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Sit on my Jace
Sep 9, 2016

It's nice that it can let you dig for answers, since if Opponent A is up to something that threatens to run away with the game and there's something in your top ten that stops it, Opponent B can give it to you.

EDIT: Now check out this pile!

Sit on my Jace fucked around with this message at 06:06 on Oct 27, 2016

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Count Bleck
Apr 5, 2010

DISPEL MAGIC!

Anil Dasharez0ne posted:

It's nice that it can let you dig for answers, since if Opponent A is up to something that threatens to run away with the game and there's something in your top ten that stops it, Opponent B can give it to you.

EDIT: Now check out this pile!



Oh, baby.

Veyrall
Apr 23, 2010

The greatest poet this
side of the cyberpocalypse
I think that's about the ceiling for how good a coin flip card can be without having the text "You win the game" somewhere on it.

Granted, I still wouldn't run it, but I'm certain someone out there is losing their mind over it right now.

Archenteron
Nov 3, 2006

:marc:
Motherfucker why didn't we get Krark as a new legend for the chaos deck

Jen X
Sep 29, 2014

To bring light to the darkness, whether that darkness be ignorance, injustice, apathy, or stagnation.
i'll probably run that in my esper gently caress all y'all deck

ZeroCount
Aug 12, 2013


Archenteron posted:

Motherfucker why didn't we get Krark as a new legend for the chaos deck

We still haven't seen the chaos 4c commander yet have we?

Star Man
Jun 1, 2008

There's a star maaaaaan
Over the rainbow
The only good chaos EDH player is a dead one. Kill them all on sight.

Sigma-X
Jun 17, 2005

Mischalaniouse posted:

please explain more about how acknowledging gays or trans people existing is "shoving it in your face"

Pretty sure I already explained why it was badly written but I think making characters whose principal character trait is being that minority instead of having it be a facet of their character is poo poo writing, I have nothing against "acknowledging them", so climb on down from that high horse. When you make the entirety of their character about their minority struggles instead of them being characters who are minorities its patronizing or poo poo writing, and these dudes do a much better job of being folks who are both gay and heroes.

Making "this guy is the powerful wizard" and "this guy is the gay one" instead of "this guy is the powerful wizard and also likes dudes" is hacky.

Rinkles
Oct 24, 2010

What I'm getting at is...
Do you feel the same way?


Thrasios, Triton Hero
GU
Legendary Creature - Merfolk
4: Scry 1, then reveal the top card of your library. If it's a land card, put it onto the battlefield tapped. Otherwise, draw a card.

Partner (You can have two commanders if both have partner.)


Alris
Apr 20, 2007

Welcome to the Fantasy Zone!

Get ready!

A Good Card.

Minority Deport
Mar 28, 2010

I love the art, I love the ability, I love the flavor text. Wayne Reynolds also did that incredible Goblin Sharpshooter reprint, so I guess he's their go-to for really wacky goblins now :allears:

mfcrocker
Jan 31, 2004



Hot Rope Guy

Sigma-X posted:

Pretty sure I already explained why it was badly written but I think making characters whose principal character trait is being that minority instead of having it be a facet of their character is poo poo writing, I have nothing against "acknowledging them", so climb on down from that high horse. When you make the entirety of their character about their minority struggles instead of them being characters who are minorities its patronizing or poo poo writing, and these dudes do a much better job of being folks who are both gay and heroes.

Making "this guy is the powerful wizard" and "this guy is the gay one" instead of "this guy is the powerful wizard and also likes dudes" is hacky.

At the same time, the trans MTG friends I have really liked Alesha so maybe it's just fine? :shobon:

I get that it's lazy as gently caress but it was so, so much better than gently caress all

Kurtofan
Feb 16, 2011

hon hon hon
It sucks that most legends are from theros and tarkir, should have tried to have more variety

Mischalaniouse
Nov 7, 2009

*ribbit*
They could draw from the other big legend set, Kamigawa, but market research says it doesn't test well.

Sigma-X
Jun 17, 2005

mfcrocker posted:

At the same time, the trans MTG friends I have really liked Alesha so maybe it's just fine? :shobon:

I get that it's lazy as gently caress but it was so, so much better than gently caress all

Sure, I agree. There's folks that unironically really like Jace, too, I get that basic / unidimensional mass market characters have appeal and I'd rather have Alesha than not. It's just fine, this magical writing is not endangering people or whatever. It's just poorly excuted and I don't think WotC deserves a pass from criticism just because there's a touchy subject in a particular story. This thread puts their bad writing on blast every week that Jace/Chandra/etc are written badly, and I don't think if they meet Queerio the rectomancer next week that they suddenly get a pass on that story.

I wish it was possible to be critical of some creative endeavor on SA (in this case, praising a better execution, even) without someone trying to loving crucify you for hating the gays / trans / whatever minority was poorly portrayed in the hack art you're criticizing. The actual gay, trans, latina, whatever folks I know in real life are actual, whole people with life goals that aren't Fight Social Perceptions but rather Write a Book, Make A Game, Own A Business, and it bugs me that we're still in gently caress-around MINORITY PROBLEMS 101 land and we have to lavish praise on whatever turd they fart out just because they made this particular shitwizard The "X" One. Especially with a fantasy setting where you can actually portray a post-hatred world and normalize that behavior, at least in some of the goddamn planes, of which there are so loving many. Alesha's story is basically commercialized virtue signaling rather than actual acceptance. I assume it comes out of good-intentioned naivety rather than a cold-hearted market manipulation but it's still everyone's right to demand better.

Which is why I really like Theros dudes because they're clearly huge proud heroes and their being a gay interracial couple has nothing to do with their heroic story in the slightest and in fact it's made clear that the people don't have a problem with that and rallied under their heroism, and that was my original point. More of that, please.

Mischalaniouse
Nov 7, 2009

*ribbit*

Sigma-X posted:

Sure, I agree. There's folks that unironically really like Jace, too, I get that basic / unidimensional mass market characters have appeal and I'd rather have Alesha than not. It's just fine, this magical writing is not endangering people or whatever. It's just poorly excuted and I don't think WotC deserves a pass from criticism just because there's a touchy subject in a particular story. This thread puts their bad writing on blast every week that Jace/Chandra/etc are written badly, and I don't think if they meet Queerio the rectomancer next week that they suddenly get a pass on that story.

I wish it was possible to be critical of some creative endeavor on SA (in this case, praising a better execution, even) without someone trying to loving crucify you for hating the gays / trans / whatever minority was poorly portrayed in the hack art you're criticizing. The actual gay, trans, latina, whatever folks I know in real life are actual, whole people with life goals that aren't Fight Social Perceptions but rather Write a Book, Make A Game, Own A Business, and it bugs me that we're still in gently caress-around MINORITY PROBLEMS 101 land and we have to lavish praise on whatever turd they fart out just because they made this particular shitwizard The "X" One. Especially with a fantasy setting where you can actually portray a post-hatred world and normalize that behavior, at least in some of the goddamn planes, of which there are so loving many. Alesha's story is basically commercialized virtue signaling rather than actual acceptance. I assume it comes out of good-intentioned naivety rather than a cold-hearted market manipulation but it's still everyone's right to demand better.

Which is why I really like Theros dudes because they're clearly huge proud heroes and their being a gay interracial couple has nothing to do with their heroic story in the slightest and in fact it's made clear that the people don't have a problem with that and rallied under their heroism, and that was my original point. More of that, please.

:allears:

Tell me more about how reasonable you are being in this discussion. I'm. All. Ears.

Lottery of Babylon
Apr 25, 2012

STRAIGHT TROPIN'

Sigma-X posted:

rectomancer

I was wondering where Butt Wizard ended up.

rabidsquid
Oct 11, 2004

LOVES THE KOG


oh no, these new magic characters dont have the character depth of, uh

Hellsau
Jan 14, 2010

NEVER FUCKING TAKE A NIGHT OFF CLAN WARS.

Sigma-X posted:

Queerio the rectomancer

His catchphrase is, obviously, "get rect."

rabidsquid
Oct 11, 2004

LOVES THE KOG


rabidsquid posted:

oh no, these new magic characters dont have the character depth of, uh

the straight white males!! all quite well written.

mcmagic
Jul 1, 2004

If you see this avatar while scrolling the succ zone, you have been visited by the mcmagic of shitty lib takes! Good luck and prosperity will come to you, but only if you reply "shut the fuck up mcmagic" to this post!

Chuckling to myself thinking of playing this in legacy.

Entropic
Feb 21, 2007

patriarchy sucks

mcmagic posted:

Chuckling to myself thinking of playing this in legacy.

I think the best thing you can say about it in 2-player is that it's better than Dubious Challenge.

mcmagic
Jul 1, 2004

If you see this avatar while scrolling the succ zone, you have been visited by the mcmagic of shitty lib takes! Good luck and prosperity will come to you, but only if you reply "shut the fuck up mcmagic" to this post!

Entropic posted:

I think the best thing you can say about it in 2-player is that it's better than Dubious Challenge.

IDK Challenge might be good in some sort of Evles deck?

Elyv
Jun 14, 2013



The idea I've heard with Challenge is to Congregation at Dawn Flickerwisp and Emrakul to the top of your deck, then cast Challenge. It's a dubious plan, though.

Entropic
Feb 21, 2007

patriarchy sucks

mcmagic posted:

IDK Challenge might be good in some sort of Evles deck?

Pay four mana to get another Llanowar Eld and give your opponent a Craterhoof or whatever?

We went over this when the card was spoiled, it's bad.

The best anyone could come up with was to flip, like, some giant bomb and something that kills it. You'd have to make sure both cards were in your top 10 first though. In which case, congrats? You spent a bunch of time and effort getting an awkward 4-mana Ashen Rider without the ETB trigger.

Silver2195
Apr 4, 2012
SaffronOlive had an interesting Against the Odds deck with Dubious Challenge, using cards like Glimmerpoint Stag and Brooding Saurian to get back stuff like Emrakul from you opponent. It didn't do particularly well, even for Against the Odds, but to some extent it seemed like bad luck.

Jabor
Jul 16, 2010

#1 Loser at SpaceChem

Entropic posted:

Pay four mana to get another Llanowar Eld and give your opponent a Craterhoof or whatever?

We went over this when the card was spoiled, it's bad.

The best anyone could come up with was to flip, like, some giant bomb and something that kills it. You'd have to make sure both cards were in your top 10 first though. In which case, congrats? You spent a bunch of time and effort getting an awkward 4-mana Ashen Rider without the ETB trigger.

The "best" is stuff like emrakul+flickerwisp, which is fine but still isn't really good enough in modern.

If it was an instant you could maybe get up to some eldrazi displacer shenanigans in standard, but 7 mana or giving your opponent a whole turn with your big fatty is nowhere near as good as just marvelling out something

Rip_Van_Winkle
Jul 21, 2011

"When life gives you ghosts, you make ghost-robots"

I think this is a philosophy we can all aspire to.

Rinkles posted:



Thrasios, Triton Hero
GU
Legendary Creature - Merfolk
4: Scry 1, then reveal the top card of your library. If it's a land card, put it onto the battlefield tapped. Otherwise, draw a card.

Partner (You can have two commanders if both have partner.)

This seems really good?

Toshimo
Aug 23, 2012

He's outta line...

But he's right!
They should fire the C16 team and replace them with the C2 team because after Partner and Experience, they clearly design like shitbags and we could really use the guys who made Monarch cause they fukken get it.

anglachel
May 28, 2012

Rip_Van_Winkle posted:

This seems really good?

Yeah it seems pretty solid, could support Merfolk tribal in Commander. Is it good enough for Legacy merfolk?

Rinkles
Oct 24, 2010

What I'm getting at is...
Do you feel the same way?

anglachel posted:

Yeah it seems pretty solid, could support Merfolk tribal in Commander. Is it good enough for Legacy merfolk?

A 1/3 that does nothing unless you have 4 mana to spare?

Elyv
Jun 14, 2013





code:
Armory Automaton
3
Artifact Creature - Construct
Whenever Armory Automaton enters the battlefield or attacks, attach to it any number of target equipments. (Control of Equipment doesn't change.)
2/2

STANKBALLS TASTYLEGS
Oct 12, 2012

Elyv posted:



code:
Armory Automaton
3
Artifact Creature - Construct
Whenever Armory Automaton enters the battlefield or attacks, attach to it any number of target equipments. (Control of Equipment doesn't change.)
2/2

how can the regulars cards be so good but the commanders be soooo bad

Count Bleck
Apr 5, 2010

DISPEL MAGIC!

Sword of Body and Mind is A Big Jerk.

Rip_Van_Winkle
Jul 21, 2011

"When life gives you ghosts, you make ghost-robots"

I think this is a philosophy we can all aspire to.

Good luck lil germ

get em with that SoBaM

C-Euro
Mar 20, 2010

:science:
Soiled Meat
Grip of Phyresis seems like pretty sweet SB tech in Legacy, even without getting a Germ token from the deal.

Elyv
Jun 14, 2013



C-Euro posted:

Grip of Phyresis seems like pretty sweet SB tech in Legacy, even without getting a Germ token from the deal.

idk, no one plays carry away. This card is quite a bit better, though

TheKingofSprings
Oct 9, 2012
Yidris seems really, really good to me

C-Euro
Mar 20, 2010

:science:
Soiled Meat

Elyv posted:

idk, no one plays carry away. This card is quite a bit better, though

The fact that it's instant speed and the effect is permanent makes it seem like a nasty combat trick. Especially if someone swings in with a Batterskull and another dude but doesn't have mana to bounce the Batterskull. Cast this on Batterskull, block the other guy with your new Germ.

Maybe that's a best-case scenario but there's some good equipment bouncing around Legacy. And it's U compared to. UU. Though maybe I was wrong and the token is necessary to make it good.

C-Euro fucked around with this message at 16:08 on Oct 27, 2016

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Toshimo
Aug 23, 2012

He's outta line...

But he's right!
I love Vulshok Battlemaster and this is a pretty good sidegrade.

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