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Brother Entropy posted:huh, what are the odds of capturing the guy in charge when you take their capital anyway? it sounds to me like you're getting some crazy good luck if you're pulling it off that consistently Or using the "more realistic battles" mod that results in basically every male in the loser's court getting captured after every battle.
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Mar 2, 2017 16:15
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TheCIASentMe posted:I think the super cheese method is to convert to Christianity, become feudal/republic, then convert back to unreformed Norse (or die and let your unreformed Norse heir inherit.) Not really, you cant access the better inheritance laws as an unreformed pagan, because you can't increase crown authority past the second or third step IIRC
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Mar 2, 2017 16:24
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Brother Entropy posted:huh, what are the odds of capturing the guy in charge when you take their capital anyway? it sounds to me like you're getting some crazy good luck if you're pulling it off that consistently Huh, I'd say like... Out 2-3 battles, I capture or kill the enemy monarch, and the time I killed them instead I subsequently kidnapped his newly-crowned son in the ensuing siege. I have noticed there's a preference for capturing women from courts, though, or maybe that's just women generally being stuck in courts.
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Mar 2, 2017 16:29
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spectralent posted:Huh, I'd say like... Out 2-3 battles, I capture or kill the enemy monarch, and the time I killed them instead I subsequently kidnapped his newly-crowned son in the ensuing siege. mostly capturing women and children with the occasional general or low-level count or baron has been my experience, nabbing the main dude i'm up against has always seemed extremely rare for me
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Mar 2, 2017 16:33
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Eric the Mauve posted:Or using the "more realistic battles" mod that results in basically every male in the loser's court getting captured after every battle. Nah, I don't think I have any mods on. Maybe it is just luck. Well it got me enough english provinces to make the title at least.
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Mar 2, 2017 16:33
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I basically always war now by checking where the monarch is and hammering that place repeatedly until I grab him, but, yeah. It'd be interesting to see what the actual odds are, this hasn't been a huge sample. Though to be fair, taking insane risks based on spurious supposition sounds pretty viking.
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Mar 2, 2017 16:34
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So to stand a chance at reforming Norse I essentially need to exploit mechanics?
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Mar 2, 2017 16:51
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Having tested it a bit more, it happens semi-frequently when you siege, rarely when you win battles, and always if the army was a rebel one. That might be why I imagined it happening a lot.
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Mar 2, 2017 17:03
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spectralent posted:So uh if you capture a king/leader does that always autowin you the war and if so how long has that been a thing? Because I just got loving mullered by a 14k stack but I suddenly have 100% warscore anyway and christ, that's pretty good isn't it? I am pretty sure since vanilla?
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Mar 2, 2017 17:21
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Darth Windu posted:Not really, you cant access the better inheritance laws as an unreformed pagan, because you can't increase crown authority past the second or third step IIRC I thought that if you converted from Christianity with a particular inheritance law to unreformed pagan you could retain that inheritance law? Just you couldn't ever change inheritance laws because obviously you'd need to reform the faith first to get the good ones. Unless that got fixed?
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Mar 2, 2017 17:32
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If you lack diplomacy, intrigue, or martial and you need someone out of the way my go-to is usually make them the spymaster and have them go study tech somewhere until they are captured. Guess that leaves you open to assassination depending on if they don't like you disposition wise but not everyone you need removed dislikes you anyway.
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Mar 2, 2017 17:43
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So I decided to try a merchant republic since making lots of money is fun and tried Venice in the 1066 bookmark. Initial years went well, secured the trade zone around venice, won the war against croatia through mercs, dominated the rival patrician thoroughly. Then the HRE declare an embargo war on me and destroys me, 8 trade posts destroyed and my income drop to negative with the huge number of unlanded male dynasty members i had to support all of those trade posts. I'm guessing I focused too much on zerg rushing trade posts instead of building but what is the general strategy to not get destroyed by embargo wars besides marrying off for non-arggression pacts. Slow your rollout of trade posts so you can fill out you pike retinue and military holdings?
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Mar 2, 2017 17:55
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I haven't played Venice in a while but I'd try to take advantage of the MR cassus bellis that let you seize a city barony in the county (and then the county itself) - if Venice owns the land the trading post is in I don't think it is subject to any embargo wars. Otherwise just try to avoid having that many trading posts in one other country, which I know can be difficult considering the goal is to link up trade zones. I ~think~ if you are the Doge you can seize a couple trading posts from a rival house via decision but they obv will not like that.
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Mar 2, 2017 18:08
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Carcer posted:So to stand a chance at reforming Norse I essentially need to exploit mechanics? Nah. Go Old Gods start with Haesteinn of Nantes and then bail out of Brittany for Ireland and Britain.
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Mar 2, 2017 19:21
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And spend 20 years waiting for claims on the holy sites in denmark to fire?
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Mar 2, 2017 19:26
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I just went to check one of my kids for childhood focus and she has 10-stats aged six  She's a genius (and strong!), and I definitely want her on my throne, which I can do but I'm gonna have to kill a lot of siblings first. Maybe make her ambitious and get her to do some legwork? Also is the "foreigner" modifier based on the character appearance or just their culture?
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Mar 2, 2017 19:30
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Zikan posted:I'm guessing I focused too much on zerg rushing trade posts instead of building but what is the general strategy to not get destroyed by embargo wars besides marrying off for non-arggression pacts. Slow your rollout of trade posts so you can fill out you pike retinue and military holdings? Just like in any start, if you have a powerful neighbor who can crush you and will benefit from doing so, you need to stay on their good side. Use your chancellor to improve relations, and secure a NAP however you can. If the emperor isn't interested in a direct marriage, see if he has any landed relatives who will take one and then ask for the NAP once you have marriage ties. But you definitely want to get as many trade posts built as fast as possible. For merchant republics, your income is a major determinant of your military strength since you rely so much on mercs. edit: spectralent posted:Also is the "foreigner" modifier based on the character appearance or just their culture? Culture.
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Mar 2, 2017 19:33
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The CKII wiki lists, amongst other features for demon worshipers, "Unholy Impregnation [sic]" Does this mean we will be able to have children from same sex couples through Satan magic? Because at this point it seems like one can almost completely simulate 1000 years of liberal darkness through ck2. thechosenone fucked around with this message at 19:39 on Mar 2, 2017 |
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Mar 2, 2017 19:35
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thechosenone posted:The CKII wiki lists, amongst other features for demon worshipers, "Unholy Impregnation [sic]" I think perhaps more likely it means we'll be able to trigger the demonspawn event, presumably for a high Dark Power cost.
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Mar 2, 2017 19:38
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Pakled posted:I think perhaps more likely it means we'll be able to trigger the demonspawn event, presumably for a high Dark Power cost. Eh, I'd take that too. seems like an immortal demon spawn would be a real cool way to play. Though since they already have the ability to do it through console I think it would be cool to be able to do it in game. I don't even think it would be important to have to marry them, just have every child be a bastard in their eyes. Not much worse that everyone knowing your basically the Antichrist.
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Mar 2, 2017 19:40
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Carcer posted:So to stand a chance at reforming Norse I essentially need to exploit mechanics? Nah. You really only NEED 3 holy sites. If you're burning Europe down constantly like a proper viking getting to 50 moral authority isn't all that hard. Use the become king ambition to snag Norway, Sweden, or Denmark and you already have one. Let subjugation and voluntary vassalization do the rest. You can do it without claims in a generation or three easily. Doing the concubine exploit to keep from having 50 sons just makes it easier to keep the kingdom together.
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Mar 2, 2017 20:04
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What's the easiest way to get child-heirs killed? Putting them in education in courts with endemic plagues?
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Mar 2, 2017 20:15
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Concubine exploit? I can see in my next attempt I need abuse tribal armies or else I'm just going to end up 40 years into the game with 5 moral authority again. I still don't understand how you guys afford it. tribal armies cost 1.7 a month and if I'm beating dirt poor irish up for MA and I'm not supposed to use my levies to raid lucrative med targets how am I supposed to afford everything?
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Mar 2, 2017 20:22
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spectralent posted:What's the easiest way to get child-heirs killed? Putting them in education in courts with endemic plagues? If your intrigue is good and circumstances line up, just go the direct route and do an assassination plot. Children are typically way easier to assassinate than adults, I think the only exception is a deliberate easter egg.
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Mar 2, 2017 20:29
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If its your own you can't assassinate them, unfortunately.
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Mar 2, 2017 20:31
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Carcer posted:Concubine exploit? I totally used levies to raid the med. You get equal prestige to your earnings, and if you siege somewhere down you can get like 40-60 gold, maybe more, and correspondingly tons of prestige. I think basically every war I was in was supplemented with 2-5k of tribal warriors. Unrelatedly, what kind of career should I be pushing a genius to? I'm considering Struggle, getting her a Shieldmaiden post with her dad to build some vassal opinion and martial further, and probably having her come into the role with 20+ martial and solid diplo and intrigue on top of it.
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Mar 2, 2017 20:31
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LORD OF BOOTY posted:If your intrigue is good and circumstances line up, just go the direct route and do an assassination plot. Children are typically way easier to assassinate than adults, I think the only exception is a deliberate easter egg. Carcer posted:If its your own you can't assassinate them, unfortunately. Yeah that I need to kill my own kids, about six of them. EDIT: I've got three of them symptomatic though 
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Mar 2, 2017 20:32
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Appoint someone abominably bad at learning to be your court physician, hope they saw the kids head off to treat consumption. E: just make sure you don't get sick in the meantime. Carcer fucked around with this message at 20:39 on Mar 2, 2017 |
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Mar 2, 2017 20:35
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spectralent posted:Unrelatedly, what kind of career should I be pushing a genius to? I'm considering Struggle, getting her a Shieldmaiden post with her dad to build some vassal opinion and martial further, and probably having her come into the role with 20+ martial and solid diplo and intrigue on top of it.
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Mar 2, 2017 20:49
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Carcer posted:How do you afford this? With all my levies raised (Generally between 2500 and 4500 troops) It costs me 4 gold a month, a tribal army on top of that is another 1.7 or something. If I'm not spending my raiding time hitting lucrative med areas I feel I'd go bankrupt really quickly. Siege Leaders and architects are your friends; you want to go martial focus right away and hope to pick siege leader that way, as architect is a huge loving hassle. It's fine to be losing money while at war; just realize that you need to think about how long and how you're gonna fight. You can get hundreds of gold with a good run; if you're running Old Gods, you want to grab Cagliari or one of the other small targets there as a base; if you need range for that grab one of the lil Breton counties. Actually making money is different from just going for MA; for MA you don't give a poo poo about the money really, so Ireland is good. But if you want cash, you rather want to aim for Start checking out Wales, then East England, then Britanny, Asturias if its small and weak, then the N-Africans, then the Pope and Venice, then the other Islands. Carcer posted:I've considered that but I can see myself basking in the achievement for about 5 seconds before the entirety of Christendom comes down on me like a furious storm of swords, crosses and hail marys. Darth Windu posted:Not really, you cant access the better inheritance laws as an unreformed pagan, because you can't increase crown authority past the second or third step IIRC Carcer posted:So to stand a chance at reforming Norse I essentially need to exploit mechanics? I remember once making a map of all the easy spots to burn poo poo down but it was basically the raiding I mentioned earlier, plus a few places in east europe on the way back, you then just kept to that circuit until you had the MA needed. Strudel Man posted:Struggle is basically the best, just because 1) chance of brawny, and 2) its likely outcomes both support the military career, while every other upbringing is split.
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Mar 2, 2017 20:50
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Thanks, I'll use that advice in my next go. I don't spend money flagrantly, especially in my sweden games where I need it as a safety blanket for when I need to keep troops raised for whatever reason. When my most recent one failed I had 600 gold ready to go on a world church burning tour when I realized I had 10 MA and only about 10 years to fix it.
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Mar 2, 2017 21:09
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spectralent posted:Unrelatedly, what kind of career should I be pushing a genius to? I'm considering Struggle, getting her a Shieldmaiden post with her dad to build some vassal opinion and martial further, and probably having her come into the role with 20+ martial and solid diplo and intrigue on top of it. I like to use Duty, since it has a 50% chance of becoming Diligent. Having Genius + Diligent gives you a very high chance of a level 3 or 4 education of any type, regardless of traits. Note that if your kid gets Rowdy and it converts into Dull, it will downgrade Genius into Quick.
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Mar 2, 2017 22:47
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Carcer posted:Concubine exploit? We all know that inheritance is a pain and when you just want one heir and maybe a backup your wife is practically guaranteed to shotgun like 30 sons into the world. Christians obviously can't use concubine tricks but pagans can and boy can they be handy. Divorce is kind of a pain no matter what religion you are and isn't free. Here's a hint: you can discard a concubine any time you feel like it. Soon as you're done with her then welp sorry babe. You can hang around the castle but no more Viking dick for you! What you do is first just don't get married. Don't need to worry about your wife shotgunning out sons if you never have one. If you need an heir or an extra son for whatever reason then you take a concubine or two then get rid of them as soon as you have your desired number of sons. It's kind of an exploit but not a huge one. The other exploit-ish thing Christians can actually do as well. Never get married and also never take concubines. Pick the Seduction focus and grab a few lovers but never legitimize the bastards until you have to. If it's succession time or you're worried about dying legitimize exactly one of them. This also lets you control which bastard gets to inherit so have like 50 sons whatever who cares. Obviously only having one heir ever is riskier than having backups but limiting your inheriting children when under Gavelkind is a god send. This is especially true if you have an heir and a backup, neither of which have sons. The one that inherits should murder the other one, especially if there isn't a dynasty to deal with otherwise. On one hand stuff like this is exploity but on the other hand it's a game about that sort of fuckery and people absolutely did poo poo like this in the medieval era anyway so it fits in spirit. They might not have done it at the industrial scale of murder that people get up to when playing CKII but people definitely murdered relatives or found ways to game the succession laws to get thrones. Of course if you're playing a republic then get married, acquire lustful, grab your concubines, seduce a dozen debutantes, and start manufacturing sons.
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Mar 2, 2017 23:39
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That concubine strategy seems much worse and complex compared to simply seducing women then strategically legitimizing bastards Just marry an old lady with good stats if you don't want kids, you don't have to stay unmarried... Just loving fight your brothers like a real viking for top level titles then conquer some more for yourself
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Mar 3, 2017 00:18
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Deceitful Penguin posted:Just marry an old lady with good stats if you don't want kids, you don't have to stay unmarried... Better if her Intrigue score is low though, because she is going to hate your guts
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Mar 3, 2017 00:57
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Eric the Mauve posted:Better if her Intrigue score is low though, because she is going to hate your guts I thought it was like with children, they're always just rivals because hey, free ambitious trait right?
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Mar 3, 2017 01:01
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Deceitful Penguin posted:Wait, you mean there are non-hating wives for non-strong/fair characters??? Your wife won't give a poo poo if you have 500 babies to concubines but she gets a massive opinion malus if you legitimize a bunch of bastard. If she has a high intrigue she'll make a very major contribution to your murder or just plain try to do it herself. I'm pretty sure close relatives, wives especially, get a good boost to plot power too.
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Mar 3, 2017 02:45
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I have a beautiful immortal gay genius master general of persian descent leading scandanavia and the norse faith. Between Attractive and Master Seductress alone, all male vassals (which is more or less all of them) have +70 base opinion, even after taking away -10 for being female. I've only been on the throne for less than a decade, so long reign is going to bring that higher. The only person in my court who didn't like me is my cousin who has a claim to like every title in scandanavia, and everyone loves me so much I had about thirty people in the plot and something like 300% plot power so he basically died a week later. I see why monarchies didn't like letting women rule; beautiful queens were OP.
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Mar 3, 2017 02:46
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ToxicSlurpee posted:Your wife won't give a poo poo if you have 500 babies to concubines but she gets a massive opinion malus if you legitimize a bunch of bastard. If she has a high intrigue she'll make a very major contribution to your murder or just plain try to do it herself. I'm pretty sure close relatives, wives especially, get a good boost to plot power too. So if she's plotting to kill you, you imprison her. Can't plot from prison! Then you either kill her or don't, depending on preference. You can plop your spymaster down to make sure you find out quick enough I guess. Divorce is just a bit of cash anyway; you should have enough as a Norse pagan if you for some reason don´t want to commit horrible acts against your wife. I'm more worried about my kids usually, as your kids should hate you already because you picked ambitious right? And generally you have more children than wives. But if you can't keep your kids from murdering you, you don't deserve to be in charge anyway. So it goes. The young eat the old and then repeat their crimes. spectralent posted:I have a beautiful immortal gay genius master general of persian descent leading scandanavia and the norse faith. Between Attractive and Master Seductress alone, all male vassals (which is more or less all of them) have +70 base opinion, even after taking away -10 for being female. I've only been on the throne for less than a decade, so long reign is going to bring that higher. The only person in my court who didn't like me is my cousin who has a claim to like every title in scandanavia, and everyone loves me so much I had about thirty people in the plot and something like 300% plot power so he basically died a week later.
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Mar 3, 2017 02:55
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Yeah, this is the first time I've actually succeeded in becoming immortal (I assume being a Genius with amazing stats helped?), so I'm not sure if you're literally ageless or if you get old but don't suffer the ill-effects. It'll be equally interesting to see if immortals hit menopause or not; having a massive dynasty of children with a maternal line that just goes directly downwards for a hundred years would be pretty funny.
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Mar 3, 2017 03:04
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