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Shadowbag posted:I'm usually in the payday goons chat, look for some loser with a lovely anime name and avatar. that doesn't narrow things down 
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Aug 27, 2016 04:19
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John Murdoch posted:Is it really all that controversial to say tasers can be worse for higher RoF guns? Sure in the absolute worst case scenario where you're just hosed no matter what you're going to lose more Raven ammo, but my point was just that for the occasional times when you do have a fighting chance (but the taser isn't conveniently standing right in front of you), I'd rather have the Raven's slow fire/high impact shots more than the 1014's fast fire/not-quite-as-high impact ones. Might also have something to do with my Raven being more accurate. That is precisely why I love me my Reinfeld shotgun. You will be down before you run out of ammo and it is almost 100% accurate whilst being tased, you can feed them a big ole supper of buckshot. To the point where if I am out of ammo entirely and see a taser near by I hope for the tase since its a free refill and takes all of one click to down the poor blue fucker. https://gfycat.com/IckyInsistentHaddock And the other reason to use a shotgun build, the animations just do their own thing sometimes, and that is just great. Though at the end of the day just run with whatever you are going to have the most fun with. Also Jacket no!  https://gfycat.com/MedicalRewardingFrog Feonir fucked around with this message at 04:27 on Aug 27, 2016 |
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Aug 27, 2016 04:19
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I did my TR run once and am never doing it again. Soloed it after never getting any interest in sticking with it as a group. Ended up putting the final push with the server in day 2 to music and now whenever I feel like it I can relive the glory.
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Aug 27, 2016 04:22
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The Cheshire Cat posted:I'm pretty sure they all go off the base value for the stat so just additive. For reference, here's your breakpoints for that reference. Head/Body; DW Head/DW Body. Tasers: 159.7 head/359.3 body; 362 head/610.9 body Cloaker: 111.8 head/598.9 body; 253.4 head/1018.1 body Tans: 79.9 head/199.7 body; 181 head/339.4 body A Breaker with 000 and all the mentioned perks hits around 992. M1014 gets to 406; Reinfeld/Raven get to just over 600 (but under 610). You could squeeze an extra 15% out of High Value Target too, which should get the Breaker over 1000 and the R/R over 610. So... yes, sufficient to one-shot drat near anything you feel like.
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Aug 27, 2016 05:34
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The Cheshire Cat posted:Is the M1014 good now? Last time I used it I felt like it was just incredibly underpowered. Go for headshots. Mine does base 85 damage with buckshot and I also have the Overkill skill from the shotgun tree, so cops die pretty quick. The biggest problem is really that it's a rapid-fire weapon with only 10 chambered shells at any one time, so you're constantly reloading.
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Aug 27, 2016 06:43
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Wastrel_ posted:Go for headshots. Mine does base 85 damage with buckshot and I also have the Overkill skill from the shotgun tree, so cops die pretty quick. The biggest problem is really that it's a rapid-fire weapon with only 10 chambered shells at any one time, so you're constantly reloading. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4Uw38mTSe0&t=214s
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Aug 27, 2016 07:37
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The Raven is badass especially if you shove the long barrel, a sight, and the military laser module on it. I wish more guns had the laser on top.
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Aug 27, 2016 11:09
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i use the raven for a dodge shotgun build. im pretty certain it did something like 145 damage or something utterly stupid while also granting 30 concealment.
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Aug 27, 2016 11:13
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Psion posted:that doesn't narrow things down It's not me because my avatar owns. 
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Aug 27, 2016 13:12
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Rumor is the console update will be everything up to update 93. gently caress speculating all the heists and bug fixes etc- but, what was the weapon balance like at that point? I guess specifically if I like the gecko vanilla version does it get better, worse, or stay the same?
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Aug 27, 2016 19:13
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You lose some accuracy. Most of the 40-45 damage guns can push to about 80ish accuracy (16 accuracy under the old/console version - they can go higher if you forgo stability entirely) but at that point in the game it was no longer possible to get perfect stability and accuracy for guns. Since the skills update added a whole bunch of +accuracy and +stability skills that work for all guns, you can make guns with perfect stats again. Pistols were still pretty OP as gently caress - they got mild damage nerfs (the firerate nerf that would reduce their usage a lot didn't come until the skills update) but on the whole they were still king from the major Crimefest 2015 changes. Shotguns were usable because they threw them a bone by normalizing them all to a fairly decent range, but they still required a heavy point investment that pistols and rifles did not.
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Aug 27, 2016 20:00
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Feonir posted:That is precisely why I love me my Reinfeld shotgun. I should give the Reinfeld another shot. My problem with it was always that it fired just a bit too slow for my liking, but that shouldn't be a problem anymore. I also tried to tinker around with the 1014 some more last night, but I kept ending up on the worst maps for it and it doesn't help that my build is currently tailored to my Raven/Beagle combo specifically.
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Aug 28, 2016 00:56
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Thanks I basically main the Mac 10 right now. From what I've seen it gets a buff in ammo count. With that said will the vector disappoint? That looks like the only interesting new gun to me. I guess the vaylkarie looks cool too.
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Aug 28, 2016 17:11
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The vector fires way too fast and has a messy sight shaking. I suggest the Micro Uzi, it is surprisingly accurate, easy recoil and fun to use.
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Aug 28, 2016 17:24
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oohhboy posted:The vector fires way too fast and has a messy sight shaking. I suggest the Micro Uzi, it is surprisingly accurate, easy recoil and fun to use. They have the same RoF lol
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Aug 28, 2016 17:32
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I just equip Jacket's Piece and run around like a loon because Oppressor says "gently caress you" to aiming
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Aug 28, 2016 17:49
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Didn't know about the micro uzi. I will be sure to check it out. I kinda do wanna speculate about heists now. I know I've seen some posts about golden grin detection bug or something like that. What is that? Just how bad are carshop and lab rats? I know goons tend to over exaggerate.
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Aug 28, 2016 18:08
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swims posted:Didn't know about the micro uzi. I will be sure to check it out. Carshop is an experience you can pretty much have once and never do again. It was a clever idea for a heist that is very tedious and samey in practice. There's an RNG element that pretty much forces you to trigger an alarm before you're ready, which can be pretty frustrating until you figure it out. The payout sucks too. It's more like a proof of concept than a level. Lab Rats is excruciating but it's fun to do once in a while in a masochistic sort of way. It's just a lot of running, walking, weird sight lines and bad geometry.
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Aug 28, 2016 18:26
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Dr Cheeto posted:They have the same RoF lol Yeah but the Micro Uzi's hidden stat of "Style Points" is better. Especially with the Futomaki which gives +100 style.
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Aug 28, 2016 18:42
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Mendrian posted:Carshop is an experience you can pretty much have once and never do again. It was a clever idea for a heist that is very tedious and samey in practice. There's an RNG element that pretty much forces you to trigger an alarm before you're ready, which can be pretty frustrating until you figure it out. The payout sucks too. It's more like a proof of concept than a level. Car Shop's initial part, without the forced alarm and timer, is actually pretty fun as a really high-tier stealth challenge. Actually clearing up to the forced alarm is damned tricky, and generally requires co-ordination for the whole team, which is unusual for stealth maps.
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Aug 29, 2016 00:19
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Concordat posted:Do percentage damage buffs act as multiplicative or additive bonuses? Trip report: gave this build a try earlier today (with High Value Target added to push it to the max). The damage is awesome but inconsistent - I could one-shot drat near anything I felt like even on DW with a Breaker, but it flaked out at bad times (ie not being able to spot the cloaker/taser ahead of time, having Underdog not kick in for whatever reason, etc) and you give up drat near everything else to get there. A slightly amusing gimmick, but not particularly viable.
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Aug 29, 2016 01:51
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Mods to increase stealth challenge are becoming a thing. Firestarter DW, all loot, no assets, modified to have all four hangars open. That translates to about 50 gangsters. Really impressive. FWB: All loot, DW, no dead civilians, no assets, modded to make the Overvault accessible, without using the vent for the gold. Five hours, including a 40 minute wait for the overdrill and ~2 hours of moving bags through safe areas, just to be able to move the gold through the escape offices. Basically, hell. Diamond: DW, no dead civilians, modded so that all 71 artifacts can be stolen. Suboptimal because he brought the glass cutter, the scrub. I'm feeling guilty because these mods were originally my suggestion to the Master Stealthers group- but that FWB one in particular is just stupidly masochistic, even by my standards. They're developing a fully stealthable Big Oil and a bunch of others now. Any requests? Discendo Vox fucked around with this message at 05:42 on Aug 29, 2016 |
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Aug 29, 2016 03:44
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That FWB one almost makes DV seem fun. Why would anyone do that to themselves? What if you get caught 3 hours in?
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Aug 29, 2016 08:13
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watho posted:That FWB one almost makes DV seem fun. Why would anyone do that to themselves? What if you get caught 3 hours in? NOT HARDXCORE ENUF
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Aug 29, 2016 08:14
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watho posted:That FWB one almost makes DV seem fun. Why would anyone do that to themselves? What if you get caught 3 hours in? FWIW most of the difficulty of that particular challenge comes from 1. taking care of the manager, 2. getting good spawns in the escape path, and 3. The patience, focus and endurance needed to spend 40 minutes waiting and an hour plus moving bags of gold through safe areas, before moving them through riskier areas. The escape is, as far as currently known, impossible to completely ghost, which is really frustrating and disappointing when compared with other heists like Alesso. Allen Wren posted:NOT HARDXCORE ENUF Also true. It's possible to run the heist with the restrictions he does, and also not kill any guards. Discendo Vox fucked around with this message at 09:03 on Aug 29, 2016 |
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Aug 29, 2016 08:52
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Discendo Vox posted:Car Shop's initial part, without the forced alarm and timer, is actually pretty fun as a really high-tier stealth challenge. Actually clearing up to the forced alarm is damned tricky, and generally requires co-ordination for the whole team, which is unusual for stealth maps. Oh this so much, the only reason I don't run Car Shop anymore is because the timer was so strict, I got burned forever when I lost a few good runs to wonky driving physics. I think I've read that they improved it, but I haven't tried it for myself.
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Aug 29, 2016 09:07
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Discendo Vox posted:Also true. It's possible to run the heist with the restrictions he does, and also not kill any guards. I may vomit.
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Aug 29, 2016 09:10
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Discendo Vox posted:Any requests? Shadow Raid full clear, all warehouse loot is artifacts (where possible), all warehouse loot transported to the van via rooftop zipline (no sewers, no river zipline, no dumpster drop). Must get the guard drop on the roof. HoxVenge DW, no guard kills (this has probably already been done)
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Aug 29, 2016 09:17
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Stealth in this game is still yawn-worthy. There's basically no thrill whatsoever in it. I only ever stealth because it's incredibly easy (Jewelry Store and, unless RNG fucks you over and gives you 5 guards, Ukrainian Job), because it's more convenient (H&T) or for achievements (and even then I have more capable crew members who can do most of the work). There is no conceivable way that 5 hours of stealth and bag-moving can be fun - not to do, and certainly not to watch. Also, forced stealth heists make no sense whatsoever, both because the crew has proven able to shoot themselves out of any and all situations, and because in Car Shop they handwave it by saying we have to refrain from damaging the cars but chances are you'll bang them up while driving away due to the lovely controls anyway.
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Aug 29, 2016 10:22
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Election Day 2 warehouse is fun to stealth. The objective requires zero bag hauling, lots of entryways, there's a lot of wiggle room inside the warehouse to escape guards and the big buck loot bags are right next to your van once you've completed the hack.
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Aug 29, 2016 10:45
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Tempest_56 posted:Trip report: gave this build a try earlier today (with High Value Target added to push it to the max). The damage is awesome but inconsistent - I could one-shot drat near anything I felt like even on DW with a Breaker, but it flaked out at bad times (ie not being able to spot the cloaker/taser ahead of time, having Underdog not kick in for whatever reason, etc) and you give up drat near everything else to get there. A slightly amusing gimmick, but not particularly viable. Alternatively, replace the shotgun buffs with Body Expertise and use LMGs.
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Aug 29, 2016 11:53
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Wastrel_ posted:Stealth in this game is still yawn-worthy. There's basically no thrill whatsoever in it. I only ever stealth because it's incredibly easy (Jewelry Store and, unless RNG fucks you over and gives you 5 guards, Ukrainian Job), because it's more convenient (H&T) or for achievements (and even then I have more capable crew members who can do most of the work). Loud is boring and too easy, at least stealth can present a little bit of a challenge. I agree, though, 5 hours of stealthing FWB sounds tedious as gently caress. I won't be signing up for that any time soon.
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Aug 29, 2016 12:13
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Oh hey I love overdri--  
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Aug 29, 2016 12:20
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So what's a good character build/set of equipment for stealth?
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Aug 29, 2016 14:32
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Wastrel_ posted:Also, forced stealth heists make no sense whatsoever, both because the crew has proven able to shoot themselves out of any and all situations, and because in Car Shop they handwave it by saying we have to refrain from damaging the cars but chances are you'll bang them up while driving away due to the lovely controls anyway. If I get caught on Murky Station the and the two loot bags are NOT secure, then I should get a countdown till a huge contingent of Murky guards mobilizes and I am in for a horrid grind to escape (essentially game over (maybe it should just be outright game over?). If I already have the two loot bags in the van/dinghy then that vehicle immediately departs (and an escape vehicle that cannot carry loot shows up at the other location for me to use to get away); acquiring other loot bags is now impossible. A countdown to when that contingent of angry guards show up which make my personal escape hard could be a short countdown but not immediate game over, and now my escape is harder (and as stated no more loot). Something similar could be done for Shadow Raid. Also something should be done to Shadow Raid so that it cannot be ECM rushed so they can increase the XP payout because I enjoy doing it solo if I am dicking around if work is slow and i cant be on mumble or playing without pausing, but its worth half the XP of Murky Station and provides less of a Stealth Boost to the next mission  Laputanmachine posted:Election Day 2 warehouse is fun to stealth. The objective requires zero bag hauling, lots of entryways, there's a lot of wiggle room inside the warehouse to escape guards and the big buck loot bags are right next to your van once you've completed the hack.
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Aug 29, 2016 14:36
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doublepostGort posted:So what's a good character build/set of equipment for stealth?  For skills I do:
Jack of All Trades aced lets you pack two ECMs and a body bag case. Drill skills in case you need to drill on something like Shadow Raid or Election Day. I think I sprinkle in some weapon stability/accuracy stuff just for shits with the extra skill points. I have also done dumb things like wearing an LBV and having the skill that increases a vest's armor and concealment plus having the skill that decreases the bag carry penalty based on how much armor you have. I didnt notice much a of a difference so I got rid of it.
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Aug 29, 2016 15:01
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Gort posted:So what's a good character build/set of equipment for stealth? First, ace every skill in the Covert Ops subtree and Duck and Cover basic, Inner Pockets basic, and Parkour basic. After that, you've got a few other skills you can pick up:
The kunai knife is ideal due to poison animations keeping guards from shooting. Asides from that, pick guns that have high concealment and high damage, because the ability to kill an alerted guard with a single shot is a good way to avoid fuckups. I'm a huge fan of suppressed shotguns for stealth because they allow you to fling corpses around. Conserving bodybags isn't nearly as important now that Jack of All Trades exists but it's still pretty fun to launch guards into safe corners. You can shout guards down before flinging them, buying time to line up a good shot. The judge is ideal for this, as it is concealable and has high damage and you can nail a flying corpse in the air to give it more speed with the high RoF. The breaker and raven shotguns also work well. Just know that if you're a client, the position you see guards and bodies in might not be accurate. Also try not to launch guards into places you can't pick their pagers up. Dr Cheeto fucked around with this message at 15:12 on Aug 29, 2016 |
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Aug 29, 2016 15:10
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Somebody repost that gif where a goon launches a guard over the balcony on Framing Frame 3 with a Loco and it immediately goes loud because the pager just falls off the map.
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Aug 29, 2016 15:18
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Shooting Blanks posted:Loud is boring and too easy, at least stealth can present a little bit of a challenge. I agree, though, 5 hours of stealthing FWB sounds tedious as gently caress. I won't be signing up for that any time soon. Deathwish can still get fairly intense. The other day I was doing Hox Revenge with 3 competent pubs and the assault ended just as we were moving the bags out of the house to the garage where the helicopter was. Heist done, right? Well the next assault proceeded to kick in seconds later, which would have been fine, except Captain Winters chose that exact moment to turn up. So we ended up fighting for the next 15 minutes against a ceaseless wave of cops without a chance of getting to him, because he spawns at the back of the house and we would have had to push through the horde to reach a place where we could hit him. After many instances of heroism, all 3 of them are in custody and I'm fighting alone. I shoot myself a very temporary path to the copter, grab the last loot bag, throw it in, and leap into the escape zone at 10% health (frenzy build) just as my last sliver of armour vanishes. I also just finished, moments ago, a DW Aftershock that was also quite an experience. The overwhelming cop spawn in the construction yard had put the other 3 crew members in custody, leaving me to make a lone dash for the truck. I get close to it, get tased, but the last round in my judge knocks over the taser, giving me just enough time to get into the truck and end the heist. No stealth heist has ever matched these levels of excitement.
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Aug 29, 2016 15:39
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Gort posted:So what's a good character build/set of equipment for stealth? Kill everyone and delete corpses.
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Aug 29, 2016 21:45
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