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Taciturn Tactician posted:Keeby why on earth are you building spirit visage over locket on support? Also frost cannon seems like a weird choice on someone who has as much slow/speed up as karma hint: the game is a normal edit: also i needed mana but did not need cdr and that was the only AP/Mana item that did not also give CDR but was also not Rod of Ages late in the game How Rude fucked around with this message at 18:02 on Oct 5, 2016 |
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Oct 5, 2016 17:37
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stump collector posted:if we're on the subject of doing one thing to fix the game id be happiest if they permabanned all of my accounts I just got 33 kills and did 73k damage to champions in a ranked game and lost so I'm with you on this one
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Oct 5, 2016 17:37
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stealth is bad except when it is on my favourite champion, teemo. mobile stealth is obnoxious to play against in every way in league of legends as there are nowhere near enough tools for dealing with stealth and having to pay pink ward taxes just because someone picked another champion only to have pink wards be the most easily removed wards in the game is a piss off
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Oct 5, 2016 17:42
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Imagine an ivern creating a bush in a line on cool down as a teemo belly crawls one bush unit forward, hidden and unknown.
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Oct 5, 2016 17:47
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I can't wait for the next time URF is around for Ivern bush making fun
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Oct 5, 2016 17:50
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Work Friend Keven posted:Imagine an ivern creating a bush in a line on cool down as a teemo belly crawls one bush unit forward, hidden and unknown. ::begins sweating profusely::
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Oct 5, 2016 17:52
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Work Friend Keven posted:Imagine an ivern creating a bush in a line on cool down as a teemo belly crawls one bush unit forward, hidden and unknown. now this is what the gently caress i am talking about. god drat.
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Oct 5, 2016 17:53
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SKARNER IS loving BUSTED
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Oct 5, 2016 17:54
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(A 420 base move speed skarner gets double shyrelia'ed through a Jayce gate & goes so fast he shoots from 2012 to 2016 and ults you)
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Oct 5, 2016 17:59
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Luna Was Here posted:Keeby why do you never create Plays dot Tee Vee clips of OUR games together HMMMM?!???!?!?!??!?!?!? cus all we do is feed and meme also re: stealth chat I would greatly appreciate Riot making pink wards less mandatory against stealth champions but also they NEED TO BRING BACK THE PINK WARD TRINKET loving GODDAMN I am sick of not being able to be a full build Support without sacrificing my ability to place pink wards at Baron/Dragon for vision control and it is the most irritating loving thing to be unable to cap my build off with a ZZrot or whatever and instead have a 75 gold item slot sitting there, mocking me or hell, make a line of support items that exist to hold one charge of pink ward on every back, one for caster-y supports and one for tanky supports and then this problem would be put to rest How Rude fucked around with this message at 18:06 on Oct 5, 2016 |
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Oct 5, 2016 18:01
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redesigning stealth so it isn't balanced around pink wards makes sense for the same reason qss not removing debuffs does, riot doesn't really want to make the game about buying items to counter certain champions. that being said im not sure why its okay for qss to remove cc, since a bunch of champions are still "good until someone buys a qss" so actually i think riot is just dumb
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Oct 5, 2016 18:08
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I just got Aether Wing Kayle from a hextech box, and now I'm torn because I already had Battleborn and don't even play Kayle. But it's not like I'm going to use any of these lovely recolour skins that have otherwise come out of the box, so ... uhm? Any guides on Kayle? Can she still jungle and support?
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Oct 5, 2016 18:10
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Honestly, the shimmer should be good enough. If its done as well as in HOTS you'll be able to track a stealthed hero if you are actively looking for them, but subtle enough that you can not notice them if you're in the Laning Zone It's allowed them to add a lot of fun talents to heroes because it makes stealth less of a binary "SEE = DEAD, NOSEE= YOUDEAD" thing.
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Oct 5, 2016 18:11
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Nietzschean posted:I just got Aether Wing Kayle from a hextech box, and now I'm torn because I already had Battleborn and don't even play Kayle. But it's not like I'm going to use any of these lovely recolour skins that have otherwise come out of the box, so ... uhm? Any guides on Kayle? Can she still jungle and support? not viridian kayle, recycle immediately
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Oct 5, 2016 18:13
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Radical posted:that being said im not sure why its okay for qss to remove cc, since a bunch of champions are still "good until someone buys a qss" so actually i think riot is just dumb The issue is that Riot as a game developer has gotten progressively better, but League of Legends as a game is still saddled with certain legacy mechanics. The suppression component of Malzahar's ult is considered such a core part of his playstyle that they don't want to remove it, yet it's incredibly unfun to go up against it in lane, so they've settled on QSS as a "gold tax" that you pay instead of racing to a big AP item first. It sucks, but I don't see it being removed until they change certain champs like Malzahar altogether. Nietzschean posted:I just got Aether Wing Kayle from a hextech box, and now I'm torn because I already had Battleborn and don't even play Kayle. But it's not like I'm going to use any of these lovely recolour skins that have otherwise come out of the box, so ... uhm? Any guides on Kayle? Can she still jungle and support? She can still jungle fairly effectively, but she's never really been able to support. Unlike Zyra or Brand, she has almost no inbuilt damage and relies heavily on items, and all the support that she brings is a decent but mana-hungry heal and her invuln.
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Oct 5, 2016 18:14
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Tired Moritz posted:SKARNER IS loving BUSTED Did something in this patch change him?
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Oct 5, 2016 18:14
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I just checked and somehow I also have Riot Kayle and Neurolimal posted:not viridian kayle, recycle immediately I own Emerald Taric and Marble Malphite  (idk if those are just recolours anymore)
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Oct 5, 2016 18:15
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https://medium.com/@joejedwards/6-20-the-return-of-support-nunu-via-undocumented-changes-6f2efdcf5d56#.2cimozom4 good news goon friends, support Nunu is back
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Oct 5, 2016 18:15
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Aerox posted:Did something in this patch change him? all the other junglers got worse
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Oct 5, 2016 18:15
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Chris de Sperg posted:https://medium.com/@joejedwards/6-20-the-return-of-support-nunu-via-undocumented-changes-6f2efdcf5d56#.2cimozom4 for only one or two patches probably
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Oct 5, 2016 18:18
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Radical posted:all the other junglers got worse Excellent. Skarner is the only fun jungler so I'm glad I can bring him out again. 
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Oct 5, 2016 18:19
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Vermain posted:The issue is that Riot as a game developer has gotten progressively better, but League of Legends as a game is still saddled with certain legacy mechanics. The suppression component of Malzahar's ult is considered such a core part of his playstyle that they don't want to remove it, yet it's incredibly unfun to go up against it in lane, so they've settled on QSS as a "gold tax" that you pay instead of racing to a big AP item first. It sucks, but I don't see it being removed until they change certain champs like Malzahar altogether. What determines if something is legitimate "counterplay" or a bullshit "gold tax," in most peoples' eyes? Champions with channeled ults (e.g., Malzahar or Morgana), and any mage facing an AD-heavy lane opponent (e.g., Yasuo or Zed), are pretty much "forced" to build Zhonya's Hourglass even if there were theoretically a better item to build. Is that legitimate, or bullshit? Champions without a get out of poo poo free ability (e.g., dashes, stealth) pretty much have to take Flash when those who have them (e.g., Evelynn or Shyvana) are more free to double-down on offensive summoners. Is this legitimate or bullshit?
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Oct 5, 2016 18:20
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Neurolimal posted:Honestly, the shimmer should be good enough. If its done as well as in HOTS you'll be able to track a stealthed hero if you are actively looking for them, but subtle enough that you can not notice them if you're in the Laning Zone The problem is that even if stealth made you more visible, while stealthed you have 100% dodge and immunity to a bunch of spells. It's part of why people have always hated Deceive- even if you know exactly where Shaco went, he still got a free flash and you can't target him for a couple seconds. It might be neat if they did that with camouflage, though. You can see Eve's shimmer anywhere you have vision but no minimap icon.
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Oct 5, 2016 18:21
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I hope Katarina is one of their bigger projects since she wasn't listed there. She's kinda a mess. Guessing the big reworks are going to be Kat, Rengar, Talon, Eve and LeBlanc maybe? Kassadin wasn't mentioned at all but he's honestly balanced for the first time in the past 5 years so they should just leave well enough alone. Firebert fucked around with this message at 18:25 on Oct 5, 2016 |
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Oct 5, 2016 18:22
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Riot is stuck in a kind of awkward middle ground with stealth--Dota has a lot of heroes with long-term stealth, items that give stealth, and frequently gives large stealth bonuses besides (Nyx or Bounty's bonus damage, Weaver running through units at Mach 10), but it's also very deliberate about giving you lots of ways to counter invisibility: wards, dust of appearance, gem, and there's a couple of heroes who have anti-invis worked into their kit. I can't think of a game off the top of my head that just doesn't have stealth, but that would be another approach. Riot wants to have stealth, but doesn't want to devote item space to countering it, so they have to try and make the stealth weak to compensate.Firebert posted:I hope Katarina is one of their bigger projects since she wasn't listed there. She's kinda a mess. She is, along with Rengar, Talon, Leblanc, and... uh... someone else I don't immediately remember.
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Oct 5, 2016 18:22
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Nietzschean posted:What determines if something is legitimate "counterplay" or a bullshit "gold tax," in most peoples' eyes? Champions with channeled ults (e.g., Malzahar or Morgana), and any mage facing an AD-heavy lane opponent (e.g., Yasuo or Zed), are pretty much "forced" to build Zhonya's Hourglass even if there were theoretically a better item to build. Is that legitimate, or bullshit? Champions without a get out of poo poo free ability (e.g., dashes, stealth) pretty much have to take Flash when those who have them (e.g., Evelynn or Shyvana) are more free to double-down on offensive summoners. Is this legitimate or bullshit? anything i dont like is bullshit
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Oct 5, 2016 18:22
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Nietzschean posted:What determines if something is legitimate "counterplay" or a bullshit "gold tax," in most peoples' eyes? Champions with channeled ults (e.g., Malzahar or Morgana), and any mage facing an AD-heavy lane opponent (e.g., Yasuo or Zed), are pretty much "forced" to build Zhonya's Hourglass even if there were theoretically a better item to build. Is that legitimate, or bullshit? Champions without a get out of poo poo free ability (e.g., dashes, stealth) pretty much have to take Flash when those who have them (e.g., Evelynn or Shyvana) are more free to double-down on offensive summoners. Is this legitimate or bullshit? Basically: is a certain item absolutely needed to counter a certain hero, or can you get around them in other ways? If you don't buy a QSS against Malzahar, he's probably just going to take a dump all over you as soon as he hits 6; same thing with Zed (unless you're playing Lissandra/Fizz). You generally want to build Seeker's against a Yasuo, but it's not a strict requirement, because you can cleverly dodge around his attempts to setup his ult and kite him when he's out of your creep line. There's no counter to Malzahar or Zed clicking on you beyond being perpetually out of range or buying a certain item.
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Oct 5, 2016 18:24
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Vermain posted:Basically: is a certain item absolutely needed to counter a certain hero, or can you get around them in other ways? If you don't buy a QSS against Malzahar, he's probably just going to take a dump all over you as soon as he hits 6; same thing with Zed (unless you're playing Lissandra/Fizz). You generally want to build Seeker's against a Yasuo, but it's not a strict requirement, because you can cleverly dodge around his attempts to setup his ult and kite him when he's out of your creep line. There's no counter to Malzahar or Zed clicking on you beyond being perpetually out of range or buying a certain item. What if Malzahar and Zed had their ultimates changed to charge-up skillshots?
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Oct 5, 2016 18:26
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Nietzschean posted:I just got Aether Wing Kayle from a hextech box, and now I'm torn because I already had Battleborn and don't even play Kayle. But it's not like I'm going to use any of these lovely recolour skins that have otherwise come out of the box, so ... uhm? Any guides on Kayle? Can she still jungle and support? Kayle is probably the only champion in the game who can legitimately play every role.
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Oct 5, 2016 18:26
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Nietzschean posted:What if Malzahar and Zed had their ultimates changed to charge-up skillshots? Then you could pretty safely remove QSS from the game, or make the cleanse component the sole purview of Mercurial Scimitar/maybe some kind of AP equivalent. It's not the suppression/Death Mark component so much as the fact that it can be applied with a single click without any real way of avoiding it beyond the aforementioned items.
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Oct 5, 2016 18:28
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Nietzschean posted:What determines if something is legitimate "counterplay" or a bullshit "gold tax," in most peoples' eyes? Champions with channeled ults (e.g., Malzahar or Morgana), and any mage facing an AD-heavy lane opponent (e.g., Yasuo or Zed), are pretty much "forced" to build Zhonya's Hourglass even if there were theoretically a better item to build. Is that legitimate, or bullshit? Champions without a get out of poo poo free ability (e.g., dashes, stealth) pretty much have to take Flash when those who have them (e.g., Evelynn or Shyvana) are more free to double-down on offensive summoners. Is this legitimate or bullshit? Building a zhonya's against zed early as an ap character kind of sucks when you could have built something better but it's still a good item that you probably would have built eventually anyway, but having to build a qss against malz as an ap champ is bullshit because it doesn't build into any ap item and feels bad to have an inventory slot devoted to half an item
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Oct 5, 2016 18:29
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Firebert posted:I hope Katarina is one of their bigger projects since she wasn't listed there. She's kinda a mess. Talon, LeBlanc, Rengar, and Kat are confirmed as receiving major updates, but lots of assassins will get minor changes.
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Oct 5, 2016 18:30
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Vermain posted:Basically: is a certain item absolutely needed to counter a certain hero, or can you get around them in other ways? If you don't buy a QSS against Malzahar, he's probably just going to take a dump all over you as soon as he hits 6; same thing with Zed (unless you're playing Lissandra/Fizz). You generally want to build Seeker's against a Yasuo, but it's not a strict requirement, because you can cleverly dodge around his attempts to setup his ult and kite him when he's out of your creep line. I think you're making a pretty tenuous distinction here, I mean if you wanna say that you don't need an Armguard against Yasuo/Zed because you can dodge all of his poo poo, then you can also say you don't need a QSS against Malzahar because you can outrange him or just sit back and farm. Also QSS doesn't work against Zed ult anymore henkman posted:Building a zhonya's against zed early as an ap character kind of sucks when you could have built something better but it's still a good item that you probably would have built eventually anyway, but having to build a qss against malz as an ap champ is bullshit because it doesn't build into any ap item and feels bad to have an inventory slot devoted to half an item I agree, this is better reasoning
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Oct 5, 2016 18:30
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How Rude posted:cus all we do is feed and meme what about the game where I carried the poo poo out of you as jungle khazix
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Oct 5, 2016 18:32
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Dr. Mantis Toboggan posted:I think you're making a pretty tenuous distinction here, I mean if you wanna say that you don't need an Armguard against Yasuo/Zed because you can dodge all of his poo poo, then you can also say you don't need a QSS against Malzahar because you can outrange him or just sit back and farm. I don't think it's healthy to have a champion mid who you have to constantly live in perpetual fear of deciding to randomly Flash forwards, click on you, and murk you. It's pretty obvious when Yasuo is setting up for his ult, even if he decides to E -> Flash -> Q to guarantee it (because of the nature of his Q progression). It is absolutely not at all obvious when Malzahar is going to Flash forwards, click on you once, and hit you with all the damage, hence why QSS is an absolutely mandatory buy against him, even for the masters of dodging like Faker.
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Oct 5, 2016 18:33
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Neurolimal posted:Honestly, the shimmer should be good enough. If its done as well as in HOTS you'll be able to track a stealthed hero if you are actively looking for them, but subtle enough that you can not notice them if you're in the Laning Zone It kind of screws over champions who are dependent on vision and auto-attacks, which bums me out a bit. Maybe if getting hit takes you out of stealth for a moment, it might work?
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Oct 5, 2016 18:36
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stump collector posted:for only one or two patches probably
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Oct 5, 2016 18:37
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Vermain posted:I don't think it's healthy to have a champion mid who you have to constantly live in perpetual fear of deciding to randomly Flash forwards, click on you, and murk you. It's pretty obvious when Yasuo is setting up for his ult, even if he decides to E -> Flash -> Q to guarantee it (because of the nature of his Q progression). It is absolutely not at all obvious when Malzahar is going to Flash forwards, click on you once, and hit you with all the damage, hence why QSS is an absolutely mandatory buy against him, even for the masters of dodging like Faker. What if Yasuo decides to Flash -> E -> Q you? Personally I think he's one of the most unfun champion to play against, and a clear example of both the mobility creep making this game less and less fun to play and Riot's record with balancing resourceless champions (it's not very good). Also, Malzahar flash ulting kinda doesn't do poo poo now unless he a) gets a gank b) manages to set up a good voidling. Nietzschean posted:I just checked and somehow I also have Riot Kayle and You got Judgement kayle for not getting banned in I think third or fourth season (...or maybe it was second?) and Riot gave everyone Riot Kayle on their last birthday. Also, I think Kayle's best off sticking to top, there's some matchups where your lane opponent really can't do anything at all.
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Oct 5, 2016 18:48
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Don't play support Willump. Don't support with a literal do-nothing skill as a melee champ at level one.
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Oct 5, 2016 18:51
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Suppression straight up does not belong in this game, especially when activated from range. It makes playing against Warwick and Malzahar completely binary, especially if there is layering cc available. Also it being a unique form of hard CC that cleanse does not work against is absolutely awful counterintuitive design for new players.
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