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Excelsiortothemax posted:Ah yes, who could ever forget the poignant story arch of the Tale of Two Martha's? Rather than just make an empty, detached snark about it, what is your actual opinion on what Snyder was trying to do with the infamous Martha scene?
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Oct 15, 2016 06:44
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I agree, the Martha scene is poignant and good.
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Oct 15, 2016 06:45
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I legit enjoyed the Martha moment. So much so that I was super surprised at the memeification of it. In hindsight it's a tad clunky but overall works really well.
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Oct 15, 2016 06:52
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If that scene was funny, it's only because Affleck and Lane were lovers in Hollywoodland.
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Oct 15, 2016 07:00
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The MSJ posted:If that scene was funny, it's only because Affleck and Lane were lovers in Hollywoodland. Well that's great in its own way because you know Bruce is putting the movies on Martha at the wake.
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Oct 15, 2016 07:09
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LesterGroans posted:Well that's great in its own way because you know Bruce is putting the movies on Martha at the wake. #TeamPriDi #PrincessDiana #AmazonPower
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Oct 15, 2016 07:15
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Drifter posted:#TeamPriDi #PrincessDiana #AmazonPower Hey, I don't see a ring on anyone's fingers!
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Oct 15, 2016 07:57
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LesterGroans posted:Well that's great in its own way because you know Bruce is putting the movies on Martha at the wake. that is so Batman. He should do a cross over with Captain America, where they go to funerals like that bad Will Ferrel and Own Wilson movie Uncle Boogeyman posted:*watching 9/11 footage on TV, picks up telephone* 
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Oct 15, 2016 08:00
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Vintersorg posted:Snyder is so goddamn good. Holy gently caress Affleck looks awkward in those photos
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Oct 15, 2016 09:10
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LesterGroans posted:Every interview and behind the scenes shot of Affleck I've seen recently makes him look like he just red-eyed back from Vegas. That's because he probably literally is red-eyed back from Vegas.
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Oct 15, 2016 11:12
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Jason momoa terry crews the rock buddy movie. Give me money hollywood i will make you (and me) rich by way of fun loving muscle people movies.
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Oct 15, 2016 12:26
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Excelsiortothemax posted:Ah yes, who could ever forget the poignant story arch of the Tale of Two Martha's? It's pretty poignant that BvS is one of the few superhero movies that had mothers play a pivotal role instead of fathers. Also, do you still think natural lighting is a filter, y/n?
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Oct 15, 2016 13:41
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My understanding is that BvS is the first piece of superhero media that pointed out/did something with the fact that their moms shared a name period.
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Oct 15, 2016 13:45
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so do half of you guys not know that Zack Snyder isn't the cinematographer on any of his movies or what
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Oct 15, 2016 13:56
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Uncle Boogeyman posted:so do half of you guys not know that Zack Snyder isn't the cinematographer on any of his movies or what
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Oct 15, 2016 14:32
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JOHN SKELETON posted:Do you think the very similar look of all Zack Snyder films is just a pure coincidence and he has no input on how the movie visually looks? They don't all share a cinematographer. no, but everyone going "Zack Snyder is a great cinematographer" is no less stupid for it also - and this is coming from someone who doesn't even really like the guy - his movie's all have pretty distinct looks, actually. Dawn of the Dead looks very different from 300 looks very different from Watchmen. Hell, even Man of Steel and BvS have a pretty distinct look from each other. Uncle Boogeyman fucked around with this message at 14:43 on Oct 15, 2016 |
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Oct 15, 2016 14:36
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Equeen posted:It's pretty poignant that BvS is one of the few superhero movies that had mothers play a pivotal role instead of fathers. His DC films have also been pretty anti-fascist too. Might doesn't make right in Batman v Superman. In Man of Steel the collateral damage was a good way of showing what happens you use might to make right. To me, when I saw Civil War, I found it interesting that the film used parents to incite violence rather than to dispel it like in Batman v Superman. I liked that film quite a bit, but it was just fun to compare and contrast somewhat similar plot points and how each movie handled them.
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Oct 15, 2016 14:59
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JOHN SKELETON posted:Do you think the very similar look of all Zack Snyder films is just a pure coincidence and he has no input on how the movie visually looks? They don't all share a cinematographer. BvS looks nothing like Man of Steel which looks nothing like Dawn of the Dead. Larry Fong's cinematography is very distinctive, and the ones he did are the ones that look the most similar.
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Oct 15, 2016 15:04
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The Martha scene is weird to me because normally a person wouldn't say "they're going to kill Martha," he would say "my mom" or "my mother." Which might even have more of an influence on Batman than a name coincidence. It works fine as a story beat, but that part of the dialogue is odd. How is Batman supposed to know who that is, if Lois didn't run in at that exact moment?
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Oct 15, 2016 15:33
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Soggy Cereal posted:How is Batman supposed to know who that is, if Lois didn't run in at that exact moment? He's not, you can see him melting down over it.
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Oct 15, 2016 15:34
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Soggy Cereal posted:The Martha scene is weird to me because normally a person wouldn't say "they're going to kill Martha," he would say "my mom" or "my mother." Which might even have more of an influence on Batman than a name coincidence. It works fine as a story beat, but that part of the dialogue is odd. How is Batman supposed to know who that is, if Lois didn't run in at that exact moment?
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Oct 15, 2016 15:41
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Soggy Cereal posted:The Martha scene is weird to me because normally a person wouldn't say "they're going to kill Martha," he would say "my mom" or "my mother." Which might even have more of an influence on Batman than a name coincidence. It works fine as a story beat, but that part of the dialogue is odd. How is Batman supposed to know who that is, if Lois didn't run in at that exact moment? I think I said this before but it sort've would work if he was still trying to protect the fact that he had a human mother, and was saying something like "they've kidnapped Martha Kent and they're going to kill her!" But then as soon as you say "Kent" you've again lost the character beat of Batman hearing the name isolated. I still think it could've worked if Clark was so badly affected by the kryptonite that he was babbling feverishly. Like instead of a clearly stated "you're letting them kill Martha!" It was more like "they're...gonna kill....Mar..tha..." as he drifted in and out of consciousness. Maybe even muttered "Martha...Kent..." right before Lois came and said "Martha Kent is his mother". Anywho that's how I - a dude with no storytelling or movie making experience - would have directed that scene
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Oct 15, 2016 15:51
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cvnvcnv posted:By being a detective. I'll tell you this, Batman would have immediately shanked Superman if Supes started blubbering about his mama. I mean, I get it, a huge portion of the audience of this movie had no idea before watching that their own parents have names but the violent shock of that discovery should not lead you to want a movie where Superman cries about his ~mommy~ being in danger. What a rude thing to say to me. Are you saying that Batman should know who Martha Kent is? Because he clearly doesn't. Are you saying that Superman generally refers to his mother by her first name? This is the part that strikes me as odd. It's just a cultural thing, I guess. Why wouldn't you be upset about your mother being taken hostage by a psychopath that carves the word WITCH into her forehead and has a man ready to flamethrower her to death? Why is it more "blubbery" to call her your mother instead of using her first name like she's a friend of yours?
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Oct 15, 2016 16:02
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I think he's trying to get her name out because Batman already told him he doesn't care about his parents
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Oct 15, 2016 16:08
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Right. The parents of the alien that Batman hates are also aliens he'd surely hate. Let them kill his mother? Sounds like a plan!
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Oct 15, 2016 16:18
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Am I missing something? Did Superman know that Batman would have a strange reaction to that particular name? We know that after the fact as the audience, but why would Superman know that?
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Oct 15, 2016 16:42
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Soggy Cereal posted:Am I missing something? Did Superman know that Batman would have a strange reaction to that particular name? We know that after the fact as the audience, but why would Superman know that? The name itself was luck - WHAT A STRANGE CONFLUENCE OF EVENTS -, but Batman had already stated Superman's ALIEN PARENTS were probably useless pieces of poo poo like their son. Superman, in the middle of being murdered, decided that he wanted to get his mom out of danger. He was telling Batman to save this human lady named Martha. Lois just hammered it home that Superman had HUMAN PARENTS and was less of an alien than Batman was thinking previously.
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Oct 15, 2016 16:50
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Soggy Cereal posted:Am I missing something? Did Superman know that Batman would have a strange reaction to that particular name? We know that after the fact as the audience, but why would Superman know that? He knows Batman is Bruce Wayne and the Waynes' murder would be easy for someone with access to Wikipedia to find out, never mind a newspaper reporter.
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Oct 15, 2016 16:51
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The Martha scene is a big case of people missing the forest for the trees. It's a big Batman moment because he realizes that he's been turned into the very thing he hates, and that he's been a big fool. It's a great Superman scene because it displays the self sacrifice style of his nature. He's about to be murdered and he doesn't plead for his life but for his mother's.
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Oct 15, 2016 16:52
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It's just a weird thing to say no matter the thematics. No one calls their mom by their first name unless like, they really need to be specific. Which he didn't have to be at that time. Like you can assume all the little things like "Superman knew Batman wouldn't understand his mom isn't an Alien" but it's not explicitly clear. It's the same issue I have with Zod's death. I see him screaming at having to kill someone, where's other see it as him screaming because of the whole finale. Since there's no follow up it's just not that clear. You can assume all you want, but eh. For me, good storytelling just flat out doesn't work if big moments like that aren't crystal clear. It's a weird thing both these movies do, and I don't get it.
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Oct 15, 2016 16:58
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Superman was actually trying to say "Beat Up Martin"
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Oct 15, 2016 16:59
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Uncle Boogeyman posted:Superman was actually trying to say "Beat Up Martin" Nice.
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Oct 15, 2016 17:02
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CelticPredator posted:For me, good storytelling just flat out doesn't work if big moments like that aren't crystal clear. It's a weird thing both these movies do, and I don't get it. The scream works for me, but, yeah, as much as I adore Batman v Superman, it's hard for me to get inside Superman's head as to where that phrasing comes from. Detective No. 27 is right about why Batman reacts the way he does, and about how it reflects Superman putting his mother ahead of himself, but I just don't see how Superman gets to that line. Which is fine, that can happen with people, but this is the climax of a conflict that's been building up the entire movie.
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Oct 15, 2016 17:06
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:His last several director credits were: Guess that's why this is all a matter of opinion
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Oct 15, 2016 17:16
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Is saying "Martha?" clunkier than "mom?" Perhaps. But it's a memorable and provacative moment.
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Oct 15, 2016 17:18
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Detective No. 27 posted:Is saying "Martha?" clunkier than "mom?" Perhaps. But it's a memorable and provacative moment. Yep, it's clunky, memorable, and provocative.
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Oct 15, 2016 17:20
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Detective No. 27 posted:Is saying "Martha?" clunkier than "mom?" Perhaps. But it's a memorable and provacative moment. I don't agree.
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Oct 15, 2016 17:21
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The thing about 300 is that it is from the perspective of the honor guard of the King of the warmongering country who kills newborn children and looks down upon people who are different. It's why things are hyper exaggerated. It's propaganda to rally the troops before a major battle. If it didn't have that framing device the it would have been awful. It's not completely devoid of Miller's horrible worldviews, but it did go through the filter. It's the best effort of adapting something written by Frank Miller, who is as far-right as any nutjob can go.
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Oct 15, 2016 17:24
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Preferably you just burn the things Frank Miller writes, not frame them as propaganda so everything they promote is okay because hey you're totally Verhoeven maaaaaaaan I guess he's trying to adapt ayn rand though so
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Oct 15, 2016 17:27
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CelticPredator posted:I don't agree. Why not? The memeification of the scene, for better or for worse, put it in people's heads. The drive-by poo poo post that brought this current round of Martha discussion shows how to a large group of people, BvS is "a tale of two Marthas"
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Oct 15, 2016 17:28
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