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Holy poo poo the Pakled epsiode is bad. It keeps bouncing back and forth between the completely different plots with zero sense of pace, and clumsily connects them at the end.
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Jul 12, 2016 07:26
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On a first watch straight after Q Who its pretty bad, but it does have some redeeming qualities. It's hard not to smirk when the ultra smug early TNG crew get outwitted by the morons from outer space, and I can't help but smile as they slap Geordi around with their space lazers.
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Jul 12, 2016 07:43
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I love how in that episode Troi does her loving job and tells everyone that this poo poo is not on the level and Geordie is in danger and everyone proceeds to just dismiss her warnings outright.
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Jul 12, 2016 07:59
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Big Mean Jerk posted:Generations is a great movie that goons regularly slam for little reason. The cinematography alone is an epiphany after 7 years of overlit sets and boring TV camera angles. I always lose my poo poo about how good Picard's quarters looked with the Amargosa sunlight flooding through the windows. Absolutely terrific. Guinan's room as well. Plus, 
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Jul 12, 2016 08:34
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Hyperriker posted:I always lose my poo poo about how good Picard's quarters looked with the Amargosa sunlight flooding through the windows. Absolutely terrific. Guinan's room as well. Ten forward, too. Although it was almost unrecognisable. And for all that Stellar Cartography was a waste of money, I do love it as basically the one time we see them get to properly realise TNG ideas for cool computer poo poo. It is such a pity that TNG wasn't made in the modern CG era when they could've done things like that all the time easily. Voyager never tried. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 09:11 on Jul 12, 2016 |
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Jul 12, 2016 09:08
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So a few Kelvin Timeline ships have come to Star Trek online with the new expansion, since you can customise the ships to an extent let's swap their skins! The Vengeance looks so much better in white!  While the Kelvin Connie is uhh... 
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Jul 12, 2016 10:03
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Best part is the JJTimeline tribble.
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Jul 12, 2016 10:06
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Veotax posted:While the Kelvin Connie is uhh... Blackface is NOT okay
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Jul 12, 2016 11:31
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Tons of new 50th Anniversary poster art; I like some of the Beyond stuff:  
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Jul 12, 2016 12:27
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Big Mean Jerk posted:Generations is a great movie that goons regularly slam for little reason. The cinematography alone is an epiphany after 7 years of overlit sets and boring TV camera angles. Data's emotional rollercoaster, McDowell devouring the props and sets in every scene, etc etc. I even love that they finally put the crew on an honest to god schooner in full naval regalia. Stewart and Whoopi nail those Nexus scenes. It's fantastic. The only downside to the whole thing is that the Duras' take down the D instead of a Romulan Warbird, something that was teased for 7 seasons. I can't even fault Kirk's death, the character dies helping to save an entire world. What more could you want? It's definitely the 2nd best TNG movie after First Contact. What really stinks about it is that there's actually glimmers of greatness in there, but the whole thing just winds up so underwhelming. You're probably right, if it had Romulans instead of the Duras sisters, it would almost definitely be more well-liked. Plus, the climax of the film is kind of a wet fart. Picard and Kirk are fighting to save a pre-warp civilization on a planet we haven't ever seen. Why do we as an audience care? Hasn't Picard also let pre-warp civilizations die because of the Prime Directive? Malcom McDowell is good, Data is good and it's nice to see Kirk and Picard share a screen. But Generations just feels very... low-rent. It isn't a satisfying end to either Kirk or the Enterprise-D. Why cookie Rocket posted:That's the thing that makes Into Darkness truly terrible-- at it's core it's an incredible return to form as far as Trek's best and highest purpose: skewering American sociopolitical issues via cowboy scifi. But then they said "nah gently caress that" and buried the best thing about it under layers of focus group approved fan pandering nonsense. Nemesis is god awful but at least it doesn't make me sad to think about how it could've been awesome. Yeah, I can really kind of respect them trying. I thought the movie was trying to say something about the ethics of drone attacks. They really, really botched the execution, though.
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Jul 12, 2016 13:25
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Another thing about ID that confuses me is these are supposed to be long range torpedoes, but they have their fuel compartment filled with fleshy meat bags. So, if they don't have the fuel to be long range torpedoes, how are they supposed to perform that first strike on the Klingons? It's not like Admiral Robocop didn't know, he explicitly put them there. His plan was to get rid of the augments and start a war with the Klingons all with one action, but in doing so he neutered the weapon to be ineffective at its main task.
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Jul 12, 2016 13:32
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Hyperriker posted:I always lose my poo poo about how good Picard's quarters looked with the Amargosa sunlight flooding through the windows. Absolutely terrific. Guinan's room as well. They had money for these 19th century uniforms but needed to borrow DS9's Star Trek uniforms.
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Jul 12, 2016 13:47
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Hyperriker posted:I always lose my poo poo about how good Picard's quarters looked with the Amargosa sunlight flooding through the windows. Absolutely terrific. Guinan's room as well. These are definitely my favorite Trek uniforms bar none. So on the TNG vs TOS front, what if the Ent-D had, in the course of attempting to stop a Borg temporal experiment, been thrown back in time to 2293 (i.e. right after the end of ST6 when Kirk and co. are on their slightly illegal farewell cruise) and the ship gets infiltrated by the Borg like in STFC (but in this version the Borg ship blows up because something goes awry with the experiment, not because the Enterprise is suddenly powerful enough to blow it up with four torpedoes) and then the rest of the plot involves the TNG crew and the TOS crew getting shuffled around as they struggle to defeat the Borg and prevent them from using an unholy combination of 24th century and Borg technology to rewrite the history of the last 80 years--thus saving the legacy of Kirk's crew. So you'd get a McCoy/Data pairing (and the emotion chip could be part of that, but done better i.e. Bones shows Data how to work with his emotions rather than against them) and maybe a Worf/Spock pairing, which I always wanted to see myself because they actually have a great deal in common. And of course Kirk and Picard, with more attention paid to their different styles of leadership and decision making and how each can work when applied correctly. You could see an Ent-A vs Ent-D battle, but one of the ships would be under Borg control so the crews wouldn't actually be fighting each other. Some could be on the occupied ship trying to bring it down from inside, others would be on the other ship (or the Excelsior!) pooling their tactical and engineering nous to defeat the Borg. Just some thoughts.
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Jul 12, 2016 13:47
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My fantasy Trek movie that would never happen would basically be First Contact... but as a TNG\DS9 crossover. Sisko resents Picard for Wolf 359 and the death of Jennifer. You have a movie where Picard and Sisko are rivals and dislike each other, but have to work together to stop the Borg. In the end, they learn to respect one another and shake hands. A crossover of TNG & DS9 where they fight the Borg would be less continuity heavy and easier for audiences less familiar with DS9 to follow than a Dominion movie because the only episodes audiences would have to know about are "Best of Both Worlds" and "Emissary." That said, I really wish Picard and the Enterprise-E had shown up in the Dominion War sometime in the last season of DS9. bull3964 posted:Another thing about ID that confuses me is these are supposed to be long range torpedoes, but they have their fuel compartment filled with fleshy meat bags. So, if they don't have the fuel to be long range torpedoes, how are they supposed to perform that first strike on the Klingons? I thought Khan was trying to smuggle them in the torpedoes? That said, it's a really, really bizarre plot twist and I'm pretty sure it's like that in the script because they tried to tie different scenes that they wanted together rather than have a plot that flows organically. Also they're like "don't kill Khan, Spock! We need his superman healing blood to make Kirk not dead anymore!" when they have 72 other guys in cold storage. And why does Spock even care about Kirk so much? The Wrath of Khan scene is powerful because Kirk and Spock have been friends for years and have become very close. In STID it makes no sense because in ST09 and STID Kirk and Spock pretty much hate each other and are at each other's throats all the time. It's like how Obi-Wan and Anakin are "supposed" to be good friends when all we see is them bickering constantly. GET IN THE ROBOT fucked around with this message at 13:58 on Jul 12, 2016 |
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Jul 12, 2016 13:55
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Aside from all that, my dumb pedantic complaint about it is that when Kirk yelled KHAAAAN they at least had an open communication channel; Kirk was actually yelling at Khan. But Spock is just howling the name heedlessly to the heavens, with nobody around to hear him. It's, well, illogical
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Jul 12, 2016 14:02
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Gammatron 64 posted:It's definitely the 2nd best TNG movie after First Contact. The problem is the way the script just springs the fact that the planet's inhabited on us practically right before it's about to blow up, like as they were writing it someone literally went "hey I don't think the stakes are high enough, let's put an indigenous population on the planet!", inserted that single line right there and called it a day. The film doesn't put in any work to make us sympathetic towards people we don't know and have never seen, so big surprise, we don't really care about them or feel their loss when the planet goes kaboom. It wouldn't even take that much, like mention in the stellar cartography scene that the Enterprise recently conducted an ethnographic survey in the Veridian system and give Picard some dialog about how rich and fascinating their culture is, something to establish the setting a little.
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Jul 12, 2016 14:04
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McSpanky posted:The problem is the way the script just springs the fact that the planet's inhabited on us practically right before it's about to blow up, like as they were writing it someone literally went "hey I don't think the stakes are high enough, let's put an indigenous population on the planet!", inserted that single line right there and called it a day. The film doesn't put in any work to make us sympathetic towards people we don't know and have never seen, so big surprise, we don't really care about them or feel their loss when the planet goes kaboom. It wouldn't even take that much, like mention in the stellar cartography scene that the Enterprise recently conducted an ethnographic survey in the Veridian system and give Picard some dialog about how rich and fascinating their culture is, something to establish the setting a little. That, or you could just say he's going to blow up a planet that we already know about and\or care about. Maybe not Earth, but something like Vulcan, Betazed, even Qo'noS. Something. Or something like "if this planet blows up, it will destabilize the region and maybe start a galactic war or some other very bad thing." The movie has pretty much no stakes whatsoever. As a member of the audience, I have to say "what are they even fighting for?" That, plus the Enterprise-D getting blown up by an ancient Bird of Prey from Kirk's era is pretty drat underwhelming for a feature film. And Kirk getting killed by a bridge.
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Jul 12, 2016 14:24
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Gammatron 64 posted:I thought Khan was trying to smuggle them in the torpedoes? That said, it's a really, really bizarre plot twist and I'm pretty sure it's like that in the script because they tried to tie different scenes that they wanted together rather than have a plot that flows organically. He did, but Buckaroo Banzai knew they were in there too which is one of the reasons why he loaded them onto the Enterprise and forbade anyone from looking at them. But that also means he knew the things were compromised and shouldn't have the long range.
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Jul 12, 2016 14:32
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Gammatron 64 posted:That, or you could just say he's going to blow up a planet that we already know about and\or care about. Maybe not Earth, but something like Vulcan, Betazed, even Qo'noS. Something. Or something like "if this planet blows up, it will destabilize the region and maybe start a galactic war or some other very bad thing." The movie has pretty much no stakes whatsoever. As a member of the audience, I have to say "what are they even fighting for?" Yeah, that was episode-level tension. I wouldn't have been surprised if they showed the Nexus in the sky of that same old village set full of people with wrinkly foreheads dressed in upholstery fabrics, all faux-panicking and running around the soundstage.
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Jul 12, 2016 14:44
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Brawnfire posted:Yeah, that was episode-level tension. I wouldn't have been surprised if they showed the Nexus in the sky of that same old village set full of people with wrinkly foreheads dressed in upholstery fabrics, all faux-panicking and running around the soundstage. If that cutaway starts with the all-white Upholstrons chatting around the obligatory town square fountain, you've improved the movie in a huge way.
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Jul 12, 2016 15:09
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And then sg-1 strolls in, surveying the ruined village. What do you reckon happened here?
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Jul 12, 2016 15:16
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Cojawfee posted:They had money for these 19th century uniforms but needed to borrow DS9's Star Trek uniforms. They actually made a set of new spaceuniforms for the movie, then shortly into shooting decided they didn't like them and scrapped them.
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Jul 12, 2016 15:27
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I am about halfway through watching the Motion Picture Blu Ray. (This is really a movie that benefits immensely from Blu Ray). I had to stop halfway through because I needed to go to bed, but my assessment is that this is a movie for people who loving love Star Trek. If you don't think utterly gratuitous beauty shots of the Enterprise model would be awesome, this movie is not for you. I also love that Captain Kirk is a complete rear end in a top hat in this movie (an rear end in a top hat beloved by his crew, but an rear end in a top hat none the less). There's a lot to pick over in this movie in terms of aesthetic choices they made and what they chose to emphasize in terms of plot, which I guess makes it a good movie in its own right. But if you're not completely mesmerized by glamour shots, again, you'll be killed by the glacial pacing. It takes almost an hour for the actual plot to get under way. Bones showing up in Full Hippie Gear to the Enterprise was also amazing, I wish he had kept that outfit for the runtime.
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Jul 12, 2016 16:10
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I like some aspects of TMP, but it's way too far up its own rear end with the long takes and ridiculously slow pacing.
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Jul 12, 2016 16:17
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FlamingLiberal posted:I like some aspects of TMP, but it's way too far up its own rear end with the long takes and ridiculously slow pacing. I was pretty in the zone when Kirk and Scotty are taking a tour of the outside of the ship, which went like three times as long as "necessary" by modern filmmaking standards. Even gratuitous shots of the engineering section were OK. Like I said though, I'm only halfway through, I haven't gotten to the part where V'Ger replaces the rough draft Betazoid. I know I have a lot more to go through. But it feels sort of like the first Conan movie, where it's almost a music video as much as a movie with a plot.
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Jul 12, 2016 16:27
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FlamingLiberal posted:I like some aspects of TMP, but it's way too far up its own rear end with the long takes and ridiculously slow pacing. Do you feel the same way about Alien? I mean, we don't get even one line of dialog until about the 10 minute mark. It's not until almost the 40 minute mark that we get the facehugger. The movies are paced very similar. Really though, you have to put yourself in the moment with TMP. No internet, likely only a few sneak shots of the ship in magazines and marketing. You go from the TV show special effects to motherfucking ILM in the prime of miniatures. I'll grant them their indulgence, I'm sure the fans appreciated it at the time. One of my issues with first contact us that we were never properly introduced to the ship. bull3964 fucked around with this message at 16:33 on Jul 12, 2016 |
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Jul 12, 2016 16:28
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MikeJF posted:And for all that Stellar Cartography was a waste of money, I do love it as basically the one time we see them get to properly realise TNG ideas for cool computer poo poo. It is such a pity that TNG wasn't made in the modern CG era when they could've done things like that all the time easily. Voyager never tried. Say what you want about Voyager, but you can't say they didn't try at least a little. They did stellar cartography and had a stupid yet doable excuse behind it. Ensign Kim and 7 of 9 along with some Borg technology and bam badass sensors 100x better than what they had or some jazz. It was clearly a way to show stuff on a huge display for dramatic effect but it worked and was pretty cool. CG wise everything they did with species 8472/Undine was pretty decent for its time. Compared to the Mummy's CGI it was practically 100% real.
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Jul 12, 2016 16:37
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bull3964 posted:Do you feel the same way about Alien? I mean, we don't get even one line of dialog until about the 10 minute mark. It's not until almost the 40 minute mark that we get the facehugger. When I was younger, The Motion Picture put me to sleep. I'm still a much bigger fan of Star Trek II, which manages to create the ship atmosphere and have a gripping plot. I kinda wish TMP had a Guy Fleegman character when they're watching V'Ger vaporize things. "Oh that's where we're going? And the ship is half-ready? Oh good. That's good."
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Jul 12, 2016 16:40
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Data Graham posted:Aside from all that, my dumb pedantic complaint about it is that when Kirk yelled KHAAAAN they at least had an open communication channel; Kirk was actually yelling at Khan. But Spock is just howling the name heedlessly to the heavens, with nobody around to hear him. It's, well, illogical Not only is he yelling at Khan, he is also really hamming it up intentionally, trying to make him think he's in a way worse position than he is. Shatner the actor playing Kirk the actor.
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Jul 12, 2016 16:59
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bull3964 posted:Do you feel the same way about Alien? I mean, we don't get even one line of dialog until about the 10 minute mark. It's not until almost the 40 minute mark that we get the facehugger. Alien is a horror movie with slow pacing on purpose to build tension. Completely different comparison.
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Jul 12, 2016 17:06
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I really like V'Ger and the Whale Probe because they're very mysterious and huge alien vessels. You look at them and immediately get that they're something beyond our understanding. You don't really get very many aliens that are truly, well... alien in Star Trek.
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Jul 12, 2016 17:08
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Big Mean Jerk posted:I can't imagine Yesterday's Enterprise as a movie. There simply isn't enough meat on those bones. And then you run into the very issue that tanked the TOS vs TNG concept; the writers couldn't make both crews heroic without one of them ending up as the clear "villain". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FHaTC0aUu-Q
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Jul 12, 2016 17:27
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Gammatron 64 posted:I really like V'Ger and the Whale Probe because they're very mysterious and huge alien vessels. You look at them and immediately get that they're something beyond our understanding. You don't really get very many aliens that are truly, well... alien in Star Trek. That's why I really liked the weird gesture aliens in Voyager that showed up for a few seconds. They were weird but definitely pretty alien compared to most. Here we go: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9pFA2XfVEc Now if we're talking alien aliens, I absolutely love the Tholians and the Gorn. VVV Ditto, I love ancient super advanced tech Tyson Tomko fucked around with this message at 17:49 on Jul 12, 2016 |
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Jul 12, 2016 17:32
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Gammatron 64 posted:I really like V'Ger and the Whale Probe because they're very mysterious and huge alien vessels. You look at them and immediately get that they're something beyond our understanding. You don't really get very many aliens that are truly, well... alien in Star Trek. The Doomsday Machine is another of my favorite examples. If there's one subgenre of sci-fi that I love best it's arbitrarily advanced ancient alien artifacts, which in part explains why I like TOS the best.
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Jul 12, 2016 17:47
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Baka-nin posted:On a first watch straight after Q Who its pretty bad, but it does have some redeeming qualities. It's hard not to smirk when the ultra smug early TNG crew get outwitted by the morons from outer space, and I can't help but smile as they slap Geordi around with their space lazers. I think it's also the start of the trend of Worf voicing a perfectly valid security concern and everyone else laughing at him for being paranoid.
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Jul 12, 2016 17:49
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Something like First Contact's "slowly converting the Enterprise into a borg ship" would have been so much more effective with the Ent D instead of the brand new Enterprise E. Because the Enterprise D is a ship that the viewers have come to know over 7 years of TV, and watching it slowly get turned into a Borg ship before Picard has to sacrifice it via self-destruct would be so much more powerful emotionally.
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Jul 12, 2016 18:11
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One letter really makes all the difference.
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Jul 12, 2016 18:22
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cargohills posted:One letter really makes all the difference. STID = STD ???
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Jul 12, 2016 18:23
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Asmodai_00 posted:STID = STD ??? STID = STI, that's the preferred term among the medical profession these days e: oh poo poo trap sprung
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Jul 12, 2016 18:34
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Instant Sunrise posted:Something like First Contact's "slowly converting the Enterprise into a borg ship" would have been so much more effective with the Ent D instead of the brand new Enterprise E. Yes, this; I was thinking this in my cursory write-up earlier but forgot to point it out. And of course that's how you can get the two ships fighting each other without one crew having to be the villain.
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Jul 12, 2016 18:35
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