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"Guys, black people have some serious problems in this country as a result of systemic issues. Also, gently caress college students, am I right? Ha ha!" This whole snippy attack comes off as really jarring considering how sympathetically he's been portraying Sam and his difficulty navigating through the world of superheroes as a black man. He's previously suggested most of the #TakeBackTheShield backlash against Sam is racial in nature, and Rage is portrayed as someone who, while more radical than Sam, isn't necessarily wrong. The issue even ends with the cops about to blame Rage for a robbery he helped to foil. It's all very frustrating to me, because addressing modern issues, when done well, is something that has always separated Marvel from DC. This isn't the first time Spencer has gotten weird like this -- some of his Avengers stuff came off as pretty disgusting -- but this was just incoherent. For example, why make the students so violent? They could have just used a Songbird-style device to steal the speaker's voice or something, which would be ideologically consistent and also actually relevant as a superhero twist on no-platforming.
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Jan 5, 2017 08:28
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vseslav.botkin posted:"Guys, black people have some serious problems in this country as a result of systemic issues. Also, gently caress college students, am I right? Ha ha!" Never allow a fanatic to write about an issue.
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Jan 5, 2017 08:52
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https://twitter.com/nickspencer/status/816681806640447488 Aww. Poor puppy.
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Jan 5, 2017 09:01
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don't think he's asking for pity here he's been about as dismissive of arguments presented against him as he was of the right wing assholes who got mad over the start of the book
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Jan 5, 2017 09:05
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I'm spying into his room right now and saw him turn away from his computer with a tear in his eye. edit: By 'right now' I meant 16 hours ago.
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Jan 5, 2017 09:11
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I feel Nick Spencer won't be writing Captain America a year from now. Marvel is going to sour on him fast when one of their editors finds a hot new talent for Trump's America.
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Jan 5, 2017 09:58
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The Cap event is gonna be a hit. What's more enticing than the prospect of Spidey impaling this guy?
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Jan 5, 2017 10:04
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Teenage Fansub posted:The Cap event is gonna be a hit. What's more enticing than the prospect of Spidey impaling this guy? I will admit the idea of Spidey impaling Nick Spencer is appealing.
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Jan 5, 2017 10:13
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Who would have thought a failed politician is bad at conveying his political thought process and morals into storytelling. When you piss off everyone in the perspective from the alt right to bernie bros to hillarymen centrists with dumb poo poo like nazi cap and the SJW campus villains maybe your the problem? EDIT: Like his core arguments hilariously aren't even that radical or cutting edge. It's milquetoast as gently caress actually. It just lacks any form of nuance or subtly or even actual humor that self aware, and not dripping with personal baggage in this case. NutritiousSnack fucked around with this message at 10:36 on Jan 5, 2017 |
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Jan 5, 2017 10:31
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I don't read the Sam Wilson book but the Steve Rogers book is really good. And I like most of what I've read by Spencer except for his first stuff on Ultimate X-Men. His Ant-Man books were great and I still miss them. Also The Fix is probably my favorite book Image is currently putting out.
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Jan 5, 2017 10:34
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Well I thought it was funny. I mean a person yelling "trigger warning" when a grenade is being thrown is on-the-nose but then I'm the kind of idiot who laughs when Stephanie Brown says "Spoiler Alert"
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Jan 5, 2017 10:37
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NutritiousSnack posted:Who would have thought a failed politician is bad at conveying his political thought process and morals into storytelling. When you piss off everyone in the perspective from the alt right to bernie bros to hillarymen centrists with dumb poo poo like nazi cap and the SJW campus villains maybe your the problem? The biggest problem I see is he is just using terms to use them, they don't actually seem relevant to what he is trying to do them but he knows they are a thing so he uses them. I am not even offended just confused.
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Jan 5, 2017 10:40
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Nova 2 is amazing and I say this as someone who knows absolutely nothing about Rich Nova.
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Jan 5, 2017 10:40
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I think it is really cool they're allowing a 13 year old to write the new Venom series.
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Jan 5, 2017 10:41
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vseslav.botkin posted:It's all very frustrating to me, because addressing modern issues, when done well, is something that has always separated Marvel from DC. This is nostalgia talking here. Marvel's always had the balls to do it, but we only remember the really good stuff and the really bad stuff by nature. Admittedly having one or two good comics for every ten or so failures (embarrassing as they are) is actually pretty good. The problem is thanks to the insane editorial issues and constant events it's cut down on the "one or two good books" while keeping the rest of the drek
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Jan 5, 2017 10:41
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CharlestheHammer posted:The biggest problem I see is he is just using terms to use them, they don't actually seem relevant to what he is trying to do them but he knows they are a thing so he uses them. I tried to convey I'm not offended either just annoyed. It's liking overhearing a political argument in middle school or on some show from a bad pundit/thinkpiece writer.
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Jan 5, 2017 10:44
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TFRazorsaw posted:of progressives I thought it was funny. Just those pages, mind you, I haven't read the issue. I'm not hard to amuse.
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Jan 5, 2017 10:46
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I do like that, no matter who you are, what you believe, how you feel, everyone can be unified and come together on the simple premise of saying, "gently caress Nick Spencer, the utter ponce."Pureauthor posted:Nova 2 is amazing and I say this as someone who knows absolutely nothing about Rich Nova. If you have the time/money you should go back and check out Rich's old stuff, I think the recommended reading list I saw was Nova Vol 1,2,4, Annihilation, Thanos Imperative. Also, have this page. 
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Jan 5, 2017 10:47
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I actually can sort of see the humor of that "trigger warning" panel as well, just 'cuz of how wacky and arbitrary it was. But then the "gag" just keeps going and digging in its heels and it's like...are we really doing this? Really? It's kinda hard to express just what it is about the scene -- which is just kinda whimsical and droll at the end of the day -- that sets off all my "  " reflexes, but I think it just ultimately comes down to the golden comedy rule: punch up, not down. Making fun of people with more power than you is funny. Making fun of people with less power than you, even with the most innocuous of intentions, is not.And then it all just comes dangerously close to the "both sides of social issues are just as bad!" middle-ground mindset that's just really obnoxious even at the best of the times, and particularly tone-deaf after the last couple months we've had out here in the real world.
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Jan 5, 2017 11:15
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NutritiousSnack posted:This is nostalgia talking here. Marvel's always had the balls to do it, but we only remember the really good stuff and the really bad stuff by nature. Admittedly having one or two good comics for every ten or so failures (embarrassing as they are) is actually pretty good. The problem is thanks to the insane editorial issues and constant events it's cut down on the "one or two good books" while keeping the rest of the drek Well, I was specifically thinking of the Superhero Registration Act, which I thought was an interesting way of reflecting how the world was changing after 9/11, even if they didn't always do so in the most coherent fashion (and they totally hosed up the dismount, of course). And honestly, I'd rather have Spencer trying and failing than yet another issue of Steve Rogers Captain America punching a mugger while giving a speech or whatever. I don't know, I find Spencer odd, because I genuinely enjoy his work like Superior Foes and The Fix, but it tends to come off as consistently mean-spirited. I guess the easiest comparison is Ennis, who consistently manages to find these warm, sympathetic moments for his characters even when the overall work is disgusting or horrifying.
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Jan 5, 2017 11:22
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I love a good phone panel. It conveys art and text, while letting you imagine what's being said on the other end.
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Jan 5, 2017 11:31
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BrianWilly posted:It's kinda hard to express just what it is about the scene -- which is just kinda whimsical and droll at the end of the day -- that sets off all my " Alternatively, you can be Frankie Boyle and make fun of people with Down's syndrome, but you're in the clear (with the same people who called you out on it, no less!) so long as you finish off with, "gently caress Maggie Thatcher, amirite?" 
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Jan 5, 2017 11:32
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vseslav.botkin posted:And honestly, I'd rather have Spencer trying and failing than yet another issue of Steve Rogers Captain America punching a mugger while giving a speech or whatever. Outside of the fact I'm utterly annoyed with Spencer and done with him at this point, I agree. I'm glad Marvel is letting writers do this, I just wish event comics stop coming so often so writers have more room to breathe and that the influx of new talent coming in has a couple of people who do this well. I'm just not going to pretend this isn't bad and cringey
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Jan 5, 2017 12:15
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BrianWilly posted:I actually can sort of see the humor of that "trigger warning" panel as well, just 'cuz of how wacky and arbitrary it was. But then the "gag" just keeps going and digging in its heels and it's like...are we really doing this? Really? It's the part later where Sam apologizes if he was 'ever like that' which put it firmly in the absolute shitpile for me, like thank god the good ones are there apologizing for the bad ones am I right? You not only get to be the South Park of comics but also say gently caress you to previous character work in one fell swoop.
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Jan 5, 2017 13:26
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Wasn't Nick Spencer the shitehawk that drove Ultimate Comics: X-Men into a ditch until it was rescued by Brian Wood? Like, he was basically kicked off the comic for writing poo poo that made zero loving sense?
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Jan 5, 2017 16:06
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"""'rescued"""" by brian wood
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Jan 5, 2017 16:10
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Blockhouse posted:"""'rescued"""" by brian wood Rescued in the way that an EMT might rescue someone that was in a car crash - it saves 'em but it ain't pretty. UC:X was an okay series once it got taken away from Spencer. It was astonishingly poo poo with Quicksilver having visions of his dead sister (who was drawn with some insane proportions), Kitty Pryde saying 'this is the story of how I became the most wanted terrorist in the world' and then never following up on it, an Egyptian crypt opening up somewhere and then never being visited again. It was 12 issues of entirely disconnected things. Then when Wood took it over he more or tried not so much spin gold from lead as spin lead from poo poo and he did a pretty good job of it. Invented some neat new mutants, created a sentient seed, had some neat cross over things happen, engaged in some superheroics and whatnot. Had the team set up a base on a mesa in the middle of arid no where and show what mutants could do if they were just left to their own devices. It was neat.
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Jan 5, 2017 16:14
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I think what was kind of jarring about the Social Justice New Warriors or whatever is that most of the time Nick Spencer is having his heroes fight "supervillains" based on "bad people" in real life. The Sons of the Serpent are whatever goofy militia/border control that hates Mexicans is that gets mentioned in the news. Serpent Society is an evil corporation that has so much money they can let people and get away with it and they're just too big to fail. Fake Bill O'Reilly and Fake Ann Coulter and etc. represent the right wing media of "fake news" or whatever. Americops is an incredibly hamhanded roll-up of for-profit prisons, private military contractors, the militarization of police, police brutality, unequal sentencing, etc. Last month's issue was an attack on revenge porn and the Fappening using Lady Stilt-Man's attempted suicide. And now this month, after taking down corrupt CEOs and politicians and generals, Nick Spencer turns his eye to those loving kids protesting against hate speech on campus. Just like all of those other groups, they just want to kill everyone who disagrees with them!
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Jan 5, 2017 16:24
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Edge & Christian posted:I think what was kind of jarring about the Social Justice New Warriors or whatever is that most of the time Nick Spencer is having his heroes fight "supervillains" based on "bad people" in real life. I think this is his attempt to go "I'm nuanced on this position." after all, the issue basically ends by saying the Kids after just confused about how to go about what they want to do. But instead, because he's Nick Spencer and poo poo, it's just cringe inducing. The side that he typically mocks goes "What the gently caress is this horrid garbage?" and the side that he typically supports go "What the gently caress is this horrid garbage?" And then everyone takes a deep breath and realizes they've come to an understanding. Even if there's no God or Buddha, there will always be Nick Spencer, and he's loving garbage.
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Jan 5, 2017 16:36
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X-O posted:I don't read the Sam Wilson book but the Steve Rogers book is really good. And I like most of what I've read by Spencer except for his first stuff on Ultimate X-Men. His Ant-Man books were great and I still miss them. Yeah Spencer is pretty great with humor books and heist stories. The smart thing to do would be to distance him from anything remotely political and just let him work with something along the lines of the Thunderbolts or the Frightful Four.
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Jan 5, 2017 16:50
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I get what he was trying to do though, even if he did it poorly. The message isn't even about extremism, well not the main message at least. The story's about the new Falcon (who has had very little focus since his introductory arc) learning that being a hero sometimes entails defending assholes or people you don't agree with. So he has to save the very Coulter-type calling for his deportation from terrorism. And sure, yeah, making the terrorists into stereotype college progressives yelling about how they can't even was It's not a great issue of the series nor a good example of Spencer's writing, but I don't think it's that bad, is what I'm saying, I guess? TwoPair fucked around with this message at 17:07 on Jan 5, 2017 |
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Jan 5, 2017 17:05
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Codependent Poster posted:Anyone who doesn't know and love Death's Head is dead to me. Sorry bro. I've enjoyed our pseudo internet friendship since we root for the same sports teams, but I...I understand...
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Jan 5, 2017 17:46
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This is completely unsurprising from the guy who had Captain America attack Wikileaks.
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Jan 5, 2017 18:04
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TwoPair posted:I get what he was trying to do though, even if he did it poorly. The message isn't even about extremism, well not the main message at least. The story's about the new Falcon (who has had very little focus since his introductory arc) learning that being a hero sometimes entails defending assholes or people you don't agree with. quote:So he has to save the very Coulter-type calling for his deportation from terrorism. And sure, yeah, making the terrorists into stereotype college progressives yelling about how they can't even was You can do a full of wacky political satire superhero comic where Maria Hill tells so many flippant jokes she sounds like she's auditioning to take over Weekend Update from Dennis Miller and all of your villains are like oafish dumbasses complaining about pressing 1 for English when they're tryin' to get their dad gum Innernet workin' so they's cahn play them crazy ol' click click click Warcrafts. You can do a superhero book that addresses SERIOUS ISSUES and REAL WORLD IMPACTS too if you want, but when you veer from issue to issue or page to page between "lol here's my writing packet for the Daily Show remote pieces" and "CHILD TRAFFICKING IS REAL. CAN. YOU. HANDLE. THIS. REALNESS?" it's a real mess. quote:It's not a great issue of the series nor a good example of Spencer's writing, but I don't think it's that bad, is what I'm saying, I guess?
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Jan 5, 2017 18:16
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The issue was dumb, but the ensuing outrage was even dumber.
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Jan 5, 2017 18:32
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Yeah I read it and I'm not so wild on what they did with this one.
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Jan 5, 2017 18:52
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Lurdiak posted:This is completely unsurprising from the guy who had Captain America attack Wikileaks. But this was the right thing. 
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Jan 5, 2017 19:25
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SilverSupernova posted:The issue was dumb, but the ensuing outrage was even dumber. I'm not outraged. I just think it's poo poo.
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Jan 5, 2017 19:28
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I had no idea the Nick Spencer stuff was supposed to be ironic tbh, but to be fair I also didn't read any of the book other than those panels.
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Jan 5, 2017 19:43
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Mr Hootington posted:But this was the right thing. 1) A group led by probably-not-actually-but-maybe USAgent break into a SHIELD office and kill a ton of people in order to steal a list of all of the SHIELD undercover agents. 2) They then leak this list (not so much a list of crimes committed by SHIELD, just the names I think?) and go "hey gently caress SHIELD, here are the names and cover names for every SHIELD undercover agent, maybe someone will kill all of them?" Then then the Avengers to save some of the undercover guys but fail for PLOT TWIST reasons and then Cap and co. extrajudicially beat the poo poo out of the Wikileaks dudes and tie them up and USAgent goes "but some of stuff SHIELD does is bad, and they are probably going to torture or disappear me" and Cap goes "hey man, not my problem, don't mess with the bull if you don't want the horns, what you did was wrong and let me expound for a page or two about why Wikileaks is bad." Like yes if in 2011 Chelsea Manning murdered a bunch of US intelligence officers to steal a list of how America had a bunch of secret spies in Al Queda and other terrorist organizations and Assange and Manning went "KILL 'EM ALL, BOYS" then yeah, great takedown of Wikileaks. Otherwise it's a disservice to strawmen to call the group in SA (or most of Spencer's "political" works) strawmen, Edge & Christian fucked around with this message at 20:01 on Jan 5, 2017 |
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Jan 5, 2017 19:59
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