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Vintersorg posted:I just picked up the art book and HOLY poo poo - this is no mere book of pictures, this is an awesome, in depth look at the Star Wars universe. Im barely in and already having my eyes widen. There was a picture of a "primitive" lighsaber, just a crystal wrapped in string and a trigger. What book is this?
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Jan 9, 2016 17:15
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Anakin goes way past sounding awkward. He sounds like he's genuinely retarded or autistic.
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Jan 9, 2016 17:18
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Yaws posted:Anakin goes way past sounding awkward. He sounds like he's genuinely retarded or autistic. Well the dude has a high midichlorian count and had a virgin birth. Also that bomb they had removed from his head no doubt scrambled a few brain cells in early development.
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Jan 9, 2016 17:21
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And now I really want to see a Todd Solondz Star Wars film.
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Jan 9, 2016 17:23
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Yaws posted:Anakin goes way past sounding awkward. He sounds like he's genuinely retarded or autistic. He sounds exactly like the kind of person who would spend ten whole years of his life rehearsing the big speech he's going to give to the girl he likes.
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Jan 9, 2016 17:25
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Zoran posted:He sounds exactly like the kind of person who would spend ten whole years of his life rehearsing the big speech he's going to give to the girl he likes. He talks to Padme throughout the whole movie like that. It's hard to watch. You like the prequels. We get it. You don't have to defend every aspect of them. Lucas himself admits to being poor at writing dialogue.
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Jan 9, 2016 17:29
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Phylodox posted:The romantic scenes in Attack of the Clones and Revenge of the Sith don't read as awkward, self-conscious teenagers being dorky. They read as a middle-aged man either trying to sound that way and failing or a middle-aged man trying to write grand, moving loves scenes and failing abysmally. No, not really.
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Jan 9, 2016 17:33
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Beeez posted:What book is this? http://www.amazon.ca/The-Art-Star-Wars-Awakens/dp/1419717804
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Jan 9, 2016 17:39
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homullus posted:I have definitely seen this "George Lucas needed somebody to rein him in" many times. I have no idea whether it's general consensus, but I've definitely seen it. Where does this idea come from? Like, we don't say "man, that Leonardo da Vinci really needed somebody to tell him to draw more wooden helicopters and give a lady more eyebrow definition." We don't say "Mozart really did have too many notes," we just accept (and critique) these works as they come to us. The prequels made over a billion dollars. Why did he need somebody to tell him to do something other than what he did? This is because not every person needs to be reined in. There are artists who can contain their vision to ensure a stronger overall work all on their own; there's a reason Vinci's public works were not littered with scribbles of unfinished and nonfunctional helicopters and paper wings. He knew that not every idea positively contributes to a work or is flawless. This is, of course, also ignoring that there did exist checks on artistic excess, in the form of patrons. Using profit as a signifier of quality is a poor concept heavily influenced by factors such as marketing, quality of the previous film, and availability. I would not argue that Divergence is a superior film to Citizen Kane.
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Jan 9, 2016 17:40
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Gorelab posted:My main problem with Rey being a Skywalker is, if there are no other Jedi, it kinda feels weird. Like this mystical all-encompassing power in the universe that connects us all; but the only people who can tap into it for the last 30ish years just kinda feels lovely, to me. My main problem with Rey being a Skywalker is it means Luke at some point deliberately abandoned his daughter to the living death of life as a scavenger on Jakku and I have a hard time seeing Our Luke doing something that awful to an innocent stranger, much less his own blood. I'm sure they can come up with something like, "Well, he knew that NO ONE would ever imagine someone stranding their child there in such a horrible place so Kylo Ren wouldn't come looking for her," etc. but still.
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Jan 9, 2016 17:43
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JonathonSpectre posted:My main problem with Rey being a Skywalker is it means Luke at some point deliberately abandoned his daughter to the living death of life as a scavenger on Jakku and I have a hard time seeing Our Luke doing something that awful to an innocent stranger, much less his own blood. I'm sure they can come up with something like, "Well, he knew that NO ONE would ever imagine someone stranding their child there in such a horrible place so Kylo Ren wouldn't come looking for her," etc. but still. Yeah, that's why there'd have to be some other explanation than Luke abandoning her, because I agree he wouldn't do that.
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Jan 9, 2016 17:48
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Beeez posted:Yeah, that's why there'd have to be some other explanation than Luke abandoning her, because I agree he wouldn't do that. Honestly I kinda thought Kylo may have kidnapped her because he didn't want to murder his cousin, and just dropped her off somewhere no one would ever find her.
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Jan 9, 2016 17:49
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Without discussing the uselessness of having an Anakin-based prequel series in the first place, it would have been better if the first movie was him as a kid, ends with the clone wars starting. The second movie could be him training and accompanying Obi Wan on missions so we actually see what made him go from tiny badly acted generic child to a gigantic creepster before the Dark Side was even involved, and this movie could also help explore issues with the Republic and the Jedi like them using a clone army, and give those blink-and-you-miss-them guys like Dooku and Grievous something to do. Then the third movie could be the romance and downfall. This still doesn't fix Padme being a terrible character or the acting/writing being garbage, but there you go my best shot. My only request would be that they keep the kaminoans somewhere, because those guys are my favorite outside of the stupid rando scene where one of them rides a stingray out of the water. This is never going to happen though so thx for reading. JonathonSpectre posted:My main problem with Rey being a Skywalker is it means Luke at some point deliberately abandoned his daughter to the living death of life as a scavenger on Jakku and I have a hard time seeing Our Luke doing something that awful to an innocent stranger, much less his own blood. I'm sure they can come up with something like, "Well, he knew that NO ONE would ever imagine someone stranding their child there in such a horrible place so Kylo Ren wouldn't come looking for her," etc. but still. Currently still hanging onto the thought that Ren spared her during his revolution and dumped her there, and also maybe the guy that was going to hit her that Ren stabs in the vision was Snoke with a funny hat. Doesn't explain why she doesn't remember bumming around with a bunch of scrub Jedi though. Does explain who would be enough of a dummy to leave a five-year-old in the care of Unkar on Jakku and then fly off into a light that turns blood-red.
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Jan 9, 2016 17:49
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JonathonSpectre posted:My main problem with Rey being a Skywalker is it means Luke at some point deliberately abandoned his daughter to the living death of life as a scavenger on Jakku and I have a hard time seeing Our Luke doing something that awful to an innocent stranger, much less his own blood. I'm sure they can come up with something like, "Well, he knew that NO ONE would ever imagine someone stranding their child there in such a horrible place so Kylo Ren wouldn't come looking for her," etc. but still. Maz's line about the people who left Rey on Jakku never coming back (but someone else might—"Luke!") strongly suggests that Luke wasn't the one who left her there. If I had to bet, my money would be on Kylo—he kills Luke's students but can't bring himself to murder another descendant of Anakin Skywalker, so he takes her and abandons her on some wasteland world instead. He keeps this secret from Snoke. e: wow, beaten
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Jan 9, 2016 17:50
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Neurolimal posted:This is because not every person needs to be reined in. There are artists who can contain their vision to ensure a stronger overall work all on their own; there's a reason Vinci's public works were not littered with scribbles of unfinished and nonfunctional helicopters and paper wings. He knew that not every idea positively contributes to a work or is flawless. What is "artistic excess"? This is what I am getting at. Imagine you are an artist, you have a strong concept of what you want to create. You have the means to create it. Of what use is anyone's opinion, if it makes the work less like what you wanted to create? I bring up the profit only to deny the profit motive for altering the work; George Lucas didn't need to be reined in to break even or whatever. If it is your money and your project, why would you take any suggestion you don't like more than what you started with?
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Jan 9, 2016 17:51
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Maybe he just didn't want to kill her because she was a little girl, guys.  We know he gets tempted by the Light.
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Jan 9, 2016 17:52
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Gorelab posted:Honestly I kinda thought Kylo may have kidnapped her because he didn't want to murder his cousin, and just dropped her off somewhere no one would ever find her. I'm a fan of this idea, that a young Kylo couldn't bring himself to kill a literal child, and instead dumped her on an obscure garbage planet and claimed he totally iced her.
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Jan 9, 2016 17:52
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Gorelab posted:Honestly I kinda thought Kylo may have kidnapped her because he didn't want to murder his cousin, and just dropped her off somewhere no one would ever find her. Yeah, that theory seems possible, though it seems ambiguous whether or not Kylo had any special attachment to Jakku or specifically a girl from Jakku.
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Jan 9, 2016 17:55
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Neurolimal posted:I'm a fan of this idea, that a young Kylo couldn't bring himself to kill a literal child, and instead dumped her on an obscure garbage planet and claimed he totally iced her. In the novelization, when Kylo talks to Snoke, he's pretty insistent that she's just a scavenger who randomly has great Force potential, nothing more. But obviously (even in the film) he knows her, or suspects he knows her, from somewhere. It seems pretty clear he's hiding who she is from Snoke.
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Jan 9, 2016 17:56
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Zoran posted:In the novelization, when Kylo talks to Snoke, he's pretty insistent that she's just a scavenger who randomly has great Force potential, nothing more. But obviously (even in the film) he knows her, or suspects he knows her, from somewhere. It seems pretty clear he's hiding who she is from Snoke. Perhaps she was the not-Ahsoka to his not-Anakin at their Jedi commune.
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Jan 9, 2016 17:58
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Beeez posted:Yeah, that theory seems possible, though it seems ambiguous whether or not Kylo had any special attachment to Jakku or specifically a girl from Jakku. I think he shows up in the flashbacks she has too. So there's that. I do still kinda hope Finn gets some force ability himself just because I think it'd make a nice contrast, the prodigy versus the more normal guy. The PT having more jedi that you could even handle, the OT only having Obi-Wan and Luke, and the ST having a small group trying to rebuild the Order.
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Jan 9, 2016 17:59
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homullus posted:I have definitely seen this "George Lucas needed somebody to rein him in" many times. I have no idea whether it's general consensus, but I've definitely seen it. Where does this idea come from? Like, we don't say "man, that Leonardo da Vinci really needed somebody to tell him to draw more wooden helicopters and give a lady more eyebrow definition." We don't say "Mozart really did have too many notes," we just accept (and critique) these works as they come to us. The prequels made over a billion dollars. Why did he need somebody to tell him to do something other than what he did? All of the Star Wars movies are collaborative efforts, so it's entirely fair and relevant to discuss how Lucas's relationship with his collaborators influenced the finished works. It's not like your Mozart or Da Vinci examples unless Lucas was the only person on the entire film crew somehow. "Reining him in" is probably not the best way to frame it, but I doubt Lucas himself would disagree that he had more creative autonomy with the PT than he did with the OT; particularly ANH, the one OT movie he actually directed. Whether this is a good or bad thing is really a matter of taste, of course. Depends on what you think of the results. It also can't be understated that the Special Editions of the OT contribute to this perception. Many people viewed these as a way for Lucas to disregard and override other peoples' contributions to the films -- especially the directors of ESB and ROTJ -- just because he could. This erased the benefit of the doubt in a lot of people's minds. Prolonged Priapism posted:"These lines are awkward and dorky!" Creating a work of art (speaking, writing, music, anything) that is supposed to be considered bad/unskilled within the work itself is an incredibly delicate balancing act that can't simply be reduced to "it's supposed to be that way". If it were that easy, anyone could do it.
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Jan 9, 2016 18:01
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homullus posted:What is "artistic excess"? This is what I am getting at. Imagine you are an artist, you have a strong concept of what you want to create. You have the means to create it. Of what use is anyone's opinion, if it makes the work less like what you wanted to create? I bring up the profit only to deny the profit motive for altering the work; George Lucas didn't need to be reined in to break even or whatever. If it is your money and your project, why would you take any suggestion you don't like more than what you started with? He doesn't need to listen to anyone, but the viewer also doesn't need to consider his opinion on his own work. It's entirely fine for him to do what he wants, and it's entirely fine for viewers to believe he would have made a better work with less control. You're defending the artist's decision to do what he wants with his work while exclaiming " you cannot write that!" To the critic. Both the work and the critique are subjective and hold no roots in objectivity or hard laws; their only effecys on you are the effects you allow. Of what use is your opinion if it conflicts pointlessly with the critic's critique? Lucas disagreed constantly with Ford's improvisation in the original trilogy. He was allowed to do this, Lucas was allowed to disagree (and allowed to ultimately relent), and the viewer is allowed to feel this improved the film. This is what I meant before by tribal right-think making Star Wars (and other CD threads)discussion tedious. You shouldn't need to defend the concept of critique and restraint to be allowed to hold an alternate opinion.
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Jan 9, 2016 18:09
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Since we're all complaining about the PT, I thought I'd list the things I do like: Episode I - Darth Maul is a fantastic-looking villain that is everything we really could've asked for in a mysterious Sith. I was actually blown away that he died, considering how much of the film's marketing featured him. Ray Park does an amazing job in stunts and movement, but more importantly, he doesn't look like an actor going through physical motions depicting telekinesis. In AotC, there are several Jedi extras in battle with droids that look loving awful - like commercial-level acting in physical movement. - The duel at the end is a bit overdone, but still much, much better than the Kenobi/Anakin duel in Ep III - however, the amazing part is the visual of Obi-Wan running to catch up to Qui-Gon and Maul from a distance. You can see his lightsaber bobbing from a distance - covering so much ground in a short time to help Qui-Gon reflects how much he has to grow up, quickly, in order to help. I wish I had a good screencap, or even a gif - the visual is one of my favorite things in all of Star Wars. - The Pod Race is fun, but the ceremony to line up the cars is actually more impressive - the score, flags, and procession. The race itself is just fine, but something about the pre-race ritual is actually really neat. The race climax of "oh, gotta fix something" is actually a little disappointing, seeing as how so much in Star Wars depends on turning something on/off, fixing something, or destroying something. (De-activating a shield, fixing the hyperdrive, shutting down the droids, etc.) - The roll-out and march of the Battle Droids at the end is also a great, impressive scene, supported by Williams' score. Until this point, it may not have been evident how much of a sacrifice the Gungans would've had to make - but this makes it extremely clear: the wealth of the Trade Federation, and thereby, its power/influence, is immense. - Darth Sidious, although obvious who's under there, is a clear and simple, but imposing villain. - For all its faults, casting Liam Neeson was perfect, and if not for him, I can't imagine his character having much credibility or presence. Episode II - The voices of the battle droids were changed here a little, for the better. Overall, they're more competent and fun to watch, and as generic 'bad guy' troops, they're great. - Christopher Lee is a great choice as a villain, and I like that a contemporary of Peter Cushing was added to this film series. He absolutely elevates everything he's in. - The clone troopers are a fantastic precursor to the Empire, complete with theme and everything. A shame they were entirely CGI, but that wasn't too noticeable. - Jango and Jr. were good side additions. I'm not a fan of Morrison's voice being dubbed into the OT, but it's still a fun character. His fights with Obi-Wan on the platform and in the asteroid field were both pretty outstanding, and gives us a hint of what Boba vs. Luke might've looked like. - Ewan comes in to his own as Obi-Wan, and actually appears to be putting in 100% effort. The film has huge flaws, and is mostly a chore to sit through, but he's a convincing Obi-Wan. Episode III - Hey, at least we finally got to see Vader and hear James Earl Jones. - Grievous was a visual treat, and his battle with Obi-Wan was, like most other things in the PT, over the top, but still a ton of fun. - Ian McDiarmid is god-damned amazing. He went balls deep into his role as Palpatine, and from everything I've seen and read, he absolutely loved it. The voicework, facial expressions, and physical work needed to pull off the character was all there. He, like Neeson and Ewan McGregor, put in a performance that gives the role credibility. I don't know that anyone else could've given such power to the character. - Of all the Jedi vs. Jedi battles, Yoda vs. Palpatine is probably the best one. They're so evenly matched, that turning up the fight to a larger scale makes more sense. Whereas Obi-Wan and Anakin jump across lava and swing on ropes, their battle is all show for the sake of looking impressive. Yoda and Palpatine are trying to find a way to overpower the other. It eventually ends in a stalemate, but Palpatine is able to walk away, while Yoda is forced to run. Thinking about all that reminds me just how much I enjoyed Palpatine in Ep III, and how perfect his character was.
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Jan 9, 2016 18:11
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Sir Lemming posted:
I think the point is that the complaint seems to have turned from "it's like x" to "it failed at being x". Like imagine if the following conversation happened: A: "[Movie] is terrible, it's so desaturated!" B: "[Movie] is supposed to have desaturated colors." A: "Well it wasn't really desaturated, so it's a failure!" computer parts fucked around with this message at 18:25 on Jan 9, 2016 |
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Jan 9, 2016 18:18
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Red posted:Since we're all complaining about the PT, I thought I'd list the things I do like: Ray Park definitely got into his character, and all the little improvisations in that duel (like the dopey grin, pointing and "come at me" arm raising, and weird crab back-walking) help make him an interesting dude that you wish you saw more of. quote:- The duel at the end is a bit overdone, but still much, much better than the Kenobi/Anakin duel in Ep III - however, the amazing part is the visual of Obi-Wan running to catch up to Qui-Gon and Maul from a distance. You can see his lightsaber bobbing from a distance - covering so much ground in a short time to help Qui-Gon reflects how much he has to grow up, quickly, in order to help. I wish I had a good screencap, or even a gif - the visual is one of my favorite things in all of Star Wars. Both this and his reaction to Qui-Gon's death feel really out of place in the film, simply because it's an actual display of emotion that is absent in both the preceeding and succeeding moment (as the RLM review points out). It feels so strange in that there's actual signs of life to his character (that then go nowhere)
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Jan 9, 2016 18:22
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Sir Lemming posted:It also can't be understated that the Special Editions of the OT contribute to this perception. Many people viewed these as a way for Lucas to disregard and override other peoples' contributions to the films -- especially the directors of ESB and ROTJ -- just because he could. This erased the benefit of the doubt in a lot of people's minds. But he always had the right to disregard and override other people's contributions, no? He had final cut on all six films. Nothing changed with the release of the Special Editions except the technology to make the final cut even more like what he wanted. Neurolimal posted:You shouldn't need to defend the concept of critique and restraint to be allowed to hold an alternate opinion.
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Jan 9, 2016 18:40
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computer parts posted:I think the point is that the complaint seems to have turned from "it's like x" to "it failed at being x". It's not really a contradiction, though. You should (arguably) be able to tell when dialog is intentionally bad without someone telling you. Effectively, that's part of the storytelling. If you can't tell, it's a failure on the part of either the audience or the writer/director/actors. Of course, it's virtually impossible to prove which.
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Jan 9, 2016 18:51
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Red posted:- The duel at the end is a bit overdone, but still much, much better than the Kenobi/Anakin duel in Ep III - however, the amazing part is the visual of Obi-Wan running to catch up to Qui-Gon and Maul from a distance. You can see his lightsaber bobbing from a distance - covering so much ground in a short time to help Qui-Gon reflects how much he has to grow up, quickly, in order to help. I wish I had a good screencap, or even a gif - the visual is one of my favorite things in all of Star Wars. Him being in the distance and blurred out doesn't make for good gif material but here you go buddy (I think this is the part you're talking about):  e: Red posted:In AotC, there are several Jedi extras in battle with droids that look loving awful - like commercial-level acting in physical movement. Almost forgot this one too. 
turtlecrunch fucked around with this message at 19:05 on Jan 9, 2016 |
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Jan 9, 2016 18:58
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Beeez posted:When the seeds for a lot of what we see in the PT were in the very early drafts of the original movie or interviews from when he was doing those movies, and Lucas has been saying since the eighties that they'd be a certain way and would throw people off, and we have stories from the set of actors specifically raising certain concerns with Lucas and him saying that it's intentional, I don't know how you could possibly argue everything is just him being a bumbling fool who didn't know what he was doing. I agree that not everything SMG claims about the movies is accurate or intentional, but things like Anakin being a whiny teenager, many of the characters being reserved and unemotional, the movies depicting a Jedi Order and Republic that has lost it's way, it being presented in a more soap opera-y way, the political intrigue and trade guilds as villains, etc. are all things that Lucas himself clearly commented on or we can see the seeds of way back in the 70s and 80s. He was not just trying to make more Star Wars movies like the original and just fundamentally misunderstood what Star Wars was about, he chose to do them in a different way, as he always said he would. For instance, fans complained that R2-D2 and C3P0 are in all six movies simply because Lucas gave it zero thought, but we have interviews from the 70s and 80s in which Lucas says he plans on those two characters being the only ones that are in all "nine"(at the time) films. He'd be planning that for around twenty years but people refused to believe that he had considered it at all. You can obviously dislike what he did, but to pretend like he's an idiot who totally stumbled through this series and didn't give any thought to the themes, characters, and plots is contradictory to the evidence we have. That's the thing man. I don't give a gently caress if he did it on purpose and he planned it out from the day he was born. I don't like the movie, if everything was intentional that actually makes it worse.
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Jan 9, 2016 19:03
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bruvs be4 luvs
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Neurolimal posted:Both this and his reaction to Qui-Gon's death feel really out of place in the film, simply because it's an actual display of emotion that is absent in both the preceeding and succeeding moment (as the RLM review points out). It feels so strange in that there's actual signs of life to his character (that then go nowhere) Obi-Wan is consistently at his most charming and likable when he cuts loose, ignores the teachings of his order, and acts like a decent human being who loves his father and his son. He has great rapport with Anakin when they're out adventuring in the field and trusting each other, but he's terrible when he reverts to being The Good Jedi. This also makes him a giant hypocrite. The fact that he acts all stoic at Qui-Gon's funeral, when he's in the presence of the entire Jedi Council, reflects this.
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Jan 9, 2016 19:06
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I like the idea of Ren not being able to bring himself to kill child Rey. It's another way for him to not live up to Grandpa's child killing skills.
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Jan 9, 2016 19:06
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homullus posted:But he always had the right to disregard and override other people's contributions, no? He had final cut on all six films. From some kind of legal or moral standpoint, sure. I don't think most people are trying to deny him the right. (Trying hard to avoid saying "nobody" here.) It just feels like a violation of the original collaboration to come back 20 years later all on your own and say "I'm gonna change a bunch of stuff now, speak up if you have any objections, okay I don't hear any, cool."
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Jan 9, 2016 19:10
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Snoke put Rey on the planet in order to trick everyone into thinking she's Skywalker's daughter, thereby seducing them to the light side.homullus posted:That elevator scene is important because it also underscores the fatal flaw in Obi-Wan's relationship to Anakin immediately at the beginning of Attack of the Clones: Anakin points out that it was Obi-Wan who fell into the nest of gundarks, and Anakin had to jump in to rescue him. Obi-Wan then gets a really satisfied "heh, yeah, that was pretty great" look on his face. The whole movie highlights how rash and thrill-seeking Kenobi still is -- his own training cut short by Qui-Gon's eagerness to train Anakin -- and how his actions contradict his "instruction" of Anakin half the time. It was already pointed out that it's Obi-Wan who immediately jumps out the window to grab the assassin droid. I think he gives Anakin one compliment the whole movie (for Anakin's suggestion that they fire above the fuel bits on Geonosis), and nags or over-corrects him the rest of the time. Yeah, fans repeat the RLM point without actually thinking about whether it's true. It's Obiwan who goes off on the whole Jedi Detective adventure where he fights bounty hunters and whatnot, because Anakin wants to stay with Padme. When Obiwan jumps out the window, Anakin is focused on protecting Padme, and he stays behind long enough for her guards to arrive. So, let's look at the dialogue in the speeder chase: Obiwan: What took you so long?! Anakin: Oh you know, Master. I couldn't find a speeder that I really liked... Obiwan: There he is! Anakin: ...with an open cockpit, and the right speed capabilities... Obiwan: If you'd spend as much time practicing your saber techniques as you do your wit, you would rival Master Yoda as a swordsman. Anakin: I thought I already did. Obiwan: Only in your mind, my very young apprentice. [Anakin points the speeder straight down, and starts accelerating towards a building.] Obiwan: Pull up Anakin! Pull up! [Anakin laughs at Obiwan, and ramps the car off the building's roof.] Obiwan: You know I don't like it when you do that. Anakin: Sorry, Master. I forgot you don't like flying. Obiwan: I don't mind flying, but what you're doing is suicide! [foreshadowing] This is, again, extremely good writing that fans just tuned out. Obiwan is the one single-mindedly focused on the mission, complaining that Anakin isn't taking things seriously ("What took you so long?! There he is!"). Anakin's pissed, and his 'joke' about finding a cool car is bitter sarcasm that means "gently caress off, I know what I'm doing." Obiwan insults him, and then Anakin endangers them both just to assert his power. This entire 'comical' exchange is bubbling with animosity. So, we get a sense of the characters: Anakin is not reckless. He's (trying to be) cool, confident, and authoritative - because he sees Obiwan as lame, fearful, and bossy. Anakin doing this stuff - taking his time, and cracking jokes - because he's self-assured. He's trying to piss Obiwan off, because why should he have to listen to this scared little guy? Anakin already knows he's the stronger one. Obiwan is a terrible at being an authority figure. Fans consistently get mixed up because they look at a person's job title instead of their characterization. To a fan, Jedis 'should be' good because it's their job to be good. Obiwan 'should be' masterful because he's called Master. The idea that Obiwan is bad at his job really upsets and confuses people. SuperMechagodzilla fucked around with this message at 19:26 on Jan 9, 2016 |
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Jan 9, 2016 19:19
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Does anyone defend the special editions over the originals?
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Jan 9, 2016 19:24
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Sir Lemming posted:It's not really a contradiction, though. You should (arguably) be able to tell when dialog is intentionally bad without someone telling you. Effectively, that's part of the storytelling. If you can't tell, it's a failure on the part of either the audience or the writer/director/actors. People praise actors that are able to disappear into a role, why does this not translate to dialogue?
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Jan 9, 2016 19:24
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homullus posted:What is "artistic excess"? This is what I am getting at. Imagine you are an artist, you have a strong concept of what you want to create. You have the means to create it. Of what use is anyone's opinion, if it makes the work less like what you wanted to create? I bring up the profit only to deny the profit motive for altering the work; George Lucas didn't need to be reined in to break even or whatever. If it is your money and your project, why would you take any suggestion you don't like more than what you started with? You are obviously not an artist. You don't even understand the process at all.
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Jan 9, 2016 19:25
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Red posted:Since we're all complaining about the PT, I thought I'd list the things I do like: This reminds me of something, right after Anakin turns and Palpatine tells him to go to the Jedi Temple to kill everyone, there's the shots of Anakin walking into the Temple with Clone Troopers that look really cool. What I'm wondering is was the birds eye view shot where they walk through shadow cribbed from Triumph of the Will or something? Hopefully someone remembers the scene I'm thinking of
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Jan 9, 2016 19:28
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I meant to play the song out of key so it is in fact good, even though your ears hurt, because I meant to play the wrong notes.
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Jan 9, 2016 19:29
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And actually, the intentionally bad dialogue is worse than the unintentionally bad stuff, so it's easy to differentiate.
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Jan 9, 2016 19:37
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