|
It occurs to me we'll probably never find out the story behind pre-SW 616 Miles Morales now.
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 19:43
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 18, 2024 03:45 |
|
|
Sam would work better yes, but I run into the same problem as with Bucky. They are brothers in arms and have fought together. It is a soldier bond.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 19:45
|
|
|
Endless Mike posted:It occurs to me we'll probably never find out the story behind pre-SW 616 Miles Morales now. Yeah probably not. We were supposed to get that story like a year ago right?
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 19:48
|
|
|
Why are comics fans so obsessed with changing the sexuality of fictional characters, especially when there is no basis for it? Can't they be happy with superheros punching nazi-dionsaurs on the moon?
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 19:51
|
|
|
Trast posted:Why are comics fans so obsessed with changing the sexuality of fictional characters, especially when there is no basis for it? Can't they be happy with superheros punching nazi-dionsaurs on the moon? Because the vast, vast, vast majority of iconic comic characters were created in a time frame when having a protagonist who was anything but a heterosexual white male was a complete no-go and pushing for greater representation is important, mixed with some people who just like the idea of two people loving. Edit: A better thing would be having comic characters evolve and move on so we get more things like Lady Thor but comics are an eternal status quo so welp. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 19:55 on Jun 29, 2016 |
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 19:53
|
|
|
Rhyno posted:Yeah probably not. We were supposed to get that story like a year ago right?
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 19:54
|
|
|
ImpAtom posted:Because the vast, vast, vast majority of iconic comic characters were created in a time frame when having a protagonist who was anything but a heterosexual white male was a complete no-go and pushing for greater representation is important, mixed with some people who just like the idea of two people loving. Greater representation is fine. But changing a character so completely without any ground to build on is just fan wankery.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 19:58
|
|
|
Trast posted:Greater representation is fine. But changing a character so completely without any ground to build on is just fan wankery. ... Really? You're going to say that for comics? I mean even ignoring all the real-world reasons why someone would be in the closet, this is a comic universe where the same characters express directly opposing viewpoints depending on era and writers, and where almost every character has such a long storied history that it's pretty trivial to find grounds to justify anything you want and probably have canon things to back it up. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 20:03 on Jun 29, 2016 |
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:00
|
|
|
ImpAtom posted:... Really? You're going to say that for comics? Yeah I am. X-O worded it a lot better than I could. X-O posted:Well sure if you want to make Cap gay even though in 75 years of stories there's never been any inclination he was gay, and in fact plenty of proof that he wasn't, sure go ahead. It doesn't make any sense. It's not like an Iceman situation where there were theories from fans for years that he might be. But the problem is, as pointed out when this this was trending on twitter or whatever, the whole campaign is completely disingenuous. It wasn't people wanting Cap to just be gay. It was people specifically wanting Cap and Bucky to be a couple. And not even based on the comics, just because of the movie. The same people would likely be just as mad if Cap was gay and not with Bucky. Because that's what they want in the movie.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:08
|
|
|
Trast posted:Yeah I am. X-O worded it a lot better than I could. Yeah, you know what? I'm going to call X-O fundamentally dishonest there. Bucky and Cap was a thing before the movie even was and at least partially because of the retcon that Bucky Barnes was not, in fact, Captain America's plucky teenage sidekick but a 20-something elite black-ops operative who Captain America wasn't aware of and who served alongside him as an equal. It's not something I particularly am chomping at the bit to see but the lovely-rear end "they just want INCEST and PEDOPHILIA" stuff is dishonest as hell by pretending like there was a giant massive retcon involving Bucky. I'm not super-thrilled by it because I dislike the idea of any close relationship inherently being viewed as sexual but it's pretty crappy to pretend like people are talking about the original Bucky and not the cold mysterious tragic badboy with an angsty past Bucky. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 20:15 on Jun 29, 2016 |
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:13
|
|
|
Wait, Cap and Bucky has a son/father thing since when? All I have read is his Bru run and I didn't get that at all. Also comics are just published fan wankry so whatevs.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:18
|
|
|
Bucky's age was never adjusted up when he was made a black ops murder- bot.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:20
|
|
|
Those two Buckys are the same person though. It's like wanting Batman and Nightwing to gently caress - sure it's not pedophilia NOW, Dick is old enough, but the relationship they have was inherently paternal for most of it and even now where they're closer to equals that dynamic is still there.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:20
|
|
|
.....ok?
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:20
|
|
|
JoshTheStampede posted:Those two Buckys are the same person though. It's like wanting Batman and Nightwing to gently caress - sure it's not pedophilia NOW, Dick is old enough, but the relationship they have was inherently paternal for most of it and even now where they're closer to equals that dynamic is still there. Not to mention that Bruce adopts Dick so he'd legally be loving his son. Just eww. 
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:25
|
|
|
JoshTheStampede posted:Those two Buckys are the same person though. It's like wanting Batman and Nightwing to gently caress - sure it's not pedophilia NOW, Dick is old enough, but the relationship they have was inherently paternal for most of it and even now where they're closer to equals that dynamic is still there. They're the 'same person' except that their history and personality and characters have been retconned and rewritten so much that trying to claim that the original Bucky is the same as the new Bucky is as dishonest as hell. If you play that game you can just as readily point out the fact that Reed Richards met Sue Storm when she was 12 years old and he was a college freshman. (Something that has seen been explicitly retconned IIRC.) It's fine to not like it but trying to go "Well, it's just them wanting (insert thing here) because they don't understand the REAL characters" is pretty goddamn reductive when we're talking about 'real characters' who got massive world-altering retcons that completely changed their history and personality on more than one occasion. Bucky isn't a 'father/son' relationship with Cap at the moment because they retconned their relationship to being Bucky as the bitter cynical guy who was grudgingly won over by Captain America and is about friendship more than anything else. I said why I don't like it. (I dislike the push fandom has to take characters who are friends and instantly push it to boning because close relationships can't exist that aren't sexual) but it's pretty dishonest to instantly jump to calling people pedophile-incest-wanters ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 20:33 on Jun 29, 2016 |
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:27
|
|
|
Bruce and Dick actually have a father son thing is the main difference. Not this weird older men/younger men have a father son thing by default.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:28
|
|
|
I forgot about the reed thing, which no one gave a gently caress about other than calling it kind of dumb.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:30
|
|
|
ImpAtom posted:They're the 'same person' except that their history and personality and characters have been retconned and rewritten so much that trying to claim that the original Bucky is the same as the new Bucky is as dishonest as hell. I just read Civil War and Sue brings up meeting Reed at 12 so if it has been retconned it has been done recently. If I recall as the scene is written it's Sue having a school girl crush (character's words) and Reed being completely oblivious because he is an autistic brainiac college freshman and not creeping on a 12 year old.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:32
|
|
|
But according to the argument being used it doesn't matter as the default relationship is paternal.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:34
|
|
|
Saying Captain America can't be gay because he hasn't been in the past is like objecting to Johnny Storm being played by a black guy.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:34
|
|
|
It's at the very least a teacher-student relationship which is still pretty creepy. Sidekicks and Heroes should not date regardless of age, gender, sexual orientation, or species because it's loving weird. Yes I know it has happened it was weird then.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:36
|
|
|
Or Bucky being what Bucky is now. Because modern Bucky is basically a whole new character.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:36
|
|
|
I'm going to start answering the phone "gently caress off we're sold out of Uncanny Inhumans #11." 26 calls about this loving book today. Hope you have your copies reserved.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:38
|
|
|
What is so special about that issue?
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:39
|
|
|
Rhyno posted:I'm going to start answering the phone "gently caress off we're sold out of Uncanny Inhumans #11." Huh. What's the deal with it? I mean I know it's Mosaic's first appearance but is that really a SOLD OUT thing?
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:40
|
|
|
Rhyno posted:I'm going to start answering the phone "gently caress off we're sold out of Uncanny Inhumans #11." I just googled to see the preview and it autofills as you type Uncanny Inhumans. That is some serious hype.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:41
|
|
|
WickedHate posted:Saying Captain America can't be gay because he hasn't been in the past is like objecting to Johnny Storm being played by a black guy. Not really. It's again, a difference between the movies and comics. In the movie universe (this time around anyway), Johnny Storm is black. That's fine. If Johnny was suddenly and inexplicably black in next months issue of Uncanny Avengers with no explanation that would be dumb. Just like Cap suddenly being gay when he hasn't been forever would be dumb. They could explain it in several ways, and that would be fine. Or they could say movie Cap is gay/bi because there's nothing really to contradict that. It would just stretch belief a little to have Steve Rogers say "well I've been bi this whole time but it never came up". Just like it would have been implausible for him to be Hydra the whole time without some history/memory alteration, which is why they revealed that right away instead of letting it hang for a year or whatever. And the entire point of the Winter Soldier reveal was that it was Bucky. If it was some dude Cap wouldn't care, it was that this enemy brainwashed assassin was his kid sidekick that gave that plot point any relevance at all. It's also not similar to the Reed/Sue thing because that wasn't years of comics where she was his sidekick/ward/whatever. She was a kid who had a crush on him and later on when she grew up they got together. \/\/ Which is why movie Cap/Bucky is nowhere near as bad an idea. Still not great for the reasons ImpAtom stated (sometimes people can be close and love each other without boning, guys) but not creepy. JoshTheStampede fucked around with this message at 20:46 on Jun 29, 2016 |
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:41
|
|
|
I find that hilarious as the movie had the same concept but he was not a kid sidekick and it didn't change poo poo
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:43
|
|
|
CharlestheHammer posted:What is so special about that issue? ImpAtom posted:Huh. What's the deal with it? Trast posted:I just googled to see the preview and it autofills as you type Uncanny Inhumans. That is some serious hype. Incredibly low ordered book despite the CW2 tie in banner. Death of Lockjaw. Standard cover is hitting $20 on ebay already.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:48
|
|
|
Rhyno posted:Incredibly low ordered book despite the CW2 tie in banner. Death of Lockjaw. Standard cover is hitting $20 on ebay already. ... but Lockjaw doesn't die?
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:48
|
|
|
ImpAtom posted:They're the 'same person' except that their history and personality and characters have been retconned and rewritten so much that trying to claim that the original Bucky is the same as the new Bucky is as dishonest as hell. Your raging at the wrong person about the pedophile and incest post. In a world that has Harry Potter and Supernatural shipping. I stand by my joke post. Mr Hootington fucked around with this message at 20:53 on Jun 29, 2016 |
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:51
|
|
|
Rhyno posted:Incredibly low ordered book despite the CW2 tie in banner. Death of Lockjaw. Standard cover is hitting $20 on ebay already. People love animals. And Lockjaw loves hugs.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:51
|
|
|
ImpAtom posted:... but Lockjaw doesn't die? It's what it's being hyped as. I didn't even get a chance to read it.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:54
|
|
|
Rhyno posted:It's what it's being hyped as. I didn't even get a chance to read it. That's really bizarre. I can't even think of what might be causing that.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 20:57
|
|
|
ImpAtom posted:That's really bizarre. I can't even think of what might be causing that. Noble sacrifice would probably be up there on the possibilities.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 21:00
|
|
|
CharlestheHammer posted:I find that hilarious as the movie had the same concept but he was not a kid sidekick and it didn't change poo poo It's be fine if they lifted the MCU Cap and Bucky past wholesale and plopped it into the 616 or whatever it is now, they could go to the bone zone in full splash pages with no objections from me. As the relationship stands though it's a "grooming" narrative that I as a dude into dudes would rather avoid.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 21:00
|
|
|
ImpAtom posted:That's really bizarre. I can't even think of what might be causing that.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 21:02
|
|
|
Lol the Inhumans need to be drones like the terrorists they are.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 21:04
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 18, 2024 03:45 |
|
|
Apparently, Lockjaw regurgitates a bunch of grenades, and two panels later, they go off in front of him. However, between these two panels, is what looks like Lockjaw teleporting to safety. So unless next month he returns without a head, he's fine.
|
|
#
?
Jun 29, 2016 21:10
|
|
