The Division - This game is our Destiny - The Something Awful Forums

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MysteriousStranger: Mar 3, 2016; My "vacation" is a euphemism for war tourism in Ukraine for some "bloody work" to escape my boring techie job and family.

Ask me about my warcrimes.

Tei posted:

I think I have seen all iteration of the use of turrets in the closed beta of Global Agenda.

They tried to fit a role for a "turret summoner agent" in the game, and they tried everything. The TeamFortress style of turrets that are a formidable defense against players. Turrets that are like grenades (the current style of Division). And turrets that where more like glorified buffs for the character. Nothing really worked, despite all iterations, is was still better to be able to move quick than to depend on a dumb ai.

In all MMORPG games where I have played, summoner are either OP of very weak, never balanced. The problem with a summoner (in a RPG game) is that the strength of the class is divided between the pet and the summoner. Separated they both are useless, together they are as strong a normal player. See the problem? You only have to separate the summoner from his pet, and he is half the powerfull a normal player. But if you stay in the same place (defensivelly) people will choose IF and HOW to attack you. A defensive position is a bad proposition, the enemy can choosing how and when mean every attack can be a surprise attack in his favor. A enemy can attack and flee if too weak, while the defender can't do that.

Tremulous elevated placing a turret to the category of Art. Theres a whole videogames genre based on turret defense positioning. Turrets can be fun, but I don't want to deal with that in a fast game and against humans. The first rule of a turret in a fps game against humans is "Put the turret in a place that is not visible by the enemy". If the enemy know where is the turret, and the TTK is very long, people will break contact before dying, but if the turret attack from a unknown position, people just die without knowing what attacked them. This style is possible with The Division turrets, because you thrown them, but you are still negotiating with the summoner problem: you are dividing your forces as your base to attack. Turrets will only work for you if in every encounter you can outsmart your enemy. And nobody is more smart than everyone else, not all the time.

At the same time, the deployable explosive is a explosive, theres no subtleties with it. The radar and the heal are straightforwards useful. Always useful. You only need to master the time to use them, nothing else. Rule #18 of min-maxing: Things that are useful all the time are more useful than things that are useful in a full blue moon.

You can mitigate the problems around turrets with map design, or make them vastly worse. It's way too early to know if they can make it work or not. It's entirely possible to make turret spaming a situational tactic.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 15:36

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# ? Jun 7, 2024 05:41

evil_bunnY: Apr 2, 2003

Regardless of PvP balance they were super useful in beta PvE for just keeping fucko's heads down as you reloaded or bounded between cover.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 15:41

Croccers: Jun 15, 2012

Ajax posted:

I had a loving headache trying to get this also. what part of the convoluted process is holding you up?

The part where I don't seem to have a coupon code or any kind of other code to enter on either the Geforce site, or Gigabyte sites, or any site in general.
And of course MSY over the phone is... well... I'd be better off talking to EB Games staff really.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 15:57

LCL-Dead: Apr 22, 2014; Grimey Drawer

Canceled my Amazon order (since they only provided prime discount on physical copy of the game) and went with the uk.gameplanet 25% off.

Pre-loading now.

Edit: I'm actually torn.. My SSD is small. I can move Elite Dangerous over to the HDD to make room for the 31gb requirement of this game or i can just install this one on the HDD. >.<

LCL-Dead fucked around with this message at 16:05 on Mar 4, 2016

# ? Mar 4, 2016 15:58

Two Feet From Bread: Apr 20, 2009; I'm. A. Fucking. Nazi.

please punch me in the face
i love it
give it to me daddy; College Slice

Tei posted:

I think I have seen all iteration of the use of turrets in the closed beta of Global Agenda.

They tried to fit a role for a "turret summoner agent" in the game, and they tried everything. The TeamFortress style of turrets that are a formidable defense against players. Turrets that are like grenades (the current style of Division). And turrets that where more like glorified buffs for the character. Nothing really worked, despite all iterations, is was still better to be able to move quick than to depend on a dumb ai.

In all MMORPG games where I have played, summoner are either OP of very weak, never balanced. The problem with a summoner (in a RPG game) is that the strength of the class is divided between the pet and the summoner. Separated they both are useless, together they are as strong a normal player. See the problem? You only have to separate the summoner from his pet, and he is half the powerfull a normal player. But if you stay in the same place (defensivelly) people will choose IF and HOW to attack you. A defensive position is a bad proposition, the enemy can choosing how and when mean every attack can be a surprise attack in his favor. A enemy can attack and flee if too weak, while the defender can't do that.

Tremulous elevated placing a turret to the category of Art. Theres a whole videogames genre based on turret defense positioning. Turrets can be fun, but I don't want to deal with that in a fast game and against humans. The first rule of a turret in a fps game against humans is "Put the turret in a place that is not visible by the enemy". If the enemy know where is the turret, and the TTK is very long, people will break contact before dying, but if the turret attack from a unknown position, people just die without knowing what attacked them. This style is possible with The Division turrets, because you thrown them, but you are still negotiating with the summoner problem: you are dividing your forces as your base to attack. Turrets will only work for you if in every encounter you can outsmart your enemy. And nobody is more smart than everyone else, not all the time.

At the same time, the deployable explosive is a explosive, theres no subtleties with it. The radar and the heal are straightforwards useful. Always useful. You only need to master the time to use them, nothing else. Rule #18 of min-maxing: Things that are useful all the time are more useful than things that are useful in a full blue moon.

What does this have to do with The Division? There is no summoner class and turrets are available to everyone at any time and are just an ability that can be swapped out. Like grenades.

Do turrets even last long enough to be hidable? I guess you could drop them as you run from players while rogue. But you don't lose any real DPS if you are separated from you turret or it is killed. Just like if you miss with grenades. Hitting the player isn't important. Getting them out of cover or suppressing them is.

Edit:
If you think that going 'turret spec' means you are making a best friend companion to help you through these rough DZ virus times then this game probably isn't for you.

Two Feet From Bread fucked around with this message at 16:11 on Mar 4, 2016

# ? Mar 4, 2016 16:08

Moochewmoo: May 13, 2009

It's super lame that the map will update where NPCs are or are not in the dark zone. I really hope they revert that. I understand the frustration in not finding bad guys where you want, but it's going to make it so that you can track groups as they move around the dark zone pretty easily.

It's a bad change but maybe someone else can convince me otherwise.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 16:17

Morter: Jul 1, 2006; Gift for the grind, criminal mind shifty

Swift with the 9 through a 59FIFTY

PirateDentist posted:

Is it a beta key to get the preorder stuff? I got a separate code to unlock that stuff from gamesplanet.

I'm sorry, where exactly can I use it? The only usable keys I got were uplay keys for the game and the season pass.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 16:21

Billy Elliot: Jul 7, 2011; Space Pirate

LCL-Dead posted:

Canceled my Amazon order (since they only provided prime discount on physical copy of the game) and went with the uk.gameplanet 25% off.

Pre-loading now.

Edit: I'm actually torn.. My SSD is small. I can move Elite Dangerous over to the HDD to make room for the 31gb requirement of this game or i can just install this one on the HDD. >.<

That works for the US right? I feel like a sucker to think of buying the season pass when there's vague into on the three DLC. I see DLC1 as PvE content, DLC2 still unclear if it does make the whole zone a dark zone, looked like DLC3 was some base build up with that gun turret?

I say this, because with current GBP to USD conversion, I'm looking at ~$70 to go gold or stick with my $43.20 standard order. Which means, the season pass will be $26.80 compared to waiting it out and paying $40.

Then again, I've made dumber decisions getting special editions of Wildstar and Warlords of Draenor expansions for dumb poo poo. I guess it looks like I'm going gold!

# ? Mar 4, 2016 16:26

ObesePriest: Nov 4, 2008

Moochewmoo posted:

It's super lame that the map will update where NPCs are or are not in the dark zone. I really hope they revert that. I understand the frustration in not finding bad guys where you want, but it's going to make it so that you can track groups as they move around the dark zone pretty easily.

It's a bad change but maybe someone else can convince me otherwise.

I also agree with you but I'm hoping maybe they implemented in a good way that it's not like just some rotation you run from one place to the next or something

# ? Mar 4, 2016 16:32

PirateDentist: Mar 28, 2006; Sailing The Seven Seas Searching For Scurvy

Morter posted:

I'm sorry, where exactly can I use it? The only usable keys I got were uplay keys for the game and the season pass.

Try here?

http://tomclancy-thedivision.ubi.com/game/en-GB/beta/index.aspx

# ? Mar 4, 2016 16:37

beaver_cheese: Feb 13, 2001; Bad day for that beaver.

Probably a bit off topic, but this game is finally forcing me to become an elite no scope gamer and buy a headset.

Any recommendations on a good headset? Don't need anything crazy expensive. Just something to be able to respond to people when they're trying to gank me.

What are you guys using?

# ? Mar 4, 2016 16:41

super macho dude: Aug 9, 2014

I hope one of the raid weapons is a grenade launcher that shoots out very bouncy grenades because they suck poo poo in video games but developers still seem insistent on putting them in.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 16:41

MysteriousStranger: Mar 3, 2016; My "vacation" is a euphemism for war tourism in Ukraine for some "bloody work" to escape my boring techie job and family.

Ask me about my warcrimes.

beaver_cheese posted:

Probably a bit off topic, but this game is finally forcing me to become an elite no scope gamer and buy a headset.

Any recommendations on a good headset? Don't need anything crazy expensive. Just something to be able to respond to people when they're trying to gank me.

What are you guys using?

Most gaming headsets are terribad. Either cough up the cash for one of the sennheisers, or find some headphones you like and buy this http://www.modmic.com/

# ? Mar 4, 2016 16:44

Sandweed: Sep 7, 2006; All your friends are me.

beaver_cheese posted:

Probably a bit off topic, but this game is finally forcing me to become an elite no scope gamer and buy a headset.

Any recommendations on a good headset? Don't need anything crazy expensive. Just something to be able to respond to people when they're trying to gank me.

What are you guys using?

Hyper X cloud is legit good and comfortable.

ASTRO if you also want to use it on consoles.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 16:44

Badfinger: Dec 16, 2004; Timeouts?!

We'll take care of that.

Tei posted:

I think I have seen all iteration of the use of turrets in the closed beta of Global Agenda.

They tried to fit a role for a "turret summoner agent" in the game, and they tried everything. The TeamFortress style of turrets that are a formidable defense against players. Turrets that are like grenades (the current style of Division). And turrets that where more like glorified buffs for the character. Nothing really worked, despite all iterations, is was still better to be able to move quick than to depend on a dumb ai.

In all MMORPG games where I have played, summoner are either OP of very weak, never balanced. The problem with a summoner (in a RPG game) is that the strength of the class is divided between the pet and the summoner. Separated they both are useless, together they are as strong a normal player. See the problem? You only have to separate the summoner from his pet, and he is half the powerfull a normal player. But if you stay in the same place (defensivelly) people will choose IF and HOW to attack you. A defensive position is a bad proposition, the enemy can choosing how and when mean every attack can be a surprise attack in his favor. A enemy can attack and flee if too weak, while the defender can't do that.

Tremulous elevated placing a turret to the category of Art. Theres a whole videogames genre based on turret defense positioning. Turrets can be fun, but I don't want to deal with that in a fast game and against humans. The first rule of a turret in a fps game against humans is "Put the turret in a place that is not visible by the enemy". If the enemy know where is the turret, and the TTK is very long, people will break contact before dying, but if the turret attack from a unknown position, people just die without knowing what attacked them. This style is possible with The Division turrets, because you thrown them, but you are still negotiating with the summoner problem: you are dividing your forces as your base to attack. Turrets will only work for you if in every encounter you can outsmart your enemy. And nobody is more smart than everyone else, not all the time.

At the same time, the deployable explosive is a explosive, theres no subtleties with it. The radar and the heal are straightforwards useful. Always useful. You only need to master the time to use them, nothing else. Rule #18 of min-maxing: Things that are useful all the time are more useful than things that are useful in a full blue moon.

Kyoon? Is that you?

quote:

Probably a bit off topic, but this game is finally forcing me to become an elite no scope gamer and buy a headset.

Any recommendations on a good headset? Don't need anything crazy expensive. Just something to be able to respond to people when they're trying to gank me.

What are you guys using?

I've been using the Siberia 2 for at least 5 years. REALLY comfy and adjustable, pretty durable. I had to buy a mic/headset splitter to use it with my PS4, but that was no big deal.

Badfinger fucked around with this message at 16:48 on Mar 4, 2016

# ? Mar 4, 2016 16:44

Croccers: Jun 15, 2012

beaver_cheese posted:

Probably a bit off topic, but this game is finally forcing me to become an elite no scope gamer and buy a headset.

Any recommendations on a good headset? Don't need anything crazy expensive. Just something to be able to respond to people when they're trying to gank me.

What are you guys using?

holy poo poo do you have any idea what you've done?!

IMO I'd just see if you can get your hands on some of last seasons discounted 'Cool Gamer Headset' stuff.
I bought some not-really-that-old-but-it's-not-the-new-stuff wired Turtle Beach PXFARTHILTER42's or something for 60% off and they work fine so :shrug:

# ? Mar 4, 2016 16:49

Morter: Jul 1, 2006; Gift for the grind, criminal mind shifty

Swift with the 9 through a 59FIFTY

PirateDentist posted:

Try here?

http://tomclancy-thedivision.ubi.com/game/en-GB/beta/index.aspx

Oh I guess it was a beta code for some reason? It worked but I don't know what it got me. Oh well :buddy:

# ? Mar 4, 2016 16:52

TehRedWheelbarrow: Mar 16, 2011; Fan of Britches

Sandweed posted:

Hyper X cloud is legit good and comfortable.

Agreed, and good noise isolation for a decent price.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 16:57

evil_bunnY: Apr 2, 2003

beaver_cheese posted:

Probably a bit off topic, but this game is finally forcing me to become an elite no scope gamer and buy a headset.

Any recommendations on a good headset? Don't need anything crazy expensive. Just something to be able to respond to people when they're trying to gank me.

What are you guys using?

Whatever headphones you have and like plus a modmic

# ? Mar 4, 2016 17:08

Akion: May 7, 2006; Grimey Drawer

Badfinger posted:

Kyoon? Is that you?

I've been using the Siberia 2 for at least 5 years. REALLY comfy and adjustable, pretty durable. I had to buy a mic/headset splitter to use it with my PS4, but that was no big deal.

Do you have any issues with yours being really, really sensitive?

Like, mine picks up the slightest background noise.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 17:09

PirateDentist: Mar 28, 2006; Sailing The Seven Seas Searching For Scurvy

Morter posted:

Oh I guess it was a beta code for some reason? It worked but I don't know what it got me. Oh well

I think you get the Hazmat outfit for free. It's a preorder bonus.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 17:15

Sandweed: Sep 7, 2006; All your friends are me.

Oh I forgot I'm using a Corsair 1500 USB headset myself right now because i disabled the audio on my motherboard and are to lazy to enable it again. Its good once you install the software for it.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 17:18

LCL-Dead: Apr 22, 2014; Grimey Drawer

Billy Elliot posted:

That works for the US right? I feel like a sucker to think of buying the season pass when there's vague into on the three DLC. I see DLC1 as PvE content, DLC2 still unclear if it does make the whole zone a dark zone, looked like DLC3 was some base build up with that gun turret?

I say this, because with current GBP to USD conversion, I'm looking at ~$70 to go gold or stick with my $43.20 standard order. Which means, the season pass will be $26.80 compared to waiting it out and paying $40.

Then again, I've made dumber decisions getting special editions of Wildstar and Warlords of Draenor expansions for dumb poo poo. I guess it looks like I'm going gold!

It worked fine for me. Key was available immediately after purchase. DLC3 looks like horde mode, btw. Defend against more and more rushes from enemy NPCs. I only bought the gold edition because this is the first game in probably a decade that I've actually found myself excited over (excluding Star Citizen in the early days).

beaver_cheese posted:

What are you guys using?

I've been using Turtle Beach PX21 / PX22 for years now if only because they have separate controls for game audio and voice audio. I originally bought into a headset for ARMA 2 & 3 stuff, where vehicle and weapon audio overpowers voice audio to a point where communication becomes impossible. They are far from top dogs in audio quality (The bass is lacking) but they get the job done well enough for casual use and are relatively cheap.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 17:40

Tei: Feb 19, 2011; Can't post for 3 days!

Earphones? I have some "standard" ones that Sony sell.

This thing is 100$, but is worth every penny.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 17:58

Vadoc: Dec 31, 2007; Guess who made waffles...

I just recently picked those up as well. Wireless and an internal microphone so there's nothing sticking in front of your face.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 18:08

vyst: Aug 25, 2009

I'm that guy that just uses ear buds with a Mic on my ps4

# ? Mar 4, 2016 18:13

MysteriousStranger: Mar 3, 2016; My "vacation" is a euphemism for war tourism in Ukraine for some "bloody work" to escape my boring techie job and family.

Ask me about my warcrimes.

evil_bunnY posted:

Whatever headphones you have and like plus a modmic

This is a very wise man.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 18:16

shankerz: Dec 7, 2014; Must Go Faster!!!!!

I've noticed it let me enter more then 1 key in my personal uplay account for the above 4x DLC... i don't know what it will do, i'm hoping it will give me 2x the items and i can sell 1x of them or break them down into parts. i'm going to add like 15 keys and well see. Again unsure if this works or not.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 18:21

Dezztroy: Dec 28, 2012

Seems like the Steam announcement regarding release times was wrong. PC is global release at midnight EST, not midnight Australian time.

http://tomclancy-thedivision.ubi.com/game/en-GB/news/detail.aspx?c=tcm:154-241778-16&ct=tcm:148-76770-32

# ? Mar 4, 2016 18:29

afkmacro: Mar 29, 2009

MysteriousStranger posted:

This is a very wise man.

Most goon issues with gaming headsets are cause they're wired and get tangled in their chairs and break. Get a wireless one.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 18:30

Snuffman: May 21, 2004

I probably missed this in all the :siren:

Hype

_{so hyped!}, but have they said how the DZ is going to be segmented (instanced?) level wise?

Are the 3 DZ's just divided by DZ level?

In the beta, there was the 1-7 DZ and the level 8 DZ. I know there's a level 30 DZ (or whatever the max level is) but what's the segmentation otherwise?

# ? Mar 4, 2016 18:34

cage-free egghead: Mar 8, 2004

Dezztroy posted:

Seems like the Steam announcement regarding release times was wrong. PC is global release at midnight EST, not midnight Australian time.

http://tomclancy-thedivision.ubi.com/game/en-GB/news/detail.aspx?c=tcm:154-241778-16&ct=tcm:148-76770-32

Wait so that means at 7am CST on Monday you will be able to play if you have a physical copy?

# ? Mar 4, 2016 18:34

Dezztroy: Dec 28, 2012

Lblitzer posted:

Wait so that means at 7am CST on Monday you will be able to play if you have a physical copy?

On console, yeah. On PC, no.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 18:36

Tenzarin: Jul 24, 2007; .; Taco Defender

Temporary Australian wont work on PC?

# ? Mar 4, 2016 18:38

shankerz: Dec 7, 2014; Must Go Faster!!!!!

Tenzarin posted:

Temporary Australian wont work on PC?

Wont be able to VPN to aussie land?

# ? Mar 4, 2016 18:55

shankerz: Dec 7, 2014; Must Go Faster!!!!!

Just a reminder if your outside of USA and want the 4x DLC (Agent Origins) that USA gets for free send me a PM, i will make a fake account for you and send you back the CD KEY, 22 done so far!

# ? Mar 4, 2016 19:02

Teddybear: May 16, 2009; Look! A teddybear doll!
It's soooo cute!

Does the 'physical copy' consist of a box with a steam key, and maybe a DVD in need of a patch, or would it just be the DVD that you'd install and get associated with your uplay account? Right now I have a preorder through Amazon (20% off because of prime) but I'm wondering if that's the route I want to go.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 19:10

Ostrava: Aug 21, 2014

beaver_cheese posted:

Probably a bit off topic, but this game is finally forcing me to become an elite no scope gamer and buy a headset.

Any recommendations on a good headset? Don't need anything crazy expensive. Just something to be able to respond to people when they're trying to gank me.

What are you guys using?

Do yourself a favor and spend the money on a some headphones that are worth it. After replacing several "gamer" headsets I finally went with something reputable. I recommend the ATH-m50 family and then get your self one of these after market mics It's probably more than you're looking to spend based off your post but if you learn from my mistakes and consider I arrived at these products _after_ other ones failed on me it makes sense.

If you're absolutely hell bent on a "gamer" headsets consider Logitech because unlike most other "gamer" hardware they offer a damned warranty. never buy razer or steel series, they're well marketed garbage.

If you have some sticker shock on the MTH's don't worry, they go on sale alllllll the time. Just keep an eye out.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 19:25

Ajax: Mar 16, 2004; Aunt Petunia's Girdle!
What's happening?

Croccers posted:

The part where I don't seem to have a coupon code or any kind of other code to enter on either the Geforce site, or Gigabyte sites, or any site in general.
And of course MSY over the phone is... well... I'd be better off talking to EB Games staff really.

http://event.gigabyte.com/201602_VGA_promotion/Default/Register

I used a photo of my receipt and it was fine

# ? Mar 4, 2016 19:32

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# ? Jun 7, 2024 05:41

Akion: May 7, 2006; Grimey Drawer

shankerz posted:

Just a reminder if your outside of USA and want the 4x DLC (Agent Origins) that USA gets for free send me a PM, i will make a fake account for you and send you back the CD KEY, 22 done so far!

Ubi has indicated this method won't work.

# ? Mar 4, 2016 19:39

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