge to the rule of law in their jurisdiction. They were more than willing to take action - not mag dumping every dumb hick in sight, but confronting and arresting people who were actively obstructing federal business. i think you missed the memo. letting these guys go home without arresting them is the best option cause ignoring this will just make these guys look foolish and then we win somehow. rule of law is unimportant
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Jan 6, 2016 05:57
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Astrofig posted:HOW many people did they have with them? You can't feed 50+ men on that little for more than a couple of weeks, at the very most. I'm starting to think they packed relatively light assuming hundreds more would show up with plenty of food and supplies. That obviously isn't happening.
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Jan 6, 2016 06:03
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Mormon fanfiction is pretty funny. It's clear Smith had zero knowledge of history that wasn't biblical, so he presented an image of Pre Columbian America as an mirror of the world of the Bible. With horses and steel, chariots and large walled cities, full of white people, that were slaughtered by the non-whites which are the Native Americans. Though Mormons have tried to explain how all this fits in with what we actually know about the history of North America, and its the best kind of "Well, when they said Iron, the meant the copper, and horses they meant deer. Though like many mainstream Christians, many Mormans have come to accept that the Book of Mormon isn't literal, and such, but there are nutcases that believe literally true, and have conspiracy theories that the truth and knowledge is being hidden. Oh and the Conspiracies are between the US Government and the Native Tribes.
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Jan 6, 2016 06:07
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Popular Thug Drink posted:it's like maybe 15-20 dudes
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Jan 6, 2016 06:08
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Condiv posted:i think you missed the memo. letting these guys go home without arresting them is the best option cause ignoring this will just make these guys look foolish and then we win somehow. rule of law is unimportant who said they shouldn't be arrested?
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Jan 6, 2016 06:10
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Tin Gang posted:who said they shouldn't be arrested? each time i've said as much i've been told i'm too brash and it will just make them into martyrs
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Jan 6, 2016 06:10
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Arresting them will make them into Martyrs, and the RWM loves people who break the law for Conservative reasons. I mean Ollie North should be serving a life sentence at Leavenworth for what he did, but instead he's a go to pundit on Fox News. Though I doubt any of these guys have the wit and charm of North or even Liddy. They'll be like the Starbucks red cup guy and embarrass themselves as soon as someone puts a camera on them and asks them to say what they really think.
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Jan 6, 2016 06:13
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Who gives a gently caress, RWM is turned up to 11 and has been for decades, arresting these idiots isn't going to make them drop some restraint they've been holding out on for 30 years and get even more butthurt.
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Jan 6, 2016 06:15
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Lyapunov Unstable posted:sounds like 1-2 weeks depending on the size of the "bags" and how theyre rationing (theyre probably already out of food) That's assuming they know how to cook---most of it is easy poo poo that a middleschooler could make like mac and cheese, ramen cups, canned soup----the gently caress are they going to do with bags of raw flour, uncooked oats and raw potatoes? Did they think to bring a camp stove? (And fuel for it?)
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Jan 6, 2016 06:18
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Optimus Subprime posted:These guys are significantly less prepped than your average back packer. The feds should just trade them some burgers for their peaceful surrender. Holy poo poo this. The feds should set up a BBQ pit upwind and have a massive roast.
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Jan 6, 2016 06:18
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They should be arrested, quietly after the conflict is over, in my opinion.
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Jan 6, 2016 06:20
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Astrofig posted:That's assuming they know how to cook---most of it is easy poo poo that a middleschooler could make like mac and cheese, ramen cups, canned soup----the gently caress are they going to do with bags of raw flour, uncooked oats and raw potatoes? Did they think to bring a camp stove? (And fuel for it?) Considering how manly it is to not know how to cook (outside of BBQing), I doubt any of these guys could make anything more complex than a cup of noodles. OAquinas posted:Holy poo poo this. The feds should set up a BBQ pit upwind and have a massive roast. This would be fantastic. Also invite all the locals over for a big old bbq, care of Uncle Sam.
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Jan 6, 2016 06:20
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Lyapunov Unstable posted:Who gives a gently caress, RWM is turned up to 11 and has been for decades, arresting these idiots isn't going to make them drop some restraint they've been holding out on for 30 years and get even more butthurt. The right has been collectively disowning these guys. Unless the feds carpet bomb the place I don't think they're going to care much about what happens to these guys.
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Jan 6, 2016 06:23
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FWIW in 2013 I snuck into a National Park during the government shutdown and wasn't arrested, nor ticketed, just given a stern talking to. Their punishment could be a wide range of things and maybe none of them are arrestable offenses.
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Jan 6, 2016 06:29
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Tin Gang posted:They should be arrested, quietly after the conflict is over, in my opinion. imo they should be forced to turn themselves over if they want out of there at all. surround them and wait them out
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Jan 6, 2016 06:51
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NathanScottPhillips posted:FWIW in 2013 I snuck into a National Park during the government shutdown and wasn't arrested, nor ticketed, just given a stern talking to. Their punishment could be a wide range of things and maybe none of them are arrestable offenses. I think bringing a bunch of guns and ammo into a functional federal refuge building might be arrestable.
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Jan 6, 2016 06:52
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If you guys aren't reading the prayers from their supporters, you should be. My favorite:quote:I have a feeling in my Spirit just now, so I came on this page because I need to know they are okay tonight. Yahweh, we come before you & exalt your Mighty Name! You are our Protector & Shield from evil. WE Pray right now for Warring Angels to encamp around and fully engulf all those at the refuge with a hedge of Divine Protection! We have seen You in the Sanctuary, we've beheld Your Power & Might! We Pray for mighty Wonders on behalf of these as in the days of Elijah! We come BOLDLY to Your Throne of Grace to obtain Mercy this night, and plead the Blood of Yeshua, our Messiah over these souls and this land & cause. We declare Psalm 91 over these , your warrior children tonight... Let us SHOUT the Victory of Life over death RIGHT NOW!
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Jan 6, 2016 07:38
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NathanScottPhillips posted:FWIW in 2013 I snuck into a National Park during the government shutdown and wasn't arrested, nor ticketed, just given a stern talking to. Their punishment could be a wide range of things and maybe none of them are arrestable offenses. The park rangers thought the shutdown was bullshit too. Plus they weren't getting paid at the time.
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Jan 6, 2016 07:41
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The goalposts have shifted; now they'll leave after a land transfer, rather than if the locals say they don't want them there; they're saying they feel like they have the support of the locals. Despite, you know, the locals all saying they don't want them there and the sheriff telling them to get out. Or rather, probably because of those things; since acknowledging them would mean that by their own word they should leave, they're going to instead pretend that doesn't exist and try to shift the narrative.
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Jan 6, 2016 08:53
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Oh man, home from work and we have a guy there that's super into this on the Bundy side. "They're just standing up for their rights" Yeah, what rights are those? "The right to government land that the feds took away" You know that land and a shitton of other federal lands are open all the time for you to do whatever you want, right? "No, they took this land from farmers" No they didn't. They took this land from no one because it's a marsh, farmers can't farm there. "They took land from the militia guys" No they didn't. After breaking multiple rules about using some federal land their permits were revoked "No, they're there to stand up for everyone's rights, even those people that the courts want to imprison again" You know they were jailed because they broke the law on three occasions lighting fires for reasons ranging from covering up illegal activity to trying to save some feed that put a team of firefighters in danger, and the judge gave them a slap on the wrist for it. So now a higher court is calling bullshit, right? I left when he started breaking out the Sandy Hook false flag conspiracy theories where the government is both some super secret, powerful entity and at the same time a bumbling, stupid mess of idiocy.
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Jan 6, 2016 09:33
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I have a request: the Bundy people have referred to some incident involving a woman in Utah being abused by the government regarding her right to graze on land set aside for a public monument. I haven't been able to find a single news article or blog entry about the incident, does anyone have a link to an article discussing the allegation?
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Jan 6, 2016 09:51
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Filthy Hans posted:I have a request: the Bundy people have referred to some incident involving a woman in Utah being abused by the government regarding her right to graze on land set aside for a public monument. I haven't been able to find a single news article or blog entry about the incident, does anyone have a link to an article discussing the allegation? If you can give a link to them alluding to it, we can give it more of a shot. Without further info, this article, based on a cursory google, is the best I can do. vvvvv HaHA! I finally beat Anosmoman to the punch for once! Discendo Vox fucked around with this message at 10:15 on Jan 6, 2016 |
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Jan 6, 2016 10:13
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Filthy Hans posted:I have a request: the Bundy people have referred to some incident involving a woman in Utah being abused by the government regarding her right to graze on land set aside for a public monument. I haven't been able to find a single news article or blog entry about the incident, does anyone have a link to an article discussing the allegation? Probably this. Ranchers have a business model based on grazing on federal land but want the land to be developed more for the purpose of grazing. Environmental groups think it'll eventually ruin the land. What's the right amount of grazing and how much can you develop the land before it ceases to be a natural habitat and exists mostly for grazing? edit: ^^^ 
Bates fucked around with this message at 12:07 on Jan 6, 2016 |
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Jan 6, 2016 10:13
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twistedmentat posted:Considering how manly it is to not know how to cook (outside of BBQing), I doubt any of these guys could make anything more complex than a cup of noodles. With cattle confiscated from the ranchers. Anosmoman posted:Probably this. Ranchers have a business model based on grazing on federal land but want the land to be developed more for the purpose of grazing. Environmental groups think it'll eventually ruin the land. What's the right amount of grazing and how much can you develop the land before it ceases to be a natural habitat and exists mostly for grazing? Cows, especially in large herds, are notoriously destructive to the land they graze on. What they don't eat, they tread into either a muddy quagmire or into a compacted mess. Either is something you don't really want to see in a nature reserve. Soylent Yellow fucked around with this message at 10:21 on Jan 6, 2016 |
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Jan 6, 2016 10:18
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Discendo Vox posted:If you can give a link to them alluding to it, we can give it more of a shot. Without further info, this article, based on a cursory google, is the best I can do. Thanks to both of you. I'm looking into it because my dad started railing against the government based on this story, arguing that while the Ammons are out of line, they have a point about gov't tyranny regarding land management abuse. I'm sure he got some uncited "article" from his email group. This happens a lot with him, every time he shows me these articles I ask him to cite the source, which of course never actually exists, it's always just email bullshit dressed up as newspaper articles. Filthy Hans fucked around with this message at 10:33 on Jan 6, 2016 |
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Jan 6, 2016 10:29
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SedanChair posted:Oh no the federal government is protecting natural resources In Arizona, New Mexico, Colorado, Utah and to an extent Texas, California and Nevada they also protect a lot of important cultural resources, and once those are gone, be it destroyed by idiot ranchers, or a mining company building a destructive mine with a high risk of cave-in (like they're doing out by Apache Flats) they're gone.
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Jan 6, 2016 10:37
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KiteAuraan posted:In Arizona, New Mexico, Colorado, Utah and to an extent Texas, California and Nevada they also protect a lot of important cultural resources, and once those are gone, be it destroyed by idiot ranchers, or a mining company building a destructive mine with a high risk of cave-in (like they're doing out by Apache Flats) they're gone. No, you see, God created this land so humans can't actually destroy it.
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Jan 6, 2016 11:26
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So do you think they're sitting around having like tactical strategy meetings and looking over maps like WW2 McArthur. Or are they peeking out the windows, thinking they see federal agents behind every tree like some Alabama housewife thinks she sees a Sasquatch out her kitchen window one morning?
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Jan 6, 2016 12:07
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Condiv posted:imo they should be forced to turn themselves over if they want out of there at all. surround them and wait them out A take so hot it's still steaming.
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Jan 6, 2016 13:16
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Vienna Circlejerk posted:A take so hot it's still steaming. We should besiege them. Find some catapults and shoot diseased corpses at them, the whole shebang.
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Jan 6, 2016 13:19
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prefect posted:We should besiege them. Find some catapults and shoot diseased corpses at them, the whole shebang. I would support surrounding them with those coin operated binoculars things.
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Jan 6, 2016 13:23
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I assumed some crazy militia people would have an iota of actual military experience and be able to plan for important poo poo like maybe bringing enough food and water?
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Jan 6, 2016 14:32
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Turtle Sandbox posted:I assumed some crazy militia people would have an iota of actual military experience and be able to plan for important poo poo like maybe bringing enough food and water? In the words of one of my retired military coworkers: "They're just so cute." These guys have no idea what they're doing at all, and if any of them actually are ex-military, they don't know anything about logisitics or supply lines and are used to having someone else do it for them.
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Jan 6, 2016 14:37
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Turtle Sandbox posted:I assumed some crazy militia people would have an iota of actual military experience and be able to plan for important poo poo like maybe bringing enough food and water? Someone else pointed out previously that the military experience that the former military guys in this group probably have is the one where the supplies just show up because there's a whole massive logistics operation they never had to think about or even really be aware of. e: beaten like a poorly supplied militia group
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Jan 6, 2016 14:40
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Apparently the government is only bad when it's making you play by the rules, NOT when it's providing half a million dollars to your 'small business': http://www.cnn.com/2016/01/05/us/oregon-wildlife-refuge-armed-protest/ CNN posted:Ammon Bundy, a leader of the armed protesters who took over a federal building in Oregon, and his family are known for battling the federal government.
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Jan 6, 2016 14:55
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Rhesus Pieces posted:B: disgusting, practically inedible exotic food. Like cans of natto, bean curd, pork brains, poo poo that's perfectly edible but that these mayo sandwich eating motherfuckers will refuse to touch. 50 cans of surströmming.
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Jan 6, 2016 14:59
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CommanderApaul posted:In the words of one of my retired military coworkers: "They're just so cute." If there's likely to be any kind of violence over this, the most probable cause is a gunfight over the last can of baked beans.
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Jan 6, 2016 15:12
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Tin Gang posted:They should be arrested, quietly after the conflict is over, in my opinion. Given the amount of media interest in a bunch of unprepared morons squatting in an abandoned building in the middle of nowhere, there's no chance any arrest anywhere for any reason could be done quietly.
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Jan 6, 2016 15:17
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Gorilla Salad posted:50 cans of surströmming. Bottles of Malort. All the alcohol they can't drink.
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Jan 6, 2016 15:23
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