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Raxivace posted:Yeah I dunno that I really buy Mika suddenly going into a leadership role like that. I don't know if I really see what Mika did as a leadership role. He basically stood up and said "we're going to continue following Orga's last command, no matter what" - which is entirely in line with his character - and he seems to have committed himself to a suicide mission to ensure that at least some of Tekkadan lives to fulfill that order. This lines up with his previous assertion that if only he killed more guys faster and better, Orga's plans would have worked. Note that in the actual defense Eugene is the one who is giving all of the commands and encouragement to people. Mika just used his near-mythical status in Tekkadan as Orga's unstoppable right hand to stop them from falling apart long enough for Eugene to take command.
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Mar 26, 2017 19:00
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There's a possibility that Julietta might do something after Rustal's "I'm exactly the kind of person you hate" talk, but I honestly doubt it. We're on track for an ending where for an everyone dies except the Tekkadan members that got away and started new lives, which is basically just an incredibly costly and bittersweet version of what Orga set out to do in the first place. Except Akihiro. They're gonna kill everyone off dramatically and end the show, and then after the credits it's gonna show the Gusion (who will not have appeared in the episode at all up to the point, because that's how the Gusion rolls during climactic fights) standing on a pile of wrecked Grazes, with a confused Akihiro going "Okay, well I guess I can go through that tunnel now."Raxivace posted:Yeah I dunno that I really buy Mika suddenly going into a leadership role like that. Yelling at people in very simple words to do a thing they were already ordered to do and were in the process of doing before the confusion happened isn't really a leadership role. The only person who gave any orders or showed any leadership in Tekkadan this episode was Eugene. Mika just cowed people.
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Mar 26, 2017 19:01
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I saw that more as a broken person goading shellshocked people into a suicidal last resort, because the alternative is death anyway and Mika doesn't care about his own fate.
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Mar 26, 2017 19:06
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Psycho Landlord posted:There's a possibility that Julietta might do something after Rustal's "I'm exactly the kind of person you hate" talk, but I honestly doubt it. We're on track for an ending where for an everyone dies except the Tekkadan members that got away and started new lives, which is basically just an incredibly costly and bittersweet version of what Orga set out to do in the first place. Except Akihiro. They're gonna kill everyone off dramatically and end the show, and then after the credits it's gonna show the Gusion (who will not have appeared in the episode at all up to the point, because that's how the Gusion rolls during climactic fights) standing on a pile of wrecked Grazes, with a confused Akihiro going "Okay, well I guess I can go through that tunnel now." And that's exactly what Mika has been doing since Episode One. He's always been Orga's fist, now he's just doing it when Orga isn't around.
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Mar 26, 2017 19:41
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Kanos posted:I don't know if I really see what Mika did as a leadership role. He basically stood up and said "we're going to continue following Orga's last command, no matter what" - which is entirely in line with his character - and he seems to have committed himself to a suicide mission to ensure that at least some of Tekkadan lives to fulfill that order. This lines up with his previous assertion that if only he killed more guys faster and better, Orga's plans would have worked. Psycho Landlord posted:Yelling at people in very simple words to do a thing they were already ordered to do and were in the process of doing before the confusion happened isn't really a leadership role. The only person who gave any orders or showed any leadership in Tekkadan this episode was Eugene. Mika just cowed people. Mika's big speech was about talking these people out of an impulsively suicidal revenge mission.
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Mar 26, 2017 19:42
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I mean, do you think generals in armies actually do all the strategic mapping and maintenance on arms? A leader is more about keeping a group together and being functional, while making the executive decision that everyone has to follow or else it's just chaos. NBA coaches don't do all the X and 0's and teach the young players how to play. That's what assistants do. They just make it all work together that goes beyond the nitty gritty.
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Mar 26, 2017 19:45
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Raxivace posted:The lesser Tekkadan members not were not in the process of doing what they were supposed to do at the moment. That's the whole point of the beginning of the episode- they were itching to throw their plan away to get revenge against Gjallarhorn, despite not even knowing for sure that they were the ones responsible for killing Orga. This was ignoring basically everything Orga wanted to actually accomplish at the end- get as many people to survive and live and laugh happily together and so on. Orga dying was what created the confusion that he snapped them out of. Before that point, they were on track to make contact through the tunnel and attempt to evacuate through it. That is what I said. Mika's been Orga's yes man since episode one and has publicly told other people to follow whatever orders Orga gave them on several occasions during crisis moments. That's exactly what he did here, for the final time. The only difference is he made sure everyone could hear him before he belted out his usual rhetoric. It's really not that much of a stretch, nor is it a surprise move for his character. He didn't suddenly turn into McArthur between Eps.
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Mar 26, 2017 20:46
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Errybody gonna die
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Mar 26, 2017 20:46
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I have a feeling something much bigger than Arianrod is about to happen.
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Mar 26, 2017 21:34
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Diabetes Forecast posted:I have a feeling something much bigger than Arianrod is about to happen. In one episode? Dangerous Person posted:Errybody gonna die Well Iok and Gaelio are pretty much guaranteed survival. Iok was injured by McGillis and needs to recover so he is out of the final battle. Kimaris was heavily damaged so Gaelio can't fight in the final battle. So it is likely just going to be a victory for Arianrhod MonsterEnvy fucked around with this message at 23:20 on Mar 26, 2017 |
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Mar 26, 2017 23:18
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I think people have been underestimating Mika. From the beginning, it has always been Mika's choice to rely on Orga. And he's gone against Orga's orders before. Mika is smart and practical. It's like Mika himself said in the cockpit, he knows what Orga's orders would've been. Mika going catatonic or flipping out and getting himself killed for revenge would've been far more out of character than what he did this episode.
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Mar 26, 2017 23:25
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Well, Hush did his best to keep his promise. Aside from getting jumped, he didn't do anything un-cool with Lafter's machine. Any bets on what Arianrhod's mechanic meant by "the special troops" heading out? More dainsleifs?
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Mar 26, 2017 23:27
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Lock Knight posted:Well, Hush did his best to keep his promise. Aside from getting jumped, he didn't do anything un-cool with Lafter's machine. Well, we do know that Dainsleif-compatible railguns work decently well in atmosphere, though they're most suited to zero-G combat where cover isn't a thing that exists. It's a potential option, but I wonder if we might be looking at something else. A secret Alaya-Vijnana brigade? Rustal wouldn't convert Julietta against her will, but he might have had a few other willing volunteers. I also wonder what Julietta herself will be flying. The Julia is (a) totally trashed, and (b) useless on the ground. Maybe that rumour about a rebuilt, modified Flauros will have something to it? That would also work with the 'Dainsleif brigade' idea.
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Mar 26, 2017 23:36
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I got a big old laugh out of how the start of the episode showed McGillis was 100% in the clear regarding Orga since nearly everyone in this thread was pinning it on him super hard.
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Mar 27, 2017 01:41
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I wonder if McGillis would actually manage to murder Rustal if Gali wasn't there. He seemed to be doing real well before purple boy showed up with his robot boyfriend.
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Mar 27, 2017 02:01
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Overlord K posted:I got a big old laugh out of how the start of the episode showed McGillis was 100% in the clear regarding Orga since nearly everyone in this thread was pinning it on him super hard. To be honest I'm not thrilled by it. McGillis ended up being a lot more of a boring character than I expected. He's not precisely boring but for someone who they spend the entire series building up he's super one-note and had very very little to actually do with Tekkadan on a character level. He's basically just there for Gaelio's plot which is fine but leaves him feeling really thin at the end of the day. I was wrong but as good as his final scene was I think he ended up being a kinda meh character. Edit: That isn't fair really. Everything with him and Gaelio is good if basically being Char again but with a Garma that survives and is pissed off at him. Everything involving him and Tekkadan is like "oh, okay, this guy just basically coasts along this plot." ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 02:10 on Mar 27, 2017 |
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Mar 27, 2017 02:05
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So is the next episode the last one? Seems like there's still a lot to cover, unless they go to a third season or movie. Before I realised how little was left, I thought we might get a Bael Vidar Kimaris FrankenGundam.
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Mar 27, 2017 02:19
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BizarroAzrael posted:So is the next episode the last one? Seems like there's still a lot to cover, unless they go to a third season or movie. episode 50 is last and it ends with Iok being crowned King of Mars while standing on top of everyone else's corpses.
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Mar 27, 2017 02:21
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BizarroAzrael posted:So is the next episode the last one? Seems like there's still a lot to cover, unless they go to a third season or movie. Next week is the last episode, barring the sudden announcement of an OAV/movie followup but I don't believe there have been any whispers of that while it was an open secret with 00.
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Mar 27, 2017 02:26
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All that's really left to resolve is the current fight after Julietta joins in, and then seeing who manages to survive. And possibly some last minute murders. Unless Kudelia has a secret revolutionary army to pull out of her rear end at the last minute.
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Mar 27, 2017 02:29
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paragon1 posted:All that's really left to resolve is the current fight after Julietta joins in, and then seeing who manages to survive. And possibly some last minute murders. The final shot is Gaelio, Rustal, Iok and Julietta meeting to discuss the future after the destruction of Tekkadan. Their ship vanishes in a nuclear explosion. Cut to Kudelia smiling. End series.
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Mar 27, 2017 02:33
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ImpAtom posted:The final shot is Gaelio, Rustal, Iok and Julietta meeting to discuss the future after the destruction of Tekkadan. Their ship vanishes in a nuclear explosion. Cut to Kudelia smiling. End series. After the credits, she takes off her wig and mask, revealing Lacus Clyne.
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Mar 27, 2017 02:35
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MonsterEnvy posted:Well they kind of deserve it in that they utterly outplayed their enemies. does it count as outplaying when it's largely built on a hilarious amount of plot armor?
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Mar 27, 2017 02:40
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GimmickMan posted:After the credits, she takes off her wig and mask, revealing
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Mar 27, 2017 02:43
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Oh Snapple! posted:does it count as outplaying when it's largely built on a hilarious amount of plot armor? I don't know. I don't really think there's any plot armor in defeating a single unaided mobile suit when you have an entire army. Like there's genuinely no reason McGillis should have won. He didn't even do a clever tactic he just charged at them in a single mobile suit after using his carrier to get relatively close.
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Mar 27, 2017 02:42
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ImpAtom posted:I don't know. I don't really think there's any plot armor in defeating a single unaided mobile suit when you have an entire army. I mainly mean in the sense that Rustal got handed a 100% perfect counter to McGillis' insurrection in the form of Gaelio stupidly surviving.
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Mar 27, 2017 02:44
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Oh Snapple! posted:I mainly mean in the sense that Rustal got handed a 100% perfect counter to McGillis' insurrection in the form of Gaelio stupidly surviving. Well, even without Gaelio, he's been playing it pretty much perfectly. He genuinely hasn't made any real mistakes or arrogant oversteps and had made the right calls in terms of how to distribute his forces and back his enemies into a corner. Gaelio countering McGillis is absolutely in his favor but it isn't like it is unjustified except for the bullshit of Gaelio surviving. (And the end of S1 is nonstop bullshit survival so that's pretty evenly distributed plot armor.) It isn't like things suddenly stopped working or the plot bullshitted to allow things to happen that normally wouldn't. Rustal just genuinely is outplaying everyone. It sucks because he's a giant shithead but it doesn't feel ill-earned. (Or if it did then he's up against Tekkadan's fairly significant plot armor themselves.)
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Mar 27, 2017 02:48
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We're not in Gundam-directly-stabbed-cockpit-explodes-no-wait-I turned off the nuclear reactor I'm fine-territory yet.
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Mar 27, 2017 02:50
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ImpAtom posted:To be honest I'm not thrilled by it. McGillis ended up being a lot more of a boring character than I expected. He's not precisely boring but for someone who they spend the entire series building up he's super one-note and had very very little to actually do with Tekkadan on a character level. He's basically just there for Gaelio's plot which is fine but leaves him feeling really thin at the end of the day. I don't know if McGillis is a "good" character, but he was super enjoyable to watch, mainly because of all the stuff that makes him not a good character to you. At least for Gundam fans. Look back through the thread, everyone, myself included, was just waiting for him to betray everyone. Expecting his great plan to be revealed. But instead he was what he was.
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Mar 27, 2017 02:53
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ImpAtom posted:Well, even without Gaelio, he's been playing it pretty much perfectly. He genuinely hasn't made any real mistakes or arrogant oversteps and had made the right calls in terms of how to distribute his forces and back his enemies into a corner. Gaelio countering McGillis is absolutely in his favor but it isn't like it is unjustified except for the bullshit of Gaelio surviving. (And the end of S1 is nonstop bullshit survival so that's pretty evenly distributed plot armor.) Rustal has been making good tactical decisions but at the end of day it's hard to not feel as if the outcome wasn't largely decided by Gaelio surviving. His presence alone forced McGillis to act faster than likely planned, and then blocked him when he made his power play, putting McGillis and Tekkadan on the backfoot from the get-go in terms of numbers. It reeked as lazy, hack writing when Vidar was first introduced and it only got worse as he played his part. It's like Okada wanted a particular outcome but wasn't creative enough to reach it without giving one side an I-Win button. Which is really weird because McGillis not being a real Seven Stars seemed like it could have served the same purpose as Gaelio surviving, but she decided that had to be used to deliver a different blow. It's just...not good to me, and truth be told I'm more just getting my thoughts out there rather than debating on it. It's just bad storytelling to me.
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Mar 27, 2017 03:03
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Oh Snapple! posted:Rustal has been making good tactical decisions but at the end of day it's hard to not feel as if the outcome wasn't largely decided by Gaelio surviving. His presence alone forced McGillis to act faster than likely planned, and then blocked him when he made his power play, putting McGillis and Tekkadan on the backfoot from the get-go in terms of numbers. It reeked as lazy, hack writing when Vidar was first introduced and it only got worse as he played his part. It's like Okada wanted a particular outcome but wasn't creative enough to reach it without giving one side an I-Win button. Which is really weird because McGillis not being a real Seven Stars seemed like it could have served the same purpose as Gaelio surviving, but she decided that had to be used to deliver a different blow. Well, I think Gaelio surviving was pretty bullshit and made no real sense so I won't disagree with you there. I think it's sort of a problem IBO has in total where it has things that it wants to happen and isn't particularly good about making them feel natural. It's why every cast member basically has a I Am Going To Die Now episode or people basically show up semi-randomly so events can occur. McGillis basically has the most justified death but even here like... Gaelio got out of his Gundam and then shoved his mask back on for no real clear reason just so he could tank a bullet from McGillis because sure why not?
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Mar 27, 2017 03:13
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They really went all out in the animation during Gaelio's and McGillis' big Lelouch/Suzaku-esque reunion One last episode to wrap things up, but in general, this series contains alot of the germs of really good stories, but didn't follow them up and instead focused on the rise-and-fall of Orga and McGillis. I really wanted to see the economic blocs rebelling against Gjallarhorn, or the original crusade by Agnika against the MAs, but instead it became about two guys (who could really use more development) taking insane gambles against the sheer might of the Arianrhod fleet. Most Gundam shows are about overturning the status quo, but in this one, the situation is even worse for the Tekkadan kids than before.
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Mar 27, 2017 03:14
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I expect next week to be the last episode, but keep in mind there was no hints or reason to believe a 2nd season would happen either. I don't know what a 3rd season could even cover, but the fact that we haven't heard anything doesn't really tilt things either way.
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Mar 27, 2017 03:26
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I mean the only thing I know about Mari Okada is Tora Dora so maybe she should just stick to light novel adaptations next time.
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Mar 27, 2017 03:30
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Shinjobi posted:I expect next week to be the last episode, but keep in mind there was no hints or reason to believe a 2nd season would happen either. Eh, the second season was rumored for a while. A third season isn't impossible but it would be a first and they've gone pretty slaughter-happy with the cast at this point.
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Mar 27, 2017 03:29
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It would be weird to have a third season given that the principal cast is getting killed off one-by-one, and there's nobody really lined up to form a new core cast. Not that they couldn't tell a story with a new cast and a few returnees.
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Mar 27, 2017 03:53
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I think they've written themselves into ending it here. To keep Tekkadan intact as a force to drive any further plot the writers would have to interrupt the "get your rear end from Mars and get new lives" path that Tekkadan is on while somehow preventing Rustal from wiping them out, and that would be a pulled punch even moreso than the end of season one. A new cast would have to get their hands on another Gundam frame, but I guess they could dig one out of the ground or gank one from a bunch of space pirates. A third option is that Tekkadan escapes as planned, we have another time skip, and then somehow they get called back into action to protect Kudelia from an external threat (maybe the Nobliss showdown that we were kind of expecting), but we have to either find another Gundam for Mika or sneak Barbatos back to earth and keep it hidden for years.
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Mar 27, 2017 04:03
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ImpAtom posted:Well, I think Gaelio surviving was pretty bullshit and made no real sense so I won't disagree with you there. I think it's sort of a problem IBO has in total where it has things that it wants to happen and isn't particularly good about making them feel natural. It's why every cast member basically has a I Am Going To Die Now episode or people basically show up semi-randomly so events can occur. McGillis basically has the most justified death but even here like... Gaelio got out of his Gundam and then shoved his mask back on for no real clear reason just so he could tank a bullet from McGillis because sure why not? i think that putting on a helmet that you have on hand anyways before going after someone who probably has a gun is a completely reasonable decision
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Mar 27, 2017 04:29
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ImpAtom posted:To be honest I'm not thrilled by it. McGillis ended up being a lot more of a boring character than I expected. He's not precisely boring but for someone who they spend the entire series building up he's super one-note and had very very little to actually do with Tekkadan on a character level. He's basically just there for Gaelio's plot which is fine but leaves him feeling really thin at the end of the day. He's exactly as crazy as Char is, only without the good sense to not go slamming directly into every conflict at full speed. It's fun to see an inept Char that's actually written as a true one.
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Mar 27, 2017 04:30
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RottenK posted:i think that putting on a helmet that you have on hand anyways before going after someone who probably has a gun is a completely reasonable decision He doesn't have his helmet onhand though. He explicitly got rid of it and wasn't using it anymore, unless he shoved it into his cockpit and kept it around just in case he needed to dramatically put it back on.
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Mar 27, 2017 04:31
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