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GalacticAcid posted:there are centrists who are good at messaging, for instance jason kander, roy cooper, or josh shapiro I don't know if he'll win but Ossoff's ads are pretty straight forward and attack government waste and corruption which I think is something most people would like to see less of unless you work for the White House.
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Apr 4, 2017 18:40
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loquacius posted:I mean it's not hard, mainstream Dems have their primaries on lockdown but don't know how to talk to anyone who isn't a carbon copy of themselves. We've been way over this already dude, c'mon the idea that the ge is easier to win than the primary for a leftist candidate seems a bit absurd to me
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Apr 4, 2017 18:42
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Concerned Citizen posted:the idea that the ge is easier to win than the primary for a leftist candidate seems a bit absurd to me Could you say that this is, perhaps, of concern to you?
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Apr 4, 2017 18:43
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speaking of primaries https://twitter.com/tomperriello/status/849231838031876096
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Apr 4, 2017 18:44
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Concerned Citizen posted:the idea that the ge is easier to win than the primary for a leftist candidate seems a bit absurd to me Say what you will about the tenets of progressive populism, Dude, at least it's an ethos Gotta have a message, gotta convince people it will help them, New Deal politics will do that nicely
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Apr 4, 2017 18:46
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Klobuchar Is supposed to be the guest speaker at the TN Jackson Day dinner. Should I bother with making a polite apology for not attending or an outright "hell no?" Reason is mainly the price -- they're asking $150 a ticket, and i've never spent three figures on food without some sort of expectation that it'll last me the rest of the month. quote:Since election day, Tennesseans have sprung into action in every corner of the state, holding our elected officials accountable and leading the resistance to President Trump. In case you haven't noticed, it's working: The Affordable Care Act is still standing! 
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Apr 4, 2017 18:46
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lol at anyone rushing to defend chelsea clinton just l o l
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Apr 4, 2017 18:47
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zegermans posted:>Leftism is the light for America Are you really this stupid?
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Apr 4, 2017 18:48
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zegermans posted:>Neoliberalism is the light for America
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Apr 4, 2017 18:50
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MaxxBot posted:Could be blockchains, I'm blocked as well and definitely have never interacted with them. I don't think I'm on any chains, I just touched this particular poop at some point.
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Apr 4, 2017 18:51
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tadashi posted:I don't know if he'll win but Ossoff's ads are pretty straight forward and attack government waste and corruption which I think is something most people would like to see less of unless you work for the White House. I haven't been following that race - it seems hopeless but I'm glad to see there's some effort going into it at least. Concerned Citizen posted:speaking of primaries Oh, wow. I wonder if Obama or Biden will come out for Perriello.
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Apr 4, 2017 18:52
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Like an actual rock could defend itself from a competent, funded primary challenge as long as that rock is the incumbent.
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Apr 4, 2017 18:52
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loquacius posted:Say what you will about the tenets of progressive populism, Dude, at least it's an ethos yes, a good progressive campaign is better than a bad centrist campaign. but the dem primary base should be more receptive than the general electorate. if you're running a base-focused campaign, that should be the easy part. i am reminded of lucy flores getting wrecked by the establishment candidate that got outspent massively by her. because she decided that she shouldn't run tv ads and instead should spend all her money knocking on doors. progressives can run lovely campaigns too! (and they often do) Vox Nihili posted:Like an actual rock could defend itself from a competent, funded primary challenge as long as that rock is the incumbent. i'm not thinking of primaries against incumbents, which are always uphill even when the incumbent is mired in scandal
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Apr 4, 2017 18:54
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GalacticAcid posted:I haven't been following that race - it seems hopeless but I'm glad to see there's some effort going into it at least. 'some' is way understating it. There's a national effort to pour money into the race and it's going to end up close enough, in an incredibly Republican district, that it's going to end up scaring at least a few Republican representatives.
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Apr 4, 2017 18:54
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Vox Nihili posted:Like an actual rock could defend itself from a competent, funded primary challenge as long as that rock is the incumbent. Me, looking over a list of why leftism doesn't win, which doesn't include "the majority of Americans don't like it" 
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Apr 4, 2017 18:55
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Concerned Citizen posted:but the dem primary base should be more receptive than the general electorate. Absolutely not. Older Democrats (ie the ones voting in Democratic primaries) have shown time and time again that they care less about policies and more about the number of things you have on your resume and what opinion the Venerated Party Elders have on you. See: that time they nominated John Kerry
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Apr 4, 2017 18:59
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zegermans posted:>Leftism is the light for America You are dumb
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Apr 4, 2017 19:00
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Me, looking at Zegerman's post history: http://i.imgur.com/jArJz56.jpg
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Apr 4, 2017 19:01
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Apr 4, 2017 19:03
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Nanomashoes posted:Me, looking at Zegerman's post history: >Zegerman is the light for America >Hillary runs terrible campaigns >Zegerman poo poo on he own balls confusedguy.jpeg
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Apr 4, 2017 19:05
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I like how your middle point is internally contradictory
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Apr 4, 2017 19:06
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loquacius posted:Absolutely not. Older Democrats (ie the ones voting in Democratic primaries) have shown time and time again that they care less about policies and more about the number of things you have on your resume and what opinion the Venerated Party Elders have on you. See: that time they nominated John Kerry i think if anything the 2016 election proved this is literally the exact opposite, given that sanders won 23 states and trump won his party's nomination. voters do not give a poo poo about party elders, but support from party elders often correlates with viability.
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Apr 4, 2017 19:06
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Concerned Citizen posted:the idea that the ge is easier to win than the primary for a leftist candidate seems a bit absurd to me You mean the centrists won't vote for a leftist? But they hate purity tests!
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Apr 4, 2017 19:07
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The real question is why are you guys so easily trolled
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Apr 4, 2017 19:08
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zegermans posted:I like how your middle point is internally contradictory the majority of their tactics are bleeding left opposition dry in the courts and stalling so that they miss ballot deadlines. on every level. it's got very little to do with what's traditionally considered "campaigning"
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Apr 4, 2017 19:09
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indigi posted:the majority of their tactics are bleeding left opposition dry in the courts and stalling so that they miss ballot deadlines. on every level. it's got very little to do with what's traditionally considered "campaigning" no it isn't
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Apr 4, 2017 19:10
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Zhulik posted:The real question is why are you guys so easily trolled i keep telling themmmmmmmmmmm
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Apr 4, 2017 19:11
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Concerned Citizen posted:i think if anything the 2016 election proved this is literally the exact opposite, given that sanders won 23 states and trump won his party's nomination. voters do not give a poo poo about party elders, but support from party elders often correlates with viability. Hillary won safe blue stronghold states full of people like the ones I know IRL who fit the description I posted to a T. They are the ones with all the delegates. Bernie won more when independents could vote and where being a registered D voter was less core to people's identity. The fact that Bernie almost won but couldn't because MA, NY, and CA were full of too many old people who definitely voted for Kerry doesn't really disprove my thesis. And I don't really think the GOP primary is relevant, I wasn't talking about them
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Apr 4, 2017 19:11
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indigi posted:the majority of their tactics are bleeding left opposition dry in the courts and stalling so that they miss ballot deadlines. on every level. it's got very little to do with what's traditionally considered "campaigning" 
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Apr 4, 2017 19:13
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Concerned Citizen posted:no it isn't yeppers
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Apr 4, 2017 19:14
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loquacius posted:Hillary won safe blue stronghold states full of people like the ones I know IRL who fit the description I posted to a T. They are the ones with all the delegates. Bernie won more when independents could vote and where being a registered D voter was less core to people's identity. The fact that Bernie almost won but couldn't because MA, NY, and CA were full of too many old people who definitely voted for Kerry doesn't really disprove my thesis. Oh look you deleted the entire Black South again. Do you write for Jacobin?
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Apr 4, 2017 19:14
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loquacius posted:Hillary won safe blue stronghold states full of people like the ones I know IRL who fit the description I posted to a T. They are the ones with all the delegates. Bernie won more when independents could vote and where being a registered D voter was less core to people's identity. The fact that Bernie almost won but couldn't because MA, NY, and CA were full of too many old people who definitely voted for Kerry doesn't really disprove my thesis. hillary's margin of victory came from running up the score in southern minority-heavy states, not because she won MA and CA by like 3 points. take south carolina, georgia, florida, and texas. all of which are completely open primaries except for florida. bernie lost because he, for whatever reason, had almost 0 appeal to black voters and also allowed hillary to take a significant lead among latinos. bernie ran very competitively, or won, in many solidly blue states. he absolutely crushed in rhode island, for example, which is generally considered the most democratic state in the nation after maybe hawaii. washington, oregon, rhode island, colorado - and he ran very close to hillary despite having the disadvantage of essentially having already lost in late states like ca. Concerned Citizen has issued a correction as of 19:20 on Apr 4, 2017 |
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Apr 4, 2017 19:16
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Those Superpredators get their votes taken away when they're thrown in the private prisons that back Dem campaigns.
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Apr 4, 2017 19:17
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zegermans posted:Oh look you deleted the entire Black South again. Do you write for Jacobin? Sorry Z, I know you're just in one of your "moods," can't play this time, I got you on the next one though  Concerned Citizen posted:hillary's margin of victory came from running up the score in southern minority-heavy states, not because she won MA and CA by like 3 points. take south carolina, georgia, florida, and texas. all of which are completely open primaries except for florida. bernie lost because he, for whatever reason, had almost 0 appeal to black voters and also allowed hillary to take a significant lead among latinos. I bring up the stronghold states because those are the ones with all the self-described "liberals" in them which he had to win to Make A Statement. He could not, largely because of the aforementioned old people. The same age-divide thing is what also lost him the South, now that you mention it, except even more so because his Youth Engine wasn't running at full bore yet and then Jeff Weaver gave up immediately. e: I guess it wasn't the SAME age divide -- older black people have nothing but goodwill toward the Clinton family, though whether it is deserved is the subject of many a thinkpiece and I won't get into it here. That's not strictly the same thing as the stronghold-state "all the important people like Hillary so I'm mad if you disagree with them  " old people.
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Apr 4, 2017 19:18
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Hellary
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Apr 4, 2017 19:21
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zegermans posted:>Leftism is the light for America Dems are great at one thing, controlling their own bureaucracy with an iron grip. Like any class of otherwise incompetent bureaucrats in the world, it's part of self ordering institutional intelligence inherent to hierarchical systems.
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Apr 4, 2017 19:22
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Oh, also RI has enough college students proportional to its population to balance out the Newport crowd. That makes them a special case. Hawaii is very blue in vote total but I wouldn't call them a "stronghold state" because they're usually fairly distant from "the establishment" as we know it.
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Apr 4, 2017 19:22
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Nanomashoes posted:Those Superpredators get their votes taken away when they're thrown in the private prisons that back Dem campaigns. And now we're to the not-racist "blacks didn't know how to vote right" phase
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Apr 4, 2017 19:24
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meanwhile in CA 34, Sanders has failed to issue and endorsement despite one of his state campaign guys being one of the candidates. i understand that CA counts for basically loving nothing politically speaking, but cmon throw us a bone here Bernie. if we end up going into the June election with Robert Ahn versus Generic Doomed Republican #241, im going to be irritable
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Apr 4, 2017 19:25
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zegermans posted:Oh look you deleted the entire Black South again. Do you write for Jacobin? I'll never stop lolling while I retrospect about during the primary about how everybody was arguing that the minority coalitions in the dem party vote for the electable candidates since it's just a necessary stopgap. Hillary really owned the hell out of that particular bloc, if so. She is one hell of a scam artist. She's still giving speeches lol.
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