Star Wars: Millenial Trash Discussion Station

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Gonz: Dec 22, 2009; "Jesus, did I say that? Or just think it? Was I talking? Did they hear me?"

I really do hope that Rey's parents are just two nobodies, maybe 1 of which was Force-sensitive. Not a Skywalker or a Palpatine or a Kenobi because that just seems too obvious.

# ? Oct 13, 2016 22:06

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# ? May 14, 2024 21:39

jeeves: May 27, 2001; Deranged Psychopathic
Butler Extraordinaire

All of you folks hoping that Vader will go on a killing spree at the end of this film need to be reminded of the fact that this is a Disney property.

We'll be lucky if they don't turn these characters into their own trilogy++ in a few years.

# ? Oct 13, 2016 22:45

MonsieurChoc: Oct 12, 2013; Every species can smell its own extinction.

I maintain that Rey is the daughter of Ken from the terrible Glove of Darth Vader books because I find that concept funny. :colbert:

# ? Oct 13, 2016 22:56

Galaga Galaxian: Apr 23, 2009; What a childish tactic!
Don't you think you should put more thought into your battleplan?!

jeeves posted:

All of you folks hoping that Vader will go on a killing spree at the end of this film need to be reminded of the fact that this is a Disney property.

We'll be lucky if they don't turn these characters into their own trilogy++ in a few years.

You haven't been watching Rebels have you? That show has had Tarkin order two subordinates decapitated via lightsaber, had the wannabe Jedi student (in a darker moment) use the jedi "mind trick" to force an AT-ST pilot to gun down his supporting stormtrooper squad and then walk off a cliff, and has killed plenty of dudes on both sides.

Speaking of Rebels, one of the Alderaanian "Hammerhead" Corvettes from Rebels was visible in that presumably Rebel fleet around the Space Station. These were "Stolen" by insurgents during an Alderaan humanitarian relief mission to Lothal.

# ? Oct 13, 2016 22:59

Jewmanji: Dec 28, 2003

Serf posted:

I think this theory relies on Jyn surviving Rogue One and I just don't see that happening.

It's called Rogue One. Isn't she going to survive and then just sail off into the sunset, fulfilling her prophecy of being a true "rogue" who can't be bought by the rebellion?

# ? Oct 13, 2016 23:03

homullus: Mar 27, 2009

Electromax posted:

Vader will ignite the saber midway through, advance on a group of rebels, and it will cut away to some guards playing space chess while the massacre occurs on a small monitor behind them.

Vader will ignite the saber midway through a rebel torso.

# ? Oct 13, 2016 23:14

Captain Splendid: Jan 7, 2009; Qu'en pense Caffarelli?

Whoops

# ? Oct 13, 2016 23:23

Zoran: Aug 19, 2008; I lost to you once, monster. I shall not lose again! Die now, that our future can live!

Gonz posted:

I really do hope that Rey's parents are just two nobodies, maybe 1 of which was Force-sensitive. Not a Skywalker or a Palpatine or a Kenobi because that just seems too obvious.

I do think making her a descendant of Palpatine would be, well, gross. And being a granddaughter of Obi-Wan or something basically amounts to trivia: we in the audience would care about that because we know who Obi-Wan is, but in-universe there are only four characters left (Luke, Chewie, C-3PO, R2-D2) who remember him. There's just not much of a legacy for Rey to grapple with there.

But Rey as Luke's daughter is so rich with potential! It's a neat explanation of her prodigious talents and her many parallels to Luke and Anakin before her. It turns the conflict between her and Ben into an inheritance struggle: who gets to define what it means to be a Skywalker? We'd also get to explore a father-daughter relationship in Episode VIII. That's something Star Wars has never done, and I think it could be really interesting for both Luke and Rey as characters.

I guess I'll also make the case for Jyn as Rey's mom. I don't have any actual spoilers, but there is some behind-the-scenes info here, so I'll spoiler those parts just to be safe:

The timeline works out. From the last trailer, Jyn is a youngish child in a flashback where the Empire comes to take her father away. This puts her at no more than ~27 at the time of Rogue One, and possibly several years younger, depending on how many years after ROTS this scene is set. Rey is born 15 years after this movie.
Assuming that Rey does indeed discover who her family was and why they left her on Jakku, the revelation won't really mean much to the audience unless we've already met her parents. Trouble is, there are almost no eligible bachelors and bachelorettes who have been established in the films. The only named white male character of suitable age is Luke, and there are zero female candidates. So there's a problem here: the backstory of the series' newest main character puts a lot of focus on the mystery of her parentage, and we don't have a woman character who can fill the role of her mother.
This movie is an odd choice for your very first spin-off. So many of the other Anthology ideas�Han Solo movie, Boba Fett movie, possibly an Obi-Wan movie�seem like much safer starting points, because they've got an established character to anchor the story. Was anyone really hankering for a Death Star Plans movie? I do think there was some reason why the Story Group believed putting this film out first was important, and Jyn as Rey's mom would be a pretty strong one. If Rey is indeed Luke's daughter, we'd also have a good explanation for why that revelation was put off until Episode 8: this movie had to come out first so that we'd be familiar with both of her parents.
(Production Info) The idea for Rogue One seems to have been linked to Luke Skywalker from the beginning. The original working title for the movie was Red Five, which was Luke's old callsign. And it seems like Rogue One shows us the establishment of the original Rogue Squadron; Luke was the one who took over the squadron after ANH.
(Casting) The TFA producers made a pretty big deal out of the fact that they looked at a racially diverse selection of actors and actresses, particularly for the role of Rey. Aside from Daisy Ridley, the two other finalists were both mixed-race. (Jessica Henwick and Maisie Richardson-Sellers both ended up with cameos in the final film.) But in casting for Jyn, the producers haven't said a word about that. In fact, the finalists for the role had a lot in common: white, medium height, brown hair, brownish eyes. And Felicity Jones has more than a passing resemblance for Daisy Ridley. This choice was made well after Daisy was cast. Could be a coincidence, sure, but it's odd that all the finalists had a similar look if it wasn't done deliberately.
I suspect that Rey's mom is already dead by the time of TFA. Giving her the lead role in her own film is a neat way of setting up the character in her own right, independently from any relationship she may eventually have with Luke or Rey.

I could be wrong. Jyn might die at the end of Rogue One. But if Rey's mom is going to be established as a character in the movies, it's basically Jyn Erso or bust.

# ? Oct 13, 2016 23:23

AndyElusive: Jan 7, 2007

Will this movie shed light onto the biggest question every one has had since Empire Strikes Back?

"Why are they called Rogue Squadron?"

:v:

# ? Oct 13, 2016 23:30

Galaga Galaxian: Apr 23, 2009; What a childish tactic!
Don't you think you should put more thought into your battleplan?!

Captain Splendid posted:

Whoops

Not a mistake, those are cargo AT-ATs, called AT-ACTs.

# ? Oct 13, 2016 23:31

Zoran: Aug 19, 2008; I lost to you once, monster. I shall not lose again! Die now, that our future can live!

Galaga Galaxian posted:

Not a mistake, those are cargo AT-ATs, called AT-ACTs.

There's something really charming about a society that has fast interstellar travel and anti-gravity technology but still moves its heavy cargo around on giant walking machines.

# ? Oct 13, 2016 23:34

AndyElusive: Jan 7, 2007

Walker's were primarily designed to inspire fear. If you can scare the piss out of people while moving cargo, all the better.

# ? Oct 13, 2016 23:38

Galaga Galaxian: Apr 23, 2009; What a childish tactic!
Don't you think you should put more thought into your battleplan?!

I just hope we get to see the AT-A(C)Ts deployed similarly to this:

# ? Oct 13, 2016 23:40

Davros1: Jul 19, 2007; You've got to admit, you are kind of implausible

Barudak posted:

That momentary shot of a fallen Jedi statue has made me realize I want an Indiana jones movie but in the Star Wars universe.

Because of course there loving is:

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Henrietya_Antilles

# ? Oct 13, 2016 23:49

Jewmanji: Dec 28, 2003

Zoran posted:

I do think making her a descendant of Palpatine would be, well, gross. And being a granddaughter of Obi-Wan or something basically amounts to trivia: we in the audience would care about that because we know who Obi-Wan is, but in-universe there are only four characters left (Luke, Chewie, C-3PO, R2-D2) who remember him. There's just not much of a legacy for Rey to grapple with there.

But Rey as Luke's daughter is so rich with potential! It's a neat explanation of her prodigious talents and her many parallels to Luke and Anakin before her. It turns the conflict between her and Ben into an inheritance struggle: who gets to define what it means to be a Skywalker? We'd also get to explore a father-daughter relationship in Episode VIII. That's something Star Wars has never done, and I think it could be really interesting for both Luke and Rey as characters.

Luke is the Emperor's grandson. This is made all but explicit in the films. It's what makes the end of ROTJ so powerful- a man caught between his father and his son. If Rey is Luke's daughter and Snoke is Plagueis, then it sets up a cool inter-generational conflict. It just seems to sensible to have Plagueis be deformed from the Emperor's attempts to de-throne him as the primary Sith, and now that the Emperor has finally been vanquished, Plagueis can return to destroy his enemy's lineage.

Jewmanji fucked around with this message at 00:09 on Oct 14, 2016

# ? Oct 14, 2016 00:07

Pops Mgee: Aug 20, 2009; People all over the world,
Join Hands,
Start the Love Train!

Davros1 posted:

Because of course there loving is:

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Henrietya_Antilles

Also related there's that non canon comic where Han and Chewie fly through a wormhole or something and crash land on Earth. Indy and Shortround end up finding the Falcon and it turns out Chewie is where bigfoot came from. It's pretty dumb.

# ? Oct 14, 2016 00:11

Jedi Knight Luigi: Jul 13, 2009

Galaga Galaxian posted:

You haven't been watching Rebels have you? That show has had Tarkin order two subordinates decapitated via lightsaber, had the wannabe Jedi student (in a darker moment) use the jedi "mind trick" to force an AT-ST pilot to gun down his supporting stormtrooper squad and then walk off a cliff, and has killed plenty of dudes on both sides.

Speaking of Rebels, one of the Alderaanian "Hammerhead" Corvettes from Rebels was visible in that presumably Rebel fleet around the Space Station. These were "Stolen" by insurgents during an Alderaan humanitarian relief mission to Lothal.

That looks exactly like the capital ship that docks with the space station at the beginning of KOTOR II

Zoran posted:

I do think making her a descendant of Palpatine would be, well, gross. And being a granddaughter of Obi-Wan or something basically amounts to trivia: we in the audience would care about that because we know who Obi-Wan is, but in-universe there are only four characters left (Luke, Chewie, C-3PO, R2-D2) who remember him. There's just not much of a legacy for Rey to grapple with there.

But Rey as Luke's daughter is so rich with potential! It's a neat explanation of her prodigious talents and her many parallels to Luke and Anakin before her. It turns the conflict between her and Ben into an inheritance struggle: who gets to define what it means to be a Skywalker? We'd also get to explore a father-daughter relationship in Episode VIII. That's something Star Wars has never done, and I think it could be really interesting for both Luke and Rey as characters.

I guess I'll also make the case for Jyn as Rey's mom. I don't have any actual spoilers, but there is some behind-the-scenes info here, so I'll spoiler those parts just to be safe:

The timeline works out. From the last trailer, Jyn is a youngish child in a flashback where the Empire comes to take her father away. This puts her at no more than ~27 at the time of Rogue One, and possibly several years younger, depending on how many years after ROTS this scene is set. Rey is born 15 years after this movie.

Assuming that Rey does indeed discover who her family was and why they left her on Jakku, the revelation won't really mean much to the audience unless we've already met her parents. Trouble is, there are almost no eligible bachelors and bachelorettes who have been established in the films. The only named white male character of suitable age is Luke, and there are zero female candidates. So there's a problem here: the backstory of the series' newest main character puts a lot of focus on the mystery of her parentage, and we don't have a woman character who can fill the role of her mother.

This movie is an odd choice for your very first spin-off. So many of the other Anthology ideas�Han Solo movie, Boba Fett movie, possibly an Obi-Wan movie�seem like much safer starting points, because they've got an established character to anchor the story. Was anyone really hankering for a Death Star Plans movie? I do think there was some reason why the Story Group believed putting this film out first was important, and Jyn as Rey's mom would be a pretty strong one. If Rey is indeed Luke's daughter, we'd also have a good explanation for why that revelation was put off until Episode 8: this movie had to come out first so that we'd be familiar with both of her parents.

(Production Info) The idea for Rogue One seems to have been linked to Luke Skywalker from the beginning. The original working title for the movie was Red Five, which was Luke's old callsign. And it seems like Rogue One shows us the establishment of the original Rogue Squadron; Luke was the one who took over the squadron after ANH.

(Casting) The TFA producers made a pretty big deal out of the fact that they looked at a racially diverse selection of actors and actresses, particularly for the role of Rey. Aside from Daisy Ridley, the two other finalists were both mixed-race. (Jessica Henwick and Maisie Richardson-Sellers both ended up with cameos in the final film.) But in casting for Jyn, the producers haven't said a word about that. In fact, the finalists for the role had a lot in common: white, medium height, brown hair, brownish eyes. And Felicity Jones has more than a passing resemblance for Daisy Ridley. This choice was made well after Daisy was cast. Could be a coincidence, sure, but it's odd that all the finalists had a similar look if it wasn't done deliberately.

I suspect that Rey's mom is already dead by the time of TFA. Giving her the lead role in her own film is a neat way of setting up the character in her own right, independently from any relationship she may eventually have with Luke or Rey.

I could be wrong. Jyn might die at the end of Rogue One. But if Rey's mom is going to be established as a character in the movies, it's basically Jyn Erso or bust.

Interesting point regarding the casting. I like where this is headed even if it turns out to not be the case.

Jedi Knight Luigi fucked around with this message at 00:36 on Oct 14, 2016

# ? Oct 14, 2016 00:33

Captain Splendid: Jan 7, 2009; Qu'en pense Caffarelli?

Galaga Galaxian posted:

Not a mistake, those are cargo AT-ATs, called AT-ACTs.

And also partially invisible

# ? Oct 14, 2016 00:35

Galaga Galaxian: Apr 23, 2009; What a childish tactic!
Don't you think you should put more thought into your battleplan?!

Jedi Knight Luigi posted:

That looks exactly like the capital ship that docks with the space station at the beginning of KOTOR II

Its not exactly like it, but it is a homage to the Kotor hammerheads.

# ? Oct 14, 2016 00:40

teagone: Jun 10, 2003; That was pretty intense, huh?

I've watched the new Rogue One trailer a good number of times now, and all I'm wishing right now is that Mads is Jedi in a hiding. His hair and his all black getup on the dreary grassy world looks real good; the way he's all done up reminds of Phantom Menace Jedi concept art.

# ? Oct 14, 2016 02:19

Kly: Aug 8, 2003

Captain Splendid posted:

And also partially invisible

no cargo

# ? Oct 14, 2016 02:27

anglachel: May 28, 2012

Captain Splendid posted:

And also partially invisible

The sides are open, not invisible. Even normal AT-ATs were primarily troop transports and the sides opened.

I think the official reason why it's Walkers, is because on some planets the anti grav technology doesnt work, but walking pretty much always works. But the real reason is it looks cool as gently caress.

# ? Oct 14, 2016 02:55

homullus: Mar 27, 2009

The real reason is Star Wars fans are primarily interested in seeing more of the same Star Wars that they've already seen.

# ? Oct 14, 2016 03:07

teagone: Jun 10, 2003; That was pretty intense, huh?

homullus posted:

The real reason is Star Wars fans are primarily interested in seeing more of the same Star Wars that they've already seen.

I generally like more of the same things I enjoy.

# ? Oct 14, 2016 03:41

Serf: May 5, 2011

teagone posted:

I generally like more of the same things I enjoy.

Agreed. Which is why I love seeing new and different takes on Star Wars.

# ? Oct 14, 2016 03:48

Gonz: Dec 22, 2009; "Jesus, did I say that? Or just think it? Was I talking? Did they hear me?"

I will never tire of these Star Wars.

# ? Oct 14, 2016 03:56

Bongo Bill: Jan 17, 2012

Novelty and familiarity, are both good,.

# ? Oct 14, 2016 03:57

GORDON: Jan 1, 2006; by Fluffdaddy

homullus posted:

The real reason is Star Wars fans are primarily interested in seeing more of the same Star Wars that they've already seen.

I already had sex once, I'm good. Someone else can take a turn.

# ? Oct 14, 2016 04:05

GoldenGun: Oct 21, 2005; In heaven everything is fine

Barudak posted:

That momentary shot of a fallen Jedi statue has made me realize I want an Indiana jones movie but in the Star Wars universe.

# ? Oct 14, 2016 08:50

Crion: Sep 30, 2004; baseball.

MrBigglesworth posted:

My biggest issue with all of this...where the gently caress is Tarkin? He was on the bridge of one of the capital ships at the end of RotS overseeing the construction of the Death Star with Palps and Vader.....he is a huge part of ANH, where is he in R1????

Tarkin isn't front and center in Rogue One not just because Cushing is many years in his grave, but because Tarkin has to survive to reach A New Hope, and there needs to be some antagonist figure for our heroes to defeat (even if they all die in the process) in the actual narrative of this film. That looks to be Ben Mendelsohn's character, because they're doing the thing that's commonly done for projects like this where the real character drama is kind of coincidental to the top-line plot -- the trailer positions Rogue One as a movie about Jyn trying to resolve issues with her father and his (captor? murderer? who knows) that happens to have the Death Star plans as a backdrop/setting more than as like, a war movie re-enactment of sci-fi times in the trenches, though there will doubtlessly be aesthetic cues from there.

And it should do that, because we already know pretty much how the whole Death Star plans thing goes. Personally I hope most of the Imperial Generals from that first, doomed roundtable meeting in ANH show up in some form to grump. Might as well.

Crion fucked around with this message at 14:42 on Oct 14, 2016

# ? Oct 14, 2016 11:26

well why not: Feb 10, 2009

So Mads will be the Obi-Wan analog to Jyn's Luke. It really does rhyme a lot.

He's more like Obi Wan than I initially thought, an older european actor who is far, far too talented to be in these movies. I'm predicting he'll eat it as well.

# ? Oct 14, 2016 14:31

Crion: Sep 30, 2004; baseball.

We'll have to wait and see but I'd suspect he's more analogous to Ep IV Anakin Skywalker, when that was a distinct character from Darth Vader. Especially considering that Jyn Erso appears to be such a complement to Luke Skywalker that there's a good chance she'll end up sleeping with him. Either way you'd think from a marketing/strategic perspective the generational family drama will probably outweigh the horror of war themes such that most of the young folk end up walking away (comms guy/pilot, immediate love interest second-in-command, probably that droid since he's cool)

# ? Oct 14, 2016 14:37

euphronius: Feb 18, 2009

Rey is obviously Luke's daughter.

# ? Oct 14, 2016 14:46

Crion: Sep 30, 2004; baseball.

I'm not sure there's any answer to the parentage question that properly respects the amount of weight Episode VII put on 1) the importance of remembering one's past, figuratively and literally, and learning from it and 2) the importance of Rey's past specifically that isn't "child of Skywalker and Erso," to be honest. It means Luke's a lovely dad and mom's probably dead, but it is what it is. Every theory involving Snoke and Kenobi sounds precisely like what the reveal would be if this was being plotted by LOST writers more concerned about pulling one over on the audience than telling a coherent narrative.

You could go with "they're nobodies, haven't thought about them" but characters in Star Wars, Force-users especially, are constantly thinking about parents and parent figures. Fewer people would care too much about Rey's parentage if the main Jedi in the prequels wasn't defined by "I never had a dad, and chose my father figure very poorly," the main Jedi in OT wasn't defined by "I thought my dad was dead, but now I must stop/save him," and the other Jedi in EpVII wasn't defined by "gently caress my dad."

Crion fucked around with this message at 15:13 on Oct 14, 2016

# ? Oct 14, 2016 15:04

GORDON: Jan 1, 2006; by Fluffdaddy

I just watched the second R1 trailer once and now I am getting the vibe that the rebel girl is Tarkin's daughter.

# ? Oct 14, 2016 16:28

Filthy Casual: Aug 13, 2014

Crion posted:

2) the importance of Rey's past specifically that isn't "child of Skywalker and Erso," to be honest. It means Luke's a lovely dad and mom's probably dead, but it is what it is.

This is exactly why I'd prefer Rey not be Luke's daughter. I really liked that "Vergence of the Force" take, like what happened with Anakin. At least then when she's abandoned, Luke has the ironclad reason of "she should be as far away from the Jedi during her formative years as humanly possible".

# ? Oct 14, 2016 16:30

Zoran: Aug 19, 2008; I lost to you once, monster. I shall not lose again! Die now, that our future can live!

Luke didn't abandon her.

# ? Oct 14, 2016 16:38

temple: Jul 29, 2006; I have actual skeletons in my closet

Mysterious parentage is the last thing I want to see in another Star Wars film

# ? Oct 14, 2016 19:32

Ass Catchcum: Dec 21, 2008; I REALLY NEED TO SHUT THE FUCK UP FOREVER.

I'd love some sex scenes tbh

# ? Oct 14, 2016 19:34

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# ? May 14, 2024 21:39

Basebf555: Feb 29, 2008; The greatest sensual pleasure there is is to know the desires of another!; Fun Shoe

well why not posted:

So Mads will be the Obi-Wan analog to Jyn's Luke. It really does rhyme a lot.

He's more like Obi Wan than I initially thought, an older european actor who is far, far too talented to be in these movies. I'm predicting he'll eat it as well.

I'll reserve judgment but on the surface this seems like such a waste. A guy like Mads should be saved for a major role, not a one-off supporting character who's going to buy it after only a handful of scenes.

# ? Oct 14, 2016 19:43

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