Auspol May - Crisis on Infinite Australias - The Something Awful Forums

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Auspol May - Crisis on Infinite Australias

EvilElmo: May 10, 2009

Mithranderp posted:

I know of at least three different doorknocking and three different phone banking initiatives by the Greens in the last fortnight or so, and at least one happening this week, just in my electorate and the ones immediately close to mine. I'd say the average age would be similar to that of the ALP ones I hear about--admittedly I know a lot of Young ALP/Young Greens so my immediate sample might skew the numbers a bit.

but you're definitely full of poo poo on this front EvilElmo

Certainly explains the low voter turn out in electorates where the most conservative suburb still has 1/3 Labor vote.

edit: The Greens have a tiny, tiny membership and no union/business backing. Where are you guys getting the volunteers to run 3 door knocks and 3 phone banking sessions in a fortnight? Methinks you're making up numbers now. The candidate and 1 other doesn't really count.

# ? May 4, 2016 15:18

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? Jun 5, 2024 18:05

The Before Times: Mar 8, 2014; Once upon a time, I would have thrown you halfway to the moon for a crack like that.

EvilElmo posted:

Certainly explains the low voter turn out in electorates where the most conservative suburb still has 1/3 Labor vote.

edit: The Greens have a tiny, tiny membership and no union/business backing. Where are you guys getting the volunteers to run 3 door knocks and 3 phone banking sessions in a fortnight? Methinks you're making up numbers now. The candidate and 1 other doesn't really count.

You'd be surprised at the support that the Greens have in the inner-city electorates. Last state election (2015, Qld) my electorate got <20% of the primary vote, with numbers hovering around 15-22% in electorates near mine. There are also a lot of strongly dedicated supporters who will be able to go doorknocking/phonebanking in a number of different electorates, not just their own. Especially the younger ones, much like with the young ALP supporters I know.

# ? May 4, 2016 15:39

Nibbles!: Jun 26, 2008; TRUMP TRUMP TRUMP

make australia great again as well please

Pretty sure the ETU backs the Greens now after saying goodbye to Labour.

# ? May 4, 2016 15:39

GoldStandardConure: Jun 11, 2010; I have to kill fast
and mayflies too slow; Pillbug

We (The Greens) door knock and call plenty of people, with teams much larger than 3.

We just don't call you or knock on your door because we don't like you.

Also I'm 30, not ~70.

# ? May 4, 2016 15:40

The Before Times: Mar 8, 2014; Once upon a time, I would have thrown you halfway to the moon for a crack like that.

Also I expect (though I have no actual data to support this, this is purely my own observation) that the percentage of Greens supporters/voters who are directly involved in campaigns for their party is much higher than for LibLab

# ? May 4, 2016 15:41

GoldStandardConure: Jun 11, 2010; I have to kill fast
and mayflies too slow; Pillbug

Mithranderp posted:

Also I expect (though I have no actual data to support this, this is purely my own observation) that the percentage of Greens supporters/voters who are directly involved in campaigns for their party is much higher than for LibLab

We had a pretty low turnout at the May Day march this year...

...because everyone was out door knocking instead :v:

# ? May 4, 2016 15:44

Negligent: Aug 20, 2013; Its just lovely here this time of year.

Mithranderp posted:

You'd be surprised at the support that the Greens have in the inner-city electorates. Last state election (2015, Qld) my electorate got <20% of the primary vote, with numbers hovering around 15-22% in electorates near mine. There are also a lot of strongly dedicated supporters who will be able to go doorknocking/phonebanking in a number of different electorates, not just their own. Especially the younger ones, much like with the young ALP supporters I know.

at the 2013 federal election, Palmer united got 15% of the vote in Qld and I think the only thing they did was ads with Clive's fat face

what I'm saying is

people vote non 2P as a protest

# ? May 4, 2016 15:48

Skellybones: May 31, 2011; Fun Shoe

Au Revoir Shosanna posted:

I would literally torture children for political gain.

Which prominent federal politician are you?

# ? May 4, 2016 17:02

Skellybones: May 31, 2011; Fun Shoe

GoldStandardConure posted:

We (The Greens) door knock and call plenty of people, with teams much larger than 3.

We just don't call you or knock on your door because we don't like you.

Also I'm 30, not ~70.

Can you really claim an age when you're the ship of Theseus

# ? May 4, 2016 17:06

WhiskeyWhiskers: Oct 14, 2013; "هذا ليس عادلاً."
"هذا ليس عادلاً على الإطلاق."
"كان هناك وقت الآن."
(السياق الخفي: للقراءة)

Skellybones posted:

Which prominent federal politician are you?

Henry J. Waternoose III.

# ? May 4, 2016 17:06

Negligent: Aug 20, 2013; Its just lovely here this time of year.

So what's going on with this boat that arrived at cocos

Can't even stop the boats, what a loser Malcolm Turnbull is.

# ? May 4, 2016 17:14

Negligent: Aug 20, 2013; Its just lovely here this time of year.

If elected, bill shorten will personally set all asylum seekers on fire.

# ? May 4, 2016 17:18

Skellybones: May 31, 2011; Fun Shoe

Negligent posted:

If elected, bill shorten will personally set all asylum seekers on fire.

Now that's innovation

# ? May 4, 2016 17:25

Doctor Spaceman: Jul 6, 2010; "Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."

Negligent posted:

If elected, bill shorten will personally set all asylum seekers on fire.

Daily Telegraph - Bill Shorten doesn't care about carbon emissions.

# ? May 4, 2016 23:32

fiery_valkyrie: Mar 26, 2003; I'm proud of you, Bender. Sure, you lost. You lost bad. But the important thing is I beat up someone who hurt my feelings in high school.

EvilElmo posted:

But like Greens across Australia, the average age of members is about 70

EvilElmo posted:

Methinks you're making up numbers now.

# ? May 4, 2016 23:36

Solemn Sloth: Jul 11, 2015; Baby you can shout at me,
But you can't need my eyes.

Au Revoir Shosanna posted:

I would literally torture children for political gain.

Yeah but the other guys would torture them too so :shrug:

# ? May 4, 2016 23:50

NPR Journalizard: Feb 14, 2008

Mithranderp posted:

but you're definitely full of poo poo EvilElmo

Ftfy

# ? May 5, 2016 00:05

tithin: Nov 14, 2003; [Grandmaster Tactician]

EvilElmo posted:

Agree on the last part.

The Greens have been trying to change perceptions, yet 20% of your own voter base want the current arrangements or something tougher. Not even your full base agree. If you can't even get Green voters on side, it's going to be a very difficult battle, over many years, dedicated to only changing minds in marginal seats for it not to be an election issue.

All the hard work on a positive campaign, where the Government is only talking about this single issue over the life of a Parliament is impossible. Other issues will come up and a scare campaign by the Liberals will scrap any progress. It happened after Rudd got rid of the pacific solution.

"unless 100% of the base agree with something, then it's not an issue? "

Wrap it up folks, politics is over.

It might be fairer Elmo to just ask people to vote labour 1 greens 2 libs 800, as that's what it looks like to me.

The majority of the thread hate them as much as you do, but don't want to reward labour with a 1 given their unceasing support for torturing asylum seekers. The best you will see is greens 1, labour 2, libs 800. :shrug:

# ? May 5, 2016 00:12

Amoeba102: Jan 22, 2010

New senate voting rules means it's Greens 1, Labor 2, LNP [this space intentionally left blank]

# ? May 5, 2016 00:16

norp: Jan 20, 2004; TRUMP TRUMP TRUMP

let's invade New Zealand, they have oil

Amoeba102 posted:

New senate voting rules means it's Greens 1, Labor 2, LNP [this space intentionally left blank]

I would have thought that exhausting your vote wouldn't be the best solution.
Giving the last seat to the coalition is probably worse than one extra crazy in the senate

# ? May 5, 2016 00:23

Amoeba102: Jan 22, 2010

I'd just leave off the LNP and people worse than the LNP. If you go to extremes, you can find cases of worse options than the LNP. One Nation or any neofascists.

# ? May 5, 2016 00:27

Anidav: Feb 25, 2010; ahhh fuck its the rats again

Nothing makes my morning than watching the remains of the Neman Government tear itself apart.

# ? May 5, 2016 00:30

Freudian Slip: Mar 10, 2007; "I'm an archivist. I'm archiving."

NTEU (Best Union) has supported the Greens the last few elections

# ? May 5, 2016 00:51

Doctor Spaceman: Jul 6, 2010; "Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."

https://twitter.com/murpharoo/status/727983514851811328

loving hell, the "Member for Rio Tinto" lines were just meant to be jokes, not suggestions.

# ? May 5, 2016 00:54

Amethyst: Mar 28, 2004; I CANNOT HELP BUT MAKE THE DCSS THREAD A FETID SWAMP OF UNFUN POSTING
plz notice me trunk-senpai

Has this thread discussed the Shapes recipe change?

# ? May 5, 2016 01:03

Doctor Spaceman: Jul 6, 2010; "Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."

https://twitter.com/a_rigby/status/728011362631188480

# ? May 5, 2016 01:04

BOAT SHOWBOAT: Oct 11, 2007; who do you carry the torch for, my young man?

While I'm opening this up to criticism here, two of my friends and I have recently started a podcast about auspol given there are very few others that we could find beyond the official ABC one etc. I sit on the Left, one of my buddies is a dirty Lib and the other is a man on the street who we're constantly trying to sway. In the latest episode we talked about the end of Brownyn Bishop, erotic novels and Waleed Aly. The second episode has better sound quality than the first. Two more updates are coming soon this week, and we're going to be updating to a regular schedule.

https://itunes.apple.com/au/podcast/continuity-and-change/id1109792474
https://continuityandchange.libsyn.com/

# ? May 5, 2016 01:45

Cartoon: Jun 20, 2008; poop

EvilElmo posted:

Yet, nobody answers if they'd prefer the ALP to have Green policy and always in opposition or Liberal policy and in Government.

Plenty of people, me included, have answered this question so you can now add disingenuous to your already well established record of outright lies. If you were trying to convince anyone of the superiority of the ALP then you are doing a piss poor job. You listed The Carbon Tax as something that the ALP achieved and the Greens couldn't. Just how loving short do you think our memories are? It was part of the deal that saw the ALP form a :siren:

MINORITY

government.

Are you getting paid by the ALP? If you are they deserve their money back.

Lid posted:

Treasurer Scott Morrison has declared an end to class warfare in Australian politics during his post-budget sales pitch, saying voters were "over the us and them" approach to governing.

ITT a white man of privelege tells the oppressed being uppity no longer exists.

So we've continued on with the story of 'safe hands' into 'we must stop class warfare'? WTF?

http://www.afr.com/news/politics/budget-2016-class-warfare-will-ruin-the-country-scott-morrison-20160504-golopo

quote:

Budget 2016: Class warfare will ruin the country: Scott Morrison by Phillip Coorey

Treasurer Scott Morrison has called for an end to the class warfare and handout mentality that surrounds federal budgets, warning it will run the country into the ground.

As Labor slammed Tuesday's budget as unfair and vowed to oppose both the estimated $50 billion-plus in company tax cuts over 10 years, and the scheduled repeal next year of the temporary income tax deficit levy for those on the highest incomes, the Treasurer said enough was enough. "We have got to stop looking at the economy as if it's a whole bunch of individuals, and they are all looking for their little bit out of the government," Mr Morrison said. "If that's the sort of country we are going to run, we'll run it into the ground and we'll run each other into the ground. Australians are over this class warfare, they are over the us and them. They are over it(Becasue they know they lost?). They know the big economic challenges that are out there facing them and their future. What they want from us is a stronger economic plan that gets them to that other side."

LABOR RESPONSE

With Malcolm Turnbull to call the election this weekend for July 2, Labor leader Bill Shorten will use his Budget Address-in-Reply on Thursday night to say Labor will support the $6 billion cuts in superannuation concessions for the wealthy, the increase in tobacco tax and the "cup of coffee and a biscuit" tax cut to middle-income earners, delivered by raising the $80,0001 income threshold, over which the 37 per cent rate applies, to $87,001. "They're the people we want to see do well and we'll take any progress for them," Mr Shorten said on Wednesday. But he will confirm Labor's opposition to the company tax cuts, which budget economist Chris Richardson estimates in today's Australian Financial Review as costing $55 billion over the decade, and the June 30, 2017, expiration of the deficit levy � a three-year, 2 percentage point increase to the top marginal tax rate, which applies to incomes over $180,001. Mr Shorten "will paint the Turnbull government as fundamentally unfair and out of touch by highlighting the disparity between its tax cuts for high-income earners and big business and its embrace of Tony Abbott's cuts to welfare payments and support for working and middle-class families" a spokesman said. He will characterise Tuesday's budget as a document that "puts big business before battlers" while tripling the deficit and cutting health and education spending. "If you earn a million dollars, if you are an income earner who earns a million dollars, you are going to get nearly $17,000 in tax cuts. But if you earn less than $80,000 you will not get a cent," he will say.

The decision to oppose the company tax cuts ensures the centrepiece of Tuesday's budget will be a feature of the election campaign. The policy starts slowly by granting a 27.5 per cent rate to all incorporated businesses with a turnover under $10 million, but ratchets up until the rate for all companies is 25 per cent by 2026-27. Mr Morrison has stressed repeatedly that backing business, starting with small and medium enterprises, was the best chance to generate growth and employment. He said the opposition needed to drop the "class envy politics".(Class envy politics, is that some form of psyops warfare?)

DEFENDED FEWER HANDOUTS

Mr Turnbull, too, defended the budget not giving handouts to everyone. "Every Australian benefits from this budget. There are benefits for people right across the spectrum; every Australian benefits from a strong economy and strong growth," he said. Treasury modelling released on Wednesday said Australian workers would enjoy two-thirds of the likely improvement in wages, hiring and living standards more broadly from the company tax cuts. Labor believes the government is too scared to release the full 10-year costing for its company tax rate cut because it will turn off voters. Labor has Parliamentary Budget Office costings showing the final three years of the policy costing about $37 billion. The government is only releasing the $5.2 billion cost for the first four years. For several weeks, the Coalition has been attacking Labor for making 10-year policy promises on health, education, disabilities and negative gearing and attempting to cost them. It has called the long-term forecasts "fantasy" funding. Although Labor is likely to support all the superannuation measures, more so because they in part reflect the policies Labor has already announced, it still attacked Mr Morrison for reneging on an earlier pledge to not touch super in the retirement phase nor do anything retrospective.

Among the measures announced on Tuesday night, the government placed a $500,000 lifetime cap on non-concessional contributions, backdated to contributions made since 2007. It also capped at $1.6 million the amount of superannuation that can be transferred into a private pension. This applies to current superannuants and retirees.

'I DON'T BELIEVE THIS IS RETROSPECTIVE' ( 2007 wasn't just yesterday Scotty)

But Mr Morrison told the National Press Club on Wednesday: "I don't believe this is retrospective." In November last year, Mr Morrison said "what we want to make sure of with superannuation is that we need to respect the fact that people have been saving under particular rules over a long period of time, that there is nothing that punishes or penalises them retrospectively on any of these things. I mean, that is one of those iron-clad rules about when you look at these systems," he said. He also once promised not to touch retirement accounts, saying: "Australians who are saving over their lives have a right to understand that the rules in the retirement phase won't change, that they have a right to expect certainty." On Wednesday, Mr Morrison contended: "I have not changed the tax treatment of retirement accounts. "We are not taxing the earnings out of retirement phase accounts. Full stop. What we have done is we have set a limit on what can go into those retirement accounts. That's a different position. And it's one I'm very comfortable with."

Mr Turnbull also gaffed during a radio interview when he was tackled on negative gearing and housing affordability. When host John Faine said his kids were effectively locked out of the housing market, Mr Turnbull quipped: "Well you should shell out for them, you should support them, a wealthy man like you."

I can see why the King Louis XVIs of our day are concerned about class warfare.

If we weren't so full of cake we might be building the barricades right now.

This budget is actually worse than NTATA and Hockey's one because it manages to seem reasonable at first glance but:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-05-05/economist-scathing-of-tasmanian-world-heritage-area-funding/7385496

quote:

Top economist surprised by lack of future Tasmanian World Heritage Area funding By Richard Baines Updated about 2 hours ago

A prominent economist has joined environmentalists in condemning the lack of ongoing federal funding to manage Tasmanian Wilderness World Heritage Area (TWWHA).

Key points:

Funding for the TWWHA to be reduced to $1.8 million from $5.2 million next year
Saul Eslake says State Government could end up paying the difference
Environment Minister says 2014-2015 agreement not changed.
This financial year, $5.2 million was allocated to manage 1.6 million hectares of Tasmania's protected wilderness.

That funding will be reduced to $1.8 million next financial year, $1.7 million the year after. The funding expires in 2018-2019. Independent economist Saul Eslake said the lack of ongoing funding took him by surprise. "That is an eyebrow-raising issue," he said. "It is small change and you would think that there's a reasonable requirement for some more funding of Tasmania's wilderness areas in order to better manage the risk of fires. "We saw over the past season [it] can have a devastating impact." Bushfires over the summer burnt more than 20,000 hectares in the TWWHA, which is home to rare pencil and King Billy pines and cushion plants and can take thousands of years to grow. Mr Eslake said the fires were evidence of a need for more funding to manage the area. He said the State Government could end up picking up the tab for any fires in the future. "Unless subsequent fires qualify for Federal National Disaster Assistance the cost of preventing fires or cleaning up after them if they do break out again might well fall to the State Government," he said.

Funding plan unchanged, Environment Minister says

In State Parliament on Wednesday, Greens leader Cassy O'Connor was unimpressed. "It is simply staggering and disappointing to see a Federal Government make such a savage cut," she said. Federal Environment Minister Greg Hunt said the funding was part of an agreement made years earlier, which totalled $10.2 million. "At that time, the Australian Government committed to supporting Tasmania to strengthen its management of the Tasmanian Wilderness by providing an additional $10.2 million for its protection, conservation, presentation and rehabilitation," he said. Mr Hunt's state counterpart Matthew Groom threw his support behind the Federal Government's contribution. "There is a strong ongoing commitment to the World Heritage Area including funding from the Commonwealth Government, $8.7 million over the course of the forward estimates, and there is a significant upfront contribution from the Commonwealth to undertake important work," he said.

Global warming -> Fire
Old Growth wanted by furniture industry -> Neglect it till it doesn't qualify as a Heritage area

Shades of the (once was a) GBR.

But why stop the kicking just when your leg was just getting warmed up?

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-05-05/calls-for-government-to-address-indigenous-suicide/7380448

quote:

Government urged to address 'epidemic' Indigenous suicide rates in remote Australia By the National Reporting Team's Natasha Robinson Posted about 3 hours ago

Aboriginal communities across the nation are calling on the Federal Government to urgently address what they describe as an "epidemic" of Indigenous suicides in remote Australia.

Key points:

Expert says suicide rates in the Kimberley doubled in the past five years
Says delay in spending funds earmarked for indigenous suicide prevention "unacceptable"
Conference in Alice Springs to brainstorm solutions to problem
The crisis is most acute in the remote Kimberley region of Western Australia, where a 10-year-old girl recently hung herself.

Indigenous leaders there say the Federal Government must act now to prevent further deaths. The call comes as the first-ever National Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Suicide Prevention Conference begins tonight in Alice Springs. Aboriginal people and health workers will travel from across Australia to attend the conference in the wake of escalating Indigenous suicide rates, particularly over the past five years. The Aboriginal Suicide Prevention Evaluation Project, chaired by West Australian academic Pat Dudgeon and former Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander social justice commissioner Tom Calma, has been mapping suicide rates. Mr Calma said suicide rates in remote Australia could be described as an epidemic (Poor lifestyle choices?). He said there had been a doubling of Indigenous suicide rates in the Kimberley during the past five years, and that the problem was larger than official statistics suggested because many deaths were never reported to the coroner. He said that although the Government was preparing to implement a national suicide prevention strategy after July, there had been an unacceptable three-year delay in spending $17.8 million in funds earmarked for Indigenous suicide prevention.(A massive saving over the three year period) "We can't continually have these significant health issues become political footballs," Mr Calma said. "It's disappointing. The whole of Indigenous affairs is continually challenged by a lack of consistent policy direction and funding. And that's due to ministers and bureaucrats procrastinating. "What we need in Indigenous affairs is good, bipartisan agreement on a way forward, and then we need to have a consistent policy approach and funding approach."

Immediate action needed in Kimberley: Morris

Wes Morris is the coordinator of the Kimberley Aboriginal Law and Culture Centre, which played an instrumental role in the establishment of a landmark coronial inquiry into a string of suicides in the Kimberley in 2007. But with suicide rates in the Kimberley now higher than they were in 2007, Mr Morris is calling for a national inquiry. "As bad as the suicide rate was back in 2007, it is twice as bad today," he said.

24-hour telephone counselling

Lifeline on 13 11 14
Kids Helpline on 1800 551 800
MensLine Australia on 1300 789 978
Suicide Call Back Service on 1300 659 467
Beyond Blue on 1300 22 46 36
Headspace on 1800 650 850

Later this year, a report by the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Suicide Prevention Evaluation Project will be published following two years of policy work by Indigenous leaders. Mr Morris said while he was looking forward to the publication of the report, action needed to be taken immediately, particular in response to the death of a 10-year-old girl in the Kimberley community of Looma in March. Mr Morris said the Government had received a report which dealt specifically with the escalating crisis in the Kimberley last December. "Indigenous suicide is a national problem. We understand that," he said. "But the worst situation in the nation happens to be in the Kimberley and the Commonwealth has had the Kimberley report since about December last year. "We're asking the Government not to wait until June or July or some future point in time. We're asking them to act in relation to this chronic emergency in the Kimberley and to act now, not later."

Funds set aside for suicide prevention unspent

For more than three years, $17.8 million in funds earmarked for Indigenous suicide prevention has remained unspent by the Federal Government. The funding was tied to a national indigenous suicide prevention plan devised by Labor under the Gillard government, but never implemented. Incoming Indigenous Affairs Minister Nigel Scullion quarantined the funds upon the change of government in 2013, and the funds are now attached to a national suicide prevention strategy to be rolled out from August. ( You can't make this poo poo up, including->) Senator Scullion's office referred questions on the issue to the Federal Government's Assistant Minister for Health Fiona Nash. A spokesman for the Minister said the Australian Government funded a number of suicide prevention and mental health programs to which Indigenous people had access. "The Australian Government's mental health reforms were only announced in November last year, and since this time, Primary Health Networks have been working hard to develop needs analysis, identify service gaps and overlaps and produce work plans in preparation for July 1," he said. "It is important that this methodical planning work is completed prior to the flow of funding."

Spate of deaths in Canada

International attention has focused on indigenous suicide in the wake of a spate of suicides in Canada. An international conference on Indigenous suicide prevention will be held in New Zealand later in the year. The Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Suicide Prevention Conference in Alice Springs that is opening tonight will hold workshops until the end of the week. The first-ever conference of its kind, it will gather together experts and members of the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander communities to build knowledge and discuss how communities can be strengthened. There will be a special focus on at-risk groups, including young people, the LGBTI community, and those facing incarceration in prisons.

Now I can't fault Turdball in the same way I took NTATA to task. To be fair Turdball has never given the slightest indication of giving the slightest gently caress about either our indigenous people or anyone else who wasn't bathed in privilege.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-05-04/bishop-says-she-stood-down-as-speaker-to-protect-tony-abbott/7384634 Choppergate's final farce.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-05-05/islamic-state-recruiter-neil-prakash-killed-in-us-air-strike/7385078 Ex judicial killings now AOK apparently. Even little girls. I know a few troubled teens who could do with a good dose of airbourne vengeance. How do I get onto the sweet sweet slaughter band wagon?

# ? May 5, 2016 01:49

G-Spot Run: Jun 28, 2005

Has anyone in the media seriously and specifically called out the repeated assertion of 80k as middle income? Because SloMo kept saying middle income over and over and over and over and over in his mini presser this morning and it makes my loving blood boil because surely if it's middle income I should know a few people who earn that much

Better yet has anyone asked him how his brain handles the cognitive dissonance of $80k as "middle income" when the pension tops out at just under $23k per single and newstart allowance tops out at just under $14k ($15k if they have children such generosity!) for a single.

I don't even think the people holding the loving microphones at these events earn $80k

# ? May 5, 2016 01:58

Negligent: Aug 20, 2013; Its just lovely here this time of year.

80k is pretty much the average full time income according to the ABS

sorry you don't know anyone that has a job

Try getting one it's really great

# ? May 5, 2016 02:08

Goffer: Apr 4, 2007; "..."

From some site from 2013, so a little outdated:

What is the typical Australian worker�s wages?
Among full-time workers, the average wage is $72 800 per year. But remember � the average (ie. the mean) gives a misleading impression about what the typical worker earns. It is pushed upwards by the large salaries of a small number of very high income earners.

The median gives a more accurate sense of the typical worker�s wages. If you earn the median salary, your wage is in the middle of the distribution � it�s higher than 50% of workers and lower than the other 50%. Among full-time workers, the median was $57 400 in August 2011, which is the most recent figure.

Even this figure, though, is a little higher than the typical worker�s wage. That�s because it doesn�t include the 3.5 million people who work part time. When you bring them into the fold, the average wage drops to $56 300, and the median drops to $46 900.

# ? May 5, 2016 02:15

NPR Journalizard: Feb 14, 2008

Negligent posted:

80k is pretty much the average full time income according to the ABS

sorry you don't know anyone that has a job

Try getting one it's really great

Now explain the difference between average and median, you imbecile.

# ? May 5, 2016 02:17

Vladimir Poutine: Aug 13, 2012

Kat Delacour posted:

Has anyone in the media seriously and specifically called out the repeated assertion of 80k as middle income? Because SloMo kept saying middle income over and over and over and over and over in his mini presser this morning and it makes my loving blood boil because surely if it's middle income I should know a few people who earn that much

If someone called them out they'd probably site the ABS median household income, which was $80,704 in 2013-14.

quote:

While there is some good data on household incomes by organisations such as the National Centre for Social and Economic Modelling, every two years the Australian Bureau of Statistics releases its survey of Household Income and Wealth.

The latest release shows that the median gross household income in 2013-14 was $80,704, and the average of all households was $107,276:

Buuuut...

quote:

As you might imagine, these figures are a bit misleading.

Yes, if you live in a household that brings in more than $80,704 yours is in the richest 50% of all households, but such figures don�t account for differences in household size. The gross income figures effectively treats a household with a family of five the same as that of a single person.

So saying you live in a household that brings in $80,000 doesn�t tell us much. If you are living alone, you�re clearly doing a lot better than another household on the same income that has two adults and three kids.

This is why the ABS uses �equivalised� household incomes. This measure allows us to compare households like for like � by firstly looking at disposable income, which gives a better indication of the income a household has available to meet its needs, and then by allowing for differences of household sizes.

The formula adds 50% to an income for each adult and 30% for each child under 15. So, for example a single person earning $1,000 a week would be on the same equivalised income as a household with a single parent with one child who earned $1,300.

Using this measure the median annual disposable income for a single person is $43,836 and for a family of two adults and two children it is $92,056:

quote:

It�s a bit hard to work out what you�d need to earn before tax to hit that median, assuming your income comes via work and not government benefits, which is rarely the case. But for a single person to take home $43,836 after income tax and the Medicare levy has been paid, they�d need to be on about $53,800.

For a family of two it is even harder to estimate, given we need to know the split of incomes earned. But assuming a 70/30 split of income (ie one partner earns 70% of the household�s income), one partner would need a job paying $85,900, while the other earned $30,000, for a total pre-tax income of $115,900.

Interestingly, the amount at which a household with two kids under 12 stops receiving any Family Tax Benefit A is $109,427 � thus a level below the median household income.

Using the same split, households earning $185,000, far from being �not especially high� would be in the top 25% of all households.

# ? May 5, 2016 02:21

Negligent: Aug 20, 2013; Its just lovely here this time of year.

Median and average are both perfectly fine measures of central tendency to support a statement that 80k is middle income

# ? May 5, 2016 02:21

Zenithe: Feb 25, 2013; _{Ask not to whom the Anidavatar belongs; it belongs to thee.}

Negligent posted:

sorry you don't know anyone that has a job

mean =/= median. Sorry you don't know anyone who finished year 10 Mathematics.

Zenithe fucked around with this message at 02:24 on May 5, 2016

# ? May 5, 2016 02:22

Amethyst: Mar 28, 2004; I CANNOT HELP BUT MAKE THE DCSS THREAD A FETID SWAMP OF UNFUN POSTING
plz notice me trunk-senpai

Frogmanv2 posted:

Now explain the difference between average and median, you imbecile.

According to the google search I just made, $80K is also the median. It's surprisingly hard to find good sources though so I'd be happy if you can prove me wrong.

# ? May 5, 2016 02:23

Cartoon: Jun 20, 2008; poop

Frogmanv2 posted:

Now explain the difference between average and median, you imbecile.

Before you start spraying accusations of 'imbecile' about note who you are actually replying to.

# ? May 5, 2016 02:24

Amethyst: Mar 28, 2004; I CANNOT HELP BUT MAKE THE DCSS THREAD A FETID SWAMP OF UNFUN POSTING
plz notice me trunk-senpai

Zenithe posted:

mean =/= median. Sorry you don't know anyone who finished year 10 Mathematics.

Stop saying this stupid poo poo if you don't have the numbers to back it up.

# ? May 5, 2016 02:25

Amethyst: Mar 28, 2004; I CANNOT HELP BUT MAKE THE DCSS THREAD A FETID SWAMP OF UNFUN POSTING
plz notice me trunk-senpai

This is from 2011. Pretty interesting.

# ? May 5, 2016 02:28

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# ? Jun 5, 2024 18:05

Goffer: Apr 4, 2007; "..."

Amethyst posted:

According to the google search I just made, $80K is also the median. It's surprisingly hard to find good sources though so I'd be happy if you can prove me wrong.

From 2013:
http://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/abs@.nsf/mf/6310.0

Median is 83% of mean if the ratio is the same, meaning $66,660 is the median compared to the $80,000 average at the moment

# ? May 5, 2016 02:32

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