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Also adding new missions to a single-player game as DLC is pretty different from adding new pieces to a chessboard that you have to pay to unlock. (It's also loving dumb when League of Legends does it.)
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Dec 22, 2016 18:35
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Kwilty posted:Fallout 4, Bioshock, BF1, really a long list of games that do this same poo poo. Yeah it's lovely, but why wouldn't Capcom do it when the business model has been so successful for other games? because fighting games and other competitive games traditionally don't come with a fraction of their options if you purchase at full price. you don't need to grind matches or pay 5 dollars to unlock the AWP in CS, and in chess I don't need to play 200 games before I can get bishops. having a handful of DLC characters like in guilty gear is bad enough, but having 26 total characters with 10 of them being DLC is pretty egregious. add to this the fact that the game will be "supported" until 2020 actually just means that there will be an additional 10-15 characters added to the roster if they keep their current pace with around 40 characters, with only 16 coming with the base, full price game. This is a straight up free-to-play model, but everything is monetized, and the season pass doesn't even cover everything. This would be a completely different situation if the base game was free with every component being monetized. the season passes are 30 dollars. they are planning on having 3 more seasons for a total of 5. the price for an incomplete package here is something like 200 dollars, without colors, without stages, without costumes. for being a featureless mess of a game it sure is expensive
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Dec 22, 2016 18:37
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ZenVulgarity posted:Is game good yet it no
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Dec 22, 2016 18:57
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I think we're getting close to the point where they'll release some kind of free to play version since the base game is like $15. Although it's entirely possible that they'll just make an even more loving neutered version as the free to play game. Wasn't there a thing data mined out of the latest patch that said something about a trial?
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Dec 22, 2016 18:59
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I have spent an embarrassingly large amount of money on this game, and i think that justifies me trashing it, even if I only play it once in a while
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Dec 22, 2016 19:02
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lol what happened to this game? Dog Hausu posted:I think we're getting close to the point where they'll release some kind of free to play version since the base game is like $15. Although it's entirely possible that they'll just make an even more loving neutered version as the free to play game. Just do what DOA did and have Ken/Ryu for free while the rest of the cast is on monthly rotations. Add Chun and Gief to the permanently uncloaked characters.
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Dec 22, 2016 19:08
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All cast f2p, specials are microtransactions. 25c a fireball, 50c for a dp.
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Dec 22, 2016 19:11
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i think f2p with a limited cast makes a fighting game worthless and you should only do it if youre dumb, ugly and also a westerner
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Dec 22, 2016 19:23
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Zand posted:because fighting games and other competitive games traditionally don't come with a fraction of their options if you purchase at full price. you don't need to grind matches or pay 5 dollars to unlock the AWP in CS, and in chess I don't need to play 200 games before I can get bishops. having a handful of DLC characters like in guilty gear is bad enough, but having 26 total characters with 10 of them being DLC is pretty egregious. add to this the fact that the game will be "supported" until 2020 actually just means that there will be an additional 10-15 characters added to the roster if they keep their current pace with around 40 characters, with only 16 coming with the base, full price game. This is a straight up free-to-play model, but everything is monetized, and the season pass doesn't even cover everything. This would be a completely different situation if the base game was free with every component being monetized. Counterpoint, League of Legends
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Dec 22, 2016 19:32
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dangerdoom volvo posted:i think f2p with a limited cast makes a fighting game worthless and you should only do it if youre dumb, ugly and also a westerner Capcom: well 2 out 3 ain't bad. Hold my sake.
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Dec 22, 2016 19:34
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sfv should have at least had the fireballs to have been f2p where you pay for characters
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Dec 22, 2016 19:34
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AnonSpore posted:Counterpoint, League of Legends league doesnt charge for base game, so, me in quoted post posted:This would be a completely different situation if the base game was free with every component being monetized. and the league model sucks compared to dota 2 for a competitive game. the only reason it works for league is because the characters are a samey mess of interchangeable garbage
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Dec 22, 2016 19:34
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Zand posted:league doesnt charge for base game, so, I only remembered that they used to sell a boxed copy of League Also yeah League sucks
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Dec 22, 2016 19:39
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it really does feel like Capcom is being forced to tank sfv5. like does someone have leverage on them?
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Dec 22, 2016 19:42
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Harada has Ono's family hostage
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Dec 22, 2016 19:43
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And the League model is not the model to emulate, the DOTA2 one is. (All game content unlocked, tonnes of cosmetic options with rules about maintaining recognisation, semi-random unlocks.)
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Dec 22, 2016 19:44
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Zelder posted:it really does feel like Capcom is being forced to tank sfv5. like does someone have leverage on them? Never attribute to malice that which is readily explained by incompetence.
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Dec 22, 2016 19:44
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Incidental: Did they fix DirectInput yet?
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Dec 22, 2016 19:46
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Shockeh posted:Incidental: Did they fix DirectInput yet? Yes.
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Dec 22, 2016 19:48
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Shockeh posted:And the League model is not the model to emulate, the DOTA2 one is. (All game content unlocked, tonnes of cosmetic options with rules about maintaining recognisation, semi-random unlocks.) The DOTA model is impossible to emulate unless you have Valve or Blizzard money + market share tbh though, hasn't Capcom lost a bunch of money? Not that what they're doing right now is good or anything, just sayin.
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Dec 22, 2016 19:49
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Saint Freak posted:All cast f2p, specials are microtransactions. 25c a fireball, 50c for a dp.
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Dec 22, 2016 19:50
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They'd have to make DP invincible again.
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Dec 22, 2016 19:53
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It's 75 cents for an invincible dp buddy
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Dec 22, 2016 19:55
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The model they're going for would've been fine if either the game didn't cost $60 or if they didn't price new characters so much higher compared to the cost of SF4 DLC. But they did both of those things and also made their game bad and keep making it worse.
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Dec 22, 2016 19:56
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Plus your mom already has a trademark on 50 cent dp's.
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Dec 22, 2016 19:57
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Intel&Sebastian posted:None of those games were released with like 1/4th the functionality of the last iteration of the series much less other games in their genres. In the same respect though, the only thing they are freemium are the characters and additional aesthetics. I get the complaint if they were charging for the challenges or something...
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Dec 22, 2016 20:02
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Kwilty posted:In the same respect though, the only thing they are freemium are the characters and additional aesthetics. I get the complaint if they were charging for the challenges or something... characters are tools in your toolbox. people with less access to characters are at a competitive disadvantage relative to people with characters. If you're just a passerby with no intention of playing this game in a head-to-head format or interested in trying to do well in an inherently competitive game than this probably makes no sense. But this genre is built on 2 players fighting eachother where the asymmetry comes from that character or options that are picked. The asymmetry should not and historically has not included access to characters or options until very recent times. SFV has more monetization for competitive tools than any other game in the genre.
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Dec 22, 2016 20:06
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Intel&Sebastian posted:Plus your mom already has a trademark on 50 cent dp's. drat.
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Dec 22, 2016 20:09
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Zand posted:characters are tools in your toolbox. people with less access to characters are at a competitive disadvantage relative to people with characters. If you're just a passerby with no intention of playing this game in a head-to-head format or interested in trying to do well in an inherently competitive game than this probably makes no sense. But this genre is built on 2 players fighting eachother where the asymmetry comes from that character or options that are picked. The asymmetry should not and historically has not included access to characters or options until very recent times. SFV has more monetization for competitive tools than any other game in the genre. People main one or maybe two characters. It's not a big deal. Get over it. I remember the same arguments being made about LoL, where matchups are often 'Gief-level, and limited character selection just doesn't matter in the long run. At all. You gotta be Faker-tier to be able to play everybody at a high level. Even Nuckledu only has ~3 characters.
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Dec 22, 2016 20:10
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Kwilty posted:In the same respect though, the only thing they are freemium are the characters and additional aesthetics. I get the complaint if they were charging for the challenges or something... you can't learn matchups without all the characters because you require them to do setups in training mode recording, or to practice character specific combos on. you also can't learn their moves on your own and rely on playing others online to learn what other characters options are.
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Dec 22, 2016 20:11
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fwiw my primary gripe is the dlc model is both prohibitively expensive and modeled after a f2p game after a gated 60 dollar purchase which is ridiculously expensive. the "full game" cost 90 dollars outright in a single year. i have nothing against expansion content costing money down the line to fund a competitive game, but there becomes a point where the barrier for entry is too high. sfv has that issue.
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Dec 22, 2016 20:14
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Corbeau posted:People main one or maybe two characters. It's not a big deal. Get over it. I remember the same arguments being made about LoL, where matchups are often 'Gief-level, and limited character selection just doesn't matter in the long run. At all. You gotta be Faker-tier to be able to play everybody at a high level. Even Nuckledu only has ~3 characters. you cant even practice in training mode to learn situations without buying the characters. if you cant see how not having access to characters limits you competitively... like with or without someone spelling it out for you, you're hopeless. 200 dollar fighting game lol
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Dec 22, 2016 20:14
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Corbeau posted:People main one or maybe two characters. It's not a big deal. Get over it. I remember the same arguments being made about LoL, where matchups are often 'Gief-level, and limited character selection just doesn't matter in the long run. At all. You gotta be Faker-tier to be able to play everybody at a high level. Even Nuckledu only has ~3 characters. 
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Dec 22, 2016 20:15
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who the gently caress is faker
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Dec 22, 2016 20:16
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Not being able to use dlc characters in the training mode to find out how to counter X thing, is a disaster.
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Dec 22, 2016 20:17
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Okay, I grant that not having them in training mode sucks.
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Dec 22, 2016 20:18
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Zand posted:characters are tools in your toolbox. people with less access to characters are at a competitive disadvantage relative to people with characters. If you're just a passerby with no intention of playing this game in a head-to-head format or interested in trying to do well in an inherently competitive game than this probably makes no sense. But this genre is built on 2 players fighting eachother where the asymmetry comes from that character or options that are picked. The asymmetry should not and historically has not included access to characters or options until very recent times. SFV has more monetization for competitive tools than any other game in the genre. I don't think this is really true at all, at least compared to a MOBA. FGs are 1v1 multiplayer where you are blind to the other pick until after you make yours with mirrors allowed. You aren't picking a character to counter another or work with another, like what DOTA and League are supposed to be doing in their long rear end pre-game drafting parts. I think you have less options only in the sense that you have less of the game than is available but this isn't really different than any other DLC. Like I don't see how it is imbalanced or anything like that. Although it would be good to be able to practice mode against DLC characters (they should add this) just to see their buttons without having to wait out seeing the character in a casual queue or something.
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Dec 22, 2016 20:20
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GOOD TIMES ON METH posted:I don't think this is really true at all, at least compared to a MOBA. FGs are 1v1 multiplayer where you are blind to the other pick until after you make yours with mirrors allowed. You aren't picking a character to counter another or work with another, like what DOTA and League are supposed to be doing in their long rear end pre-game drafting parts. you can counter pick in fight games some chars have better MUs than other chars that's the main reason why someone would want to have multiple chars in their pocket we are talking about this from a tournament competitive perspective not from online ranked perspective where you get matched up with someone randomly
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Dec 22, 2016 20:23
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If i was committed to a fighting game that was scheduled to cost 200 dollars for the characters alone and even more for the complete package I'd probably feel the need to defend it too but I dont think my brain is limber enough to justify it. I mean, I could purchase literally every iteration of guilty gear fg franchise for that price, or every previous penultimate street fighter game for that price, or the entire tekken series, etcGOOD TIMES ON METH posted:I don't think this is really true at all, at least compared to a MOBA. FGs are 1v1 multiplayer where you are blind to the other pick until after you make yours with mirrors allowed. You aren't picking a character to counter another or work with another, like what DOTA and League are supposed to be doing in their long rear end pre-game drafting parts. you're wrong. access to characters is access to options thanks everyone who has decided to out themselves
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Dec 22, 2016 20:23
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Zand posted:you're wrong btw If you want to be competitive why would you not buy the characters?
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Dec 22, 2016 20:23
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