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wicka posted:Let's keep in mind that Liberty literally doesn't have the power to do this, FOM is not the FIA, they don't make the rules. No one at Liberty is going to hold the same level of influence as Bernie. Didn't the split turbo come from the truck division originally?
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Dec 18, 2016 17:00
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Ya this has been brought up time and time again. Mercedes and Ferrari have roadcar divisions that they can pull resources from there to hide extra spending. Even Red Bull has that "technology" company or whatever.
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Dec 18, 2016 17:02
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A cap might actually work for the big bosses of rich teams though. Forces engineers to actually think rather than just throwing money at a problem until something sticks. Red bull already do something similar with Toro Rosso in that they give young engineers much less money than the main team and they are more than able to keep up with the midfield. Might actually encourage teams like Nissan, Toyota, Ford and so on who are using the tin top series for development back into a new less money sinking f1.
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Dec 18, 2016 17:10
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1500quidporsche posted:Ya this has been brought up time and time again. Mercedes and Ferrari have roadcar divisions that they can pull resources from there to hide extra spending. Even Red Bull has that "technology" company or whatever. Same goes for Renault, both McLaren and Honda, even Haas. Gene Haas spent two years in prison for tax evasion, I don't think the dude is beyond shuffling some numbers.
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Dec 18, 2016 17:10
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They should focus more on a fair distribution of prize money than anything else if they want to solve the issue of getting the rest of the field afloat.
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Dec 18, 2016 17:36
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wicka posted:No one at Liberty is going to hold the same level of influence as Bernie.
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Dec 18, 2016 17:39
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Triple A posted:They should focus more on a fair distribution of prize money than anything else if they want to solve the issue of getting the rest of the field afloat. Yup. Ferrari spend $300m a year because they get $330 in prize money. If they only got $80m they'd only spend $80 mil
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Dec 18, 2016 18:01
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Big teams like Mercedes and Red Bull are going to spend whatever they want no matter the prize money. A cap wouldn't be enforceable because teams exist to cheat but if it was it'd help teams like Williams and Force India.
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Dec 18, 2016 18:12
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El Hefe posted:Big teams like Mercedes and Red Bull are going to spend whatever they want no matter the prize money. Right, so why do they get more of the prize money? It should just be split evenly.
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Dec 18, 2016 18:14
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Just like everything else equal prize money wouldn't be a silver bullet but I do think you'd see Mercedes and Red Bull exercise some modicum of sanity and restraint if they only got an extra $10m for coming in 1st in the WCC instead of an extra $100m
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Dec 18, 2016 18:16
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Didn't one of the big time F1 team leaders get really pissy when it was suggested that the lower teams got paid more?
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Dec 18, 2016 18:20
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iospace posted:Didn't one of the big time F1 team leaders get really pissy when it was suggested that the lower teams got paid more? That doesn't sound like the F1 I know and love.
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Dec 18, 2016 18:26
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I find it incredibly difficult to believe that well regarded teams like Red Bull, Ferrari and Mercedes would put political posturing for personal gain above the true spirit of competition that is F1. It just seems unfathomable.
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Dec 18, 2016 18:35
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wicka posted:Right, so why do they get more of the prize money? It should just be split evenly.
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Dec 18, 2016 19:00
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You'd think that Force India would be at the top of the field given that Vijay Mallya doesn't pay anyone.
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Dec 18, 2016 19:53
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Just lock the engineers and drivers in a warehouse for 3 months pre-season and BOOM whatever they come out with is what they race with all season. Also all cars should have sprinklers on the back to incentivise overtaking.
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Dec 18, 2016 20:19
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Khablam posted:Just lock the engineers and drivers in a warehouse for 3 months pre-season and BOOM whatever they come out with is what they race with all season. Bernie account spotted
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Dec 18, 2016 20:23
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Another thing that would be nice is a few extra trophies to recognize good rookies, gentlemanly drivers and support staff that has really done good work.
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Dec 18, 2016 20:30
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Aren't both those suggestions already in place and the first one is why Mercedes won everything the last 3 years and the second one is about the same as the current aero formula except it has the opposite effect?
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Dec 18, 2016 20:31
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POOIS SHAMILTON
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Dec 18, 2016 20:56
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keevo posted:You'd think that Force India would be at the top of the field given that Vijay Mallya doesn't pay anyone. Force Sweatshop
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Dec 18, 2016 21:28
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Soon liberty will arrive at the correct conclusion, which is more spec parts on the cars and/or huge technical restrictions, like making aero dimensions so strict that there is essentially only one way to build a front wing or whatever. Aero r&d is such a waste of money anyway - does it actually trickle down to road cars at all? Thats the way to bring down costs. When Merc realises that the extra 200million they are paying in R&D over the smaller teams is only giving them eight tenths a lap, instead of 2 and a half seconds, they will see its a poo poo return on investment. The net result for F1 would be lowered costs, more parity, and a grid full of talented drivers, with therr being no need to sell seats for cash and sponsorship.
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Dec 18, 2016 23:00
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AgentJotun posted:Soon liberty will arrive at the correct conclusion, which is more spec parts on the cars and/or huge technical restrictions, like making aero dimensions so strict that there is essentially only one way to build a front wing or whatever. Aero r&d is such a waste of money anyway - does it actually trickle down to road cars at all? Think about how good F1 has been as an engine-dependent formula.
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Dec 18, 2016 23:07
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AgentJotun posted:Soon liberty will arrive at the correct conclusion, which is more spec parts on the cars and/or huge technical restrictions, like making aero dimensions so strict that there is essentially only one way to build a front wing or whatever. Aero r&d is such a waste of money anyway - does it actually trickle down to road cars at all? This would suck rear end and be bad
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Dec 19, 2016 00:55
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AgentJotun posted:Thats the way to bring down costs. When Merc realises that the extra 200million they are paying in R&D over the smaller teams is only giving them eight tenths a lap, instead of 2 and a half seconds, they will see its a poo poo return on investment. This is hilarious because when you make the cars more and more equal, minuscule performance improvements actually become even more important, and valuable
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Dec 19, 2016 00:56
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AgentJotun posted:Soon liberty will arrive at the correct conclusion, which is more spec parts on the cars and/or huge technical restrictions, like making aero dimensions so strict that there is essentially only one way to build a front wing or whatever. Aero r&d is such a waste of money anyway - does it actually trickle down to road cars at all? They'll see that 0.8s as an advantage they can have that the rest can't and therefore one that cannot be passed up, and it'll be even harder for the others to catch up.
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Dec 19, 2016 01:08
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Any team would spend $200m to gain 0.8s, if they had the money. Ask Ferrari or Red Bull or McLaren if they wouldn't. If they were 0.8s faster Red Bull or Ferrari could've won the championships.
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Dec 19, 2016 01:17
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Alain Post posted:This is hilarious because when you make the cars more and more equal, minuscule performance improvements actually become even more important, and valuable Exhibit A: NASCAR
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Dec 19, 2016 01:29
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Alain Post posted:This is hilarious because when you make the cars more and more equal, minuscule performance improvements actually become even more important, and valuable Totally wrong professor. What becomes more important is a good driver pairing and good team operations - pitstops, strategies etc. As for the 8 tenths I meant it more in terms of 8 tenths over some mythical baseline car. If Ferrari managed to get 6 tenths worth with their own development and RB 7 tenths.....now maybe its not worth Mercedes money.
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Dec 19, 2016 01:33
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AgentJotun posted:Totally wrong professor. What becomes more important is a good driver pairing and good team operations - pitstops, strategies etc. The scenario you suggested actually exists in the real world and works out exactly like Mr. Post said.
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Dec 19, 2016 01:49
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I think he's trying to suggest that it would make the delta between cars smaller than that of driver skill/speed. But yeah, his idea won't achieve that goal.
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Dec 19, 2016 01:55
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I am trying to say that but i dont see why it wouldnt work. Or atleast largely contribute to the goal.
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Dec 19, 2016 02:15
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Tl;dr f1 is bad and boring we can't stop watching
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Dec 19, 2016 02:58
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iospace posted:Tl;dr f1 is bad and boring we can't stop watching There are entire seasons of F1 where I watch 3-4 GPs and just keep up by reading the results/watching highlights afterwards, there needs to be a good reason to get up at 5 am. MotoGP on the other hand, totally worth it. Especially this season.
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Dec 19, 2016 06:41
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IanTheM posted:There are entire seasons of F1 where I watch 3-4 GPs and just keep up by reading the results/watching highlights afterwards, there needs to be a good reason to get up at 5 am. MotoGP on the other hand, totally worth it. Especially this season. I used to get up religiously for every qualifying and race from 2008 until 2011, I stopped after that and haven't looked back since
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Dec 19, 2016 06:59
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I'm moving to a race-highlights-only viewing schedule next season
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Dec 19, 2016 07:01
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I hereby move to take watching races live behind the shed. All in favor?
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Dec 19, 2016 07:24
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Real F1 fans move to Europe and watch F1 over Sunday lunch.
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Dec 19, 2016 10:45
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F1.gif 
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Dec 19, 2016 11:01
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Khablam posted:Also all cars should have sprinklers on the front to increase overtaking.
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Dec 19, 2016 11:07
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