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Veteran Hag was a pretty fun time. And by "fun time" I mean she didn't even survive two full turns. Opened by marking her with the Occultist, got a 27 damage Iron Swan crit, a decent Hound Rush, and then my Arbalest got tossed into the pot, which was upsetting. I stopped caring once the Houndmaster got a 40 damage crit and the Hag proceeded to bleed to death in two more actions. I get the feeling I'm not going to find Veteran bosses too hard as long as I keep remembering to mark and use dog treats.
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Feb 4, 2016 04:26
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Glidergun posted:A lot of that probably comes from Survivalist/Nomad Wagon, which really quickly ramp into ~100 crest upgrades. Ignoring the Survivalist own is probably 400 crests on its own, which is eminently worthwhile because that's no more than 1000/2000 gold per character. It costs 1.2 million gold to upgrade 16 heroes to max weapons and armor and max all their skills.
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Feb 4, 2016 04:31
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One issue with the whole "heirlooms for upgrades" thing is that you'd have to be pretty careful about balancing the economy. Right now things are priced under the assumption that lategame players are raking in huge amounts of cash by filling every inventory spot with high-value cash. If players had to start carrying both, there would be a much lesser incentive to do long dungeon runs because even in 100% light you run out of space for stuff in medium dungeons if you're taking heirlooms. That is, unless they started discarding every gold item in favor of heirlooms. This would just shift how things are bottlenecked, as pointed out earlier. Such bottlenecks are forced to exist by the limited inventory size. I expect that even if you do things perfectly, someone who is playing the game suitably well will still hit level 5 dudes way before they have a big enough pile of gold to get the full upgrades. You've just replaced the deed grind with a gold grind, which I guess is better since you can do any dungeon, but really the answer should probably be something like reducing the top-tier deed prices for the blacksmith in any case. (I'd probably be fine if the 10% discount upgrades were more expensive as a tradeoff) A bigger problem would be for new players, who run the risk of never escaping the apprentice stage of the difficulty curve because they can't juggle spending their gold treating their heroes and also upgrading their hamlet. The current system is far more forgiving, since any heirlooms you get are progress for permanent upgrades to the hamlet, not investments in fragile heroes. Such considerations are less relevant if you're framing it as a mod for players who already understand the game fairly well, of course. On another note, it's amazing how humbling this game can be. I've put together a baller team to do a long champion ruins dungeon (Vestal-Hway-Hound-MaA with like +30% scouting quirks) and everything is going smoothly. Between camp buffs and the Ancestor's Lantern I've got +40% surprise chance on top of full torchlight. Things go smoothly and I'm overflowing with gold and shining trapezohedra. I make it to the last room thinking that things are going pretty well and three enemies all attack my highwayman, putting him to death's door immediately. They get one death check off before I can stabilize it. The crazy thing is that that damage wasn't even from critical attacks, just from focused attacks with no dodges. (I had earlier eaten a huge critical point blank shot, but the master at arms is a tank so things were fine after camping). I was feeling largely comfortable for so long so that scare at the end really drives home that overconfidence is a slow and insidious killer. I think I would have been more safe if I had topped off with my remaining food before entering the final fight. Also, I was targeting stress enemies first as opposed to the actually damaging skeletons, literally thinking 'there's no way I'm going to lose dudes to hp loss so I might as well make sure they get back to town with as little stress as possible'. Oops. e: Harrow posted:I get the feeling I'm not going to find Veteran bosses too hard as long as I keep remembering to mark and use dog treats. FreeKillB fucked around with this message at 04:35 on Feb 4, 2016 |
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Feb 4, 2016 04:32
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Nakar posted:480 Crests for the Nomad Wagon, 320 for the Survivalist. Take those out and you need about 100 stacks. So... better. But still. Is that before or after the guild/blacksmith discount upgrades? If it's before, that's probably not too bad, especially since there are probably 2-4 skills per hero you can afford to leave at a lower level.
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Feb 4, 2016 04:37
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FreeKillB posted:I swear I forgot about the treats for almost every boss I have brought a dog to so far. It's a really interesting class ability, but just like skill juggling it's something that's easy to not be in the habit of utilizing properly. This was, no joke, the first time I'd remembered to use a dog treat. I had to keep reminding myself, "Don't forget the loving dog treat."
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Feb 4, 2016 04:40
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FreeKillB posted:One issue with the whole "heirlooms for upgrades" thing is that you'd have to be pretty careful about balancing the economy. Right now things are priced under the assumption that lategame players are raking in huge amounts of cash by filling every inventory spot with high-value cash. If players had to start carrying both, there would be a much lesser incentive to do long dungeon runs because even in 100% light you run out of space for stuff in medium dungeons if you're taking heirlooms. That is, unless they started discarding every gold item in favor of heirlooms. This would just shift how things are bottlenecked, as pointed out earlier. Such bottlenecks are forced to exist by the limited inventory size. I expect that even if you do things perfectly, someone who is playing the game suitably well will still hit level 5 dudes way before they have a big enough pile of gold to get the full upgrades. You've just replaced the deed grind with a gold grind, which I guess is better since you can do any dungeon, but really the answer should probably be something like reducing the top-tier deed prices for the blacksmith in any case. (I'd probably be fine if the 10% discount upgrades were more expensive as a tradeoff) Like my goal here, if implemented, would be to just encourage going to every dungeon instead of only one, and of switching from heirloom-heavy runs to gold-heavy runs once per tier instead of "Weald/Warrens-heavy until the Blacksmith, Stage Coach, and Training Hall are done." Ideally the amount of work necessary shouldn't change, just mix up play a little better and prevent Heirlooms from eventually reaching an extinction point. Glidergun posted:Is that before or after the guild/blacksmith discount upgrades? If it's before, that's probably not too bad, especially since there are probably 2-4 skills per hero you can afford to leave at a lower level.
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Feb 4, 2016 04:45
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What do the dog treats do?
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Feb 4, 2016 04:46
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Snak posted:What do the dog treats do?
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Feb 4, 2016 04:48
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Internet Kraken posted:He's a complete rear end in a top hat in NG+ level 5 so I have nothing but contempt for him.
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Feb 4, 2016 04:49
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Nakar posted:3 round buff, +15 ACC, +50% DMG. It's pretty huge. Wow, that is pretty good. It should probably say that on the item...
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Feb 4, 2016 04:49
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I keep forgetting to use them, too.  I would be enjoying Houndmaster way more if I ever remembered.
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Feb 4, 2016 04:49
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Snak posted:Wow, that is pretty good. It should probably say that on the item... Yeah, they're majorly important. They make the Houndmaster amazing for bosses: mark an enemy and enjoy doing ridiculous damage to them for three turns.
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Feb 4, 2016 04:52
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Nakar posted:3 round buff, +15 ACC, +50% DMG. It's pretty huge. Snak posted:Wow, that is pretty good. It should probably say that on the item... At one point IIRC it lasted until the end of the dungeon and stacked, so there was no reason not to use both treats immediately (though I somehow frequently still forgot to).
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Feb 4, 2016 04:53
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Internet Kraken posted:You delay doing champion dungeons as long as possible. If you're not playing on NG+/don't want to grind lower levels, you'll have to send some poor saps in eventually. Having a good skill and trinket setup can overcome the equipment deficit but I won't pretend its not difficult and that the RNG can't be extremely spiteful.
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Feb 4, 2016 04:53
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i always end up throwing the dog treat away, on the assumption that id forget to use it anyway
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Feb 4, 2016 04:53
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Nakar posted:Stuff is really, really expensive now, and getting bumped through the Veteran content is not hard for guys. Obviously the smart thing to do is to take a deep breath and say "I know I am unprepared for Champion dungeons and am not going to do them," but then you're sitting there staring at some partially-invested lv5 guys and asking what the hell you ought to be doing then because those guys leveled up to 5 pretty quick and now they can't do anything without it being suicidal. The gold grind is pretty bad though....
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Feb 4, 2016 04:55
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paranoid randroid posted:i always end up throwing the dog treat away, on the assumption that id forget to use it anyway I'll pick up too much loot, remember I have dog treats, but hold on to them anyway cause I think to myself "It's not that much loot and I'll just use these in the next battle and free up some space then anyway." I never use them in the next battle.
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Feb 4, 2016 04:57
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Rascyc posted:Is NG+ substantially harder? Its just increased monster stats across the board with a loss condition. Not significantly harder just because if you developed the right tactics in NG they will still work in NG+, so you don't really have to learn anything new. The increased stats on some enemies does push them to insane levels when you reach the champion dungeons though. Madmen are insanely fast and insanely dodgy so dealing with them is infuriating. Same applies to dogs in the weald. Rascyc posted:Man I've been doing the cove with 4/4 upgrades for awhile now. Sometimes you lose the RNG on fish people but I'm batting favorable for the most part. See this is a case where the increased monster stats make a difference. The fishmen have enough speed that in NG+ outspeeding them won't happen without upgraded equipment, making the cove substantially more dangerous than other regions. And even with fully upgraded gear it was basically a coin toss whether my plague doctor would move before the shaman.
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Feb 4, 2016 04:58
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How Rude posted:I know how to play this game semi-competently, I'm just venting because my intended strategy got hosed because for some reason my Jester had multiple level 1 abilities equipped instead of what I intended. But I could have run from the fight right away and been fine, like someone else told me Rascyc posted:
Rascyc posted:You can't retreat from the shambler when you go into the void zone. Gabriel Pope posted:I could've sworn I successfully retreated from a shambler one time after that change was put in. You definitely can't retreat for a round or two, because all surprise attacks do that now, but I think it eventually unlocks the retreat option? Rascyc posted:Really? What's the point of the dumb "void zone" then? I thought I tried to retreat half way through the fight and the icon was grayed out but now I don't remember.
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Feb 4, 2016 04:59
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paranoid randroid posted:i always end up throwing the dog treat away, on the assumption that id forget to use it anyway
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Feb 4, 2016 05:01
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Rascyc posted:It's fine. I've been playing this game since early access and look at this comedy of gently caress ups on my part: If the shambler is the tentacle hell critter then I did retreat from it after about 3 rounds... Then ran into it again when I ventured back into the hallway after camping, assuming it had departed. Comedy of fuckups abound.
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Feb 4, 2016 05:06
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Rascyc posted:It's fine. I've been playing this game since early access and look at this comedy of gently caress ups on my part: 
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Feb 4, 2016 05:24
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Dusty Lens posted:If the shambler is the tentacle hell critter then I did retreat from it after about 3 rounds... Then ran into it again when I ventured back into the hallway after camping, assuming it had departed. At that point you really just have to laugh.
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Feb 4, 2016 05:27
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Jade is such a lovely annoying item. The should change the stack size from 4 to 8. As it is now, it is almost always stupid to keep in your inventory. Jade is worth 250 gold each. That means a full stack is 1,000 gold. Gold stacks to 1,500. It's usually the case that you can find enough gold to fill that inventory slot and that using it to hold 4 Jade would just be robbing yourself of 500 gold. If Jade stacked to 8, instead of 4, then it would be a little gamble: Will I find a total of 6 or more Jade in this dungeon to make this inventory slot worth it.
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Feb 4, 2016 05:57
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Going Necromancer hunting. Maybe half these dudes are probably going to die.
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Feb 4, 2016 06:07
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Bad Seafood posted:Going Necromancer hunting. Read it in the narrator's voice and it's a good time.
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Feb 4, 2016 06:24
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As long as you have healing you should be fine, Necromancer goes down pretty fast and it looks like your front line can probably knock down the skeletons the turn they show up.
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Feb 4, 2016 06:26
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Im glad theyre taking back the xp treshhold thing, it was the wrong approach entirely. They need to find a way to skip earlygame heroes for lategame players instead of getting them faster out of the midgame.
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Feb 4, 2016 06:35
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Oh my god. This game has made me a horrible boss. I just had the most fun level 0 farming run in awhile. But I screwed up somewhere, and one of my party ended up getting afflicted. Oh well, I thought, they are level 0, I will just dismiss them after the quest. But due to my healer being irrational, one thing lead to another and by the halfway point of the quest, my entire group was afflicted. Now, they were doing fine, but from that point on, I was basically making them work as hard as the possibly could to survive so that the quest would be as profitable as possible... knowing the whole while I was going to fire them as soon as they completed it, since it wasn't worth paying the cost of treating the mental health issues that working for me caused them. edit: I haven't actually fired them yet, but really, I'm not sure I can justify the cost. They just aren't that good of employees. If they were good employees, they would have been able to perform the tasks assigned to them without becoming mentally ill...
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Feb 4, 2016 06:36
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Fire them, they are fictional pixels.
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Feb 4, 2016 06:39
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Well that went better than expected. Couple times I thought I might die on the way over, but the fight itself was a breeze. Killed the Necromancer himself on the fifth turn thanks to strategic stunning and blight stack (20-30 damage per round!) taking only one turn extra to clean up the riffraff. Next up, my long-awaited rematch with the Brigand 12 Pounder.
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Feb 4, 2016 06:40
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You are not as bad as the ancestor until you find yourself swarmed by hybrid pigmen you are responsible for, hth
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Feb 4, 2016 06:40
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Bad Seafood posted:Well that went better than expected. Bring a marking Party. My winning combination was Arbalest / Occultist / Highwayman /Bountyhunter.
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Feb 4, 2016 06:45
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Snak posted:Oh my god. This game has made me a horrible boss. I just had the most fun level 0 farming run in awhile. But I screwed up somewhere, and one of my party ended up getting afflicted. Oh well, I thought, they are level 0, I will just dismiss them after the quest. But due to my healer being irrational, one thing lead to another and by the halfway point of the quest, my entire group was afflicted. Now, they were doing fine, but from that point on, I was basically making them work as hard as the possibly could to survive so that the quest would be as profitable as possible... knowing the whole while I was going to fire them as soon as they completed it, since it wasn't worth paying the cost of treating the mental health issues that working for me caused them. What large corporation are you the CEO of?
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Feb 4, 2016 06:47
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FrickenMoron posted:Bring a marking Party. My winning combination was Arbalest / Occultist / Highwayman /Bountyhunter.  Last time I went up against the Pounder and friends I kept whiffing while they kept getting crits, so this team is specifically designed around stunning, buffing/debuffing, and making absolutely sure I can kill everything I need to every turn. That said, uh, if these dudes fail I'm gonna need to run some suicide dark runs cause I'm running low on cash for the first time this save file.
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Feb 4, 2016 07:04
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FrickenMoron posted:Bring a marking Party. My winning combination was Arbalest / Occultist / Highwayman /Bountyhunter. I did this with a GR instead of the Highwayman
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Feb 4, 2016 07:34
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The 12 Pounder is now a quarter pounder.  Thanks to everybody who helped me tweak my team just right for some sweet, sweet revenge. Now those two dudes I lost the first time around can rest in peace.
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Feb 4, 2016 07:36
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Is the Ancestor responsible for the loving cannon and if so how? It doesn't seem very eldritch but I could also see him being irresponsible in who he sells his cannons to.
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Feb 4, 2016 07:38
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The villagers didn't take too kindly to his cosmic ambitions and the local police detachment proved too honorable to accept bribes so he hired some thugs skilled in the art of physical persuasion to keep prying eyes away from the manor. Dunno what the third part of the story is yet but no doubt since the Ancestor went and offed himself the brigands have declared themselves rulers of the roost.
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Feb 4, 2016 07:49
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Holy poo poo I think two hours just vanished. I've been building an army of emotionally broken death machines and I've finally cleared the gutters. I got like four level 3 dudes, two rank four guys, I've got a roster of monster mashers. I just killed a cannon, a loving cannon. I got lucky with misfires and then by the time the guy successfully fired it into my face we all survived on death's door but it did NOT so booya, everyone levels up, everyone gets a week off to go to church, it's a goddamn party here in the Hamlet. Which is good because I've entered Week 57 and would have been bummed to have nothing to show for it... Are all of the bosses in the game just variations on these four bosses? I'm seeing like 16-pound cannon on my checklist, which I assume is a tougher version of the cannon I just wrecked?
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Feb 4, 2016 07:58
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