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So you are all going to join PUP now then?
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May 22, 2016 05:39
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Proles up! Party.
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May 22, 2016 05:41
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Don't you see? The Greens are finally becoming legitimate with their own leader being criticised for exploiting some foreign workers.  It's a good thing.
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May 22, 2016 05:49
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Lol "Greens members didn't elect RDN as leader" as if any other Parliamentary leader is voted for by their members. Labor doesn't count because member votes are worth squat next to caucus votes.
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May 22, 2016 05:55
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RDN's excuses are pretty pissweak, but he isn't a poors so he doesn't understand the exploitation  As others have noted, au pairs have often been held to ransom with withheld passports and ridiculous living charges (to say nothing of the veneer-thin pimping of the agency who pockets a big percentage too), but I have no doubt many in the other parties are doing the same and having an nice big ho ho hypocritical sneer while they can. Like the excuses about how their 2nd or 3rd home is being paid off with taxpayer funds from this morning's Insiders where the CormannBot was claiming he had a tiny apartment and he was forced into it; it also seemed no one but Barrie Cassidy was eager to pursue the subject of negative gearing, which I expect of Gerard "Wanker" Henderson with his faux outrage about Mirabella being asked about being called a bitch, but Lenore Taylor and Dennis Aitken were noticeably quiet on the subject because they're no doubt doing it too.
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May 22, 2016 05:57
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open24hours posted:The au pair thing doesn't seem that bad if you think about what an au pair is, which is generally a young woman on some sort of cultural exchange (i.e. a working holiday) and only staying for a short time. If being an au pair was a career then I'd understand the outrage. To me, It is mainly the fairness of deducting lodgings from a wage. The 'value' of lodgings for au pairs is far more abstract and nebulous than local rental and share housing prices for a number of reasons. The accommodation is only provided on the provision that the person is taking a job, and would otherwise not be offered on the market. It is a granny flat or spare bedroom; it isn't a 'real' accommodation since you are a guest, not a tenant. In all likelihood you can't have social events and bring guests over, or have the freedom to behave as you'd would in a relaxed adult environment (nor would you be able to feel fully relaxed). The employer is creating value from something that would otherwise be valueless. Would they charge this amount to a relative who is visiting? It can only be accomplished by people who own and have bigger than necessary homes. A working parent who rents and might see this as a more beneficial arrangement than child care just doesn't have the means to take advantage of it. They are in a financially advantageous position to have spare space in one of the most expensive places to live in the world, so why charge board in the first place? The accommodation is intrinsic to the job itself. The whole point of having an au pair live with the family is to be able to have easy access to their services. It is essentially a way to keep the employee satisfied and at work longer. It is no different from providing a well stocked break room with meals, hammocks/rest area, office shower etc. or perks to improve job satisfaction/retention such as a gym membership or taxi service. No one expects you to be docked below minimum wage in order for employers to provide these benefits, so why is it different for au pairs? The private accommodation is the place of employment. There is no rational way for a person to compartmentalise and separate these conflicting mental models. At least in the case of a job like fruit picking there is a physical separation between the job and your accommodation, you don't pick fruit to operate the stove or to move from room to room. The hours might be more flexible than would be acceptable under an award. You might be working a few hours in the morning and a few in the evening. The hours might change week by week in a way that is incompatible with a second job. Or you might be asked to do extra work at the last minute, and have no real say in the matter. You don't get credited for hours if you are in the house when 'off duty', so you end up 'working' far more than the official hours. If you see a child doing something really dumb but you aren't working, you are still going to intervene; you are always passively working. What is and isn't work is murky, and always benefits the employer. And finally, $300/week is essentially at or above market rate for share accommodation+utilities, but without many of the benefits of share accommodation. You might be getting food as well (again, this is more like a perk), but how much say are you really going to have with that? Do you expect your employer to also pay for cosmetic/hygiene products, and any extra food that wasn't already being prepared for a meal (beyond maybe being able to request some chips, biscuits and fruit)? It is harder to stretch $150 if you are locked in to your arrangements than if you had $450 but had more choice over where and how you lived, and opportunities for additional work. Even if it is legal, it isn't the sort of thing a progressive politician should be taking advantage of. At the very least he should be paying minimum wage for those '25' hours. If these practices were done in a purely business environment by corporations, people would be far less forgiving. This doesn't even get into the exploitation of foreign/captive labour and women's work. Tokamak fucked around with this message at 06:03 on May 22, 2016 |
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May 22, 2016 06:01
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^^^^^^^ A very good post The question for me comes to being legally correct vs ideologically correct. Seems to me as long as it's legal politicians are happy to leave ideology at the door. This is a slipup in RDN's appearance and is a blow, but I don't think he's a secret fascist creeping into the party.
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May 22, 2016 06:48
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So how should Greens how-to-voters deal with this on election day? I'm not going to defend the prick.
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May 22, 2016 07:11
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Well, Comrade, You Should Vote For The Socialist Alternative Who Are Completely Pure Of Ideology
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May 22, 2016 07:14
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Good thing the Greens leader potentially paying people $6/hr (25hrs at $150) is distracting everyone from the government's internship policy of forcing young people to work for $4/hr and while undermining the already lovely youth employment market.
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May 22, 2016 07:16
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purity or death
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May 22, 2016 07:21
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DAAS Kapitalist posted:So how should Greens how-to-voters deal with this on election day? I'm not going to defend the prick. Realistically, you have very slim odds of anyone actually asking you questions about it (or anything else) on the day. People just wanna avoid you and move on. Anyone who still remembers this on July 2 and wants to make a stink about it has already made up their mind not to vote Green, but I guess it might look bad to bystanders to flounder about it. If it were me I'd just say yeah, I wasn't impressed with this RDN story either, I'd be happy if we had say, Scott Ludlam for instance in charge instead but mate, if you're honestly that concerned about improving working rates and conditions I don't know how you can think the other parties are going to do a better job.
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May 22, 2016 07:23
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Murodese posted:Well, Comrade, You Should Vote For The Socialist Alternative Who Are Completely Pure Of Ideology That would be as silly as not voting Green because they're against nuclear power (yes OK,  ). It's to the Greens' credit that I haven't had to think too hard about their politicians being shithead politicians in the past.
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May 22, 2016 07:23
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Frogmanv2 posted:Thats not what you stated. If you would like to change your argument, then go for it, but to say he appointed himself is entirely wrong. And I'm sorry you are such a pedant. yeah it's still Greens policy but he doesn't exactly like to advertise the fact does he? Can we trust him to push the issue if the Greens are holding the balance of power after this election or in future? Maybe he will but maybe he won't. I'd like for the MPs to debate and discuss how they would like us to prioritise and advertise ourselves as a party, advertise because the only real power the leader should have is the power of getting more media coverage due to being the "leader" of the Greens and then for the membership to come together and vote on the new leader and therefore the kind of rhetoric and positioning we want to move forward with. There was no committee, the leader is elected by the parliamentary group which consists solely of MPs, not the National Delegate meeting or reference group or anything else. I am on committees but I'd rather not specify which ones I am on, you know that is not what I am talking about. I am talking about how stupid and hypocritical it is to have a grassroots party where the membership do actually get a say in policy and elect virtually every position within the party BUT the leadership which is for some reason both too important to be trusted to the regular members and yet a worthless title so we shouldn't worry about it. Anyway this is beside the point that RDN is a scumbag for underpaying his staff, the election of the leader is something we can deal with post-election. DAAS Kapitalist - don't defend him, most people I talk to while volunteering like the Greens but don't trust RDN and I just say yeah he's poo poo but members still decide and control policy so his only real influence is that the media go to him first for any Greens related announcements and then I add that we are hoping to have a proper leadership election after the federal election.
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May 22, 2016 08:17
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May 22, 2016 08:25
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Quantum Mechanic posted:Hi! You guys are being killed on the ground. I live in grayndler and the part i live in petersham-stanmore is covered in albanese signs. This is the complete opposite of the last state election where it was green stuff everywhere. Ive seen albanese like twice already out hustling. Its only early days but yeah labor has a mucn stronger presence in the seat so far.
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May 22, 2016 08:37
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You people are tearing into RDN even though he is still the best potential PM by a long shot, all because the right wing media want you to. Yeah, he probably hosed up over his au pair arrangements, but at least he doesn't support the illegal detention and torture of refugees.
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May 22, 2016 08:59
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MaliciousOnion posted:You people are tearing into RDN even though he is still the best potential PM by a long shot, all because the right wing media want you to. Yeah, he probably hosed up over his au pair arrangements, but at least he doesn't support the illegal detention and torture of refugees. RDN isn't a potential PM
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May 22, 2016 09:00
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I'm more of a potential PM than RDN
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May 22, 2016 09:11
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MaliciousOnion posted:You people are tearing into RDN even though he is still the best potential PM by a long shot, all because the right wing media want you to. Yeah, he probably hosed up over his au pair arrangements, but at least he doesn't support the illegal detention and torture of refugees. I'm still voting Greens, what's wrong with criticising him for his fuckup?
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May 22, 2016 09:11
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Anidav posted:I'm more of a potential PM than RDN Vote #1 Anidav
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May 22, 2016 09:23
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Anidav posted:I'm more of a potential PM than RDN
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May 22, 2016 09:40
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Snod. posted:Vote #1 Anidav Do we get to lynch the PM? (Hi ASIO)
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May 22, 2016 09:42
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Snod. posted:Vote #1 Anidav australia would got exploited by all the bigger nations
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May 22, 2016 09:52
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Vladimir Poutine posted:australia would got exploited by all the bigger nations Which is different how, exactly?
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May 22, 2016 09:53
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Vladimir Poutine posted:australia would got exploited by all the bigger nations
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May 22, 2016 10:06
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CrazyTolradi posted:You say that like any of our trade deals hugely benefit us. All I know is after Turkey, Vietnam and Iraq, NEXT TIME we support an empire in its nation-building we'll get a sweet deal out of it. E: And Korea.
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May 22, 2016 10:21
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I would Annex New Zealand so that we get Carls Jr. That is my election platform. Pro Burg.
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May 22, 2016 10:25
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Anidav posted:I would Annex New Zealand so that we get Carls Jr. That is my election platform. Pro Burg. Well, I'm convinced.
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May 22, 2016 10:28
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Solemn Sloth posted:RDN isn't a potential PM Oops. Party leader is what I meant. edit: can't any politician become PM? They just have to resign to the lower house? MaliciousOnion fucked around with this message at 10:33 on May 22, 2016 |
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May 22, 2016 10:30
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Anidav posted:I would Annex New Zealand so that we get Carls Jr. That is my election platform. Pro Burg. All hail our Anidav overlord. Once and future Prime Minister.
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May 22, 2016 10:31
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MaliciousOnion posted:Oops. Party leader is what I meant. Yeah if they have a majority of the seats in the lower house. The only potential for Di Natale to become PM would be if the Greens entered a coalition with Labor, he was named deputy PM and Shorten went off overseas.
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May 22, 2016 10:36
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Every man, woman and child deserves to eat at Carls Jr. Not because they want to but because they have to. I would also legalize keeping Pademelons as pets.
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May 22, 2016 10:38
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Anidav do you want to live in the lodge or Kirribilli house more?
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May 22, 2016 10:40
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I would build my own house because a leader is built on his or her own success rather than the success of others.
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May 22, 2016 10:43
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Starshark posted:All I know is after Turkey, Vietnam and Iraq, NEXT TIME we support an empire in its nation-building we'll get a sweet deal out of it.
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May 22, 2016 10:44
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Anidav posted:Every man, woman and child deserves to eat at Carls Jr. Not because they want to but because they have to. I don't trust an American to make a quality burger.
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May 22, 2016 10:58
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Tokamak posted:I don't trust an American to make a quality burger. Probably doesn't even have Beetroot, fried egg and pineapple on it
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May 22, 2016 11:00
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I would also make this our national anthem. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_9SsX7HJhE
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May 22, 2016 11:00
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| # ? Jun 5, 2024 09:50 |
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Anidav posted:I would also make this our national anthem. FTFY
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May 22, 2016 11:05
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