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LibrarianCroaker
Mar 30, 2010
light is the stupid destiny name for gear score

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Queen_Combat
Jan 15, 2011

Nuebot posted:

Garbage that drags the game down

My point, friends.

Nuebot
Feb 18, 2013

The developer of Brigador is a secret chud, don't give him money

Lizard Wizard posted:

What the gently caress is light

It's basically gear score with a special name. Each piece of gear you have, has a light score. Your average light level determines how much damage you do against equal level enemies but not against lower level enemies because if you do low level content your poo poo gets scaled down. If enemies too strong for your light level and you do no damage too them. So if, for example, you have a 400 light (the current max) gun but the rest of your gear is only like, 100 or something then you won't be able to hurt anything stronger than you until you shoot some lower level guys and get better drops.

For some context about the Destiny thing as well, the light cap was upped with the expansion and the raid beaten like a week into the new expansion. Unless you nolifed it most people barely managed to get above 350 by the time the first clear went up. Yet people were demanding 370+. Raiding was the easiest way to get your light up until another event started because it was one of the few ways to get guaranteed upgrades.

Dewgy
Nov 10, 2005

~🚚special delivery~📦

Yardbomb posted:

To be honest so are they, people just pile on "MOBAs" because it's the easy/popular one to blame, but I'll be damned if I haven't also met plenty of nice and cool people I've stayed buddies with on them, compared to the jumble of Call of Duty's and Battlefields and Counter-Strikes I've also played where all I can remember for massive strings of time in most of them is just the absolutely miserable shitbag human beings I was around. All genres are filled with awful people that are gonna be assholes because internet anonymity, but they all have helpful and good communities in them as well if you just look.

I think the biggest problem with MOBAs is they seem to fall into the same trap of game design that CCGs do: Your skills in one don't really necessarily translate well to others, unless the skill you have in mind is "reading up on a bunch of esoteric rules".

They don't really have that "I'm decent at this and can bullshit my way through a few rounds" buffer like more action-ey games do like FPSes or fighters, which makes low level play a real crapshoot. You're either fumbling around with other newbies or getting stomped by someone who knows the ruleset better than you, and no amount of twitch skill can save you.

Owl Inspector
Sep 14, 2011

ShootaBoy posted:

That's the thing dragging games down for me these days, "competative gaming".

That poo poo ruins games. Because every Joe McFucknuts with a mouse thinks he can go "pro" it breeds this super toxic atmosphere of needing to always be 100% perfect and efficient. Then that trickles down the rest of the playerbase, until you're being called a stupid n***** in a training match against bots because you aren't flawlessly playing the char you've picked up for the first time ever.

You might enjoy the tales of hanjo.

Mazerunner
Apr 22, 2010

Good Hunter, what... what is this post?

Dewgy posted:

I think the biggest problem with MOBAs is they seem to fall into the same trap of game design that CCGs do: Your skills in one don't really necessarily translate well to others, unless the skill you have in mind is "reading up on a bunch of esoteric rules".

They don't really have that "I'm decent at this and can bullshit my way through a few rounds" buffer like more action-ey games do like FPSes or fighters, which makes low level play a real crapshoot. You're either fumbling around with other newbies or getting stomped by someone who knows the ruleset better than you, and no amount of twitch skill can save you.

That's probably true, but I'd say it's more that games are fairly lengthy (20min+, likely much longer) and they have a severe snowballing effect. Someone gets ahead- now they have gold and experience, so it's easier for them to get kills or farm, so they can help out their teammates get ahead, so the team can take objectives, and then win...

It can be very obvious who's going to win fairly early on but it still takes time to actually close out the game. If you're on the losing team it's mentally exhausting, knowing that you're almost certainly going to lose, and any chance of winning has to come from your team playing perfectly and the enemy team playing poorly and things dragging out to 40+ minutes until the strengths equalize.

It's also very easy for someone, for whatever reason- new player, or playing a new character, or having a bad day, or in a bad matchup, or whatever- to make a few mistakes that start the snowball and drag down the rest of their team down even if they're playing well.

People get very upset. But Mobas don't have in-game joining, so leavers have to be penalized pretty harshly, which means you can basically get stuck in a game with someone who's pissy about losing and may or may not just be trying to throw the game to get it over with faster and it really just feeds off of itself.

Overwatch has a bit of this too, where a team that's doing well will charge their ultimates faster, but not the anywhere near the same degree, and games are over in like 10 minutes, and unless you're doing competitive mode you can just leave if you're having a bad time or the rear end in a top hat can leave and be replaced or whatever.

Mazerunner has a new favorite as of 23:37 on Oct 23, 2016

Nuebot
Feb 18, 2013

The developer of Brigador is a secret chud, don't give him money

Mazerunner posted:

Overwatch has a bit of this too, where a team that's doing well will charge their ultimates faster, but games are over in like 10 minutes, and unless you're doing competitive mode you can just leave if you're having a bad time or the rear end in a top hat can leave and be replaced or whatever.

Ultimates like this in general seem kind of lovely for that very reason. Destiny PVP does it too. It charges constantly through the match, but kills give you a pretty huge boost. So if you're doing bad you'll only get off one per game but if you're doing good you might get two, or three. With the right builds there are people who can get off way more. So of course someone doing good enough to get an early super can use it to just obliterate any chance the losing team had of recovering. This is especially poo poo when supers vary from one guy being able to dash around instantly killing guys and refilling his health with every hit for a few seconds, or one guy being able to roam around like a jedi shooting lightning from his hands for half a minute. To one guy getting 3 instant kill shots that are super easy to see and avoid, and another guy being able to throw up a protective bubble that any other super can just instantly destroy, killing anyone inside of it because it explodes when it breaks.

Mazerunner
Apr 22, 2010

Good Hunter, what... what is this post?

Nuebot posted:

Ultimates like this in general seem kind of lovely for that very reason. Destiny PVP does it too. It charges constantly through the match, but kills give you a pretty huge boost. So if you're doing bad you'll only get off one per game but if you're doing good you might get two, or three. With the right builds there are people who can get off way more. So of course someone doing good enough to get an early super can use it to just obliterate any chance the losing team had of recovering. This is especially poo poo when supers vary from one guy being able to dash around instantly killing guys and refilling his health with every hit for a few seconds, or one guy being able to roam around like a jedi shooting lightning from his hands for half a minute. To one guy getting 3 instant kill shots that are super easy to see and avoid, and another guy being able to throw up a protective bubble that any other super can just instantly destroy, killing anyone inside of it because it explodes when it breaks.

Oh I know all about Destiny you don't gotta tell me. There's also the orbs of light, where getting kills with a super drops little bundles of energy that teammates can pick up to further charge their super. If you're coordinated you can just chain them repeatedly pretty much.

...

you're not quite right about the bubble though, it doesn't actually explode. It's just most supers capable of destroying it will leave an aoe or involve multiple explosions or can continue on. If you're smart you can use the bubble to bait out another super and peace out. Their super cancels yours but yours charges faster and you generated orbs for teammates (no orbs for them for destroying it).

RyokoTK
Feb 12, 2012

I am cool.

RareAcumen posted:

Overwatch's community is absolutely terrible and the only way to have a decent one is to completely remove everyone's ability to talk like Splatoon.

I don't know about Splatoon but people have found pretty effective ways of conveying their lovely sportsmanship and attitudes in Dark Souls just with gesture emotes.

Nuebot
Feb 18, 2013

The developer of Brigador is a secret chud, don't give him money

Mazerunner posted:

Oh I know all about Destiny you don't gotta tell me. There's also the orbs of light, where getting kills with a super drops little bundles of energy that teammates can pick up to further charge their super. If you're coordinated you can just chain them repeatedly pretty much.

...

you're not quite right about the bubble though, it doesn't actually explode. It's just most supers capable of destroying it will leave an aoe or involve multiple explosions or can continue on. If you're smart you can use the bubble to bait out another super and peace out. Their super cancels yours but yours charges faster and you generated orbs for teammates (no orbs for them for destroying it).

Oh, it doesn't? It always just seemed like it exploded. My bad then. Have you been playing the new expansion? Because they added an artifact that charges your teams super faster once yours is full. Last time I played PVP every game mode has basically just become mayhem with less grenades, not that many people use grenades anymore since they keep reducing the damage on them, and which ever team squats together the most gets faster supers and wins.

Action Tortoise
Feb 18, 2012

A wolf howls.
I know how he feels.

RareAcumen posted:

Overwatch's community is absolutely terrible and the only way to have a decent one is to completely remove everyone's ability to talk like Splatoon.

I don't think that's necessary.

splatoon doesn't have voice chat bc it's on a platform whose target demographic is intended to be much younger than its contemporaries. not having voice chat saves nintendo any heat they would get from parents complaining about all the new words their kids learned from online play.

dark souls and journey have coop play without dialogue to preserve that sense of isolation those games evoke while having players interacting online. you can still have insane and hilarious encounters in those games without uttering a word (someone on a computer please link the candlebutt ganksquad), but not hearing someone's goofy voice is enough to maintain some tonal consistency during online play.

competitive games are gonna need communication, and voice chat is the fastest way to inform your team while still playing. it sucks that trash people exist online, and you should report them not bc they hurt your feelings, but bc being trash online doesn't help your team and if you're one of those types, quit getting mad over video games.

also, games should automatically boot anyone who says "we need x!" and doesn't switch to that role within two minutes into spectator.

joshtothemaxx
Nov 17, 2008

I will have a whole army of zombies! A zombie Marine Corps, a zombie Navy Corps, zombie Space Cadets...
I play 2-3 competitive Overwatch games a night with my brother. Over half of them, we are teamed with some idiot coaching us on why we're all horrible players and people. We're about to give up on it, but it's still a polished and very fun game (sans the "community").

Tiggum
Oct 24, 2007

Your life and your quest end here.


ShootaBoy posted:

That's the thing dragging games down for me these days, "competative gaming".

That poo poo ruins games. Because every Joe McFucknuts with a mouse thinks he can go "pro" it breeds this super toxic atmosphere of needing to always be 100% perfect and efficient.
This always annoyed me when I used to play Magic: the Gathering on Magic Workstation. You'd end up starting a bunch of games against people who'd quit as soon as they saw that you were using anything that wasn't one of the current popular tournament strategies. And this would happen even if you put "casual" or "friendly game" or whatever in the game description.

Somfin
Oct 25, 2010

In my🦚 experience🛠️ the big things🌑 don't teach you anything🤷‍♀️.

Nap Ghost

spooky like this! posted:

It also means that everyone is expected to play the min/max "optimal" build because gently caress just having fun with a game.

One of the reasons I love Path of Exile so much is that the infinitely complex passive upgrade tree and impossibly-vast item pool mean that when you build a character you're actually encouraged to build your own personal character, rather than following guides (except, explicitly, as guidelines). There are entire endgame-viable builds based on loving around with the core concept behind a 'character' and using their position in the tree to create something truly special and unique, and the developers love throwing in strange little items that are kinda crap to most people but can fit odd builds perfectly- like Three Dragons, a helmet that swaps the effects of elemental attacks that you make (lightning freezes, fire shocks, ice burns). There's no min/maxing and very little criticism for not min/maxing, just 'you could probably change this and this if you want more X' advice.

One thing dragging it down is how hard it is to find poo poo you want in the tree and tag it as important, but that's just me whining.

Somfin has a new favorite as of 04:33 on Oct 24, 2016

princecoo
Sep 3, 2009

joshtothemaxx posted:

I play 2-3 competitive Overwatch games a night with my brother. Over half of them, we are teamed with some idiot coaching us on why we're all horrible players and people. We're about to give up on it, but it's still a polished and very fun game (sans the "community").

I've found the community to be alright - in Quick Play. In Competitive though, yeah there is ALWAYS at least one or two dudes who is a lovely loser or armchair general who demands everyone play whatever class he wants them to play.


I once had a guy cuss me out constantly back when the new character Ana dropped (a sniper character that has a sleep dart that instantly drops enemies for 5 seconds, a grenade that heals friendlies but damages enemies (and makes them unable to be healed by any sources for a period of time) and can shoot enemies to damage them or shoot friendlies to heal them). I chose Ana in competitive, and he lost his poo poo because I "needed to go a real healer" and everytime someone died or something "bad" happened, it was my fault because I wasn't a proper player.
We won, I got a card at the end of the match for most healing done and Play Of The Game, where it showed me killing 2 enemies, shutting down an enemy Ult and healing 4 team mates up to full health.

He quit next game. That was fun.

Nebrilos
Oct 9, 2012
Reposting this complaint from the FFXIV LP thread:

I played FFXIV until level 50 and beat the (level 50 spoilers)plot dungeon for that level but I just lost interest due to all of the fetch quests. I mean, sure, at level 4 they send you to pick some oranges, and I don't mind that, but at level 50 people are calling you the savior of Eorzia, and you still have to personally bring some lady's earrings to be repaired (and then do a favor for the goldsmith who repairs them). Can't they get someone else to do it? All of the content in Heavensward is gated behind these fetch quests.

I was interested in the crafting, but it seems like for all of the good gear you either have to grind specific raids or tomestones, so crafting is pointless. Apparently to get a fully leveled artifact weapon takes an entire month of grinding for 3 hours a day. Just for 1 weapon.

Also, they made the (level 50 spoilers)final confrontation with Ultima Weapon be an 8-person raid that is part of the random queue. The only way to experience the content is to queue for it and I ended up with a bunch of speedrunners collecting tomestones who dashed through it and mulched the bosses before I had even finished watching the cutscenes. Doesn't really make for a good climax to the story.

I really wanted to like this game, but I just couldn't.

Away all Goats
Jul 5, 2005

Goose's rebellion

princecoo posted:

I've found the community to be alright - in Quick Play. In Competitive though, yeah there is ALWAYS at least one or two dudes who is a lovely loser or armchair general who demands everyone play whatever class he wants them to play.


I once had a guy cuss me out constantly back when the new character Ana dropped (a sniper character that has a sleep dart that instantly drops enemies for 5 seconds, a grenade that heals friendlies but damages enemies (and makes them unable to be healed by any sources for a period of time) and can shoot enemies to damage them or shoot friendlies to heal them). I chose Ana in competitive, and he lost his poo poo because I "needed to go a real healer" and everytime someone died or something "bad" happened, it was my fault because I wasn't a proper player.
We won, I got a card at the end of the match for most healing done and Play Of The Game, where it showed me killing 2 enemies, shutting down an enemy Ult and healing 4 team mates up to full health.

He quit next game. That was fun.

That's even funnier now that Ana is considered one of the top 2 healers in the game and generally just one of the best characters in the game thanks to sleep dart and her ultimate.

Nuebot
Feb 18, 2013

The developer of Brigador is a secret chud, don't give him money

Nebrilos posted:

Reposting this complaint from the FFXIV LP thread:

I played FFXIV until level 50 and beat the (level 50 spoilers)plot dungeon for that level but I just lost interest due to all of the fetch quests. I mean, sure, at level 4 they send you to pick some oranges, and I don't mind that, but at level 50 people are calling you the savior of Eorzia, and you still have to personally bring some lady's earrings to be repaired (and then do a favor for the goldsmith who repairs them). Can't they get someone else to do it? All of the content in Heavensward is gated behind these fetch quests.

I was interested in the crafting, but it seems like for all of the good gear you either have to grind specific raids or tomestones, so crafting is pointless. Apparently to get a fully leveled artifact weapon takes an entire month of grinding for 3 hours a day. Just for 1 weapon.

Also, they made the (level 50 spoilers)final confrontation with Ultima Weapon be an 8-person raid that is part of the random queue. The only way to experience the content is to queue for it and I ended up with a bunch of speedrunners collecting tomestones who dashed through it and mulched the bosses before I had even finished watching the cutscenes. Doesn't really make for a good climax to the story.

I really wanted to like this game, but I just couldn't.

Basically every plot dungeon is full of rushing like that, too. You're really not missing much story-wise. Elf boy is the worst character and even if I don't play the game anymore I hope he dies. I have a friend who still plays and every update I ask him if that guy is dead yet because holy poo poo, he is single handedly responsible for every piece of poo poo thing you have to do in that game. Oh, you have a clear objective? Noooope time to go in a really roundabout direction and do a million fetch quests instead because elf guy says so, only for it all to inevitably backfire and its back to plan a.

EDIT: Seriously, canonically your character single handedly kicks ultima weapon's rear end. The game even acknowledges how useless everyone is and that your character is the only one badass enough to murder gods. But then you just can't get on with the god killing, you have to do dumb poo poo instead.

Nuebot has a new favorite as of 06:47 on Oct 24, 2016

RareAcumen
Dec 28, 2012




Action Tortoise posted:

I don't think that's necessary.

splatoon doesn't have voice chat bc it's on a platform whose target demographic is intended to be much younger than its contemporaries. not having voice chat saves nintendo any heat they would get from parents complaining about all the new words their kids learned from online play.

dark souls and journey have coop play without dialogue to preserve that sense of isolation those games evoke while having players interacting online. you can still have insane and hilarious encounters in those games without uttering a word (someone on a computer please link the candlebutt ganksquad), but not hearing someone's goofy voice is enough to maintain some tonal consistency during online play.

competitive games are gonna need communication, and voice chat is the fastest way to inform your team while still playing. it sucks that trash people exist online, and you should report them not bc they hurt your feelings, but bc being trash online doesn't help your team and if you're one of those types, quit getting mad over video games.

also, games should automatically boot anyone who says "we need x!" and doesn't switch to that role within two minutes into spectator.

My post was generic and it'll be recycled for the next time a multiplayer gsme releases and is popular.

Cleretic
Feb 3, 2010
Probation
Can't post for 4 days!

Nuebot posted:

Basically every plot dungeon is full of rushing like that, too. You're really not missing much story-wise. Elf boy is the worst character and even if I don't play the game anymore I hope he dies. I have a friend who still plays and every update I ask him if that guy is dead yet because holy poo poo, he is single handedly responsible for every piece of poo poo thing you have to do in that game. Oh, you have a clear objective? Noooope time to go in a really roundabout direction and do a million fetch quests instead because elf guy says so, only for it all to inevitably backfire and its back to plan a.

I think every dungeon is like that. I did my first Duty yesterday, and I didn't have nearly the time I'd need to even read the tutorial messages about Duties they give you. I just had to sort of guess what was going on and shoot fireballs until I was given enough time to read even one tutorial message.

I was not given enough time to read one tutorial message.

Cleretic has a new favorite as of 07:31 on Oct 24, 2016

spit on my clit
Jul 19, 2015

by Cyrano4747
dying light: the following


fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck the buggy, gently caress the giant, empty farmstead wasteland, gently caress the buggy crafting poo poo, gently caress the plot twist, gently caress the ending..volatile caves were cool, though

MiddleOne
Feb 17, 2011

Literally 2 seconds into playing GTA online a kid yelled into the voicechat only to be immediately chastised by an equally annoying teenager. It's like CS 1.6 never died. 10/10 Rockstar, would disable voice chat again.

Nuebot
Feb 18, 2013

The developer of Brigador is a secret chud, don't give him money

MiddleOne posted:

Literally 2 seconds into playing GTA online a kid yelled into the voicechat only to be immediately chastised by an equally annoying teenager. It's like CS 1.6 never died. 10/10 Rockstar, would disable voice chat again.

First time I played it three different people were singing three different songs and one kid was just screaming friend of the family non-stop until I finally just muted the voice chat. It was pretty early on in GTAOnline though so it was pretty much only to be expected.

Cleretic posted:

I think every dungeon is like that. I did my first Duty yesterday, and I didn't have nearly the time I'd need to even read the tutorial messages about Duties they give you. I just had to sort of guess what was going on and shoot fireballs until I was given enough time to read even one tutorial message.

I was not given enough time to read one tutorial message.

Yeah, true enough. Tanks in FFXIV love to just rush and pull loving everything because a well geared tank in that game is tank, dps and healer in one god damned go. But a poorly geared one is beyond poo poo, will die instantly and will usually then call a vote kick for the healer.

Perestroika
Apr 8, 2010

Tiggum posted:

This always annoyed me when I used to play Magic: the Gathering on Magic Workstation. You'd end up starting a bunch of games against people who'd quit as soon as they saw that you were using anything that wasn't one of the current popular tournament strategies. And this would happen even if you put "casual" or "friendly game" or whatever in the game description.

Probably the weirdest outgrowth of this I have seen was in Gunz: The Duel. Gunz was a free-to-play third person shooter that was popular perhaps ten years ago. It really wasn't very good, but it had guns and swords and wallruns, and most importantly was free to play, so there I was.

Anyway, most of the "competitive" high-level play revolved around breaking the poo poo out of the game's engine any way you could. The most popular way of this was "butterflying", which basically involved doing a jump, airdash, attack and block with your sword all at once. In practice this meant you could move around at a pretty high speed while attacking and defending at the same time (blocking with a sword also blocked bullets). Two people going up against each other this way would just be jumping around each other in circles forever, hoping to hit the other during the small window in which they were not blocking and thus vulnerable.

I took one look at that and basically decided to gently caress all that, because doing that poo poo would probably give you hand cramps three minutes in. Instead I just stuck to using guns and learning how to shoot when the butterflyers were vulnerable. You would not believe how mad some people got about that. Shooting people was the lamest poo poo, and literally destroying the game forever. Apparently there was even some schism in the community about that, but I never got all to deep into that. :allears:

tl;dr: People got mad when I shot people with guns, in a game called Gunz.

The Lone Badger
Sep 24, 2007

Perestroika posted:

You would not believe how mad some people got about that. Shooting people was the lamest poo poo, and literally destroying the game forever. Apparently there was even some schism in the community about that, but I never got all to deep into that. :allears:


I want to hear more of this. Please tell me you have some logs saved or something.

bawk
Mar 31, 2013

I played the same game for a while, and it was really astounding. When they say Butterflying made you incredibly fast and mobile, it doesn't touch on the fact that you can jump off of any wall, like a bastardized wall-jump. Any wall, any geometry. You basically bounce from wall-to-wall and can block mostly anything with the right timing. The "dueling" portion of it was heavily rooted in the same e-bushido as Dark Souls, where there are implied rules (in Dark Souls: bow before a duel, if your opponent buffs it means you can use your buffs, no healing during the fight) and breaking these rules by shooting your guns or otherwise NOT doing the stupid butterfly style would result in you being killed by players abusing even more glitches from the "K-Style" (korean style) of play, which is full of more move-cancels than a loving Platinum Game.

Butterfly was basically jumping in a stupid circle that let you clown on new players by being impossible to hit and impossible to dodge, unless they also knew how to use move-cancels to get away/kill you, or they just mag-dumped into you past your stupid combo poo poo. Some really, really good players could do more complex poo poo that made them even harder to hit and frustrating to try and mag-dump into because it took a lot of loving bullets to get past their stupid guards. This is just if they were Butterfly Dueling, sometimes you'd just get an rear end in a top hat abusing invincibility and delays being cancelled by dashing around/using multiple weapons of the same type to constantly fire on you. They could shoot one, shotgun switch, shoot the other, switch, shoot the first, switch back, and shoot the second again faster than you could shoot your whole magazine with a rifle/dual pistols, and shotguns did way more damage and it was way easier for someone experienced to do this while constantly dashing around you to kill you.

Of course, any Butterfly Duel could be immediately and easily hosed with by using a rocket launcher. Rocket launchers were fun :getin:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ppSU5xeEMdU

just look at this poo poo

bawk has a new favorite as of 11:15 on Oct 24, 2016

Judge Tesla
Oct 29, 2011

:frogsiren:

spit on my clit posted:

dying light: the following


fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck the buggy, gently caress the giant, empty farmstead wasteland, gently caress the buggy crafting poo poo, gently caress the plot twist, gently caress the ending..volatile caves were cool, though

I liked it, my only real complaint are the stealth Demoilishers who only show up when you are looting cars and always from behind you, I'm not overly fond of the Armoured Volatiles either, those guys didn't need to get tougher.

muscles like this!
Jan 17, 2005


My problem with The Following was how after a couple of levels the car became extremely difficult to level up. Unless you were grinding through zombie groups your regular driving doesn't give you enough XP.

Davoren
Aug 14, 2003

The devil you say!

thecluckmeme posted:

I played the same game for a while, and it was really astounding. When they say Butterflying made you incredibly fast and mobile, it doesn't touch on the fact that you can jump off of any wall, like a bastardized wall-jump. Any wall, any geometry. You basically bounce from wall-to-wall and can block mostly anything with the right timing. The "dueling" portion of it was heavily rooted in the same e-bushido as Dark Souls, where there are implied rules (in Dark Souls: bow before a duel, if your opponent buffs it means you can use your buffs, no healing during the fight) and breaking these rules by shooting your guns or otherwise NOT doing the stupid butterfly style would result in you being killed by players abusing even more glitches from the "K-Style" (korean style) of play, which is full of more move-cancels than a loving Platinum Game.

Butterfly was basically jumping in a stupid circle that let you clown on new players by being impossible to hit and impossible to dodge, unless they also knew how to use move-cancels to get away/kill you, or they just mag-dumped into you past your stupid combo poo poo. Some really, really good players could do more complex poo poo that made them even harder to hit and frustrating to try and mag-dump into because it took a lot of loving bullets to get past their stupid guards. This is just if they were Butterfly Dueling, sometimes you'd just get an rear end in a top hat abusing invincibility and delays being cancelled by dashing around/using multiple weapons of the same type to constantly fire on you. They could shoot one, shotgun switch, shoot the other, switch, shoot the first, switch back, and shoot the second again faster than you could shoot your whole magazine with a rifle/dual pistols, and shotguns did way more damage and it was way easier for someone experienced to do this while constantly dashing around you to kill you.

Of course, any Butterfly Duel could be immediately and easily hosed with by using a rocket launcher. Rocket launchers were fun :getin:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ppSU5xeEMdU

just look at this poo poo

Man, whatever happened to having a good time playing fairly?

A Festivus Miracle
Dec 19, 2012

I have come to discourse on the profound inequities of the American political system.

Davoren posted:

Man, whatever happened to having a good time playing fairly?

The good will spirit of online vidya gaming with people from all-over the world was dead after the first ten minutes of Quakeworld. While I was annoying the gently caress out of my parents with loud noises and playing with my own poo poo, nerds were getting gettin' mad at other nerds.

The Mighty Moltres
Dec 21, 2012

Come! We must fly!


Pharaoh

It's an ancient Egyptian city-building sim that came out in 1999. I got it when it I was 11, and still play it to this day. It's cool.
The thing that always bothered me about it, though, is how terrible the firefighters are. You can have far more firehouses in a given area than you really should need, yet things will still catch on fire. (When a firefighter walks by a structure, he reduces the chance of it going up in flames. They all seem to take similar paths eventually though, leaving parts of the city vulnerable.)
Then, a lot of the time when there's a fire, the firefighters nearby won't respond to it. They just take their buckets and casually walk back to the station, as more and more buildings are engulfed.
What's even worse is that your water carriers are walking right by these burning ruins, not even thinking of helping. Like come on man, no one is thirsty in this city, at least try to snuff some of those embers!

MiddleOne
Feb 17, 2011

yo rear end is grass posted:

Pharaoh

It's an ancient Egyptian city-building sim that came out in 1999. I got it when it I was 11, and still play it to this day. It's cool.
The thing that always bothered me about it, though, is how terrible the firefighters are. You can have far more firehouses in a given area than you really should need, yet things will still catch on fire. (When a firefighter walks by a structure, he reduces the chance of it going up in flames. They all seem to take similar paths eventually though, leaving parts of the city vulnerable.)
Then, a lot of the time when there's a fire, the firefighters nearby won't respond to it. They just take their buckets and casually walk back to the station, as more and more buildings are engulfed.
What's even worse is that your water carriers are walking right by these burning ruins, not even thinking of helping. Like come on man, no one is thirsty in this city, at least try to snuff some of those embers!

Haha oh lord, you're playing these games like I did when I was a kid.

Both in Pharaoh, Ceasar 3 and Zeus there are solutions to this but it's kinda counterintuitive to figure out on your own as walker logic is chance based. Every time walkers reach a crossing they make a roll on which path to pick. This means that routes become immensely different and unreliable in just 2 crossings. What you actually have to do to control this is to wall of your cities into small condensed service neighborhoods using the roadblocks. (or gatehouses in Ceasar 3) These neighborhoods should have one perfectly circling route that leads back to its beginning with no crossings. This way you can have the walkers walk the same route a 100% of the time.

DoubleNegative
Jan 27, 2010

The most virtuous child in the entire world.

MiddleOne posted:

Haha oh lord, you're playing these games like I did when I was a kid.

Both in Pharaoh, Ceasar 3 and Zeus there are solutions to this but it's kinda counterintuitive to figure out on your own as walker logic is chance based. Every time walkers reach a crossing they make a roll on which path to pick. This means that routes become immensely different and unreliable in just 2 crossings. What you actually have to do to control this is to wall of your cities into small condensed service neighborhoods using the roadblocks. (or gatehouses in Ceasar 3) These neighborhoods should have one perfectly circling route that leads back to its beginning with no crossings. This way you can have the walkers walk the same route a 100% of the time.

Basically this, yeah. The old Impressions city building games are all puzzle games, where the puzzle is always "How do you build neighborhoods without any intersections?" The first few levels are always a pain for that very reason, because you can't stop your walkers from going to the far end of the Kingdom Road if they so choose.

For content, I want to complain about the same games. The fact that they had to have a shoehorned in military mechanic is annoying. Nobody is going to look at Caesar or Pharaoh and go "I'd totally play this but where's the army management?" I'd rather just build cool looking Egyptian cities without having to worry about being raided by assholes. :sigh:

Guy Mann
Mar 28, 2016

by Lowtax
Collecting artifacts for the museum in Stardew Valley has become absolute tedium in the endgame due to the fact that some artifacts can only be acquired by fishing and how bad the drop rates from fishing are: When you fish you have a 15% chance of a treasure chest appearing, and when you get a treasure chest there is a 0.16%-0.18% chance that it will contain an artifact. You can equip items to make treasure chests appear more frequently but since you still have to catch the fish it doesn't do you much good since these items replace bait that makes fish bite more quickly and lures that make them easier to catch so you just wind up taking longer anywaus. Also there's a skill that gives you an additional 15% chance to get a chest when fishing, but if you don't know about it far ahead of time then you can pick the wrong upgrade path and miss it and the game doesn't let you re-spec.

The game is usually pretty good about giving you multiple avenues to collect items and complete goals but that one fishing-exclusive artifact is sitting there, taunting me.

Terminally Bored
Oct 31, 2011

Twenty-five dollars and a six pack to my name
Playing through Zelda series for the first time:

- LTTP was really fun. Beat it, liked it, will probably go back to find secrets and easter eggs. Hit detection was really unreliable though and I don't know if it's because of the 3DS VC or was like that in the original. I'd make the music loops a little longer (especially the dungeon themes) but the game is about 1 megabyte so that's pretty remarkable.

- Link's Awakening. Awesome music, liked how weird the whole game is but it's really goddamn tedious to constantly change equipment. Also Wow! This looks really heavy! You won't be able to lift it with just your bare hands Wow! This looks really heavy! You won't be able to lift it with just your bare hands Wow! This looks really heavy! You won't be able to lift it with just your bare hands Wow! This looks really heavy! You won't be able to lift it with just your bare hands Wow! This looks really heavy! You won't be able to lift it with just your bare hands Wow! This looks really heavy! You won't be able to lift it with just your bare hands Wow! This looks really heavy! You won't be able to lift it with just your bare hands
Stopped playing at the third dungeon. Will go back someday because the soundtrack owns.

- Ocarina of Time remake: lock-on doesn't work sometimes. I know this was one of the first games to use it but still, the combat seems to be the least fun thing in all four Zelda games I played (didn't bother with Links Adventure). Also, what's up with the loving names in those games? Dodongos, Bongo Bongo, goddamn bats are called kees or something. And everyone on the Internet only uses the in-game names for some reason, it makes walkthroughs incomprehensible, especially where you have to kill monsters in the right order to open the next room. Also the graphics aged pretty bad. Good pixel art is good forever but even the best of the early 3D visuals look poo poo now. It doesn't help that some of the textures in the remake are vomit inducing, like that level inside the sea monster. The dungeons are also nothing interesting compared to LTTP ones.

I'll probably start Majora's Mask before finishing Ocarina because I read that it's more sidequest oriented and there are less dungeons there.

John Murdoch
May 19, 2009

I can tune a fish.

princecoo posted:

I've found the community to be alright - in Quick Play. In Competitive though, yeah there is ALWAYS at least one or two dudes who is a lovely loser or armchair general who demands everyone play whatever class he wants them to play.

While I was already arriving at the conclusion that I wasn't going to buy Overwatch as I played it during one night of the beta (because I'm a self-destructive idiot who would absolutely get sucked into long marathon sessions and inevitably turn into That Guy), what helped seal the deal was a dude going into meltdown mode because I had the gall to try out Hanzo for a little while. I think he was still ranting about how worthless of a player I was an entire game later, and by that point I was playing McCree and helped win the game with a four man ult, which was unsurprisingly PotG. That felt satisfying at least.


As for a complaint of my own, I've got started on Prototype 2 and man is the writing...something. The main character's blunt directness is amusing enough (even if it clashes with the sneaky stealth approach I like using), but everything else... I mean, the first game wasn't Shakespeare, but it at least made an attempt at being grounded and that helped sell the horror aspects of the story. Here, literally all pretense is dead and buried and you have soldiers who just want to murder people for fun, scientists who want to experiment on innocent people for fun, and both of those groups hate each other because they're literally painted as dude bro jocks and nerds respectively. :rolleyes: Maybe I'm just not in the mood for dumb, campy schlock at the moment, but it doesn't help that the game tries to quickly give the protagonist some cheap pathos (I don't even have to say how, if you're familiar with video games you know exactly how) and is now setting up some elaborate conspiracy plot with Alex Mercer and it all comes off as discordant.

Action Tortoise
Feb 18, 2012

A wolf howls.
I know how he feels.

Guy Mann posted:

Stardew Valley

I fell off this just before my 2 years were up. is it worth it to clear the desert dungeon? it takes up so much time in my day and I've yet to fully clear my community board.

also I've been wanting to get back into multiplayer shooters. I've been thinking overwatch bc it reminds me so much of tf2. is the community that poo poo if I just wanna do quickplays? and will I need a headset if I wanna just be extremely casual? are there voice commands I can use for general purposes like in tf2? I know I made a carepost about voice chat but I've always been quick on typing to alert my team.

MiddleOne
Feb 17, 2011

DoubleNegative posted:

Basically this, yeah. The old Impressions city building games are all puzzle games, where the puzzle is always "How do you build neighborhoods without any intersections?" The first few levels are always a pain for that very reason, because you can't stop your walkers from going to the far end of the Kingdom Road if they so choose.

For content, I want to complain about the same games. The fact that they had to have a shoehorned in military mechanic is annoying. Nobody is going to look at Caesar or Pharaoh and go "I'd totally play this but where's the army management?" I'd rather just build cool looking Egyptian cities without having to worry about being raided by assholes. :sigh:

In Zeus the combat is kinda minimalist so at least they were learning. It has other problems in that regard though.

Inexplicable Humblebrag
Sep 20, 2003

Action Tortoise posted:

I fell off this just before my 2 years were up. is it worth it to clear the desert dungeon? it takes up so much time in my day and I've yet to fully clear my community board.

the skull cave has infinite floors

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Away all Goats
Jul 5, 2005

Goose's rebellion

DoubleNegative posted:

For content, I want to complain about the same games. The fact that they had to have a shoehorned in military mechanic is annoying. Nobody is going to look at Caesar or Pharaoh and go "I'd totally play this but where's the army management?" I'd rather just build cool looking Egyptian cities without having to worry about being raided by assholes. :sigh:

Have you tried Children of the Nile? It's probably one of my favorite city sim games of all time. There is some light military stuff but it varies depending on the scenario. Some are literally just chill, build your city and giant pyramids/statues

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