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Moon Atari posted:This loss is entirely on the democrats. We should have realised how deeply in trouble they were when Obama lost everything but the executive and they did basically nothing to try to change their approach They actually did change something, they started equivocating economic populism with racism as opposed to ignoring it entirely 
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Nov 10, 2016 04:49
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Fojar38 posted:There is with that attitude. The Tea Party could do it, why couldn't a left-wing equivilent? A lot of people were completely and utterly shocked out of complacency over the last 24 hours and a lot of people are pissed off and frightened. Cause look at this loving map  The Dems need three pickups to take the Senate in 2018 and they're playing a hell of a lot more defence than offence
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Nov 10, 2016 04:49
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The white supremacist movement that propelled Trump would definitely have rolled over for the Jewish guy. They would definitely have been nicer to him than to Hillary. Yep.vyelkin posted:Cause look at this loving map With that map Dems will need a miracle to keep 41 seats.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:49
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vyelkin posted:Cause look at this loving map Oh better do nothing then, just cry and point fingers on internet forums.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:49
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Kilroy posted:that's lame and most people don't identify as a "worker" Yea idk, I think it'd work. It's way better than "Democratic Party"
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Nov 10, 2016 04:50
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Kilroy posted:by the way if I was going to run for public office where is a good place to start serious post. I live in a solid blue state Contact your local party. E: I'm literally doing this a week from now.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:49
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Like what "working class issues" did Republicans campaign on other than "I will reopen the closed factories!!!!" I'm honestly drawing a blank.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:50
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Fojar38 posted:There is with that attitude. The Tea Party could do it, why couldn't a left-wing equivilent? A lot of people were completely and utterly shocked out of complacency over the last 24 hours and a lot of people are pissed off and frightened. Even if they do that, they'll never organize Trump will make the Republicans organize though, so don't you worry little dem Trump's gots this
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Nov 10, 2016 04:51
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The "Corporate Drone Labor Party"Trabisnikof posted:Like what "working class issues" did Republicans campaign on other than "I will reopen the closed factories!!!!" I'm honestly drawing a blank. Trump will yell at China.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:51
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I recently spoke with a friend who is a close advisor to Hillary (you are free to not believe me, but I'm sure this will be public soon enough). They told me that Trump has absolutely no transition plan and no issues team. They had no idea they were going to win and have absolutely nothing going on. They're made no attempts at contacting foreign leaders as is usually done. Apparently it's still unclear, in general, if he actually intends to govern.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:52
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Kilroy posted:that's lame and most people don't identify as a "worker" Really? Why do you think populism is back?
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Nov 10, 2016 04:52
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PerniciousKnid posted:The white supremacist movement that propelled Trump would definitely have rolled over for the Jewish guy. They would definitely have been nicer to him than to Hillary. Yep. Uh, yea they would have. Hillary failed to bring out many people. Because people are tired of pragmatic establishment politicians.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:52
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PerniciousKnid posted:The white supremacist movement that propelled Trump would definitely have rolled over for the Jewish guy. They would definitely have been nicer to him than to Hillary. Yep. This is true but the bigger issue is that something like 7 million voters turned out for Obama in 2012 but not for Clinton. Trump actually got fewer votes than Romney did. The big question is not really whether Bernie or Biden or whoever else you want to hypothesize would have won over significant numbers of Trump voters but also whether they would have turned out the millions of Democrats who stayed home.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:52
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Trabisnikof posted:Except the Democrats were talking working class issues every single day but the media wouldn't cover it unless it is a goof or an attack on Trump. so this is that "in the tank for Hillary" everyone's been talking about
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Nov 10, 2016 04:53
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Trabisnikof posted:Like what "working class issues" did Republicans campaign on other than "I will reopen the closed factories!!!!" I'm honestly drawing a blank. That's all they had to do to win. Just acknowledge the fact that they exist. The democrats didn't.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:53
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Crowsbeak posted:Really? Why do you think populism is back? Why do you think those two things are related is the bigger question.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:53
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My Linux Rig posted:Even if they do that, they'll never organize Contact your local parties, contact your local officials and encourage your left-wing friends to do the same. Let the same fear and anger that drove the tea party drive you. Lord knows we all need an outlet for it and we'll feel a lot better doing something than posting on the internet feeling sorry for ourselves.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:53
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PerniciousKnid posted:The white supremacist movement that propelled Trump would definitely have rolled over for the Jewish guy. They would definitely have been nicer to him than to Hillary. Yep. Is this for real
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Nov 10, 2016 04:54
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Polygynous posted:so this is that "in the tank for Hillary" everyone's been talking about It's trabisknof, he's a special kind of democrat.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:54
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Trabisnikof posted:Like what "working class issues" did Republicans campaign on other than "I will reopen the closed factories!!!!" I'm honestly drawing a blank. Gonna stop the loving feds from getting their hands in Medicare.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:55
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tsa posted:Why do you think those two things are related is the bigger question. You know promising jobs and standing against the elite is appealing to workers right?
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Nov 10, 2016 04:55
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Quick Draw McGraw posted:Is this for real What do you think has been going on in the world for the past 5000 years? Crowsbeak posted:You know promising jobs and standing against the elite is appealing to workers right? PerniciousKnid fucked around with this message at 04:56 on Nov 10, 2016 |
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Nov 10, 2016 04:54
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Fojar38 posted:There is with that attitude. The Tea Party could do it, why couldn't a left-wing equivilent? A lot of people were completely and utterly shocked out of complacency over the last 24 hours and a lot of people are pissed off and frightened. Because a significant portion of center left progressives see the democratic party as a cross between a lesser evil and a cage, where on the opposite side the republicans had already been fostering the stuff that would become the tea party and catering to evangelical and randian poo poo it led to. Because a lot of those left progressives are old enough to variously remember BLM, Occupy, the WI recall protest, Moveon, the anti-war movement and, gently caress, in some cases Clintonian third wayism and seeing every progressive movement they pushed for slowly quashed or smothered under the suits of neoliberal DNC hacks. A lot of the people who would be in a position to do a left wing radical movement like the tea party with the democratic party don't trust it in the first place beyond holding up their noses and voting for them as a lesser evil.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:55
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Trabisnikof posted:Except the Democrats were talking working class issues every single day but the media wouldn't cover it unless it is a goof or an attack on Trump. Of course the media covered it, this whole RAHHHH MEDIA nonsense is just that, made up nonsense by people angry their candidate lost. The media were strongly in favor of hillary and lexical/sentiment analysis of reporting shows that clearly.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:54
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Trabisnikof posted:Like what "working class issues" did Republicans campaign on other than "I will reopen the closed factories!!!!" I'm honestly drawing a blank. That's pretty much it which leaves a wide field for others to go on the offensive with.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:55
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Trabisnikof posted:Except the Democrats were talking working class issues every single day but the media wouldn't cover it unless it is a goof or an attack on Trump. Yeah, and then the media got pissy when Clinton stopped talking to them for a few weeks because every question was about e-mails. The media for all their hand-wringing went in for the horse race, and by god that was the narrative we were going to get from August 2015 to yesterday. As to Bernie mobilizing the white working class voters, he may have appealed to them, but he struggled to make a connection with other groups in the Democratic coalition, especially minorities. I don't see a clear path for him to get past the "lol gently caress SJWs" mindset of many Trump voters through discussion, and I see him struggling just as much to motivate as much of Obama's 2012 base. He'd just have different problems with that motivation. And boomers have a problem with socialism as a term, even if millenials don't. His only advantage would have been not running into 30 years of opposition noise.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:55
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PerniciousKnid posted:What do you think has been going on in the world for the past 5000 years? You are either hysterical or just very dumb When's the last time you weny outside Do you really think anti-semites rule the country. Really?
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Nov 10, 2016 04:55
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Agnosticnixie posted:Because a significant portion of center left progressives see the democratic party as a cross between a lesser evil and a cage, where on the opposite side the republicans had already been fostering the stuff that would become the tea party and catering to evangelical and randian poo poo it led to. Because a lot of those left progressives are old enough to variously remember BLM, Occupy, the WI recall protest, Moveon, the anti-war movement and, gently caress, in some cases Clintonian third wayism and seeing every progressive movement they pushed for slowly quashed or smothered under the suits of neoliberal DNC hacks.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:57
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I just hope the Trump administration crashes and burns, hard. It certainly doesn't look prepared.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:57
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Polygynous posted:so this is that "in the tank for Hillary" everyone's been talking about What part of what I said wasn't factual? Working class issues was a massive part of what the Clinton campaign and Democrats at leather tried to talk about. Paid family leave, increasing the minimum wage and expanding jobs programs are big ones. It just doesn't matter what you say as a campaign because people pick their media content by their politics so you can never break through. Tight Booty Shorts posted:It's trabisknof, he's a special kind of democrat. I mean a Blue Dog Democrat isn't that special. tsa posted:Of course the media covered it, this whole RAHHHH MEDIA nonsense is just that, made up nonsense by people angry their candidate lost. The media were strongly in favor of hillary and lexical/sentiment analysis of reporting shows that clearly. The comparison of airtime spent on each candidate and on the issues showed the media favored Trump with more time and discussed the issues less than ever. Now whining won't fix it, but we have to acknowledge it. Trabisnikof fucked around with this message at 04:59 on Nov 10, 2016 |
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Nov 10, 2016 04:57
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PerniciousKnid posted:What do you think has been going on in the world for the past 5000 years? Seriously. American politicians don't care about Jews unless they're running Israel and asking for arms money. One GOP dude spread mere rumors about a candidate being a Jew, and said candidate loving committed suicide.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:58
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https://twitter.com/kmscodi/status/796554667748716545?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw
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Nov 10, 2016 04:57
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Crowsbeak posted:Then change it. This. The Tea Party changed the Republican Party, a similar movement can do the same for the Democratic Party. We already saw the seeds of it with Bernie's surprisingly competitive campaign and I suspect that lots of old-guard Clintonites would be willing to try something new to defeat a resurgent GOP led by Trump.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:57
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Fojar38 posted:Contact your local parties, contact your local officials and encourage your left-wing friends to do the same. Let the same fear and anger that drove the tea party drive you. Lord knows we all need an outlet for it and we'll feel a lot better doing something than posting on the internet feeling sorry for ourselves. This, stop whinging and go do something. You know what will get you another 4 years of a government you don't want? Whining about it, pearl clutching and blaming people.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:58
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jwang posted:Please give me a rebuttal, because I'm feeling super nihilistic right now. I sincerely welcome anything that can turn me away from this way of thinking. I'm seriously considering going in for counseling as is. The rebuttal is holy poo poo you just basically asked minorities who have been poo poo on since this country was in existence to tolerate losing even more rights and losing their lives for the greater good of white people.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:59
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tsa posted:Of course the media covered it, this whole RAHHHH MEDIA nonsense is just that, made up nonsense by people angry their candidate lost. The media were strongly in favor of hillary and lexical/sentiment analysis of reporting shows that clearly. No clearly its the famously right wing, anti-semitic major broadcast news and cable networks
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Nov 10, 2016 04:58
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And I think that the past 24 hours should have taught us that maps don't mean what they used to. How do you think that working class voters in the rust belt will feel in 2 years when things still haven't improved?
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Nov 10, 2016 05:00
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Mister Macys posted:Seriously. American politicians don't care about Jews unless they're running Israel and asking for arms money. What kind of hosed up mirror universe do you come from
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Nov 10, 2016 04:59
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Quick Draw McGraw posted:You are either hysterical or just very dumb Well the President-elect spent his summer re-tweeting anti-semitic memes from literal Nazis so yeah, anti-semites rule the country now. This is just a basic fact. To answer your first question I'm pretty sure yesterday was the last time I went outside. Good luck out there kids.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:59
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Both the tea party and Trump's movement are made up of people that once formed the labour movement. They can be won back to left wing economics but it is going to take a change in dialogue. Less open disdain and you are all bigots talk for one. That doesn't mean adopting racist policy, it means focusing on class and grouping policy that supports minorities under that banner. The civil rights movement involved a lot of cooperation with unions, even while the majority of people in the unions were racist as heck.
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Nov 10, 2016 05:00
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