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Hello goons, I am about to start a new job (fingers crossed), which apparently means getting another bike. I am keeping my Brutale and want to get a sumo. My goal is to push my limits on a bike that can take punishment from being crashed. It sounds like sumo is a good idea. In particular DRZ 400 SM sounds like a good choice. Is there any reason for me to consider other sumos? Looking at craigslist, this DRZ seems to have sensible mods. https://sfbay.craigslist.org/pen/mcy/5938842460.html How would I go about inspecting them to make sure PO did not gently caress up? captainOrbital posted:I mean, who cares? It's not as pretty as an MV or a Bonnie, but whatevz. It's better. As MV owner I can certainly say that FZ-09 is very comfy and much more reliable. It's a great bike, especially for the price.
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Jan 10, 2017 23:47
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pokie posted:Hello goons, The canonical counterpoint to the DRZ is the WR250X. It's easy to find people endlessly arguing both bikes' virtues. They can do highway but you won't really have margin for overtaking. On that particular bike, the carb is a big plus; they're expensive and supposedly really wake the bike up (I've only ridden a DRZ with that carb already on it). However I would be hesitant about buying a bike with a big bore kit. Did it need the kit because it was blown up? How was the workmanship when installing the kit? Are big bore DRZ engines still reliable? Is the added power worth those risks? Cursedshitbox would be able to tell you more. However the rest of the mods suggest the guy knows what he's doing. Sure seems expensive for a dirt bike from 2007 though. I agree that the DRZ is a good choice though, if your goal is a bike that you won't feel too bad about crashing, I wouldn't recommend a 690SMC. High Protein fucked around with this message at 23:57 on Jan 10, 2017 |
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Jan 10, 2017 23:54
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Thanks. WR250x is out because the only one for sale is 150 miles away and costs more than the three nearby DRZs. I am not buying new given my goals for this bike.
pokie fucked around with this message at 00:01 on Jan 11, 2017 |
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Jan 10, 2017 23:58
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drat, that FJ 09 is ticking all the right boxes, outside of a retro look. It's a little spendy, but it seems to address all the issues I'd have with the FZ. The ABS and TC/SC are nice touches that aren't really on any of the bikes I was looking at, either.
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Jan 11, 2017 00:00
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The retro-lookin FZ-09...the XSR900? That one has ABS and TC, and it should be less expensive than the FJ. No big dad screen tho.
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Jan 11, 2017 00:01
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I guess you could look for older KTMs and Huskies, if you don't need the stoic reliability of the DRZ and are willing to trade for a bit more fun. 625SMC, 660SMC, 640 LC4 supermoto, Husky SM610, etc. The 660 is a sick bike, kick start only.
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Jan 11, 2017 00:02
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High Protein posted:I guess you could look for older KTMs and Huskies, if you don't need the stoic reliability of the DRZ and are willing to trade for a bit more fun. 625SMC, 660SMC, 640 LC4 supermoto, Husky SM610, etc. The 660 is a sick bike, kick start only. Looked those up. There is a Husky sm610 https://sfbay.craigslist.org/pen/mcy/5953484140.html And a couple LC4s like this https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/mcd/5930859281.html Others I could not find. It sounds like the main advantage is more power. I figure I probably don't need that. One of the appeals of DRZ is popularity. So it should be easy to find parts, knowledgeable riders, etc.
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Jan 11, 2017 00:23
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pokie posted:Looked those up. There is a Husky sm610 https://sfbay.craigslist.org/pen/mcy/5953484140.html True, the DRZ is basically the Ninja 250 of the sumo world.
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Jan 11, 2017 00:28
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The DRZ is an absolute dog, though I've only ridden a stock one. They are very tractorish, too. However, that can be a good thing, depending on who you are. If power mods really do give it the extra pep, it might be worth a shot. Cursedshitbox's DRZ is why I still love them even though I've ridden one. WR250X should definitely be on your list. I went out of state to get mine. People who have them don't want to part with them. I've never worked on a more elegantly engineered bike, and FI along with the low weight is a major plus. It's an absolute dog unmodified, too, but a fun dog. https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/mcy/5949015106.html This is set up really well. https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/mcy/5952307129.html a solid deal https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/mcy/5950043541.html dirt setup would be worth having, but not super needed.
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Jan 11, 2017 00:29
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Coydog posted:The DRZ is an absolute dog, though I've only ridden a stock one. They are very tractorish, too. However, that can be a good thing, depending on who you are. If power mods really do give it the extra pep, it might be worth a shot. Cursedshitbox's DRZ is why I still love them even though I've ridden one. I must have hosed up my search somehow not to see these. Thanks! How does one go about deciding whether to get WR or DRZ?
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Jan 11, 2017 00:32
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I'm so beyond biased I really couldn't tell you. They really are two polar opposites of the same bracket of supermoto, and people will argue back and forth which one is better until the sun burns out. It comes down to what speaks to you personally when you look at the bike and how it's designed. The WRx struck me immediately with it's reliability and styling, as well as being very compact. It's a really incredible bike, and will go wherever you point it, and do whatever you ask it to do. I really liked everything about mine, except for the gas capacity (which can be fixed). The DRZ is the bigger, heavier, low tech option. I really see the appeal in that, too. Carbs make power mods cheaper, if not easier (but you are only doing it once). While I never want carbs again, they aren't as bad as people say. The DRZ is pretty metal in a "bush bike" kind of way. I think the WRx is the vastly better bike, and they typically sell for way lower than the DRZ because the general market thinks "hurrr 400 is more than 250". They hold their value, though, for sure. The aqua EL backlight on the gauge/dash thing is really pretty, too. My buddy with the stock DRZ rode my modded WRx and got off it blathering on about how incredibly fast and torquey it was. I personally found the light weight and smaller size to be more manageable.
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Jan 11, 2017 01:05
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I thought of two cheap/low performance supermotos: XT660X. Might be able to find this cheap, reliable, probably faster than a DRZ/WR. But heavy and not a 'real' sumo. BWM G650 XMoto. I've seen these go cheap and it's a good bike. Don't know about parts availability though.
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Jan 11, 2017 01:13
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High Protein posted:I thought of two cheap/low performance supermotos: I was not able to find either on my market. Sumo seems like a smaller niche than I thought. I guess there is a strong sumo presence on SA. Coydog posted:I think the WRx is the vastly better bike, and they typically sell for way lower than the DRZ because the general market thinks "hurrr 400 is more than 250". They hold their value, though, for sure. The aqua EL backlight on the gauge/dash thing is really pretty, too. My buddy with the stock DRZ rode my modded WRx and got off it blathering on about how incredibly fast and torquey it was. I personally found the light weight and smaller size to be more manageable. What about using the bike to transfer skills to a naked sport? Would you say they are both fine for improving cornering skill and confidence? Also, which of the craigslist option of wrx that you listed would you choose?
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Jan 11, 2017 01:48
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How are DR650s? I wanna some shitass dual sport down the road.
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Jan 11, 2017 02:02
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Fun in sumo trim, but very expensive for the performance you get. Suspension terrible.
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Jan 11, 2017 02:16
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It's a shame neither Honda or Yamaha want to make a 650 thumper that's got modern tech.
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Jan 11, 2017 02:24
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captainOrbital posted:The retro-lookin FZ-09...the XSR900? That one has ABS and TC, and it should be less expensive than the FJ. Wow, I think this is the bike I need. It's only moderately more expensive than the CB1100 and it's both massively more powerful and it's got important safety features. I'm sold.
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Jan 11, 2017 03:24
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pokie posted:I was not able to find either on my market. Sumo seems like a smaller niche than I thought. I guess there is a strong sumo presence on SA. A sumo will teach you more about sporty riding than half a dozen sporty bikes in a row will. Source: I learned more on a 250 dual sport than in the previous eight years of riding powerful sporty bikes. The skills and feel 100% transfer over and it makes you way more comfortable with spinning up the rear, trailing the front brake and other shenanigans on a powerful bike that you're normally reluctant to attempt because the margin of error for learning is so narrow. Isolationist posted:Fun in sumo trim, but very expensive for the performance you get. Suspension terrible. They also feel incredibly tall even by dirtybike standards. For the same sort of cost you could get a yamaha TTR250 with vastly better suspension (and pretty much everything else). Availability in your area may vary.
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Jan 11, 2017 04:04
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Slavvy posted:They also feel incredibly tall even by dirtybike standards. Bull loving poo poo, it's the most manageable big dual sport I've ever sat on, and you know that's saying a lot for me  I felt better on it than the drz400sm (prob bc the drz suspension is way stiffer)
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Jan 11, 2017 04:35
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I strongly considered building up a DR650 sumo, as another option to just getting a 690. I'm glad I made the choice I did, but there is still a lot to love about a DR. It's still way more practical to just get a DRZ sumo, than make a DR sumo. Power will be about the same between them, as is tech and weight (though the DR wins by being even lower tech), but the DRZ has way better suspension and geometry. So if you want a bush piggy sumo, just get the DRZ. pokie posted:I was not able to find either on my market. Sumo seems like a smaller niche than I thought. I guess there is a strong sumo presence on SA. All three of those have such a high price. Our market is in the 4k range, but much closer to 4k than 5k. Doesn't matter, DRZ's regularly go for that and more around here, and thats just lunacy for what you are getting. I say shoot for the 5k one with the power mods. It's similar to how I had mine set up, and that is what you want. Try to pay no more than $4500. Listing is fresh, so he probably won't bite yet. Try. (I sold mine for 4k  ) After that, the 4500 one looks clean, but lacks all the power mods. The 3800 one looks like a shitshow, now that I see it. But LOL 3800 FIRM get out of here stalker. To mimic what slavvy said, and what is in the Sumo thread OP (which you should read because it's fun), a sumo will teach you so many transferable skills. It was my 3rd bike, and the EX250 had already taught me a lot, but off the top of my head it taught me: -Wheelies (mediocre ones) -Stoppies (terrible ones) -How to be comfortable if your back wheel slides out leaving a corner or is locked -How to be comfortable if your front loses some traction -How to shift your weight forward and back to safely clear obstacles on the fly (saved me from at least one bad crash) -general cornering -I'm not going to finish this list because I don't have all night. Plus, it showed me how enjoyable trailriding and off roading is, and off road is where I learned even more skills that made me even safer. Sumos are like cheat mode for motorcycles, and they forgive a lot of your mistakes (so you can learn from them not heal from them). Sure, they make you look like an absolute rockstar, but at the end of the day you are a vastly safer rider, and these skills transfer to other bikes. It doesn't need to transfer to other bikes, because when you are bored of the WRx or whatever, you'll only want to get a bigger supermoto. 
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Jan 11, 2017 04:39
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So I guess it comes down to wr250x vs DRZ400sm. If anyone wants to chime in, I am all ears.Coydog posted:It doesn't need to transfer to other bikes, because when you are bored of the WRx or whatever, you'll only want to get a bigger supermoto. Oh I am keeping Brutale for longer rides. I just found that it stifled my learning a bit since I am less willing to practice with an expensive bike with difficult to get parts.
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Jan 11, 2017 04:52
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M42 posted:Bull loving poo poo, it's the most manageable big dual sport I've ever sat on, and you know that's saying a lot for me Interesting! The one I rode was appropriately sprung for a middle aged man so maybe that took a lot of the factory sag out of it?
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Jan 11, 2017 04:52
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3 thou on a 434 is fine. if it had like 500 miles, yeah i'd go running, gently caress that. A lot of people just simply start throwing go fast poo poo at them because disposable income and its slow out of the box. 434 would make it a 94mm bore which is A-OK. go over 95 you start having reliability issues. a bbk/carb/cams do wake them up, but its still a drz at the end of the day. If you want to go fully retarded like I did, you can really get some poke outta em, but still a drz. WR is lighter, EFI, and has an aluminum frame. I've never ridden one personally so I can't give you a very fair comparison. I've ridden several drzs in various stages of stock to unstock. Stock they're very very meh but you can flog it mercilessly without a single gently caress given. They're the Honda Civic of supermoto. Dr650? gently caress yeah they rule for midget people. My spouse owns a 07' model thats lowered ontop of lowered ontop of loving low. I'm a tall bastid and hate riding it through rough poo poo for him, but it does the job. Supermoto? ehhh, depends on your use. They're heavy. His has a 790 kit on it, and id say it feels similar to that of a 434 drz. the PO handled the suspension and its so loving niiiiice on the highway. E: I've put 16 thou on mine, and aside from a lovely aftermarket cam chain, and me failing to notice a stupid rivet mis-located on a MLS headgasket, its been a pretty consistent moto. It puts up with my dumb bullshit happily. I'd like to start hauling the fucker to track days this spring. E2: you're bay area yea? if you want come rip mine around the block. I'm in Vallejo. cursedshitbox fucked around with this message at 06:19 on Jan 11, 2017 |
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Jan 11, 2017 05:45
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cursedshitbox posted:
Yes, I think we met at z3n's house. I am the dude with the mv agusta. Sure, I would love to come check it out. Message me at redacted pokie fucked around with this message at 06:25 on Jan 11, 2017 |
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Jan 11, 2017 06:16
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Coydog posted:I strongly considered building up a DR650 sumo, as another option to just getting a 690. I'm glad I made the choice I did, but there is still a lot to love about a DR. It's still way more practical to just get a DRZ sumo, than make a DR sumo. Power will be about the same between them, as is tech and weight (though the DR wins by being even lower tech), but the DRZ has way better suspension and geometry. So if you want a bush piggy sumo, just get the DRZ.
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Jan 11, 2017 06:31
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Isolationist posted:I'm $10k into a DR650 sumo build, can 100% confirm its not worth it and it'd be a million times smarter to just buy the right tool straight off the bat (KTM 690 SMC > 790 DR). Sup bottomless pit suzuki buddy 
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Jan 11, 2017 06:35
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Isolationist posted:I'm $10k into a DR650 sumo build  yo what the gently caressI'd love a katoom, but those are actually too big even with a shaved seat and correct suspension. Except for the 390 duke, which I want for the track someday...
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Jan 11, 2017 14:01
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Isolationist posted:I'm $10k into a DR650 sumo build, can 100% confirm its not worth it and it'd be a million times smarter to just buy the right tool straight off the bat (KTM 690 SMC > 790 DR). Well this has to be a good story. My opinion on WR vs DRZ is "Buy the reliable one". If you're gonna get deep into (street) sumo you're buying a 701 / 690 or whatever soon enough, if you're not, the power differential just won't matter.
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Jan 11, 2017 16:02
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Z3n posted:My opinion on WR vs DRZ is "Buy the reliable one". If you're gonna get deep into (street) sumo you're buying a 701 / 690 or whatever soon enough, if you're not, the power differential just won't matter. Which one do you think is more reliable?
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Jan 11, 2017 19:11
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See, that's what I want to know, too. The WRr/x is renowned for being stone cold reliable. It's a modern yamaha, of course it is. Valve adjustments every 26k relaible. The only thing that I've heard might go on the early ones is the fuel pump in high temps. It's a bike that will take you around the world with no issues. The DRZ seems about equal, for different reasons. It's been produced for decades, with little changes, and seems like it has AK-47 levels of reliability. I don't doubt that it is every bit as reliable as the WR, and wouldn't hesitate to circle the world on it either. Well maintained carbs are about as good as good EFI. Z3n knows way more than I about mechanical stuff on bikes, and bikes in general, so I really want his opinion. The WRx has 6 gears while the DRZ has 5, btw. That might be important to you.
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Jan 11, 2017 19:17
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So now I'm getting sucked into all the FZ platform bikes, like the XSR and FJ. Is there any real difference between the FJ09 and XSR900 besides fairing/looks and the like?
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Jan 11, 2017 19:33
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Re: SUMO chat. The word reliable keeps coming up, but everyone seems to be ignoring the Honda option? 
GnarlyCharlie4u fucked around with this message at 19:44 on Jan 11, 2017 |
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Jan 11, 2017 19:41
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call to action posted:So now I'm getting sucked into all the FZ platform bikes, like the XSR and FJ. Is there any real difference between the FJ09 and XSR900 besides fairing/looks and the like? FJ has a comfier seat, more room for a passenger, grab rails, a bigger tank, wider bars, handguards, heated grips, and is factory-ready for locking side cases. It's probably a bit heavier, and the fuel mapping might be different. The whole platform is based on a nearly-identical chassis/engine combo that is built up in different ways for different reasons. The basic FZ, the slightly fancier retro XSR, and the sport-touring FJ. I rid the FJ about a year ago, and it was pretty good. The bars felt really wide to me, but it was super comfy. I haven't gotten a chance to ride the XSR yet, but I'll hit up Yamaha when they come back to Chicago with all their bikes. Maybe they'll let me ride the V-MAX this time.
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Jan 11, 2017 20:11
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GnarlyCharlie4u posted:Re: SUMO chat. The word reliable keeps coming up, but everyone seems to be ignoring the Honda option? Valves made of cheese that stretch too far before a yamaha is even halfway through a top end is not reliable.
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Jan 11, 2017 20:46
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Slavvy posted:Valves made of cheese that stretch too far before a yamaha is even halfway through a top end is not reliable. having a license plate is good too.
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Jan 11, 2017 21:03
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Once I unload my FZ1 and my wife's Hawk GT, I think my next project bike will be a WR450F sumo conversion. If I'm very, very lucky I'll be able to find a firesale on a '16 model somewhere, but I'd probably have an easier time finding a used 701 and would still get out cheaper.cursedshitbox posted:having a license plate is good too. It's not hard to get a dirt bike titled for street use in many states, and if you live in a state where it's near impossible, you can probably get titled and registered through South Dakota and ride on an out of state plate - no idea what that would mean for insurance, but people have done it Jazzzzz fucked around with this message at 21:24 on Jan 11, 2017 |
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Jan 11, 2017 21:08
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M42 posted:
Figured out the exchange rate: bike owes me $11k AUD, or roughly $8k USD. Bought 05 yellow bike second hand and cheap, chucked sumo wheels on it ($4k, had pre-existing full system). Hit and killed a roo at about 80 KPH (didn't go down and was still rideable), so since it was going into the shop for a while for fixing plastics etc, I looked at Procycle's performance mods and got a quote of $1500 for labour from a local shop. Dropped $3k on parts (790 big bore, performance cam, race carb, airbox mod, full intake improvements etc) from Procycle. Bike went to a performance bike store for build, flowed and ported head etc. Stock suspension was feeling pretty old, so got new springs and oil chucked in (but no USD or gold valves etc). Labour cost ended up being $3.5k, and thus I'm $10/11k into a DR650 that puts out only about 50% more power than normal (but is a kinda funny sleeper). Two things I learned from this; big bore singles with straight exhausts = permanent hearing damage even when always wearing ear plugs, and that I am basically idiot Harley/BMW farkler #53516, but stupider. Also my B-King has lots of carbon fiber . Help me, CA!
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Jan 11, 2017 22:58
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Jan 12, 2017 00:55
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Isolationist posted:Hit and killed a roo at about 80 KPH (didn't go down and was still rideable)  How much poo poo were you shaking out the bottom of your trousers after that? God drat.
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Jan 12, 2017 01:01
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Carth Dookie posted:
The scary part looking back was that Fingerling was riding in front of me at the time, on a dirt track in the middle of nowhere, on an uninsured B-King. So goddamn lucky it jumped out late! Fun part was riding home through twisty dirt roads out in the countryside with no headlight (smashed by roo's neck) trying to keep up with Fingerling's headlight. Animals all over the place, not 50 metres from roocorpse there was a koala wandering across the dirt. Isolationist fucked around with this message at 03:04 on Jan 12, 2017 |
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Jan 12, 2017 02:57
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