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botany posted:The GOP is in a legitimate Prisoner's Dilemma situation right now, and that's actually pretty interesting to see in the wild. If you and me are both Republicans, then it is in both of our interests to court minority votes and be less racist, so that our party can continue to be electable in the future. However, if you do that, then it's in my best interest to rake you over the coals for it and look like a strong leader instead, especially if we're running for the same seat. So while the party as a whole benefits from a conciliatory approach and a leftward shift, individually that makes you weak. They're pretty much hosed for a while, and it will be interesting to see how they get out of it.
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Oct 29, 2016 22:43
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botany posted:The GOP is in a legitimate Prisoner's Dilemma situation right now, and that's actually pretty interesting to see in the wild. If you and me are both Republicans, then it is in both of our interests to court minority votes and be less racist, so that our party can continue to be electable in the future. However, if you do that, then it's in my best interest to rake you over the coals for it and look like a strong leader instead, especially if we're running for the same seat. So while the party as a whole benefits from a conciliatory approach and a leftward shift, individually that makes you weak. They're pretty much hosed for a while, and it will be interesting to see how they get out of it. They can't get out of it without minority votes. It is simple arithmetic.
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Oct 29, 2016 22:44
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Nessus posted:See I doubt this, because Trump profoundly insulting the largest regional group of Hispanics (Mexicans) at length isn't going to just fall off the radar. While the GOP can probably undo what Trump did, it would require dedicated, focused effort, and is likely to be derailed by the 2020 primary candidate. Also, a lot of rising GOP wannabes will probably take pains to act like Trump, which will likely involve calling Mexicans rapists and thieves and vowing to build a wall (even though they represent Iowa, which, at last check, did not share a land border with Mexico). True. It's just pretty mind-boggling to me for something like this to happen and the only path ahead for them seems to be to shift the tiniest bit leftward. I expected them to do that for this year too so what the gently caress do I know.
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Oct 29, 2016 22:45
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Like I know I have reputation for being a bit crazed when it comes to the militia types and nazis but the acquital has em convinced that Hillary is going to see alot more terrorism fro these types. I also do not doubt that the terrorist group the Crusaders who were just caught are only the most vocal of these types of terrorists. Hillary I do not doubt with a favorable USSC will repass Obama's Dream executive order and it will send these people into farther craziness.
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Oct 29, 2016 22:45
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botany posted:The GOP is in a legitimate Prisoner's Dilemma situation right now, and that's actually pretty interesting to see in the wild. If you and me are both Republicans, then it is in both of our interests to court minority votes and be less racist, so that our party can continue to be electable in the future. However, if you do that, then it's in my best interest to rake you over the coals for it and look like a strong leader instead, especially if we're running for the same seat. So while the party as a whole benefits from a conciliatory approach and a leftward shift, individually that makes you weak. They're pretty much hosed for a while, and it will be interesting to see how they get out of it. Donald J Trump is the most qualified and competent candidate that the GOP could put forward. This isn't a mistake or a one off fluke.
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Oct 29, 2016 22:45
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Crowsbeak posted:Like I know I have reputation for being a bit crazed when it comes to the militia types and nazis but the acquital has em convinced that Hillary is going to see alot more terrorism fro these types. I also do not doubt that the terrorist group the Crusaders who were just caught are only the most vocal of these types of terrorists. Hillary I do not doubt with a favorable USSC will repass Obama's Dream executive order and it will send these people into farther craziness. Why won't Hillary Clinton say the words Radical Domestic Terrorism!?
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Oct 29, 2016 22:46
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Admiral Ray posted:True. It's just pretty mind-boggling to me for something like this to happen and the only path ahead for them seems to be to shift the tiniest bit leftward. I expected them to do that for this year too so what the gently caress do I know. 
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Oct 29, 2016 22:48
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Nessus posted:Gestures of reconciliation and mildness will probably be treated with extreme relief and favor by the media and various disgusted quasi-moderates, which will in and of itself be poisonous to the deplorable base. Until they rebuild their base to be less tightly focused on these people, they're kind of hosed on a national level, though less so on a local level. They would've been in much better shape now if they'd started doing something like this in '08, I imagine, but then OBAMA I'm still going to get heartburn when a 2020 candidate who wants to cut trillions of dollars worth of taxes from the 0.1%, make having an abortion impossible and allow discrimination against gay people by businesses is hailed by Serious People as a breath of fresh air and a moderate.
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Oct 29, 2016 22:55
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Antti posted:I'm still going to get heartburn when a 2020 candidate who wants to cut trillions of dollars worth of taxes from the 0.1%, make having an abortion impossible and allow discrimination against gay people by businesses is hailed by Serious People as a breath of fresh air and a moderate.
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Oct 29, 2016 23:00
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Potus is a lock. How does the Comey news impact the senate? If he had a political motivation that or the house would be it. E: And without 50 senators it doesn't matter if Clinton wins, there's no 1000 years of liberal darkness.
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Oct 29, 2016 23:02
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canepazzo posted:Stop arzying: how do either of these compare to 2008/2012? "outpacing the GOP" and "being up by 15 among this subgroup" both sound good but it's not really helpful without something to compare it to florida numbers still don't look very good compared to 2012 (obama got 53% of early/absentee vote iirc) but former obama people said that she was doing well for the fact that early voting started on a weekday, so monday morning will probably be a better time to tell how dems are doing there
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Oct 29, 2016 23:04
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WaPo article linked earlier:quote:[Trump Foundation's] smallest-ever gift, for $7, was paid to the Boy Scouts in 1989, at a time when it cost $7 to register a new Scout. Trump’s oldest son was 11 at the time. Trump did not respond to a question about whether the money paid to register him. haha seriously what the gently caress
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Oct 29, 2016 23:09
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I just saw one of those airplane-pulled banners that said "WI Chinese Americans for Trump!" Is...is that really a thing?
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Oct 29, 2016 23:13
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That Old Tree posted:WaPo article linked earlier: Too bad a candidate actually using his charitable foundation as a personal piggy bank will be ignored in favor of baseless accusations of the other candidate using her charitable foundation as a personal piggy bank.
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Oct 29, 2016 23:13
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186 posted:I just saw one of those airplane-pulled banners that said "WI Chinese Americans for Trump!" There's a small fraction of FYGM Asian-Americans going for Trump, so yeah, it's kind of a thing. Overall Chinese-Americans are like, 70% Dems though.
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Oct 29, 2016 23:16
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That Old Tree posted:WaPo article linked earlier: SEE! HE CARES ABOUT PEOPLE! That $7 trickled down and helped fuel the economy. And this is why we need to cut taxes, so to increase the chance that another 7 bucks will be handed to some poors some day in the future. TRUMP2016
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Oct 29, 2016 23:18
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Tarezax posted:There's a small fraction of FYGM Asian-Americans going for Trump, so yeah, it's kind of a thing. Overall Chinese-Americans are like, 70% Dems though. 
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Oct 29, 2016 23:18
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186 posted:I just saw one of those airplane-pulled banners that said "WI Chinese Americans for Trump!"
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Oct 29, 2016 23:18
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186 posted:Is...is that really a thing?
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Oct 29, 2016 23:20
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it's p. much people retrofitting really, really old school patriarchal chinese ideology onto trump. it's not really about his politics (minus maybe 'gently caress refugees') so much as him being a dude running against a lady. there was a dude on reddit who would go AS A GAY ASIAN IM VOTING FOR TRUMP every five seconds and if you really sat down and read his posts it was super blatantly him trying to regain some sort of big strong gorilla stature by voting for the loud angry man. (i read those posts because some bad news site was using them as a thinkpiece)
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Oct 29, 2016 23:22
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Nessus posted:Important question: was it a Trump-branded aircraft? As if a Trump branded aircraft would even be able to fly 
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Oct 29, 2016 23:25
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readingatwork posted:That's still meddling in another country's democratic process and is pretty awful. I disagree. I would rather see us fund anti-right wing and pro-peace parties in Israel and Palestine than sit back and watch while Israel spirals farther into apartheid fascism. Edit: and to pre-empt the inevitable question, I don't have a problem with the Russian government funding political parties in other countries. I have a problem with them funding fascist and right-wing parties in other countries. Lightning Knight fucked around with this message at 23:28 on Oct 29, 2016 |
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Oct 29, 2016 23:25
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cult member at airport posted:The GOP will have to re-brand to appeal to Latinos and Asians but they'll survive. Racism isn't just a white people thing. But wait, I thought only white people were racists. When other races do it they're just acting out against years of oppression and it's completely justified.
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Oct 29, 2016 23:28
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bad boy in the boy band posted:But wait, I thought only white people were racists. When other races do it they're just acting out against years of oppression and it's completely justified. Oh gently caress off, they're not talking about Latinos and Asians being racist against white people, they're talking about them being racist against black people, which is absolutely and sadly a thing.
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Oct 29, 2016 23:28
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https://twitter.com/ShaunKing/status/792276297997103105
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Oct 29, 2016 23:32
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bad boy in the boy band posted:But wait, I thought only white people were racists. When other races do it they're just acting out against years of oppression and it's completely justified. Racists are the real racists. Really makes you think.
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Oct 29, 2016 23:33
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bad boy in the boy band posted:But wait, I thought only white people were racists. When other races do it they're just acting out against years of oppression and it's completely justified. So Mr. Cheng the Guy Who Hates Black People is being "racist as hell" colloquially but is not furthering "racism" in the way that Ted Cobbler, Generic Nice GOP Man Who Has An Adopted Black Daughter And Also Voted To Increase Minimum Sentences For Weed, is. It is interesting to consider whether this is particularly true in other nations, though it's kind of academic. I imagine the key of whether you can have "racism" in the organized systemic way is "is there an obviously top-of-the-heap ethnic group?" and of course even, say, Malaysia would be influenced by white supremacy in other, more swole nations even if the domestic scene was dominated by Malays making GBS threads on non-Malays.
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Oct 29, 2016 23:32
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bad boy in the boy band posted:But wait, I thought only white people were racists. When other races do it they're just acting out against years of oppression and it's completely justified. Who is saying only white people are racist?
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Oct 29, 2016 23:33
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Tarezax posted:There's a small fraction of FYGM Asian-Americans going for Trump, so yeah, it's kind of a thing. Overall Chinese-Americans are like, 70% Dems though. And those two voter blocs talk past each other, usually in different languages. We don't vote overwhelmingly Dem as other minorities (IIRC Indian-Americans are the most heavily Dem voters)
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Oct 29, 2016 23:34
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Lightning Knight posted:Oh gently caress off, they're not talking about Latinos and Asians being racist against white people, they're talking about them being racist against black people, which is absolutely and sadly a thing. Latinos and Asians are more often racists against each other. See Japanese vs. Koreans vs. Chinese vs. Filipinos or Mexicans vs. Hondurans vs. Guatemalans vs. Nicaraguans etc.
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Oct 29, 2016 23:33
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Young Freud posted:Latinos and Asians are more often racists against each other. See Japanese vs. Koreans vs. Chinese vs. Filipinos or Mexicans vs. Hondurans vs. Guatemalans vs. Nicaraguans etc. Those are not mutually exclusive phenomena!
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Oct 29, 2016 23:35
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skylined! posted:Who is saying only white people are racist? Black people 
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Oct 29, 2016 23:35
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botany posted:The GOP is in a legitimate Prisoner's Dilemma situation right now, and that's actually pretty interesting to see in the wild. If you and me are both Republicans, then it is in both of our interests to court minority votes and be less racist, so that our party can continue to be electable in the future. However, if you do that, then it's in my best interest to rake you over the coals for it and look like a strong leader instead, especially if we're running for the same seat. So while the party as a whole benefits from a conciliatory approach and a leftward shift, individually that makes you weak. They're pretty much hosed for a while, and it will be interesting to see how they get out of it. It is incredible to see how thoroughly they have screwed themselves over in pursuit of ideological purity voting. It has long since become a contest where only the most basely extremist can rise, even if they know full well that their stances will severely damage them and the nation as a whole as they bow to the will of people that they trained to be as irrational as possible to save their own skin. Integrity in the toxic environment the GOP has cultivated is a death sentence.
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Oct 29, 2016 23:36
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Pretty sure I was called by a RNC pollster today in Indiana. lots of leading questions (Which Statement Do you Agree with more, Bayh is a Washington insider or Todd Young Will support us in washington, to which i Responded neither.) They must be desperate right now as My wife and I have been getting Called 3-4 times a week by pollsters.
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Oct 29, 2016 23:37
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Young Freud posted:Latinos and Asians are more often racists against each other. See Japanese vs. Koreans vs. Chinese vs. Filipinos or Mexicans vs. Hondurans vs. Guatemalans vs. Nicaraguans etc. Oh absolutely. My dad, born in Mexico, worked in the gas delivery business for the last ten or so years and most of the people he worked with were of Indian or Pakistani descent and holy poo poo the amount of racism in both ends was staggering to me.
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Oct 29, 2016 23:37
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botany posted:The GOP is in a legitimate Prisoner's Dilemma situation right now, and that's actually pretty interesting It's hilarious is what it is. The typical way of preventing sub-optimal Nash equilibria is an external mechanism that enforces cooperation, incentivizes maximising the minimum/average/global utility, penalizes certain combinations of actions etc. In other words, regulation. The conservative political movement which believes in the omnipotence of free markets, "rational self-interest" etc is getting viciously savaged by a tragedy of the commons that their economic philosophy is incapable of dealing with in a game theoretic sense. What's even funnier is that the very existence of such games is typically denied by conservatives precisely because it highlights the need for regulation. Even "reasonable" conservatives aren't capable of changing to deal with the problem, because the problem is caused by a situation they argue cannot exist.
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Oct 29, 2016 23:36
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Young Freud posted:Latinos and Asians are more often racists against each other. See Japanese vs. Koreans vs. Chinese vs. Filipinos or Mexicans vs. Hondurans vs. Guatemalans vs. Nicaraguans etc. I find that this usually doesn't last past the first generation, at least for Asians. Later generations born and raised in America quickly find that white people treat them as one monolithic block and come together in solidarity. Of course this could just be me being in a Millenial bubble...
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Oct 29, 2016 23:36
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Tarezax posted:I find that this usually doesn't last past the first generation, at least for Asians. Later generations born and raised in America quickly find that white people treat them as one monolithic block and come together in solidarity.
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Oct 29, 2016 23:38
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Complaint Compilation posted:Black people I have a black person sitting next to me and they say that's bullshit. Checkmate,
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Oct 29, 2016 23:40
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Phone posted:Donald J Trump is the most qualified and competent candidate that the GOP could put forward. If he had kept his head down and just said generic talking points from the convention to now he would be terrifyingly close to the white house, if not the frontrunner. When he (I think at the convention?) silenced the "LOCK HER UP" chants and responded, "Let's defeat her in November." I was scared. That looked like a candidate who had learned how to smartly channel the shrieking hot ball of rage, while making himself look sane enough for "reasonable" people to vote for him. Fortunately, that wasn't the case.
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Oct 29, 2016 23:39
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