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Arsenic Lupin posted:Somebody actually did a study. Half of the doctors in a hospital had clicky pens reminding them that overuse of antibiotics was a problem. I may have forgotten the control statement; it was something very similar to this.) The other half had advertising pens. Advertising tat is not the same as quid pro quo corruption, even if it is a mildly effective way to push products.
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Oct 29, 2016 22:38
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we are all puppets to advertisements in general. drink your ovaltine. vote yes on the soda tax tho
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Oct 29, 2016 22:46
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Guy Farting posted:this is illegal I know a few pharma reps that trade sexual favors for good numbers from doctors. While the quid pro quo culture has gotten much better it's still crazy scummy.
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Oct 30, 2016 00:41
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Shbobdb posted:I know a few pharma reps that trade sexual favors for good numbers from doctors. While the quid pro quo culture has gotten much better it's still crazy scummy. So why don't you report them?
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Oct 30, 2016 00:46
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Trabisnikof posted:So why don't you report them? Because they are my friends. What sort of an rear end in a top hat reports their friends?
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Oct 30, 2016 00:51
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Shbobdb posted:Because they are my friends. What sort of an rear end in a top hat reports their friends? If I thought my friends were hurting a bunch of innocent people?
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Oct 30, 2016 01:01
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Trabisnikof posted:If I thought my friends were hurting a bunch of innocent people? I bet you called the cops on parties with alcohol in high school too. Don't they know that what they are doing is illegal and someone might get hurt?
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Oct 30, 2016 01:07
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hmmm yes people who give sexual favors as a part of their work are great people to have as friends
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Oct 30, 2016 01:09
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Shbobdb posted:I bet you called the cops on parties with alcohol in high school too. Don't they know that what they are doing is illegal and someone might get hurt? If you think it is no big deal when your friends do it why bring it up as an example of a bad thing? Who cares if doctors describe a different medicine so they can get some action, it's basically the same as having a beer!
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Oct 30, 2016 01:10
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LOL. Things can be "not good things" especially on a systemic level while also not being worth "literally ruining someone's life over". To say nothing of in-group loyalty. It's like you don't even understand basic socialization.
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Oct 30, 2016 01:11
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I don't think it's great to compare the AMA and other professional organizations to unions, because I think that gives people the impression that despite unions declining for decades, things are fine for workers because all these professional orgs are basically the same thing. It's true that both unions and other professional organizations lobby on behalf of their membership, but basically every interest group of any kind lobbies, so I don't think that's an important point of comparison. cheese posted:No, but professional organizations, be they AMA or teachers union or the set painters guild in Hollywood, are heavily affected by public perception of their job, and the gender and class bias that accompany that. I mean, there is a riddle where the entire point of it is that you assume the doctor in the story is male. Doctors don't need to strike because their union equivalent has power that the California Nurses Association can only dream of possessing. That's actually directly to the point. Non-union professional organizations that typically represent white-collar employees have a generally positive reputation on both sides of the American political spectrum (with some exceptions). Whereas the Right has a rabid hatred of unions (unless they're police or prison guard unions, of course, those get a pass). I'm not trying to divert this into a conversation about unions, I just think it's important in dialogues like this to make the distinction clear. The AMA isn't a union and mostly doesn't do union-like things.
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Oct 30, 2016 01:36
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Shbobdb posted:LOL. If your in-group is people who live a life of FYGM, yes. Like this is just another in a litany of examples of you picking your upper class peers over the rest of us, so I'm not surprised.
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Oct 30, 2016 02:08
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Jobs making ~$140K/yr that involve low levels of expected sex work are now "upper class". Good to know.
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Oct 30, 2016 02:33
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Shbobdb posted:~$140K/yr 
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Oct 30, 2016 02:34
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Wait, is your friend being trafficked as a sex worker? Wouldn't want to snitch on her and ruin her life!!
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Oct 30, 2016 02:41
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How hot were the ladies and what did they have to do to hit their commissions?
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Oct 30, 2016 02:45
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Shbobdb posted:Jobs making ~$140K/yr that involve low levels of expected sex work are now "upper class". Good to know. well, yeah
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Oct 30, 2016 02:51
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I would think maybe you would be concerned that your co-worker's unethical behaviour reflected badly on your profession or the image your company projects. But then again maybe they're great at BBQs so why rock the boat. Must be fun working in what is basically the setup to a porno, though.
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Oct 30, 2016 02:52
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Shbobdb posted:LOL. Leperflesh posted:I'm not trying to divert this into a conversation about unions, I just think it's important in dialogues like this to make the distinction clear. The AMA isn't a union and mostly doesn't do union-like things.
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Oct 30, 2016 02:57
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Shbobdb posted:Jobs making ~$140K/yr that involve low levels of expected sex work are now "upper class". Good to know. lol good job qfb
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Oct 30, 2016 03:18
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FilthyImp posted:I would think maybe you would be concerned that your co-worker's unethical behaviour reflected badly on your profession or the image your company projects. But then again maybe they're great at BBQs so why rock the boat. They aren't my co-workers, just people I know socially. Pharma sales is dirty man. Plus, I am nowhere near attractive enough to be in Pharma sales. You've gotta respect people's hustle and I'm not going to get in the way of that. It's tough out there so you gotta do what you can to make it. A big reason why I oppose Capitalism is because the system heavily rewards people for shady, immoral behavior. Class is more-or-less set at birth and the only way to get around that (other than relying on blind luck) is to hustle like crazy. I respect a good hustle but hustling is a symptom of a decadent system. I'm more concerned with the system forcing (or at least heavily encouraging) people to hustle in shady ways than I am with the individuals forced to hustle.
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Oct 30, 2016 03:35
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cheese posted:Its almost like the AMA has helped create a system where older doctor's hilariously high salaries are protected by each new wave of young doctors, who need said hilariously high salary to have any hope of paying off that student loan (which is well above a quarter of a million for many students, especially if they already racked up 100k from undergrad). Medicine should be an undergraduate degree like it is in almost every other first world country. Also, the work long hours thing is a problem doctors themselves have created. Medical schools should let more doctors in so they don't have to work long hours. Increasing the supply of doctors would mean that doctors' salaries would probably go down though, and I doubt they would go for that . . .
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Oct 30, 2016 14:46
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What about the rise of nurse practitioners? I've felt much more cared for and listened to when I've seen NPs over doctors, and in CA, they can prescribe medications. I don't know how their schooling or pay structure or anything works, though.
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Oct 30, 2016 16:30
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I work in Pharma R&D in California and way too many of you want to burn me to death
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Oct 30, 2016 19:15
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silence_kit posted:Medicine should be an undergraduate degree like it is in almost every other first world country. The amount of education and training required to safely practice medicine isn't very flexible, so even if you relaxed the formal academic requirements, you would have to make up the difference in apprenticeship, certification courses, etc. none of which would presumably be free. You're just moving the problem around. Bastard Tetris posted:I work in Pharma R&D in California and way too many of you want to burn me to death
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Oct 30, 2016 19:31
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Dead Reckoning posted:So any 22 year old with the right BS degree could apply for a license to hang a shingle and start prescribing meds? No thanks. No, I'm saying that there is no reason why medical school needs to be a post-graduate degree. Most of the undergraduate degree prior to medical school is spent studying things not relevant to medicine. It's wasteful, and would help reduce the debt doctors get early in their careers from paying for their schooling. In almost every other first-world country, medical school is an undergraduate degree. P.S. not a lot of people wash out of medical school--it is not that hard. You don't need to be a brilliant genius to be a doctor. If they just let more people in, more people would meet the standards, and we'd have more doctors. silence_kit fucked around with this message at 20:05 on Oct 30, 2016 |
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Oct 30, 2016 19:46
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Dead Reckoning posted:Sorry, you're working for the evil profit machine, which makes you an unfortunate but necessary casualty of war. Once we starve and slay the beast, full utopia now will break out. For profit medical research is the only thing holding us back. This guy never ran a JV with academia
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Oct 30, 2016 19:55
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Shbobdb posted:They aren't my co-workers, just people I know socially. Pharma sales is dirty man. Plus, I am nowhere near attractive enough to be in Pharma sales. You've gotta respect people's hustle and I'm not going to get in the way of that. It's tough out there so you gotta do what you can to make it.
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Oct 30, 2016 21:11
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LeoMarr posted:Doesnt communism extremely bias people who are shady and immoral by putting everyone on a level playing field and making any succesd based on illicit activity and favor exchangimg Why is the assumption that because someone thinks capitalism as a system sucks, they must be communist? Capitalism sucks. Communism in Russia resulted in widespread environmental destruction, several of the worst radioactive disasters ever, oh, and wiped a sea off the map of the Earth.
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Oct 30, 2016 21:19
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A White Guy posted:Why is the assumption that because someone thinks capitalism as a system sucks, they must be communist? Capitalism sucks. Communism in Russia resulted in widespread environmental destruction, several of the worst radioactive disasters ever, oh, and wiped a sea off the map of the Earth. Sorry welcome to Earth. Capitalism is here to stay. Capitalism is good. Communism is not.
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Oct 30, 2016 23:03
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LeoMarr posted:Capitalism is good for a very small proportion of the Earth's population, and is bad for the entirety of the Earth overall.
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Oct 30, 2016 23:29
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LeoMarr posted:Doesnt communism extremely bias people who are shady and immoral by putting everyone on a level playing field and making any succesd based on illicit activity and favor exchangimg  capitalism definitely doesn't favor people who are shady and immoral and promote illicit activity and favor exchanging
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Oct 31, 2016 01:42
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Squeegy posted:
Just wait until the trusts get busted u0 again Youll see free market capitalism flourishing. Communist interlopers have hosed capitalism.
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Oct 31, 2016 02:15
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silence_kit posted:No, I'm saying that there is no reason why medical school needs to be a post-graduate degree. Most of the undergraduate degree prior to medical school is spent studying things not relevant to medicine. It's wasteful, and would help reduce the debt doctors get early in their careers from paying for their schooling. In almost every other first-world country, medical school is an undergraduate degree. I feel like so far in my life, 100% of what I have needed from my doctor hasn't needed the expertise of someone amazing. I mean, the last issue I had was an ear infection and it just needed some antibiotics. I'm sure as I get older and horrible poo poo starts happening to me I'd want doctors with a lot more education. Anyway, my property manager sent me a friend request on facebook on a Saturday at 9 at night. I assume she was drunk because what else are middle aged ladies doing on a Saturday night at that hour but drinking wine and scrolling through social media. I've been living here for 6 years, why now? Anyway, her page is public and, uh-oh, she posts garbage from Fox new like Janine Pirro rants, some people standing for the anthem like true Americans and blue lives mattering. No I did not accept the request. In this fact-free world I'm worried that she'll decide that I haven't actually been paying my rent once she finds out I'm some kind of free-loading socialist.
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Oct 31, 2016 03:32
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silence_kit posted:No, I'm saying that there is no reason why medical school needs to be a post-graduate degree. Most of the undergraduate degree prior to medical school is spent studying things not relevant to medicine. It's wasteful, and would help reduce the debt doctors get early in their careers from paying for their schooling. In almost every other first-world country, medical school is an undergraduate degree. Would you agree that engineering should be a post-graduate degree, since that's true in a lot of the developed world?
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Oct 31, 2016 03:35
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Bast Relief posted:I feel like so far in my life, 100% of what I have needed from my doctor hasn't needed the expertise of someone amazing. I mean, the last issue I had was an ear infection and it just needed some antibiotics. I'm sure as I get older and horrible poo poo starts happening to me I'd want doctors with a lot more education. Making medicine an undergraduate degree isn't really less medical education though. Pre-med students only have to take like a handful of introductory science classes to be able to get into medical schools in the US. That's not really the content of an entire undergraduate degree. Making students pay for 4 years of education for like 1 1/2 years of relevant content is totally wasteful and it adds to the debt doctors incur at the beginning of their careers.
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Oct 31, 2016 04:24
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Lol what pre-med path did you take? When I graduated I ended up with ~90 credits in biology and chemistry alone.
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Oct 31, 2016 04:40
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Bast Relief posted:I feel like so far in my life, 100% of what I have needed from my doctor hasn't needed the expertise of someone amazing. I mean, the last issue I had was an ear infection and it just needed some antibiotics. I'm sure as I get older and horrible poo poo starts happening to me I'd want doctors with a lot more education. You know what she wants  . I'm going to take a wild guess and say that her best years were about 30 years and 100 pounds ago. .
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Oct 31, 2016 05:42
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LeoMarr posted:Just wait until the trusts get busted u0 again Busted up by whom? Big Government? 
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Oct 31, 2016 06:11
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A White Guy posted:You know what she wants Bzzzt. I'm a lady and her husband and her, while not all that attractive, are in decent shape. I don't know what she wants from me. They've always been so professional. At least the owner of the property itself is an uber lefty from the bay.
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Oct 31, 2016 06:29
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