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Are the YoRHa androids child soldiers? I thought I read something about YoRHa being only 10 years old earlier in the thread but I can't track it down. Their impractical clothing and general incompetence really are reminiscent of a bunch of teenagers.
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Apr 24, 2017 06:55
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I don't think the androids have a concept of children.
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Apr 24, 2017 06:59
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White Coke posted:Are the YoRHa androids child soldiers? I thought I read something about YoRHa being only 10 years old earlier in the thread but I can't track it down. Their impractical clothing and general incompetence really are reminiscent of a bunch of teenagers. This is Yoko Taro we're talking about. I'm not sure he can get hard if a child isn't imperiled first.
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Apr 24, 2017 07:00
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White Coke posted:Are the YoRHa androids child soldiers? I thought I read something about YoRHa being only 10 years old earlier in the thread but I can't track it down. Their impractical clothing and general incompetence really are reminiscent of a bunch of teenagers. Their age is kinda hard to determine since they are just data transferred from a server to a body that (probably) doesn't age and is remade whenever they
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Apr 24, 2017 07:19
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E;fb i guess, my bad not actually reading latest post  Androids exist in the cloud with their bodies being replaced in case of terminal (lethal?) shutdown. The transfer boxes don't seem to act as teleportation devices but rather as 3D printers, too. Which makes the question of their age interesting. When were 2B and 9S created? They both demonstrate unique characteristics not found in other similar models. Well, we haven't seen any other scanners so far though...
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Apr 24, 2017 07:28
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CharlestheHammer posted:Every game has that option. The devs wanted to put in an optional ending where you simply left the area, but the idea was nixed.
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Apr 24, 2017 07:30
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Yes, it's an option. That doesn't mean it's not really loving stupid. We didn't spend money on this poo poo to not play it. It doesn't sound ~deep and meaningful~.
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Apr 24, 2017 07:34
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It's amusing/surprising because of all of the games I would expect to allow you to walk away from a boss fight and get a semi-legitimate ending out of it, this one would be it. Also in terms of "quitting is an option", to me that only makes sense if you acknowledge it in the game that the player made that choice, as opposed to saying "well just stop playing if you don't like how much of a monster you feel like  " (which may be out of context for Spec Ops but it's definitely a head-up-your-own-rear end thing I've heard from other developers huffing their own farts about how players playing video games means YOU WERE THE MONSTER ALL ALONG). OneShot and Undertale both do it in varying ways (although Undertale's is only if you pick it up again after completing it).Renoistic posted:The devs wanted to put in an optional ending where you simply left the area, but the idea was nixed. Anyways, ~game design~ Ursine Catastrophe fucked around with this message at 07:54 on Apr 24, 2017 |
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Apr 24, 2017 07:45
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Your confusing games spec doesn't have joke endings.
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Apr 24, 2017 07:47
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Renoistic posted:The devs wanted to put in an optional ending where you simply left the area, but the idea was nixed. Apparently in playtesting too many people chose that option and then got mad about how short the game was 
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Apr 24, 2017 07:50
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Just add a cue credits trigger to all games' first optional input so I don't have to play video games tia
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Apr 24, 2017 07:52
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CharlestheHammer posted:Your confusing games spec doesn't have joke endings. Whoops. I thought "The devs wanted to put in an optional ending where you simply left the area, but the idea was nixed." was referring to Adam's boss fight, not spec ops.  Begemot posted:Apparently in playtesting too many people chose that option and then got mad about how short the game was "How can we make art out of calling the player a monster if most players are choosing not to be a monster?" 🤔 Ursine Catastrophe fucked around with this message at 07:55 on Apr 24, 2017 |
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Apr 24, 2017 07:53
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Far cry 4 lets you align with the villain and finish the game immediately so theres that
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Apr 24, 2017 08:01
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Ursine Catastrophe posted:Whoops. I thought "The devs wanted to put in an optional ending where you simply left the area, but the idea was nixed." was referring to Adam's boss fight, not spec ops. That isn't what that implied at all
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Apr 24, 2017 08:02
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Ursine Catastrophe posted:
Because not being a monster means a bigger and worse monster came to power and ruined things more than the player would have. You HAVE to be the monster. Literally the lesser of two evils. I think that's Drakengard though.
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Apr 24, 2017 08:19
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Ursine Catastrophe posted:"How can we make art out of calling the player a monster if most players are choosing not to be a monster?" 🤔 Start softly, make them feel like it's okay, that it's justified. Present some other character that the player can scapegoat their decisions onto - a commanding officer or someone in authority. Offer the chance to leave a few times, both before and after the player has started making monstrous decisions, but always offer a reason why they might choose to stay. Stanley Milgram the gently caress out of them... and then yank the carpet out from under them at the end. Hard to do with a shooter. Might be easier to do with an RPG or a more open and story-focused type of game.
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Apr 24, 2017 08:26
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Undertale pretty much perfected the 'make the player feel like a monster' angle The True Pacifist Ending gives you a completely fulfilling game experience. You can stop right there. An in-game character asks you to stop right there and specifically says that restarting the game will be erasing everyone's happy ending. If you choose to do so and start killing everyone, then the entire world turns against you, continuously pushes back against you, and asks you to stop what you're doing and turn back. The player isn't tricked into anything - everything is their choice. If you continue to murder everyone and reach the final boss, that boss will express his pure disdain for you as a person that is willing to go to any lengths to keep themselves entertained. apocalypticCritic posted:Start softly, make them feel like it's okay, that it's justified. Present some other character that the player can scapegoat their decisions onto - a commanding officer or someone in authority. Offer the chance to leave a few times, both before and after the player has started making monstrous decisions, but always offer a reason why they might choose to stay. Stanley Milgram the gently caress out of them... and then yank the carpet out from under them at the end. Tactics Ogre sort of does this. You can choose to slaughter an allied village and blame it on the enemies to bolster your war effort, resulting in an entirely different storyline. Your commanding officer orders it but you have the chance to defy him. And of course, there's Nier 1.
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Apr 24, 2017 08:42
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Please stop talking about Spec Ops. The conversation never goes anywhere. The game itself is fine. What the dev said was dumb. Please stop beating a dead horse.
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Apr 24, 2017 09:27
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But I want to sound ~deep and meaningful~ when talking to people!
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Apr 24, 2017 09:40
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Malachite_Dragon posted:But I want to sound ~deep and meaningful~ when talking to people! No, you just want to get the thread locked. I know it's surprising that other people find different stuff deep and meaningful than you do, but it's true, and yet it doesn't belong in an LP of Nier Automata either way.
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Apr 24, 2017 09:43
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Games are trash. poo poo SQUARE ENIX
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Apr 24, 2017 09:51
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jyrque posted:Games are trash. poo poo SQUARE ENIX But... Nier Automata T-shirt!
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Apr 24, 2017 10:01
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chiasaur11 posted:But... Nier Automata T-shirt! I'm wearing that shirt and only that shirt right now
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Apr 24, 2017 10:08
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Choosing not to play a game is, in fact, meaningful. I got Zero Time Dilemma, went through a confusing intro full of jackasses i couldn't stand, and then the bad guy let me flip a coin to decide all of their fates. The coin came up with "you're all free to go" and the game ended. I figured letting these jokers get off scot free is preferable to having to endure them any longer, so i figuratively walked off and haven't touched the game since.
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Apr 24, 2017 10:48
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Nier is fantastic. Spec Ops is poo poo in that it cheats to force moral questions and ends up being a propaganda piece. It's an aside to the above complaint, but in terms of chemical weapons the US hasn't used them against personnel since WW1, and not against environments since the Vietnam War (although deployments were made in Europe during the cold war), although the US has also assisted in their use most recently in 1988 through providing Iraq with intelligence on where an Iranian attack would occur. Spec Ops the Line Spoiler, not Nier: The game forces you to use the WP on civvies! No alternatives, and literally endless reinforcements if you don't. I uninstalled and removed the game at that point (I'd rather die), but word is if you drop it at the corner carefully the game magically fills it in over the civvies. In the end the only real choice is to remove the game from steam and issue a complaint. RA Rx fucked around with this message at 19:00 on Apr 24, 2017 |
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Apr 24, 2017 13:34
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jyrque posted:Just add a cue credits trigger to all games' first optional input so I don't have to play video games tia I hereby decree that all DVDs are actually videogames because you have to press the play button on the menu, that counts as "beating" the "game"
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Apr 24, 2017 13:45
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MarquiseMindfang posted:I hereby decree that all DVDs are actually videogames because you have to press the play button on the menu, that counts as "beating" the "game" We found out what the Citizen Kane of videogames is! We did it, guys!
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Apr 24, 2017 13:47
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Choosing not to play a game can be meaningful, see e.g. Save the Date. But Spec Ops doesn't do it well because I think it never actually truly inhabits the player in the PC in a consistent way. The PC has a name, has a personality, often chooses actions on his own, or is implied to have heavy pro-murder opinions due to the way options are presented to you. What the effect of all of this was, to me anyway, was to remove really the sense of culpability. You aren't really making the dude do whatever bad thing, you're really just watching him do it. So stopping playing isn't meaningful narratively because it doesn't change the fact that the PC absolutely would do the thing, and having the game judge You falls flat. It makes about as much sense as the scriptwriter blaming the actor or the audience for the bad thing that happened in his play. I think there's a relevance to Nier: Automata in this argument, but it'll be a long-rear end time before we get to it. Fangz fucked around with this message at 14:01 on Apr 24, 2017 |
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Apr 24, 2017 13:58
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Reminder that the "you can just turn the game off" line is mostly apocryphal and Spec Ops is good if only for how loving insane it makes gamers.
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Apr 24, 2017 14:01
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HenryEx posted:Choosing not to play a game is, in fact, meaningful. Good job murdering them all jackass. Zero Time Dilemma goes places 
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Apr 24, 2017 14:03
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RA Rx posted:Nier is fantastic. I agree.
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Apr 24, 2017 14:08
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MiddleOne posted:Good job murdering all them jackasses. Thanks, i feel it's kinda the right thing to do. If you really wanna hinge your big convoluted plan on chance, then you don't get to do backies if the coin flip doesn't work out in your favor.
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Apr 24, 2017 14:08
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HenryEx posted:Thanks, i feel it's kinda the right thing to do. If you really wanna hinge your big convoluted plan on chance, then you don't get to do backies if the coin flip doesn't work out in your favor. Now I just want you to sit down and play through the game even more.
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Apr 24, 2017 14:12
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The real Spec Ops was inside us all along.
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Apr 24, 2017 14:28
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Oxxidation posted:Reminder that the "you can just turn the game off" line is mostly apocryphal and Spec Ops is good if only for how loving insane it makes gamers. CharlestheHammer posted:Because manchildren are dumb and whiny. It's incredible how many positive takes on Spec Ops The Line hinge around it being a good game because it supposedly annoys people that the reviewer doesn't like.
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Apr 24, 2017 15:41
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Well yeah seeing people freak out because a game doesn't cater specifically to whatever arbitrary acceptable level is always funny. Especially when they try and make some half assed argument to pretend their criticism is legit.
CharlestheHammer fucked around with this message at 15:50 on Apr 24, 2017 |
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Apr 24, 2017 15:47
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The Repo Man posted:Please stop talking about Spec Ops. The conversation never goes anywhere. The game itself is fine. What the dev said was dumb. Please stop beating a dead horse. Apologies for also beating that horse yesterday. Also agreed, this cannot continue.
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Apr 24, 2017 15:53
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You can turn Spec Ops: The Line off if you don't want to be complicit anymore. But you probably won't, you paid for the game after all. That's kinda the point, really. You're experiencing a story and being made to feel complicit in the horrible things going on in the story. If it's too much for you to handle you don't need to continue, but it's a story, it has an ending, and seeing that ending requires continuing the story. "Just turn the game off" isn't really a choice put in by the game, it's a choice on the part of the player whether they want to engage with a story this brutal or not. People seem to interpret it like turning the game off is the "right" decision and the game punishes you for not doing so. That's silly. The written story, the intended experience is to put you in the boots of a real soldier experiencing real horrors of war and being forced to do horrible things, that's the narrative that was written. Choosing not to engage in that kind of narrative is purely a personal choice.
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Apr 24, 2017 16:14
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This cannot continue
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Apr 24, 2017 16:16
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The Saddest Rhino posted:This cannot continue
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