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All motorsports are dominated by countries with bad national anthems. Germany, Spain, Britain. None of the good ones (Italy, Russia, France, maybe USA) get anywhere. Except for a couple Italians in bike racing.
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Sep 25, 2016 14:26
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| # ? May 30, 2024 17:40 |
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wicka posted:by no stretch of the imagination is this an answer to the question i asked. WHY would this improve racing? what effect would it have? Watching two cars racing is better than watching one car lapping at a pace to conserve the tires he is on long enough, and a car following doing the same. Who can't overtake because doing so would literally harm his race. If you take away the BS that comes from the current ultra reliance on team strategies you get closer to drivers racing each other. wicka posted:i've answered this 14 loving times. we only banned a part of radio communication, and it sucked, and it unnecessarily punished drivers for things that are completely out of their control. banning ALL chatter still maintains this problem. read what i am saying and not just what you want to hear, gently caress. Well wicka, it sucked because they only banned a part of it, and not long enough to allow any changes in thinking to happen, and not with any other changes. The real world is a bit more nuanced than "more of X = more of result".
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Sep 25, 2016 14:36
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Dubs posted:Every single pitstop in Every single race by Every single driver, being decided by the driver and not the pitwall would improve what I think of as RACING This doesn't make any sense to me. If they ban radios, team would just roll the dice on changes and then it becomes a random numbers game instead of a race.
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Sep 25, 2016 14:47
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Khablam posted:Watching two cars racing is better than watching one car lapping at a pace to conserve the tires he is on long enough, and a car following doing the same. Who can't overtake because doing so would literally harm his race. no, lol. strategy existed before radio. managing tire wear existed before radio. Khablam posted:Well wicka, it sucked because they only banned a part of it, and not long enough to allow any changes in thinking to happen, and not with any other changes. The real world is a bit more nuanced than "more of X = more of result". ... banning radio only created situations where easily-manageable mechanical issues, issues entirely out of the drivers' control, caused them to drop places or retire, which resulted in worse races. so, yes, more of a radio ban would still result in more of these problems, obviously. this is why i've asked you, on several occasions, to just let it go! because we tried this, it did not work, and insanity is trying the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
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Sep 25, 2016 15:01
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Rev. Dr. Moses P. Lester posted:All motorsports are dominated by countries with bad national anthems. Germany, Spain, Britain. None of the good ones (Italy, Russia, France, maybe USA) get anywhere. Except for a couple Italians in bike racing. USA has a terrible anthem
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Sep 25, 2016 15:02
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wicka posted:no, lol. strategy existed before radio. managing tire wear existed before radio.
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Sep 25, 2016 15:10
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I agree that a big problem is drivers aren't pushing the cars because of tire bullshit. Dunlop gets to pour all their resources into making the best tires they can for the Nurburgring 24 while Pirelli has to half-rear end it to appease the crypt keeper. Free Pirelli. Make Rubber Great Again.DOOP posted:USA has a terrible anthem It's to the tune of a drinking song.
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Sep 25, 2016 16:09
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Whatever we change, can we put back refueling as well? And limit the amount of fuel they can start with.
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Sep 25, 2016 16:43
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Bring back the Milwaukee GP, that'll fix it  (no really, back in 1912 the American Grand Prize was in Milwaukee).A couple things that I think could be good starting points, but not end-all be-all fixes:
iospace fucked around with this message at 17:26 on Sep 25, 2016 |
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Sep 25, 2016 17:21
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Bring back ground effects.
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Sep 25, 2016 17:33
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Bring back Pastor Maldonado.
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Sep 25, 2016 17:37
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Bring back Pastor in the fan car
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Sep 25, 2016 17:42
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daslog posted:This doesn't make any sense to me. If they ban radios, team would just roll the dice on changes and then it becomes a random numbers game instead of a race. so the bloke in the car able to reduce that randomness by pitting at the right time gets an advantage
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Sep 25, 2016 17:46
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wicka posted:no, lol. strategy existed before radio. managing tire wear existed before radio. Which the driver determined, by racing his race car. Do you not see how this is different than deciding this based on a computer model, fed into his ear or no?
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Sep 25, 2016 17:46
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Khablam posted:Which the driver determined, by racing his race car. Do you not see how this is different than deciding this based on a computer model, fed into his ear or no? lol. you actually have no idea how any of this works, and are apparently just a sad old man who rails against anything new or different. face it: we tried this. it didn't work. i'm sorry that you're wrong, but you are, and we established this by trying the dumb thing you're suggesting. please drop it.
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Sep 25, 2016 17:53
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why do we even need drivers IMO they just get in the way of the perfect computer simulation
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Sep 25, 2016 17:55
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I mean why even run the race? just run each teams simulation against each other
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Sep 25, 2016 17:56
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the world is going to be so much better when the boomers die
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Sep 25, 2016 18:00
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wicka posted:lol. you actually have no idea how any of this works, and are apparently just a sad old man who rails against anything new or different. So do you fundamentally disagree that the deciding factor that determines the winner of the race should be driver skill?
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Sep 25, 2016 18:05
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Khablam posted:So do you fundamentally disagree that the deciding factor that determines the winner of the race should be driver skill? no, i fundamentally disagree that you have any idea what you're talking about i've explained this to you forty seven motherfucking times. how does leaving drivers prone to random mechanical failures test their skill? huh? explain that one, champ. for the last loving time: the idea that you're suggesting? WE DID IT. it sucked so bad that even the FIA admitted they were wrong. it's over. it's done. cry about it elsewhere.
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Sep 25, 2016 18:08
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wicka posted:no, i fundamentally disagree that you have any idea what you're talking about I'm not suggesting we ban team radio. This is what I'm talking about when I say you read what you want to read.
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Sep 25, 2016 18:17
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Khablam posted:I'm not suggesting we can team radio. lol, you have written countless angry essay posts justifying something you don't want to do? k banning team radio is a terrible idea. that's all i'm saying. if you don't want to be a part of that conversation, don't, but don't argue with me for two loving days and then be like "oh but that's not actually what i meant." only you are persisting with this lovely argument. move on to something else.
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Sep 25, 2016 18:22
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Old Russian saying. "Arguing with ..... is like trying to teach pig to dance, all it do is frustrate you and annoy pig"
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Sep 25, 2016 18:29
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I've said since the beginning the same thing - your assertion that a radio ban wouldn't work is based on the assumption that we just ban radio in a vacuum, and no other changes were made. What if other changes were made that made the sport more centralised around decisions the driver makes alone? If it would be too 'random' what needs to change so the driver can make these decisions and affect the outcome? Watching drivers lap at a pace a computer tells them is optimal is boring. Watching drivers race as quickly as they can in the situations in front of them is not. That's a lot of the reason why changeable conditions are exciting; why Canada 2011 was amazing and most the races this season have not.
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Sep 25, 2016 18:28
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Khablam posted:I've said since the beginning the same thing - your assertion that a radio ban wouldn't work is based on the assumption that we just ban radio in a vacuum, and no other changes were made. What if other changes were made that made the sport more centralised around decisions the driver makes alone? If it would be too 'random' what needs to change so the driver can make these decisions and affect the outcome? are you suggesting a formula where it's impossible for the car to break?
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Sep 25, 2016 18:32
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if cars are so complicated they cant be soley operated by the guy in them (WITH A BIG loving COLOR SCREEN WITH HIM) and need a pitwall to micro manage the car to not break then they are too bullshit complicated and if they need to change the cars so they are wicka spec "impossible to break" I am ok with it
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Sep 25, 2016 18:43
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wicka posted:are you suggesting a formula where it's impossible for the car to break? What breakage do you believe can't be detected in-car? As it is, most problems are radio'd driver to pits. It's then the pit crew who come up with a solution. Well gee, perhaps the driver can also work out a solution. e: ignoring reliability being only a minor factor for years. Also assuming some slight issues with reliability being an unfair trade for overall more exciting races.
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Sep 25, 2016 19:07
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were you not watching during the radio ban months ago? reality already answered all your questions. why do you persist? it's baffling. just let it loving go, man.
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Sep 25, 2016 19:22
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The fact not opinion bit: We can't ban radio outright right now, it's already been demonstrated that the recent radio ban turned it into a massive clusterfuck. The reason for this is that the engines are far too complicated for a driver to fix on their own, not because they lack talent but because they lack degrees in engineering. We can change the rules on strategy, fuel, and tyres all we like but we still won't be able to ban radio. The "solution" is to go back to V# engines but we can't do that because they are last generation technology and the works teams, rightly, won't have it. One of the biggest problems team radio has is public perception, it's overused according to some people and underused according to others, what it needs is someone like Liberty media to get together with the FIA and the teams and form a working group and this is now happening. opinion bit: If FOM had filmed the race like every other sporting event has been doing for at least 15 years then there would have been the option of different audio channels available to people with digital TV. Sky has it and the BBC had it on the red button. Some people could have had the option of having team radio, others could have turned it and the commentary off. But that was too daring and modern for bernie so has never happened and now here we are.
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Sep 25, 2016 19:38
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Khablam posted:. Well gee, perhaps the driver can also work out a solution. lol. Half these drivers aren't even old enough to have finished the degree needed to be able to do this. Young max hasn't even finished A levels. 
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Sep 25, 2016 19:41
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learnincurve posted:The fact not opinion bit: We can't ban radio outright right now, it's already been demonstrated that the recent radio ban turned it into a massive clusterfuck. The reason for this is that the engines are far too complicated for a driver to fix on their own, not because they lack talent but because they lack degrees in engineering. We can change the rules on strategy, fuel, and tyres all we like but we still won't be able to ban radio. The "solution" is to go back to V# engines but we can't do that because they are last generation technology and the works teams, rightly, won't have it. One of the biggest problems team radio has is public perception, it's overused according to some people and underused according to others, what it needs is someone like Liberty media to get together with the FIA and the teams and form a working group and this is now happening. engrave this on my tombstone
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Sep 25, 2016 20:05
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Khablam posted:What breakage do you believe can't be detected in-car? As it is, most problems are radio'd driver to pits. It's then the pit crew who come up with a solution. Well gee, perhaps the driver can also work out a solution. Slow punctures can be detected by the pit wall monitoring the pressure before the driver feels anything and the radio allows them to tell the driver before the tyre lets go and sends him into the wall.
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Sep 25, 2016 20:19
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learnincurve posted:Old Russian saying. "Arguing with ..... is like trying to teach pig to dance, all it do is frustrate you and annoy pig"
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Sep 25, 2016 21:20
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Xisticide posted:Slow punctures can be detected by the pit wall monitoring the pressure before the driver feels anything and the radio allows them to tell the driver before the tyre lets go and sends him into the wall. You can solve any safety issues by routing things like this through race control. Then the team doesn't have to play "lets do blatant test-cases on what is safety orientated", which is what made the partial ban this season a poo poo-show. But again I'm not arguing for a radio ban, I'm arguing I prefer a formula where a radio ban wouldn't result in 'random results' because there isn't too much emphasis on strategy by pit-crew analysis. Of course wicka will claim a partial ban with obscure and poor wording and inconsistent application somehow proves this is a bad idea.
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Sep 25, 2016 22:49
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how many more times do I need to say it? a full ban, by definition, MUST include all the problems that the partial ban had. LET. IT. GO. jfc
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Sep 25, 2016 22:56
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Ban radios please
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Sep 25, 2016 23:18
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Wicka: "The debate is over, it's done, the issue is closed." *Twenty million new posts debating the issue*
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Sep 25, 2016 23:17
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1500quidporsche posted:Wicka: "The debate is over, it's done, the issue is closed." not sure how it's my problem that people keep extending a nonsensical argument
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Sep 25, 2016 23:26
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Everyone, including those who are on your side, agree that the silly radio restriction thing was not a radio ban.
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Sep 25, 2016 23:30
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The ultimate answer is to ban F1, problem solved.
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Sep 25, 2016 23:37
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