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Honestly, thinking about it, I think this show is worse paced than JJ, though I'm in the minority who didn't mind the meandering of the latter.
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Oct 3, 2016 19:33
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Cythereal posted:Someone in this thread mentioned that Cottonmouth had a male prostitute in the flashback chapter. I didn't see it, but took it that I overlooked it. I think people just got queer undertones from Cornell because he was a sensitive kid who liked music and as an adult he dressed real good and whatnot. I'm pretty sure there was...negligible...indication that he was ever into men.
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Oct 3, 2016 19:41
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Guy Goodbody posted:What I like about Claire is that she's now enthusiastic about superhero stuff. Everybody else is all reluctant and brooding, she's just totally driven and excited to be involved with superheroics. Yeah, Claire Temple is being set up to be the moral core of the group and I don't see a problem with that. honestly the love angle makes plenty of sense given what happened in the DD Season 1. Murdock is frightened of himself, in constant doubt, unwilling to represent others truly, imposing morality through force. Luke Cage is a super hero with none of the deficiencies that drove Claire away from Murdock. He's willing to lead, to be a role model, and he is always questioning his approach in healthy ways. He imposes his morality through example, and others join him through solidarity. Even though near nothing can hurt him, he's as non violent as he can possibly be given the circumstances.
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Oct 3, 2016 19:44
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Guy Goodbody posted:What I like about Claire is that she's now enthusiastic about superhero stuff. Everybody else is all reluctant and brooding, she's just totally driven and excited to be involved with superheroics. Claire is becoming a really cool character and it's nice to have someone completely on board with the hero business. It's a little annoying how they always use her to add in sexual tension, but I could forgive it if her sleeping with all the heroes becomes a running gag with Jessica Jones S2 and Iron Fist because that would be pretty great.
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Oct 3, 2016 19:47
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Parkingtigers posted:I thought the show dipped a little in the middle, but I was also literally falling asleep from late night binging at that point so it may have been me. Post finalé, the more I think about the show the more I find myself enjoying having watched it. I think it absolutely had the best last episode and ending out of all the series so far. Agreed with all of this and I like literally everything that Netflix MCU has put out, albeit to varying degrees. Just ranging from goddamn awesome to pretty good and well worth watching, IMO. Good stuff!
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Oct 3, 2016 19:50
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juche posted:This pretty much. I also hated how it was so obviously ABC produced. My spergometer jumped a good bit when it turned out Scarfe was dirty and then dead, as he provided a vital contact into the NYPD for Misty once she left and went hero. Also disappointed by the arm fix. Was IMing with an admin buddy while he was working and even mentioned it looked like they were prepping the arm.
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Oct 3, 2016 20:23
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Serf posted:My only issue with this show (which was fantastic from start to finish imo) is that they totally wasted Mahershala Ali only 7 episodes in. He is one of my favorite actors, and he was killing it as Cottonmouth. I hate that they killed him off in his best episode, where we see how he and Mariah came up. I loved Erik LaRay Harvey as Diamondback and thought he was a great villain, but they should've saved him for season 2. Cottonmouth wasn't as much of a problem as he should've been imo, but every time Ali was onscreen I was absolutely into it. I liked his death scene, and seeing Mariah rise up to take his place because it was a great bait-and-switch, but I wish he could've gotten the Kingpin/Diamondback treatment because he is such a joy to watch. Preach. I like the way Cottonmouth died but would rather it had been at the very last episode. Hell have him lose his cool at the end to have a street fight with Cage and it pretty much would have played out very much the same but stronger. Mahershala Ali is amazing and always glad to see him get work. Hell plunder the hell out of all the Wire and Boadwalk Empire cast as far as I'm concerned. Who wouldn't want to see Omar/Chalky White? One guy that would be perfect for this show and it should be a given: Charles S. Dutton. Guy can play Preacher, OG, Big boss, Cop.... pretty much anything. Seriously a solid underrated actor and his background would be a perfect match for this show. Give him a role and let him go to town. He won't disappoint. I've heard some of the complaints for the show and really... it did fine. The rally to arm cops came off weird but there were also scenes of the cops harassing innocent people of the street, smacking around a kid in interrogation and a speech where Mariah talks about Luke Cage stirring up the cops and them taking it out on the people. Her tone was similar to the way you warn kids about messing with dangerous neighbourhood dogs or that crazy guy down the street. Implied. I picked it up right off the bat and laughed. There was this guy a while ago that said when you want to get your opinion across you got to start off light and sweet before you lay the truth on people. Cage was here with a very controversial topic and it was made for lots of people to get hooked. Give it a season or two to get some legs and see where it goes. Most tv shows take that long to really hit their peak. All of the Marvel network shows have been solid. The music has been the best thing I have heard on television.... ever. I'm still hoping Talib Kwali gets to add some next season as he can do nice with the old school throwback.
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Oct 3, 2016 20:47
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Cythereal posted:I could see it being more a thing of myth and rumor - everyone's heard he's bulletproof, sure, but people don't really believe it and assume those stories must be exaggerated. Exploring Luke Cage as a myth in the making to the people of Harlem could have been a much more interesting use of the time spent on Diamondback. Not only that, but you don't think the boss isn't going to have you jacked up for pulling a runner?
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Oct 3, 2016 20:53
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Renoistic posted:The beginning of episode 10 is great and making me laugh my rear end off. Marvel / comic book scientists sure love doing reckless poo poo. They wouldn't be who they were AND in the MCU if they didn't.
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Oct 3, 2016 20:57
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Cottonmouth and Misty were definitely my unexpected favorites. They had some of the best scenes. I'll admit JJ is my favorite of the Netflix Marvel shows but like JJ, the more time after I finished watching it, the more I appreciate the show so it might end up eclipsing DD season 1.
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Oct 3, 2016 21:06
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Guy Goodbody posted:So much of the show was good. Good acting, some great characters, great cinematography, music and the location were used incredibly well. It's a shame that the show overall is kinda boring. I agree with everyone who said it's three episodes too long. The first really glaring example was in the second episode when Pops made Luke agree to find the kid. Why wasn't that how the first episode ended? How long did Luke spend with those loving magic bullets in him? Did he need to be shot with two different magic bullets on two separate occasions? What was the point of Diamondback becoming mini-Kingpin if he just wanted to kill Luke Cage? So much time wasted on unnecessary poo poo. You know, Diamondback mentions the mass produced models are substantially less powerful than his prototypes.
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Oct 3, 2016 21:14
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the plot structure in luke cage is pretty good, but the writing is atrocious. everybody just bounces off each other; i don't think there's been a single line that actually naturally followed the line preceding it. it's just one-liner after one-liner with no real care for what comes before or after it. i've finished up through episode eight so far, and the worst of it has been: any scene with just Cottonmouth and Mariah. They're fantastic actors, but every time they come together (and it doesn't even make sense that they chat so often, when the very first episode has her explaining that she shouldn't be seen with him) it's just the same poo poo over and over again. "I like money." "I like respect." except repeated back at each other a hundred times, and then the whole thing repeated six or seven times throughout the show's run. Their last scene together was the only one with any real meat to it, which is a shame, since that's uh not happening anymore and pop's death scene was just horribly awkward. the writers could have done literally anything with his last words, and instead they just had him rattle off the only two catchphrases he managed to establish in the screentime leading up to that scene and kick the bucket. and scarfe got the exact same treatment five episodes later! but gripes aside i am enjoying the show overall, since the set design and acting is definitely really good, and as i said i at least like how the overall plot is moving PS: does anybody else think it was maybe very slightly tone deaf to have a black dude proclaim that he was no angel when that word has become, uh, fraught with context in the last few years
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Oct 3, 2016 21:23
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I think the judas bullets were a bit of a misstep, and I wish they expanded on that smoke grenade that hit Cage. Like tear gas can slow him down, bear spray and stuff like that can hurt his ability to breathe properly even though it doesn't sting the eyes and membranes like a normal person. So the big fight at the end is Diamondback(who has a rebreather in his suit, or trained himself to be resistant to crowd control poo poo in prison), and the police firing can after can of gas at the Harlem mob that won't disperse. So Cage is jumping in front of gas cans, smacking them out of the air while simultaneously fighting Diamondback surrounded by the mob surging forward cheering him on. In the end the crowd pushing the cops back actually helps Cage win the fight. Sort of spelling out that Harlem itself is this guy's Robin. Anyways that it my Luke Cage fan fiction plz like and subscribe
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Oct 3, 2016 21:33
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How has angel become fraught with context over the last few years?
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Oct 3, 2016 21:34
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bloodychill posted:How has angel become fraught with context over the last few years? He was no angel
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Oct 3, 2016 21:35
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bloodychill posted:How has angel become fraught with context over the last few years? "He was no angel" is a phrase Fox News used to describe the victim of the shooting that lead to the Ferguson protests - an unarmed black kid who once posted a photo of himself on facebook in a hoodie with a gun. The phrase has since become something of an emblem of police killing unarmed black men for no reason and certain loud, pervasive segments of the media saying it was justified.
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Oct 3, 2016 21:36
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Cythereal posted:"He was no angel" is a phrase Fox News used to describe the victim of the shooting that lead to the Ferguson protests - an unarmed black kid who once posted a photo of himself on facebook in a hoodie with a gun. The phrase has since become something of an emblem of police killing unarmed black men for no reason and certain loud, pervasive segments of the media saying it was justified. I'm really lucky to not follow ultra right wing nonsense not to know about this I guess.
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Oct 3, 2016 21:47
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Samizdata posted:You know, Diamondback mentions the mass produced models are substantially less powerful than his prototypes. What does that mean?
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Oct 3, 2016 21:54
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Guy Goodbody posted:What does that mean? It means that a single bullet wouldn't basically take Luke down for days. Diamondback mentions something about diluting the alien metals or something.
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Oct 3, 2016 21:56
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bloodychill posted:It means that a single bullet wouldn't basically take Luke down for days. Diamondback mentions something about diluting the alien metals or something. The reason the single Judas bullet took him down for days was because it penetrated his skin and his weird physiology pulled the bullet fragments deeper into him. For the mass production Judas bullets to not do that, they'd have to not be able to penetrate his skin. if the MP bullets can't do that, they're, what, the equivalent of bean bag rounds to him? They leave a nasty bruise? They establish that the Judas bullets are a huge threat, but then they introduce the MP bullets and never establish how much of a threat they actually are to Cage. Except for "less that that". I agree with bring back old gbs, having the cops come up with another tactic that takes advantage of Cage's weaknesses would've been a lot better.
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Oct 3, 2016 22:01
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Guy Goodbody posted:The reason the single Judas bullet took him down for days was because it penetrated his skin and his weird physiology pulled the bullet fragments deeper into him. For the mass production Judas bullets to not do that, they'd have to not be able to penetrate his skin. if the MP bullets can't do that, they're, what, the equivalent of bean bag rounds to him? They leave a nasty bruise? They establish that the Judas bullets are a huge threat, but then they introduce the MP bullets and never establish how much of a threat they actually are to Cage. Except for "less that that". Well, even Mariah brings up all the stuff bbog mentions. Does he have gills? Drown the bitch. They never really explore that, but it may come up in S2 or Defenders.
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Oct 3, 2016 22:05
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I just finished it and, while it wasn't great, I thought it was decent for a superhero series. I'd rate it as slightly better than Jessica Jones and waay better than the dumpster fire called Daredevil. No zombie mutant ninjas in sight.
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Oct 3, 2016 22:29
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Guy Goodbody posted:The reason the single Judas bullet took him down for days was because it penetrated his skin and his weird physiology pulled the bullet fragments deeper into him. For the mass production Judas bullets to not do that, they'd have to not be able to penetrate his skin. if the MP bullets can't do that, they're, what, the equivalent of bean bag rounds to him? They leave a nasty bruise? They establish that the Judas bullets are a huge threat, but then they introduce the MP bullets and never establish how much of a threat they actually are to Cage. Except for "less that that". I thought it was because the Judas bullet also exploded and fragmented, not just penetrated his skin. I figured the mass produced ones wouldn't explode, so they'd be like normal bullets to Luke - able to break his skin, but would do less overall damage. The cops never even shot at Luke with the new ones, so we don't know if they'd even work.
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Oct 3, 2016 22:35
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I'm probably the only person who actually got a big kick out of the fight between Hammer Tech Diamondback and Cage at Pop's Barber Shop. It's like the show wanted to wait until nearly the very last moment before becoming a tried and true comic book story.
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Oct 3, 2016 22:38
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gninjagnome posted:I thought it was because the Judas bullet also exploded and fragmented, not just penetrated his skin. I figured the mass produced ones wouldn't explode, so they'd be like normal bullets to Luke - able to break his skin, but would do less overall damage. The cops never even shot at Luke with the new ones, so we don't know if they'd even work. I am pretty sure they did once, like right before the cop who got his hair cut at Pop's let Luke go. They shot at him, missed, and a chunk of wall exploded.
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Oct 3, 2016 22:42
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AndyElusive posted:I'm probably the only person who actually got a big kick out of the fight between Hammer Tech Diamondback and Cage at Pop's Barber Shop. It's like the show wanted to wait until nearly the very last moment before becoming a tried and true comic book story. I liked it but at the same time i didn't like it because I knew the people who complained about the Hand would complain about it. Also the choreography could have used a little more work.
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Oct 3, 2016 22:43
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I really enjoyed this show, but man did they gently caress up by killing off Cottonmouth so early and moving on to Diamondback. If they woulda just slowed their roll a bit and left the latter for season 2, this would've been so much better. The highs were higher than anything I got out of JJ or DD, but the lows were pretty frequent. Especially Mariah's rally to end police brutality by giving them more powerful weapons and Luke's speech at the precinct, which was apparently so compelling that all the cops stopped whatever else they were doing to listen.
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Oct 3, 2016 22:52
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Gaunab posted:I liked it but at the same time i didn't like it because I knew the people who complained about the Hand would complain about it. Also the choreography could have used a little more work. I guess I like bad things since I had no complaints about The Hand in DD S02. I don't get the complaints about the choreography either. Having the fight spliced with flash backs lent considerable weight to what was happening. It wasn't a hugely detailed super brawl and we've all certainly seen bigger but this one was incredibly personal. Having it mostly take place inside and on the street directly in front of the Barber Shop allowed the Harlem community to stand out from how usual comic book civilians react to these increasingly common occurrences. They embraced the conflict and in doing so helped to connect them with the characters in ways that I haven't seen replicated very much or very well in other MCU offerings.
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Oct 3, 2016 23:00
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The final fight was silly but it was one of the most honest, earnest moments and worked a lot for me. I'm not sure the show quite earned the cheering but I appreciated it anyway and the choreography helped sell it for me as the rough-and-tumble brawl it was.
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Oct 3, 2016 23:05
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if I was a gorilla, I would say it was bananas. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLPbw52g5bQ
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Oct 3, 2016 23:12
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tweet my meat posted:Claire is becoming a really cool character and it's nice to have someone completely on board with the hero business. It's a little annoying how they always use her to add in sexual tension, but I could forgive it if her sleeping with all the heroes becomes a running gag with Jessica Jones S2 and Iron Fist because that would be pretty great. She really should make out with Jessica at least once.
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Oct 3, 2016 23:17
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BrianWilly posted:Nah, I mentioned this in the BSS thread, but (this is barely a spoiler) the prostitute (who was dressed like a woman) wasn't Cottonmouth's, he just worked for Mama Mabel. To be fair, the actor playing young Cottonmouth comes off a little fey in his line reading, but I think that's more attributable to where the actor is in his own life's journey than any comment on the character he's playing. Also the prostitute wasn't dressed like a woman, she was a trans character, played by a trans actress (same episode non-spoiler)
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Oct 4, 2016 00:10
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^^^^^^ I have no idea how you can infer anything else from that scene other than there was a trans woman who was under Mama Mabel's protection. How do you draw a line from that to "Kid Cottonmouth was loving her"??? I'm on episode 7 now and it's stretching my suspension of disbelief a little that "I know your secret, you were in prison and I can send you back!" is some kind of Luke Cage kryptonite. raditts fucked around with this message at 01:07 on Oct 4, 2016 |
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Oct 4, 2016 00:59
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raditts posted:I'm on episode 7 now and it's stretching my suspension of disbelief a little that "I know your secret, you were in prison and I can send you back!" is some kind of Luke Cage kryptonite. What gets me about that is they really should be talking about sending him to that super-prison from the third Captain America movie. They're not going to put the guy who can punch through concrete in a plain old prison; it's going to be even worse.
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Oct 4, 2016 01:16
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Do you think Cottonmouth used ZipRecruiter.com?
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Oct 4, 2016 01:17
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MrAristocrates posted:The final fight was silly but it was one of the most honest, earnest moments and worked a lot for me. I'm not sure the show quite earned the cheering but I appreciated it anyway and the choreography helped sell it for me as the rough-and-tumble brawl it was. Yeah I'm 100% on board with that and it's also started by the best line in the show so it all was set up for me to be pretty giddy about it. Though I definitely rate JJ as above this I felt like this show had by far the best use of music and flavour in general. Luke is a genuinely likable person compared to the other two and deep down its abundantly clear that hes a good person which I very much appreciate having someone like that in the pretty depressing netflix heroes so far. I agree somewhat with the Judas bullet being a strange and undercutting plot point but honestly I'm fine with it being a way to take Luke's power away for a little bit and it felt like a clever way to integrate the story into the larger universe. I don't see any of the cultural implications of it but the black guy being shot and then hunted down as the suspected criminal seems like its supposed to be hitting on a lot of current issues better than other ways you can have to just disable luke for a little bit. I think what saved the concept for me was the show working hard to demonstrate that something like this existing has massive implications. Literally seconds after saying the police can get access to this the ADA shows up to remind the audience the Punisher is a thing and holy poo poo now hes probably going to get his hands on your space super bullets. My biggest complaint by far is the yet another police corruption plot but at least that was all wrapped up pretty quickly. Theres a pretty big undercurrent of tension as Cottonmouth (who I was dreading as a shittier Kingpin) is genuinely a solid character. I think its just mostly a very solid acting job on a potentially simple role but I just really like the idea of a more simple gangster type figure that genuinely is not some brilliant mastermind pulling a hundred strings (also his excited at seeing the Judas bullet is amazing). Him being killed off probably hurt the show but I dont see a way of keeping him on any longer. Diamondback I liked as a legit crazy guy with zero bigger plan and the insane bible reveal being a giant fake out was loving great. The brother/relationship stuff I thought was super weak and came out of nowhere with basically zero payoff? Misty was just continuously great throughout the show though and I can't really fault much of the character or her arc tbh. Its probably the more tightly paced/controlled and I mostly wish the Luke plot had been closer to that. I didn't really click with Shades until the hostage episode before I picked up on his deal and it all made his story way more hilarious and engaging retroactively. I cannot believe I was rooting for him to kill Zip by the end there. Am I going crazy in hearing the bits of the daredevil tune in Misty's theme music, I assume it was trying to go for a'hey yeah the justice part of the show plays the blind guy's music' but I cant tell if im projecting or not.
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Oct 4, 2016 01:24
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:
I worded this poorly. I mean he was a distraction, like intended by the story to be a distraction, to distract luke cage and also the viewers. While Luke, and the viewers, are getting wrapped up in this fight with a crazy guy in a doofy costume that obviously luke will beat up, it's just a matter of time, Mariah and Shades are escaping and killing Candace, which is the real final fight - and it's one the heros lose.
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Oct 4, 2016 02:13
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Phobeste posted:I worded this poorly. I mean he was a distraction, like intended by the story to be a distraction, to distract luke cage and also the viewers. While Luke, and the viewers, are getting wrapped up in this fight with a crazy guy in a doofy costume that obviously luke will beat up, it's just a matter of time, Mariah and Shades are escaping and killing Candace, which is the real final fight - and it's one the heros lose. It's such a cheesy conceit, but I'll always think of David Simon when I see that kind of wrap-up in a finale.
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Oct 4, 2016 02:46
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Wanderer posted:What gets me about that is they really should be talking about sending him to that super-prison from the third Captain America movie. They're not going to put the guy who can punch through concrete in a plain old prison; it's going to be even worse. Or maybe the SUPERMAX from Jessica jones.
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Oct 4, 2016 03:43
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Here's my question: Jessica Jones was a film noir story about abuse. Luke Cage (so far) seems like a modern blaxploitation about African-American culture and the systematic failing to help provide that culture. What exactly was Daredevil's overarching theme and genre?
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Oct 4, 2016 04:37
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