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Man Unseen Diplomacy really is still basically the best. I really hope more people make games like it, but I also know they probably wont because who has the room to make it work othet than me lol
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Jan 30, 2017 05:04
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Songbearer posted:Regarding the Rift + Touch, has anyone tried two sensors, one front and one behind? How's the tracking with that setup? I love playing in VR but I think I'd finally like to have a 360 standing experience rather than front facing, so if I can just buy a USB extension cable without a third sensor and get a functional experience then I'd do that. I had no trouble with a two sensor setup, aside from some very specific instances (like in Sports Bar VR, there were positions where I'd be leaning over to take a shot at pool and managed to block both cameras). For the most part, it worked great for me. It's worth at least trying out -- if your space is too big for it to work reliably you can always order the third sensor later.
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Jan 30, 2017 07:08
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GlyphGryph posted:Man Unseen Diplomacy really is still basically the best. I really hope more people make games like it, but I also know they probably wont because who has the room to make it work othet than me lol My play area is 4m x 2.7m  . If I toss my couch and watch tv from the floor, I would have the room....
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Jan 30, 2017 14:01
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Randomosity posted:Make sure you're splitting cameras across multiple USB controllers, otherwise you'll run out of bandwith and tracking gets worse. I only have a single controller, and this has not been my experience. seems perfectly smooth with 4 cameras. I'm still going to order the Inateck card because this thing is chewing up all my loving USB ports. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00FPIMICA Is this the best one?
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Jan 30, 2017 15:45
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So is SuperhotVR always going to be an Oculus exclusive? I can't find any Vive release date information on the googles.
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Jan 30, 2017 17:30
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Ziploc posted:So is SuperhotVR always going to be an Oculus exclusive? I can't find any Vive release date information on the googles.
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Jan 30, 2017 17:48
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Flex Mentallo posted:Hey, If you're trying vr stuff you should come by booth #10242, I'm there with some ppl from my team demoing Statik on the psvr Was that the game where your hands were in the box? poo poo, if I had known you were a goon, we would have accepted the invitation to try the 2p mode. It looked fun as gently caress. I wish you guys consider a PC VR release in the future somehow. Not sure exactly how you would do that, though, as I don't think the Xbox One controller has a gyroscope in it.
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Jan 30, 2017 20:07
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Nalin posted:Was that the game where your hands were in the box? poo poo, if I had known you were a goon, we would have accepted the invitation to try the 2p mode. It looked fun as gently caress. I wish you guys consider a PC VR release in the future somehow. Not sure exactly how you would do that, though, as I don't think the Xbox One controller has a gyroscope in it. I think you're forgetting the controllers they do have available for PC VR...
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Jan 30, 2017 20:10
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Neddy Seagoon posted:I think you're forgetting the controllers they do have available for PC VR... Do the PC controllers do positional tracking? I thought Oculus shipped with a stock Xbox pad. And the game wouldn't work with independent one-hand Vive or Touch controls. Goon please leak me a Statik release date, I've been excited about it forever 
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Jan 30, 2017 20:13
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I think the Steam controllers are the only big brand ones with gyroscopes.
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Jan 30, 2017 21:03
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Bought a 3 meter USB 3.0 extension for my second Rift sensor and put it on a cupboard behind me, 360 tracking works practically flawlessly. If it does clip, it's practically imperceptible in the middle of the action. Feels great to be able to scamper around buildings in Climbey without needing to stop and fidget with the sticks, can't wait to try other games with it later 
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Jan 30, 2017 23:16
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Songbearer posted:Bought a 3 meter USB 3.0 extension for my second Rift sensor and put it on a cupboard behind me, 360 tracking works practically flawlessly. If it does clip, it's practically imperceptible in the middle of the action. Feels great to be able to scamper around buildings in Climbey without needing to stop and fidget with the sticks, can't wait to try other games with it later Try Raw Data or Onward. A lot of games don't put you in situations where you'll get occlusion and so you can get by with 2 sensor roomscale or 3 sensor room scale. 3 sensor roomscale works 98% for my setup, ceiling mounted and in corners, but the one corner without a sensor has issues if I'm crouching or pointing down and my body occludes one of my hands. The larger distance of my play area probably exacerbates the issue a bit, its about 9ft x 11ft, definitely pushes the sensor range to the limits. I've got a 4th sensor arriving tomorrow that should solve that problem because its annoying being so close to perfection.
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Jan 30, 2017 23:33
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Man the price parity thing sure has gotten away from itself with roomscale hasn't it?
KakerMix fucked around with this message at 01:38 on Jan 31, 2017 |
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Jan 31, 2017 01:34
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rage-saq posted:Try Raw Data or Onward. A lot of games don't put you in situations where you'll get occlusion and so you can get by with 2 sensor roomscale or 3 sensor room scale. Bullet Sorrow has a lot of turning and crouching in many directions, and while there was some occlusion occuring when I turned to the right and crouched it wasn't enough to render the game unplayable. I am working with a fairly small playspace though (About 7ft long by 5ft wide) so my cameras don't have a lot of ground to cover.
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Jan 31, 2017 02:08
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Songbearer posted:Bullet Sorrow has a lot of turning and crouching in many directions, and while there was some occlusion occuring when I turned to the right and crouched it wasn't enough to render the game unplayable. I am working with a fairly small playspace though (About 7ft long by 5ft wide) so my cameras don't have a lot of ground to cover. Yeah, that's about how big my space is, and two cameras works fine.
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Jan 31, 2017 02:35
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KakerMix posted:Man the price parity thing sure has gotten away from itself with roomscale hasn't it? No. Two sensors seems to be ok which is the same price tag. And then for near fool proof with a third sensor yeah Oculus does cost $80 more. The hardware is slicker though. Bum the Sad fucked around with this message at 04:20 on Jan 31, 2017 |
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Jan 31, 2017 04:18
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And it'll all go right in the bin once the headsets with inside-out positional tracking start coming out  .
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Jan 31, 2017 05:38
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Cojawfee posted:It has worked for me. Has the same occlusion issues that the vive has, just a smaller tracking area. There are no occlusion issues with the Vive. You can do anything with the controllers and headset and will never have an issue except holding your hands up to adjust the headset. But don't say there are every occlusion issues with the vive because that's just not true you can crawl or walk to every wall. The only time I ever lose tracking is about 5 inches below my light house (I have them in the corners). But 99+% of the space is perfectly tracked, Rift does come close. Vive tracking is flat out better but the touch controllers are nicer and the vive is less comfortable.
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Jan 31, 2017 07:35
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Stick100 posted:There are no occlusion issues with the Vive. You can do anything with the controllers and headset and will never have an issue except holding your hands up to adjust the headset. But don't say there are every occlusion issues with the vive because that's just not true you can crawl or walk to every wall. The only time I ever lose tracking is about 5 inches below my light house (I have them in the corners). But 99+% of the space is perfectly tracked, Rift does come close. Vive tracking is flat out better but the touch controllers are nicer and the vive is less comfortable. Occlusion is occlusion, and it is possible to occlude the wands from the Lighthouses. Touch is easier to occlude, because they are smaller and the sensors have a smaller FOV, but to say Lighthouses will have "no occlusion issues" isn't true. Even Alan Yates recommended/tweeted 5 Lighthouses for perfect coverage without any occlusion (1 in each corner and 1 on the ceiling, probably), which makes sense.
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Jan 31, 2017 08:25
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I think the biggest issue is the Oculus camera fov. I have a relatively small space, about 2.5m X 1.5m. The problem is finding camera positions that are high up enough to allow the cameras to see all that area. Luckily the ceiling is high so I can use adhesive wall mounts and get coverage for most of the space, but if it was a regular-height ceiling then I would be screwed. Also obviously it requires a third sensor, but I think that does put it on price parity with Vive? Don't know what could be done to improve the camera fov - presumably there's a problem with image distortion if you use even more powerful lenses. Presumably their next gen will use something different.
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Jan 31, 2017 10:04
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Poetic Justice posted:Occlusion is occlusion, and it is possible to occlude the wands from the Lighthouses. Touch is easier to occlude, because they are smaller and the sensors have a smaller FOV, but to say Lighthouses will have "no occlusion issues" isn't true. Even Alan Yates recommended/tweeted 5 Lighthouses for perfect coverage without any occlusion (1 in each corner and 1 on the ceiling, probably), which makes sense. I'm trying to imagine it and I legit can't conceive of a situation where you occlude a Vive controller from both lighthouses. If it can see even one of them, even just a little bit, it tracks. Are you lying on the floor, curled around it?
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Jan 31, 2017 11:15
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AgentF posted:I'm trying to imagine it and I legit can't conceive of a situation where you occlude a Vive controller from both lighthouses. If it can see even one of them, even just a little bit, it tracks. Are you lying on the floor, curled around it? This is effectively what I need to do for my controllers to lose tracking, yeah.
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Jan 31, 2017 11:25
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El Grillo posted:I think the biggest issue is the Oculus camera fov. I have a relatively small space, about 2.5m X 1.5m. The problem is finding camera positions that are high up enough to allow the cameras to see all that area. Luckily the ceiling is high so I can use adhesive wall mounts and get coverage for most of the space, but if it was a regular-height ceiling then I would be screwed. Also obviously it requires a third sensor, but I think that does put it on price parity with Vive? What's your "adhesive wall mount" btw?
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Jan 31, 2017 13:09
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Stick100 posted:There are no occlusion issues with the Vive. You can do anything with the controllers and headset and will never have an issue except holding your hands up to adjust the headset. But don't say there are every occlusion issues with the vive because that's just not true you can crawl or walk to every wall. The only time I ever lose tracking is about 5 inches below my light house (I have them in the corners). But 99+% of the space is perfectly tracked, Rift does come close. Vive tracking is flat out better but the touch controllers are nicer and the vive is less comfortable. Yes there are. While it is more robust than the Rift, I've definitely had tracking issues with the vive. There are definitely positions you can be in where one controller will block one lighthouse and your body blocks the other lighthouse. The vive wands are much larger than the touch controllers so there's more surface area to pick up the laser sweep, but there is still sometimes occlusion.
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Jan 31, 2017 13:55
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AgentF posted:I'm trying to imagine it and I legit can't conceive of a situation where you occlude a Vive controller from both lighthouses. If it can see even one of them, even just a little bit, it tracks. Are you lying on the floor, curled around it? It's easily done if your room is less than ideal. My VR area is also my office, with desks against most of the wall area. If I'm trying to pick something up from the ground near the edge of the play area, especially in the corner closest to one of the boxes I may have to do some gymnastics to ensure the controller can see at least one. I'd say that two is mostly fine if you have an open play area with no "natural occlusion". Three with good placement would probably make it so you had to be actively trying to cause occlusion in those cases, four or five might make it basically impossible to do so without basically curling up in a ball.
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Jan 31, 2017 15:07
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Neddy Seagoon posted:And it'll all go right in the bin once the headsets with inside-out positional tracking start coming out There are a whole bunch coming too. Though none of them have tracked hand controllers that also use inside out tracking. I saw one with crummy looking wands and a single tracking camera. Garbage.
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Jan 31, 2017 15:16
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I actively don't want inside out tracking, since it seems like it would preclude things like the Vive attach bits that are coming out, and additional body sensors, and varied controllers. Just... wasted effort outside of a limited, mobile experience.
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Jan 31, 2017 15:48
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Are the new gen 2 headsets coming anytime soon? or should i just go out and buy a oculus or vive?
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Jan 31, 2017 15:48
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Sefal posted:Are the new gen 2 headsets coming anytime soon? or should i just go out and buy a oculus or vive? The new Gen 1.5 stuff like the Vive wireless kit seems like it will be attachments for existing technology. Actual Gen 2 stuff seems like it will be at least two years out, imo.
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Jan 31, 2017 15:50
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Yeah I'm expecting new poo poo no earlier than 2018. This poo poo only released to consumers mid-2016.
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Jan 31, 2017 16:10
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GlyphGryph posted:I actively don't want inside out tracking, since it seems like it would preclude things like the Vive attach bits that are coming out, and additional body sensors, and varied controllers. Not at all; there are plenty of ways to make those things work with an inside-out tracking system, whether it's by putting inside-out tracking in the peripherals themselves, using the headset as a base station, or whatever. Sefal posted:Are the new gen 2 headsets coming anytime soon? There aren't really any better headsets on the horizon, but six months from now you may well be able to get Gen1-level headsets much more cheaply as more manufacturers enter the market.
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Jan 31, 2017 16:10
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Alright cool. I think i'm going to buy a Vive in that case. Was worried that gen 2 might have launched soon but if its 2 years away, i can justify splurging on a headset now
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Jan 31, 2017 16:15
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Looks like some new VR stuff coming in March. Again no tracked controllers, but I think VR hardware development is going to speed up a ton. It's not going to be Vive and Oculus only for long. http://www.pcworld.com/article/3158222/virtual-reality/microsofts-first-tethered-windows-10-vr-headsets-to-ship-in-march.html
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Jan 31, 2017 16:22
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Arizona Sunshine is 15% off at Humble Bundle. Not quite enough for me, but I thought I'd pass it along for those looking for an excuse to buy it.
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Jan 31, 2017 18:02
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TomR posted:Looks like some new VR stuff coming in March. Again no tracked controllers, but I think VR hardware development is going to speed up a ton. It's not going to be Vive and Oculus only for long. If they're anything like lenovos those'll be pretty gen 2-ish. They were promising 1440p screens with the same/more fov + fps at CES. So full Gen 2 setups by end of year maybe?
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Jan 31, 2017 18:27
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Surprise Giraffe posted:If they're anything like lenovos those'll be pretty gen 2-ish. They were promising 1440p screens with the same/more fov + fps at CES. So full Gen 2 setups by end of year maybe? Much as I would love this to be true, I don't think it's likely. The difference between 1200p and 1440p isn't that exciting (as the GearVR demonstrates) and it seems like the monitor manufacturers have a lot more to gain by cutting costs and broadening the market for the proven headsets than they would by trying to push the technology envelope. I'm not saying we won't see 1440p/120fps headsets this year, but I'm not convinced they'll be consistently better than the current three - let alone a generational difference.
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Jan 31, 2017 18:43
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NRVNQSR posted:Much as I would love this to be true, I don't think it's likely. The difference between 1200p and 1440p isn't that exciting (as the GearVR demonstrates) and it seems like the monitor manufacturers have a lot more to gain by cutting costs and broadening the market for the proven headsets than they would by trying to push the technology envelope. I'm not saying we won't see 1440p/120fps headsets this year, but I'm not convinced they'll be consistently better than the current three - let alone a generational difference. Fair enough. We'll have to wait and see anyway. Wonder if they'll go for 120fps though. Are there many people who'd be motion sick due to the frame rate at 90? I've not heard if PSVR gets better results in that sense
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Jan 31, 2017 19:10
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wolrah posted:I'd say that two is mostly fine if you have an open play area with no "natural occlusion". Three with good placement would probably make it so you had to be actively trying to cause occlusion in those cases, four or five might make it basically impossible to do so without basically curling up in a ball. I guess I must have an open play area with no natural occlusion. I did move my light house forward so the monitor wouldn't block it. Before I did that I would lose tracking on my controllers when I set them down on my desk (right outside play space). I can't get occlusion of the controllers without using two hands to wrap around the sensors. I can get occlusion of the headset if I go to a corner away form the lighthouses and then use a hand to cover the outside edges of the headset (when you adjust the headset). I've been able to do nearly everything in every single corner of my playspace (except around one cubic foot in right blow/fornt of the lighthouses without no lost tracking. The Touch controllers I can't use about 20-40% of my space (in 360 mode). And even in the safe play space it's extremely easy to lose tracking. I wish someone would make the touch controllers with Vive tracking because they controllers are much better (feel better, have more inputs, much lighter).
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Jan 31, 2017 19:13
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NRVNQSR posted:Not at all; there are plenty of ways to make those things work with an inside-out tracking system, whether it's by putting inside-out tracking in the peripherals themselves, using the headset as a base station, or whatever. As everyone who's tried to use Vive controllers with a Rift or any other combination of tracking systems has discovered, you need either common reference points or detailed calibration for multiple tracked things to really work out. Lighthouse bases or Rift cameras provide common reference points for everything within their respective systems, but getting everything to agree on where it is across systems is not easy. An inside-out system makes this a lot more complicated, since all the tracked objects (or I guess in this case tracking objects) need to agree on what they're seeing and be able to communicate that to the host. Fiducial markers simplify things a bit, but obviously those have a negative impact on WAF. Either way you need a decent amount of processing power on the device or a high bandwidth low latency path to the host PC and spare computing power there. I believe inside-out tracking is the obvious solution for the next generation of GearVR/Daydream type hardware, but Lighthouse definitely scales the best with additional tracked/tracking objects. wolrah fucked around with this message at 19:58 on Jan 31, 2017 |
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Jan 31, 2017 19:52
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Surprise Giraffe posted:Fair enough. We'll have to wait and see anyway. Wonder if they'll go for 120fps though. Are there many people who'd be motion sick due to the frame rate at 90? I've not heard if PSVR gets better results in that sense The real benefit of 120fps comes if you're doing interpolation like ATW and ASW do. With a 90hz display you can only ever have the game display frames at 90fps (which is hard to achieve), interpolated 45fps (which feels a little juddery even with ASW) or interpolated 30fps (unusable). If a display can do 120fps as well then that gives you the additional options of interpolated 60fps (which PSVR has shown to be a comfortable compromise) or interpolated 40fps (uncomfortable for most but might be nice to have as an option on really underpowered setups). wolrah posted:As everyone who's tried to use Vive controllers with a Rift or any other combination of tracking systems has discovered, you need either common reference points or detailed calibration for multiple tracked things to really work out. Lighthouse bases or Rift cameras provide common reference points for everything within their respective systems, but getting everything to agree on where it is across systems is not easy. The usual solution to this is to have the inside-out tracking objects track each other. That sounds hard, and it is, but it's a problem that needs to be solved for inside-out tracking to work in the first place. Of course if you're going the route of using the headset as a base station then synchonisation comes for free.
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Jan 31, 2017 20:30
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