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Pick posted:Please try to remember that most people who watched Zootopia appreciated it for its nuance and artistry and not because of wiener reasons. Sorry it turns out people only watch movies based on who they want to gently caress.
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Feb 27, 2017 18:18
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Then what does it say that I watched a movie where a man fucks a turtle?
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Feb 27, 2017 18:19
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Waffleman_ posted:Then what does it say that I watched a movie where a man fucks a turtle? You want to pull your head into the turtle shell, obviously.
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Feb 27, 2017 18:20
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loving a turtle is completely ok as long as it is also a metaphor.
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Feb 27, 2017 18:21
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I'm not terribly enthused with the Oscar wins. Not because I think any of the film's were bad, but because the predictability reminds me the Oscars wound up being Hollywood patting itself on the bad for films that remind them of themselves. I didn't have to watch them to know Zootopia would win because A) It's a homegrown film by their friends and B) The added benefit of making it appear like they care about racism. Meanwhile in reality, Hollywood's making a big show about having a record SIX (woooaaah) black actors nominated. Again, I know it's really not Zootopia's fault. I'm just reminded, "Oh, yeah. This is about hollow posturing." I'm a Debbie Downer. 
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Feb 27, 2017 18:28
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Das Boo posted:I'm not terribly enthused with the Oscar wins. Not because I think any of the film's were bad, but because the predictability reminds me the Oscars wound up being Hollywood patting itself on the bad for films that remind them of themselves. I didn't have to watch them to know Zootopia would win because A) It's a homegrown film by their friends and B) The added benefit of making it appear like they care about racism. Meanwhile in reality, Hollywood's making a big show about having a record SIX (woooaaah) black actors nominated. This is how I feel. It was always pretty much down to Zootopia or Moana (Which bugs me. Disney should earnestly be limited to 1), and one of them allows the academy to feign concern about racism. It was always the guaranteed pick. The only earnest surprise was that they didn't go for La La Land.
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Feb 27, 2017 18:59
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It's not an unfair sentiment, but it's a bit odd to complain about it now because the Animation Oscar has been consistently awarded to the "safe" option since its inception. Underdogs pretty much never win in this category, so I don't know why anyone would have expected a different outcome this time around.
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Feb 27, 2017 19:02
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I don't really know why "underdogs" should win. I thought Zootopia was the best of those films, so it should win it.
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Feb 27, 2017 19:07
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Samuel Clemens posted:It's not an unfair sentiment, but it's a bit odd to complain about it now because the Animation Oscar has been consistently awarded to the "safe" option since its inception. Underdogs pretty much never win in this category, so I don't know why anyone would have expected a different outcome this time around. The first two years of the animated feature Oscar are really interesting. Shrek beat Monster's Inc., and Spirited Away won over Lilo & Stitch. After that though, outside of 3 outliers, it's all been Disney/Pixar movies.
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Feb 27, 2017 19:10
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Pick posted:I don't really know why "underdogs" should win. I thought Zootopia was the best of those films, so it should win it. Well, from a social welfare perspective, you could argue that lesser known films profit most from a victory because it allows them a moment in the spotlight. Through selecting an underdog, the academy could show a greater audience that quality animation can be found outside of the traditional American mold, thereby highlighting the versatility of the medium. From a quality perspective, The Red Turtle and My Life as a Zucchini were far superior, you heathen.  PenguinKnight posted:The first two years of the animated feature Oscar are really interesting. Shrek beat Monster's Inc., and Spirited Away won over Lilo & Stitch. After that though, outside of 3 outliers, it's all been Disney/Pixar movies. I'll give you Sprited Away, but I wouldn't consider Shrek an unconventional pick. It was a huge success upon release, and its cultural imprint has been far larger than the one of Monster's Inc.
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Feb 27, 2017 19:12
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Samuel Clemens posted:It's not an unfair sentiment, but it's a bit odd to complain about it now because the Animation Oscar has been consistently awarded to the "safe" option since its inception. Underdogs pretty much never win in this category, so I don't know why anyone would have expected a different outcome this time around. Nah, not just complaining about it now. It's an annual thing and I was outright livid about The Tale of Princess Kaguya a couple of years back. (Or what was it? "Obscure Chinese poo poo?") But it does bother me that if you swapped titles and had Disney's The Red Turtle and and Ghibli's Zootopia, Disney still would've won. It was just a cherry on top they could choose the status quo while also making a political statement. But the brand name is WAY more important here. And my sentiment isn't limited to the animation category, the whole dog and pony show just bums me out.
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Feb 27, 2017 19:16
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Das Boo posted:Nah, not just complaining about it now. It's an annual thing and I was outright livid about The Tale of Princess Kaguya a couple of years back. (Or what was it? "Obscure Chinese poo poo?") But it does bother me that if you swapped titles and had Disney's The Red Turtle and and Ghibli's Zootopia, Disney still would've won. It was just a cherry on top they could choose the status quo while also making a political statement. But the brand name is WAY more important here. 'Chinese Cartoon' was used to refer to Song of the Sea. Anyway I think that's a plausible hypothetical, but I still think Zootopia is the better film. And Ghibli is overrated. EDIT: VVV Oh right, maybe. I think it was more amusing for SotS though. Fangz fucked around with this message at 19:22 on Feb 27, 2017 |
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Feb 27, 2017 19:20
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Fangz posted:'Chinese Cartoon' was used to refer to Song of the Sea. I thought that particular voter deemed them both Chinese? 
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Feb 27, 2017 19:21
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The rule of thumb with Oscar nominated animation is to watch pretty much everything, because what wins will at least be mediocre fun, and the excellent gems will be the poo poo that got nominated but oscars being the popularity contest that they are had no hope in hell of winning. A reminder that Ernest & Celestine and The Wind Rises lost out to loving Frozen. I mean the category has pretty much been crap since the Toy Story 3 win, which I am still having a hard time justifying, considering The Illusionist had been nominated that year.
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Feb 27, 2017 19:23
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I'm almost curious if we'll get to see what infuriating logic was used to vote for Zootopia as best animated film this year. I definitely agree with the outcome, but I'm sure the reasoning behind it will be less agreeable.
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Feb 27, 2017 19:24
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Also I feel like if Disney only could put in one nomination it'd be Finding Dory, or Sing, or even Sausage Party that gets nominated instead of anything else. And Zootopia's victory would become more likely, not less.
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Feb 27, 2017 19:25
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I think you'll find that Trolls deserved best animated
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Feb 27, 2017 19:25
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OWLS! posted:The rule of thumb with Oscar nominated animation is to watch pretty much everything, because what wins will at least be mediocre fun, and the excellent gems will be the poo poo that got nominated but oscars being the popularity contest that they are had no hope in hell of winning. Well, Return of the King won Best Picture and frankly all the LoTR films are kind of insufferable now.
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Feb 27, 2017 19:25
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Macaluso posted:I think you'll find that Boxtrolls deserved best animated Fixed your post there.
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Feb 27, 2017 19:25
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OWLS! posted:Fixed your post there. Trolls is good .
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Feb 27, 2017 19:26
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Laika actually poured a yuuuge amount of Nike money into promoting Kubo for the Oscars. Kind of glad it didn't win Best Animated just for that reason. Although Jungle Book was definitely the most boring possible pick for Best Visual Effects.
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Feb 27, 2017 19:27
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Pick posted:Trolls is good Stopmotion better .
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Feb 27, 2017 19:27
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Das Boo posted:Nah, not just complaining about it now. It's an annual thing and I was outright livid about The Tale of Princess Kaguya a couple of years back. (Or what was it? "Obscure Chinese poo poo?") Yeah, me too man, but that's also because it was genuinely miles better than what actually won. Whereas for this year, while I personally think Kubo and Moana were more interesting movies than Zootopia, the winner was still a very good animated film that's on par with the other nominees. I think the Oscars are on the whole pretty worthless with regards to animation picks, but I don't think you can say they got it wrong this time unless you wanna be contrarian. The reasoning behind their picks, sure, but I don't think the winners themselves are undeserved.
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Feb 27, 2017 19:27
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Still can't believe Jimmy Neutron: Boy Genius lost to Shrek.
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Feb 27, 2017 19:27
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Samuel Clemens posted:Well, from a social welfare perspective, you could argue that lesser known films profit most from a victory because it allows them a moment in the spotlight. Through selecting an underdog, the academy could show a greater audience that quality animation can be found outside of the traditional American mold, thereby highlighting the versatility of the medium. I have absolutely no proof of this but I'm pretty sure that the Oscars for animated feature breakdown like this: 2 or 3 of the best films from major studios are nominated to duke it out for the Oscar, while the recognition and reward for the smaller films is intended to be in the nomination itself; with only the smallest fraction of a chance for an upset win for movies like My Life as a Zucchini. I mean, an Oscar nomination alone doesn't probably do much for, say, Moana's numbers--but 'just' a nomination for The Red Turtle gets the film significantly more attention than it would have gotten otherwise.
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Feb 27, 2017 19:28
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Yeah, I was mad Kaguya didn't win because I thought it was the best animated film that year. I don't feel the same way about Frozen winning over The Wind Rises, because though I enjoyed The Wind Rises I don't think it's particularly great.
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Feb 27, 2017 19:28
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Das Boo posted:I'm not terribly enthused with the Oscar wins. Not because I think any of the film's were bad, but because the predictability reminds me the Oscars wound up being Hollywood patting itself on the bad for films that remind them of themselves. I didn't have to watch them to know Zootopia would win because A) It's a homegrown film by their friends and B) The added benefit of making it appear like they care about racism. Meanwhile in reality, Hollywood's making a big show about having a record SIX (woooaaah) black actors nominated. I feel very much the same way about the Animated Shorts Category. Piper was very well done, and perhaps featured the best technical and character animation of the bunch. But out of the grouping, it felt the most emotionally unchallenging. Whereas the other films, whether or not it's true, felt like a lot of the artists put themselves, or their life, or culture into their art. And the stakes felt higher for them, to show the artistry and capability of animation outside of the DIsney mold. And instead, as you can predict, the body as a whole voted for the film that had the widest distribution. It's like that comment from voters about 'Chinese Crap' all over again. To summarize, watch Pear Cider and Cigarettes, it's a short by the guy who was the character designer behind the opening to Beatles Rock Band, Motorcity, and Tron: Uprising. It was robbed.
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Feb 27, 2017 19:28
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Pick posted:Yeah, I was mad Kaguya didn't win because I thought it was the best animated film that year. I don't feel the same way about Frozen winning over The Wind Rises, because though I enjoyed The Wind Rises I don't think it's particularly great. Looking back to 2014, I wasn't very enthused about either of those films. What's maddening was that the Lego Movie wasn't even nominated. Instead there's Despicable Me 2 and the Croods.
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Feb 27, 2017 19:35
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SomeJazzyRat posted:To summarize, watch Pear Cider and Cigarettes, it's a short by the guy who was the character designer behind the opening to Beatles Rock Band, Motorcity, and Tron: Uprising. It was robbed. oh hell yes. i will track it down to watch after work
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Feb 27, 2017 19:35
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Fangz posted:Looking back to 2014, I wasn't very enthused about either of those films. What's maddening was that the Lego Movie wasn't even nominated. Instead there's Despicable Me 2 and the Croods. I mean, sometimes it's just a function of who you're up against. Tangled didn't even get a nomination, which I still think is bullshit. But that was a hell of a year for animation.
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Feb 27, 2017 19:36
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Shadow Hog posted:I'm almost curious if we'll get to see what infuriating logic was used to vote for Zootopia as best animated film this year. I definitely agree with the outcome, but I'm sure the reasoning behind it will be less agreeable. Hollywood loves to pat itself on the back for its assumed progressiveness, and it's a passably entertaining Disney movie. it's a rather obvious winner. Fangz posted:'Chinese Cartoon' was used to refer to Song of the Sea. Ghibli movies are actually a good counter to Zootopia's fantasy-peddling. Castle in the Sky in particular comes to mind, since both it and Zootopia are about fantastical cities. Zootopia is about selling its own fantasy of its setting, which is why it's story revolves around getting rid of the elements that ruin said fantasy. Castle in the Sky also revolves around the characters pursuing the fantasy of Laputa, but in its conclusion rejects that fantasy and returns to the real world (granted, the "real world" is also fantastical to a degree). The villain, fittingly, wants to satisfy a narcissistic fantasy of domination and control who fully embraces what the city represents. The most pure and beautiful parts of the city ultimately end up outside of human reach and exploitation, while the heroes embrace freedom. Ghibli's fantasies in general are mature because they reject easy escapism and immersion, and their most enchanting elements (skies, seas, nature, villages, cities ) can be found in reality. BravestOfTheLamps fucked around with this message at 20:15 on Feb 27, 2017 |
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Feb 27, 2017 20:12
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So, out of curiosity since the movie came up earlier: has anyone tried to get the uncut version of Land Before Time released, or is it just sitting there in Bluth's vault still? (For anyone who's not aware, the movie had 11 minutes hacked out of it before release for varying reasons. You can find a breakdown of the edits pretty easily if you look, and while a couple of them are fair enough, the changes to the ending are absolutely bizarre, as are a few of the other excisions earlier in the movie.)
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Feb 27, 2017 20:21
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https://twitter.com/spacecoyotl/status/836291524962856960
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Feb 27, 2017 20:35
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OWLS! posted:The rule of thumb with Oscar nominated animation is to watch pretty much everything, because what wins will at least be mediocre fun, and the excellent gems will be the poo poo that got nominated but oscars being the popularity contest that they are had no hope in hell of winning. Ernest & Celestine and the Wind Rises were both mediocre at best.
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Feb 27, 2017 20:35
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hot dog!
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Feb 27, 2017 20:45
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Koramei posted:Yeah, me too man, but that's also because it was genuinely miles better than what actually won. Whereas for this year, while I personally think Kubo and Moana were more interesting movies than Zootopia, the winner was still a very good animated film that's on par with the other nominees. It wasn't my favorite of the bunch, but that's me! I'm more irritated because it could have been any drat thing and as long as the Disney or Pixar label is on it, it's pretty well a sealed deal. If you're a big Zoo fan, it's even a little disheartening to know that your film is not actually being recognized for its artistic or thematic achievements, but just because it happens to be branded with one of the biggest labels on earth. It'd be really cool if an awards show for outstanding films judged those films based on their actual achievements rather than who's funding them, but we know from past comments that's not the case. I'm not limiting this to the animated category or saying Zoo didn't deserve to win but knowing how these assholes vote, I'm bummed it won for all the wrong reasons. And it's pretty lovely to look at all the work that went into Zoo and say, "Well, I guess I'll vote for it because I took my kids to it and I know what a Disney is."
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Feb 27, 2017 21:04
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Das Boo posted:It wasn't my favorite of the bunch, but that's me! Yeah well Zootopia still beat out Moana and Finding Dory, so.... EDIT: I mean 'Best Disney/Pixar Movie' is relatively competitive this year. Your complaint works a bit better for Inside Out, or good lord, Big Hero 6, which had no real competition on that criteria. Fangz fucked around with this message at 21:18 on Feb 27, 2017 |
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Feb 27, 2017 21:10
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Well, it probably does deserve the Best Disney Movie of the Year award.
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Feb 27, 2017 21:11
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Of course the actual best animated movie this year is A Silent Voice.
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Feb 27, 2017 21:26
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Fangz posted:Yeah well Zootopia still beat out Moana and Finding Dory, so.... I'm only making the complaint now because the Oscars just happened again and it's a reminder of how the show works. And like I said, Zoo offers the added benefit of political commentary to people who historically have an issue with racial disparity, making them feel a little better about themselves. So given they vote for the Disney movie, but in choosing between the two Disney movies they vote for they can feel better about voting for the movie literally about a hot button political issue. So again, I'm bothered, this year and every other, by the way this awards show votes. Like if Zoo didn't exist, Moana would have won without a doubt. It's Disney. That's the big decider here. If Zoo switched companies it would still have its political commentary, but it wouldn't be Disney. So it'd almost certainly lose. And still surprised Dory didn't get a nod even though that movie was a hideously paced retread. Surprising though, because it's got that Pixar name slapped on it. Most surprising thing about the Oscars this year. And I can not stress this hard enough: My problem isn't with Zoo winning in particular, it's how the Oscars operate even when they coincidentally happen to choose the best contender. Like if I was the most qualified candidate for a job but they gave it to me solely because I'm a woman, I'd still find that pretty insulting. Zoo is probably the best pick. But I knew they were going to pick it and for what reasons, and those reasons bug me.
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Feb 27, 2017 21:41
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