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Kassad posted:https://twitter.com/ReutersWorld/status/837252813910593536 Between this and the OLAF anti-corruption people smashing into FN offices, it's a good time.
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Mar 2, 2017 12:07
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Cat Mattress posted:No, it has grown steadily over time and Jean-Marie got to the second round of presidential elections in 2002, so it was quite prominent before he got kicked out. Le Pen father never envisionned himself getting elected, for him it was more important to stay true to his ideals, even if it meant never winning. Him getting to 2nd turn actually had a wake up effect, and he did a terrible score in 2007. Le Pen daughter is actually shooting for the job and will do whatever it takes. She's expected to reach the 2nd turn, and winning is not outside the realm of possibilites anymore. She's much more dangerous than her father ever was.
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Mar 2, 2017 12:09
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Fados posted:Yes except the party only gained the prominence it has today by taking a very clear turn of moderation with the kicing out the literal 'father' of the party. No, the party only gained the prominence it has today by appearing to take a very clear turn of moderation, which is incidentally what all fascists do when they don't think they can seize power through force up to and including the actual loving Nazis. This is why it's pretty loving important to maintain a healthy goddamn suspicion of any claims that the fash have mellowed out, since in every case that they've managed to take power after such a turn the mask has come off as soon as they feel secure in the saddle.
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Mar 2, 2017 12:19
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Junior G-man posted:Between this and the OLAF anti-corruption people smashing into FN offices, it's a good time.
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Mar 2, 2017 12:20
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Meanwhile, a textbook clusterfuck that's a going to give a little local boost to the FN vote. Calling those people uneducated fascist hicks on TV all day won't fix their broken neighborhoods, but at least we're better than them. vvv lol we're hosed
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Mar 2, 2017 12:37
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https://twitter.com/Livesquawk/status/837256042820079617 https://twitter.com/Livesquawk/status/837256025547943941 Fillon's base continues to give no fucks about his legal troubles.
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Mar 2, 2017 12:37
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Nyandaber Z posted:Le Pen father never envisionned himself getting elected, for him it was more important to stay true to his ideals, even if it meant never winning. Him getting to 2nd turn actually had a wake up effect, and he did a terrible score in 2007. Le Pen daughter is actually shooting for the job and will do whatever it takes. She's expected to reach the 2nd turn, and winning is not outside the realm of possibilites anymore. She's much more dangerous than her father ever was. I'm amazed that the world didn't learn their lesson about underestimating conservative women in politics after Thatcher.
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Mar 2, 2017 12:38
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LemonDrizzle posted:https://twitter.com/Livesquawk/status/837256042820079617 At first I read "unch" as a sort of "ouch" word (because these numbers next to these names are a painful sight). Then I saw the -1 and got that "unch" actually was short for "unchanged", and that broke the magic. 
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Mar 2, 2017 13:06
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LemonDrizzle posted:https://twitter.com/Livesquawk/status/837256042820079617 It's a rolling 3 day poll finishing yesterday. The latest drama won't be reflected yet.
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Mar 2, 2017 13:12
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Mar 2, 2017 14:28
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MiddleOne posted:I'm amazed that the world didn't learn their lesson about underestimating conservative women in politics after Thatcher. I don't underestimate Le Pen not NF, in fact I think, like most here, they are the biggest danger to european future. I just don't like applying these very specific 20th century regime labels to everything. I think it's lazy and anachronistic. Call them autoritarian, xenophobic, whatever you want, analyze what makes them new and maybe you'll find their weak spot. I see this fash-bash as the left wing equivalent of calling everything I don't like politically socialism/communism. Fados fucked around with this message at 14:46 on Mar 2, 2017 |
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Mar 2, 2017 14:43
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MiddleOne posted:I'm amazed that the world didn't learn their lesson about underestimating conservative women in politics after Thatcher. https://twitter.com/TheProgressives/status/837251412459458560
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Mar 2, 2017 15:30
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Hambilderberglar posted:Does OLAF actually have the power to twist Marine's arm if she's found guilty of improprieties? I was under the impression it's a relatively toothless office? OLAF can only make recommendations to the relevant judicial authorities , it has no powers to prosecute or sanction or to compel anyone to do so. A proposal for a European Public Prosecutor's Office has been floating around, but signing up to it is not compulsory; the Dutch government for one is scared of how voters may react to handing prosecution powers to an EU body, never mind that it is supposed to basically follow domestic laws.
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Mar 2, 2017 15:33
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Jesus christ, what country is that MP from?
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Mar 2, 2017 15:38
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MiddleOne posted:Jesus christ, what country is that MP from? I think it's this luminary.
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Mar 2, 2017 15:40
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Yeah, it is.
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Mar 2, 2017 15:41
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Hambilderberglar posted:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janusz_Korwin-Mikke Even the Polish usually think Korwin Mikkel is too loving crazy. I think he's also in favour of returning to an absolutist monarchy.
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Mar 2, 2017 15:42
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Junior G-man posted:Even the Polish usually think Korwin Mikkel is too loving crazy. I think he's also in favour of returning to an absolutist monarchy. Why is he sitting in Parliament and getting a salary from the EU? Who elected that clown and why?
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Mar 2, 2017 15:46
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Raspberry Jam It In Me posted:Why is he sitting in Parliament and getting a salary from the EU? Who elected that clown and why? Getting a seat or two in the EU-parliament is surprisingly easy if you represent fringe interests.
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Mar 2, 2017 15:49
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Hambilderberglar posted:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janusz_Korwin-Mikke this is bad for Korwin
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Mar 2, 2017 15:51
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LemonDrizzle posted:"Silent majority" doesn't really work when you're calling people to a public protest, though...
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Mar 2, 2017 15:58
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Doctor Malaver posted:So yeah, hating foreigners doesn't make you fascist. You'd also have to have some specific ideas about the political system, economy, war. I'm pretty sure that most FN voters don't want all political parties in France to be abolished, people to be mobilized and sent to some war, and Le Pen getting dictatorial power. You're right, to be fascist they'd need to blame foreigners for economic difficulty or threats to safety, consider people who disagree with their cause to be traitors and to say their own culture is innately superior to that of their opponents. OH WAIT THEY'RE FASCISTS YOU PIECE OF poo poo QUISLING.
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Mar 2, 2017 16:19
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Doctor Malaver posted:So yeah, hating foreigners doesn't make you fascist. You'd also have to have some specific ideas about the political system, economy, war. I'm pretty sure that most FN voters don't want all political parties in France to be abolished, people to be mobilized and sent to some war, and Le Pen getting dictatorial power. Lol you haven't ever been on Twitter have you. Unless you have some insight into FN supporters that contradicts the available evidence of them supporting a fascist party and saying fascist things on social media?
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Mar 2, 2017 16:33
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When I think Fn Supporter I think "respect the existence of other political parties"
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Mar 2, 2017 16:40
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Kurtofan posted:When I think Fn Supporter I think "respect the existence of other political parties" socialope
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Mar 2, 2017 16:42
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Kurtofan posted:When I think Fn Supporter I think "respect the existence of other political parties" I think "responsible public servants in the European Parliament" whose wages they richly deserve for their hard toil.
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Mar 2, 2017 16:50
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Junior G-man posted:I think "responsible public servants in the European Parliament" whose wages they richly deserve for their hard toil. How is the European Project ever to succeed if we do not compensate the representatives in our shared Parliament adequately? You sound like a fascist, IMO
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Mar 2, 2017 17:00
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Rappaport posted:How is the European Project ever to succeed if we do not compensate the representatives in our shared Parliament adequately? You sound like a fascist, IMO I am. It is me, the hidden fascist.
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Mar 2, 2017 17:01
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Baron Corbyn posted:That argument would carry more water if France was a two-party state. Unlike America where the only alternative to Trump was a neoliberal, there are plenty of viable anti-capitalist non-racists they could vote for. Except Trump is the head of a neoliberal party in the first place, and does not generally have problems with neoliberal policies, so that excuse for trump voters literally never made sense.
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Mar 2, 2017 17:06
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endlessmonotony posted:You're right, to be fascist they'd need to blame foreigners for economic difficulty or threats to safety, consider people who disagree with their cause to be traitors and to say their own culture is innately superior to that of their opponents. With that definition even Fidel Castro would have qualified as fascia
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Mar 2, 2017 17:15
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Kurtofan posted:this is bad for Korwin
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Mar 2, 2017 17:18
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Don't want to keep making GBS threads up the thread with the fascist-or-not talk, I would just like to leave these two articles which point out some differences between the new right-wing populism with it's 20th century sousin and why it's very important to notice where they part, not to normalize them in some way but precisly how to point out they are can unwittingly be even more dangerous today. http://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2015/12/10/9886152/donald-trump-fascism http://www.vox.com/the-big-idea/2017/1/3/14154300/fascist-populist-trump-democracy Note: They are mostly about Trump, but I feel the same applies in Europe.
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Mar 2, 2017 17:30
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Hambilderberglar posted:How? He thrives on trolling and his base will reward him for this? 
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Mar 2, 2017 17:32
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Lord of the Llamas posted:Lol you haven't ever been on Twitter have you. No, I don't speak French and I don't use Twitter. This forum is my main source of information on French politics. I'd be curious to learn more about what FN voters and MPs want/believe. I'm old fashioned so I'd prefer survey results or party program to Tweets...
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Mar 2, 2017 18:04
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endlessmonotony posted:You're right, to be fascist they'd need to blame foreigners for economic difficulty or threats to safety, consider people who disagree with their cause to be traitors and to say their own culture is innately superior to that of their opponents. Do you really think this reflect the views of 1/4 of the French electorate, which would vote FN? The truth if that FN and far-right voters have more nuanced view than you want to admit. FN doesn't equate fascism, unless your definition of fascism is too broad to be useful, other than to disqualify political views you simply disagree with. Doctor Malaver posted:No, I don't speak French and I don't use Twitter. This forum is my main source of information on French politics. They're simply the french manifestation of white anxieties and euroskepticism. They're nativists. Iggore fucked around with this message at 18:07 on Mar 2, 2017 |
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Mar 2, 2017 18:05
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At no point would the French establish some kind of fascist regime.
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Mar 2, 2017 18:06
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jBrereton posted:At no point would the French establish some kind of fascist regime. Why stop at fascism when you can go back to absolute monarchy? People in the so-called republican party have complained about revolutionary values, such as the abolition of privileges.
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Mar 2, 2017 18:24
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Iggore posted:Do you really think this reflect the views of 1/4 of the French electorate, which would vote FN? The truth if that FN and far-right voters have more nuanced view than you want to admit. they would have lined up behind Petain, no doubt.
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Mar 2, 2017 18:24
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It's difficult to take it the accusation that FN = fascist party when you hear it from posters in this thread, since according to the left wing posters here, anyone who is to the right of them or even another left winger who supports a liberal social democracy but who also thinks EU handles immigration poorly = fascist. I don't actually know what FN stands for hence I have not commented on French politics.
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Mar 2, 2017 18:34
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I propose a tried and true system for classifying Trump voters. there are gonna be five categories: V. Persons Exonerated (German: Entlastete). No sanctions. (these are the people who did not vote for Trump or did not actively support Trumpism) IV. Followers (German: Mitläufer). Possible restrictions on travel, employment, political rights, plus fines. (voted for Trump, but was not involved in any crimes; voted Trump out of impotent rage, for the "Lulz" or "to stick it to the establishment") III. Lesser Offenders (German: Minderbelastete). Placed on probation for 2–3 years with a list of restrictions. No internment. (voted Trump and posted Pepe memes in GBS) II. Offenders: Activists, Militants, and Profiteers, or Incriminated Persons (German: Belastete). Subject to immediate arrest and imprisonment up to ten years performing reparation or reconstruction work plus a list of other restrictions. (alt-right shitheel, wanted to exterminate some folks) I. Major Offenders (German: Hauptschuldige). Subject to immediate arrest, death, imprisonment with or without hard labour, plus a list of lesser sanctions. (alt-right shitheel, exterminated some folks)
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Mar 2, 2017 18:35
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