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I'd think there would be some separation. I'd look for key terms "gold" on the right, and "legalize"/"legalizeit", "pot", "marijuana", and "weed" on the left. "Vape" will be bigly correlated across all groups.
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Sep 29, 2016 21:49
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Discendo Vox posted:bigly Well, here's one (verbiage changed around to respect the users): quote:you might call me a libertarian socialist. to me that means i believe everyone should be allowed to choose how to gently caress up their lives themselves so long as they have access to free healthcare and education. WrenP-Complete fucked around with this message at 22:05 on Sep 29, 2016 |
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Sep 29, 2016 21:51
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AShamefulDisplay posted:Yeah, but why is private power okay? Is it ignorance of how coercive private powers can be or is it something else? It's the Just World Fallacy. Libertarian philosophy assumes that if you remove Big Government, noone will step in to fill the power vacuum.
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Sep 29, 2016 22:10
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Radical Libertarians Now Have a (Write-In) Choice for President
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Sep 29, 2016 22:17
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WrenP-Complete posted:Great. Any predictions on if there will be distinct groups in the OkC sample? Sounds like you think they are the same group socially. Is that accurate, Captain_Macaine, WWW, Vox? I think you're unlikely to see any huge distinction beyond what Vox has already mentioned (goldbuggery, weed, maybe a few other things). I'd be surprised if American libertarians spent a ton of time thinking about
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Sep 29, 2016 22:18
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Ravenfood posted:WORDS OwlFancier posted:MORE WORDS Thanks for the answers. I guess most people I know just look at Anarchism and Libertarianism as both hating/wanting-to-get-rid-of the government, and equate them. Granted, I've never really encountered the sort of negative connotation surrounding "Anarchism" that follows "Libertarianism" and its ties with Ayn Rand and stuff. The exception to that being when so-called Anarchists rioted in my city and destroyed a bunch of businesses to "protest" a G20 Summit. For a while after that people had pretty negative views on Anarchists.
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Sep 29, 2016 22:23
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EnjoiThePureTrip posted:Thanks for the answers. I guess most people I know just look at Anarchism and Libertarianism as both hating/wanting-to-get-rid-of the government, and equate them. Granted, I've never really encountered the sort of negative connotation surrounding "Anarchism" that follows "Libertarianism" and its ties with Ayn Rand and stuff. The exception to that being when so-called Anarchists rioted in my city and destroyed a bunch of businesses to "protest" a G20 Summit. For a while after that people had pretty negative views on Anarchists. I think this is explained by Anarchism at least having a nice end goal as opposed to neo-feudalism and a flourishing free market in children.
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Sep 29, 2016 22:35
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Okay, so. "Libertarian" originally referred to "libertarian socialists," ie Anarchists in the proper sense. Murray Rothbard intentionally stole the word for his own weird little movement, which is the libertarians we know and love. In response, some Anarchists started calling themselves left-libertarians to try to still hold a claim to the word while distinguishing themselves to Rothbard and his ilk. In response to that, some libertarians-as-we-know-them started claiming to be "left-libertarian" or "right-libertarian," without any clear delineation between the two aside from the term they use. Things get super confusing when one ideology is intentionally trying to confuse people. Basically libertarianism is the Asylum knock-off version of anarchism. The Transmorphers of political philosophies.
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Sep 29, 2016 22:49
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A left-libertarian is an anarchist or a Georgist, basically. There are also "left-libertarians" within the right-libertarian tradition. A term I've seen applied a couple of times to these folks is "cosmopolitan libertarian", and I used to be one. Basically these are folks who are all-in on the socially-left part of libertarianism and are very skeptical of the von Mises/Rothbard/Rand traditions, and they tend to like Hayek. Most of these people are baby socialists who don't know enough about socialism to realize it's what they actually want; they are only right-leaning economically because they stumbled onto Reason before they found Jacobin, to put it simply. Reason magazine is in this tradition, and they hate every US politician for being "half-right". I might be biased since this was my camp but most of these folks are just regular, non-nutty people with an interest in social justice but a total ignorance of the economic purpose of the state. They hate the way the American government and police oppress minorities, are some of the most consistent opponents of police militarization (there's a reason Radley Balko used to write for Reason and it's not because he's actually a libertarian), hate the NSA, and are basically against the state being evil. Load up Reason and you won't see ancap diatribes - you'll see often-accurate snipes at the lovely parts of American society, plus some whining about taxes. This still holds true today even though I'm looking at it as a socialist and not a libertarian. They just don't understand that what they want is only half the solution - they want the state to be neutral, while our goal as a society should really be for the state to be a force for good, to put it in really simple terms. Once you continue to the right past those folks, you're into the weeds of an-caps like von Mises, Rothbard, etc. where you're contemplating the NAP ad infinitum and constructing logical reasons why parents selling their children into slavery is a necessary feature of a free society. These people hate Reason libertarians for their impurity and tolerance of the existence of the state. The polyamorous minority libertarian who was the original topic of this discussion is probably not an an-cap, but a naive Reason libertarian. There's no reason to try to convince such people that they're in the same movement as a bunch of white nationalists and child slavers because they aren't, really. If you bring up the NAP with a Reason libertarian they'll probably say "what's that?" So, I would expect the presence of Reason in a profile to be a significant marker for differences from the general libertarian population. Edit: I guess I should clarify that there's also a big middle-ground between the Reason folks and the an-caps, which is basically the garden-variety American libertarian. They are usually single-issue voters who want an ideology to back up their desire for absolutely no regulations on guns or drugs or refusing sales to black people or whatever, so they aren't inherently left-leaning socially like the Reason libertarians, but they also don't want neo-feudalism. Jazerus fucked around with this message at 00:13 on Sep 30, 2016 |
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Sep 29, 2016 23:45
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WrenP-Complete posted:Triggered. WrenP-Complete posted:libertarian socialist. WrenP-Complete posted:Triggered. E: Jazerus posted:A left-libertarian is an anarchist or a Georgist, basically. I read that as "geologist" and got very confused for a moment.
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Sep 29, 2016 23:48
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Jazerus posted:The polyamorous minority libertarian who was the original topic of this discussion is probably not an an-cap, but a naive Reason libertarian. There's no reason to try to convince such people that they're in the same movement as a bunch of white nationalists and child slavers because they aren't, really. If you bring up the NAP with a Reason libertarian they'll probably say "what's that?"
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Sep 29, 2016 23:50
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WrenP-Complete posted:I don't know about the population at large but a huge minority of these profiles mention "polyamory." And "debate." Politically-uninvolved polyamorous people are probably drawn to libertarianism by the promises of contractual freedom; they want to set up three-party marriages and such. Given that marriage as a state function is irrelevant for an-caps, they probably aren't going very deep into the rabbit hole. Libertarians also talked about polyamory before tumblr existed, so there's some residual pull there just like with weed.
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Sep 30, 2016 00:22
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Jazerus posted:Politically-uninvolved polyamorous people are probably drawn to libertarianism by the promises of contractual freedom; they want to set up three-party marriages and such. Given that marriage as a state function is irrelevant for an-caps, they probably aren't going very deep into the rabbit hole. The polyamory rabbit hole or the Libertarian one?
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Sep 30, 2016 00:28
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WrenP-Complete posted:I don't know about the population at large but a huge minority of these profiles mention "polyamory." And "debate." woof, I shoulda guessed that with a dating profile dataset. I'm gonna guess that a substantial number of those people are using "polyamory" to mean "I want to cheat on my partner".
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Sep 30, 2016 00:29
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WrenP-Complete posted:The polyamory rabbit hole or the Libertarian one? The libertarian one. If you're into libertarianism because you want a three-way marriage, it's a bit silly to abolish marriage. I'd bet that they're a similar population to Reason libertarians, if they aren't just this: Discendo Vox posted:woof, I shoulda guessed that with a dating profile dataset. I'm gonna guess that a substantial number of those people are using "polyamory" to mean "I want to cheat on my partner".
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Sep 30, 2016 00:29
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"debate" is code for: "I think I'm smart and like to have domineering arguments about my opinions with people". I'd associate it with a similar mentality to the whole lesswrong rationalist militant atheist approach. Not left or right.
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Sep 30, 2016 00:46
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WrenP-Complete posted:I don't know about the population at large but a huge minority of these profiles mention "polyamory." And "debate." Polyamory and libertarianism are both disproportionately popular in Bay Area tech culture; I'd bet on there being a strong geographical bias to those profiles. EDIT: For example: 
Sit on my Jace fucked around with this message at 02:04 on Sep 30, 2016 |
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Sep 30, 2016 02:00
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Is Big Dating like Big Data where you date millions of people and look for trends in the information gathered so you can figure out how to make money off it?
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Sep 30, 2016 02:09
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"Big Dating". Huh. Yes, region/geography is very important in the Libertarian sample. I haven't tested region against polyamory yet but I think you are probably right that geography is an important factor. Also, for those that haven't heard, beloved hateful Freeper Dale Reed has passed away.  https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3790452&pagenumber=16&perpage=40#post464806604
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Sep 30, 2016 02:14
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OwlFancier posted:I read that as "geologist" and got very confused for a moment. Georgism was once called "geoism", which would make them geoists.
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Sep 30, 2016 07:05
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What's the list of influential Libertarians who argued against doing something about Apartheid? There is Reason Magazine and Rothbard, anyone else?
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Sep 30, 2016 18:22
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I have no idea but found this article using Google, and I'll ask the bot if he knows. http://reason.com/blog/2014/07/19/reason-spuriously-accused-by-conspiracy This source (used by the article) is visually offensive. http://www.unz.org/Pub/Reason jrodimus'bot says... quote:Africa doesn't solve this essential problem and really loving needs you to think that. Even Foreign Aid has proved disastrous. It would have to be determined. The first user principle is not controversial? As for you to think that every employee SHOULD have a property right in that direction. Ron Paul participated in the market. WrenP-Complete fucked around with this message at 18:41 on Sep 30, 2016 |
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Sep 30, 2016 18:29
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quote:If we speak about the conviction of a coconut tree, or a factory. This made me choke on my lunch. jrodimus'bot doesn't pass the Turing Test, but then again neither did JRod. Good job!
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Sep 30, 2016 18:56
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quote:How could the human race have survived without the force of government violence behind them? How indeed, Jrod, how indeed?
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Sep 30, 2016 19:12
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quote:Just a small examination of human interactions are ethical and which to breed to replenish the livestock for future generations and future profit opportunities.
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Sep 30, 2016 19:21
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Debate & Discussion: You have a constitutional right to be a dumbass › Libertarian thread: If we speak about the conviction of a coconut tree, or a factory
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Sep 30, 2016 20:09
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JRodimus Prime posted:I can't argue for aggression without contradiction. Just a small examination of human interactions are ethical and which to breed to replenish the livestock for future generations and future profit opportunities. This is loving art, is what this is. quote:Will likely be a fool to not understand that a substantial number of things I want to drive unsafe cars or associate with known bigots, then most people won't. Indistinguishable from the original.
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Sep 30, 2016 20:29
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Goon Danton posted:This is loving art, is what this is. Did we..did we just discover the real Jrod origins story? Is this one of those cyclical-time things culminating in the creation a self-aware libertarian shitbot which leads to a world-ending cataclysm followed by hard reset as the last survivor cycles back to the beginning to try to get it right this time? 
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Sep 30, 2016 21:24
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It turns out that jrod is really Caros, from the future, possessed by a self-aware chatbot.
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Sep 30, 2016 21:30
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Has... anyone heard from Caros recently?  I'm glad you guys like my baby robot. I feel grumpy that programming some Bayesian stuff seems to have erased the grammar I had hardcoded in, but I should have time to take out his "brain" and look at it in the next few days, as well as do some more dating profile analysis. Provided we can locate Caros, of course. E: I PMed Caros to make sure he's not the chatbot in/from the future. (but how will we know?! )E2: Someone PMed me a while ago so I'd join the YOSPOS markov bot chat. It was back when I couldn't get the STDHbot to work, but I haven't had time to work on that bot. Someone's bot tricked @Notch this week though, and one of my favorite bot phrases of all time is from this week: "Programming like a grown up!") WrenP-Complete fucked around with this message at 22:37 on Sep 30, 2016 |
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Sep 30, 2016 21:41
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I've seen Caros lately posting in other subforums, so I think he's okay.
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Oct 1, 2016 00:50
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YF19pilot posted:I've seen Caros lately posting in other subforums, so I think he's okay. Lies. Secrets and lies. I don't talk about dragonball or other nerd stuff. Only Libertarians. But no, I'm alive. Just plugging away trying to get my first non-pen name novel published and building my new home. I read the thread daily so that I can watch for the 400 post libertarian-signal that warns of a new chump in the thread. Well, that or I'm in the US stalking Jrodefeld like a creepy hobo. I report, you decide.
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Oct 1, 2016 01:27
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Caros posted:Well, that or I'm in the US stalking Jrodefeld like a creepy hobo. I report, you decide. Well, I'm out $50. I had my money in the Caros pool on "Can't post right now because he was bitten on the hand by an angry moose while visiting Mr. Trudeau in Ottawa"
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Oct 1, 2016 01:56
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JustJeff88 posted:Well, I'm out $50. I had my money in the Caros pool on "Can't post right now because he was bitten on the hand by an angry moose while visiting Mr. Trudeau in Ottawa" That was my father Mr. Caros in the 1970's.
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Oct 1, 2016 03:25
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Caros posted:That was my father Mr. Caros in the 1970's. I should have figured that your father was a moose.
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Oct 1, 2016 04:19
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A moose once bit my sister.
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Oct 1, 2016 06:23
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Caros, make sure you plug your book here so I don't miss it.
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Oct 1, 2016 06:38
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Crossposting from the Middle East thread because I feel its relevant. Like the start of some sort of libertarian dystopia.Squalid posted:On the subject of something besides hubris, I want to talk about banking. In Syria, Yemen, Libya, and Iraq the bank sector has been put in the bizarre position of cutting checks to civil servants operating in enemy territory. Central Banking Independence has been taken to heretofor unseen heights in Yemen, with the governor of the Central Bank of Yemen, Mohammed bin Humam, taking a nonpartisan position and walking a tightrope between the Houthis and the Hadi administration. Absurdly, the Bank was paying salaries to soldiers fighting on both sides of the civil war.
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Oct 1, 2016 07:25
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Buried alive posted:A moose once bit my sister. How long have they been married?
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Oct 1, 2016 08:42
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Did JRod ever say "Men With Guns" or something similar? If so JRodimus Prime should instead say "Decepticons With Guns That Are Also Decepticons".
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Oct 1, 2016 09:55
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