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Tired Moritz posted:I wouldn't be surprised if it's Rudolf or Kyrie. Kyrie got more attention in 4 then the other adults.
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# ? May 6, 2017 00:58 |
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# ? May 15, 2024 02:44 |
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idonotlikepeas posted:OK. There's a theory that I've been hanging onto for a long while, and maybe now is a good time to get into it. What you seem to be implying here is that in the canonical world, the world of the actual events that really happened in Rokkenjima, not in any of these bottle stories, Sayo might not be the culprit, but the culprit has found the golden land. I think Sayo definitely found the golden land... but almost certainly isn't the culprit. Rudolf and Kyrie both die at the start of the first two games. Their death is even confirmed in red for the first game. But I can counter this twisted logic that even lead you down this path. The reason post-Ep-3 Eva won't talk about what really happened on that island is whatever else happened, she absolutely detective-saw-it-for-sure shot Battler dead. She is a murderer. If she tried to tell a mostly true story about what happened, but lie about the bit where she killed her nephew in cold blood, there's always the chance some evidence will be found that contradicts whatever story she told, raising suspicion. Better to not say anything and wait until the cops find something to worry about lying to cover your rear end.
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# ? May 6, 2017 01:46 |
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Tender Child Loins posted:I was already in a mood but now... oh man. Okay. Unrelated, but I have to ask,what's with your username?
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# ? May 6, 2017 01:47 |
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Neopie posted:Okay. Unrelated, but I have to ask,what's with your username? I thought we agreed to wait until episode 8 to ask this, nea. You're breaking the witches code!
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# ? May 6, 2017 01:49 |
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Neopie posted:Okay. Unrelated, but I have to ask,what's with your username? A few years ago, I posted in a FYAD name change thread and Zach (I think) stuck me with this. I just haven't had a good idea for a name change, plus I can't justify spending the money to do it. vv witchcore ricepunk fucked around with this message at 02:06 on May 6, 2017 |
# ? May 6, 2017 02:01 |
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ZiegeDame posted:Rudolf and Kyrie both die at the start of the first two games. Their death is even confirmed in red for the first game. But I can counter this twisted logic that even lead you down this path. The reason post-Ep-3 Eva won't talk about what really happened on that island is whatever else happened, she absolutely detective-saw-it-for-sure shot Battler dead. She is a murderer. If she tried to tell a mostly true story about what happened, but lie about the bit where she killed her nephew in cold blood, there's always the chance some evidence will be found that contradicts whatever story she told, raising suspicion. Better to not say anything and wait until the cops find something to worry about lying to cover your rear end. At this point, everyone has died in one of the games. none of them are stated to be explicitly true. In fact I think all of them have to be false except possibly episode 3, though it still seems likely that everything is non-canon after... the first dinner, really.
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# ? May 6, 2017 02:03 |
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curiousCat posted:At this point, everyone has died in one of the games. The Detective has never once seen Kanon's dead body.
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# ? May 6, 2017 02:20 |
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ProfessorProf posted:"Gohda-san's a splendid chef. He's the only reason anyone'd ever want to come to this island." GohBato confirmed, and epitaph solved. It really was about the sweetfish (dish) after all.
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# ? May 6, 2017 02:48 |
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ZiegeDame posted:You're using Sayo as interchangeable with Kanon here, right? Otherwise I'll need some explanation of this evidence of being friends with Maria. Correct. I have (reluctantly) accepted the theory that Shannon and Kanon are the same person. This is also why we never see Kanon's body. There's only one body to find, and it's usually Shannon's. ZiegeDame posted:Rudolf and Kyrie both die at the start of the first two games. Their death is even confirmed in red for the first game. But I can counter this twisted logic that even lead you down this path. The reason post-Ep-3 Eva won't talk about what really happened on that island is whatever else happened, she absolutely detective-saw-it-for-sure shot Battler dead. She is a murderer. If she tried to tell a mostly true story about what happened, but lie about the bit where she killed her nephew in cold blood, there's always the chance some evidence will be found that contradicts whatever story she told, raising suspicion. Better to not say anything and wait until the cops find something to worry about lying to cover your rear end. In every different universe, different people die. Knox's 2nd. It is forbidden for supernatural agencies to be employed as a detective technique. Multiple universes are supernatural, whether you believe in them or not. Eva's guilt or innocence in one timeline can't be used to determine her guilt or innocence in another. The universe I am referring to as "canonical", the one that leads to Ange's world, has not yet been seen. The stories so far were written by Sayo (the first two) and a web author (the latter three). They are not true. You can certainly theorize that Eva did it. As I said, my objection there is purely dramatic; the entire world of 1998 thinks she did it, including Ange. After all that, having her actually be the murderer would deflate the entire story. Keep in mind, the story claims the witch of theatregoing to be the most important; while witches don't actually exist, one could see that inclusion as symbolic of the importance of drama to the narrative.
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# ? May 6, 2017 03:14 |
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It is true that it's theoretically possible that ANGE Beatrice isn't from the episode 3 world, but that seems sort of odd. Would fit the constant deceptions that have been popping up, though. Qrr posted:Where did I argue that the detective was shown things that didn't exist? If you argue that Erika wasn't given a clue about Kanon=Shannon, then she has to be shown things that don't exist. She's been in the same room as both of them numerous times, and has seen them as separate people.
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# ? May 6, 2017 03:27 |
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Tender Child Loins posted:A few years ago, I posted in a FYAD name change thread and Zach (I think) stuck me with this. I just haven't had a good idea for a name change, plus I can't justify spending the money to do it. vv give me a week and I will personally paypal you the money so I never have to see your username again. I mean this with all respect, you're one of the best posters in this thread, every post you make is fantastic, but OH MY GOD I CANNOT STAND YOUR USERNAME I HAVE CONVULSIONS EVERY TIME I SEE IT
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# ? May 6, 2017 03:29 |
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Zack Ater posted:So... Ange is reading this story about Battler as GM to Featherine, which makes it a meta-layer "above" the main story, right? But now Virgilia and the new Beatrice came to the meta-layer, presumably as part of that story? Well, yes, but there's just the three worlds; the world of the present, the world of the future, and the meta world.
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# ? May 6, 2017 03:35 |
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idonotlikepeas posted:In every different universe, different people die. Knox's 2nd. It is forbidden for supernatural agencies to be employed as a detective technique. Multiple universes are supernatural, whether you believe in them or not. Eva's guilt or innocence in one timeline can't be used to determine her guilt or innocence in another. The universe I am referring to as "canonical", the one that leads to Ange's world, has not yet been seen. The stories so far were written by Sayo (the first two) and a web author (the latter three). They are not true. We do know that every must conform to certain rules, rules which meta-Beatrice is the personification of. If one of those rules isn't the identity of the culprit at the very least, then I don't see what the point of the game is. Or to put it another way, if the four mysteries presented to us are completely unrelated, then reasoning is impossible, and it would not be necessary to understand the previous games to create your own.
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# ? May 6, 2017 03:39 |
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Neopie posted:give me a week and I will personally paypal you the money so I never have to see your username again. I mean this with all respect, you're one of the best posters in this thread, every post you make is fantastic, but OH MY GOD I CANNOT STAND YOUR USERNAME I HAVE CONVULSIONS EVERY TIME I SEE IT Hahaha! Thanks? To be honest, I kind of feel that way about the name too, so I usually didn't post much. Sorry for inadvertently creeping you out. I guess everyone's been making fun of my name in the Discord chat, huh?
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# ? May 6, 2017 03:45 |
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Cyouni posted:If you argue that Erika wasn't given a clue about Kanon=Shannon, then she has to be shown things that don't exist. She's been in the same room as both of them numerous times, and has seen them as separate people. Has she ever interacted with both of them in the same scene? If we see a person and Erika doesn't talk about them or interact with them, then we don't have evidence that they're there. We aren't seeing from her viewpoint.
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# ? May 6, 2017 03:52 |
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Tender Child Loins posted:Hahaha! Thanks? To be honest, I kind of feel that way about the name too, so I usually didn't post much. Sorry for inadvertently creeping you out. I guess everyone's been making fun of my name in the Discord chat, huh? If it makes you feel better, I just learned that one of the newer Witches shipped me and Resurgam when they were going through the thread. Witchchat is an entire layer of meta above the LP thead that you are probably better off not thinking about too deeply.
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# ? May 6, 2017 03:51 |
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Tender Child Loins posted:Hahaha! Thanks? To be honest, I kind of feel that way about the name too, so I usually didn't post much. Sorry for inadvertently creeping you out. I guess everyone's been making fun of my name in the Discord chat, huh? I choose not to speak any Red about this. On a completely unrelated note, "Tragic Cryptic Love" would preserve the acronym.
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# ? May 6, 2017 03:54 |
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idonotlikepeas posted:Imagine having that kid hate you every day, but never telling her the secret that would destroy her. That's love, right?
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# ? May 6, 2017 04:03 |
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I mean given that whole debacle about Kinzo earlier Tender Child Loins is a pretty fitting username
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# ? May 6, 2017 04:10 |
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^^^^ How does this manage to be really cute yet devastating at the same time? The Shannon/Kanon theory was pretty interesting in the beginning because it answered some interesting questions, but now that there is battle over whether Shannon will be with George or Kanon being with Jessica, it's tantalizingly almost confirmed. But allow me to toss in more chips to the pile. Same eye color, same brooch jewel. Also they both wear hats. EagerSleeper fucked around with this message at 04:17 on May 6, 2017 |
# ? May 6, 2017 04:15 |
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EagerSleeper posted:Also they both wear hats. Oh, well, that settles it then.
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# ? May 6, 2017 04:19 |
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Anime artstyle. I think George is supposed to be chubby but he has super kicks so idk. At least the tips confirmed that the moms are actually attractive and not like impacted by anime no age syndrome.
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# ? May 6, 2017 04:21 |
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ZiegeDame posted:We do know that every must conform to certain rules, rules which meta-Beatrice is the personification of. If one of those rules isn't the identity of the culprit at the very least, then I don't see what the point of the game is. I don't think that's one of the rules. I think the rules are more about the starting conditions of the game and the personalities of the people involved. If you fully understand both the starting and ending conditions, you can create a number of different mysteries, with different culprits. It's absolutely impossible for the culprit to be Eva in some games and she's shown as at least one of the culprits in Episode Three, so I think there's at least some evidence for this. Tender Child Loins posted:I guess everyone's been making fun of my name in the Discord chat, huh? If it makes you feel any better, those same folks seem to think I'm Erika. Consider what we just learned about her. EagerSleeper posted:
Their facial shapes are the same too, which isn't true of every character.
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# ? May 6, 2017 04:22 |
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EagerSleeper posted:^^^^ There's also a lot of time and opportunity to change clothes, too, as they seem to get different shifts, and the island, I'm sure, has a lot of nooks and rooms for a clothing stash. I don't really see how complication of clothing is a factor, because A) anime art style and B) the devil's proof of a lot of clothing stashes and the unreliability of a lot of testimonies pretty much makes clothes-changing a free action. oath2order posted:If it makes you feel better, I just learned that one of the newer Witches shipped me and Resurgam when they were going through the thread. E...Eh? Really? Um... doing wh- no no no, don't answer that. resurgam40 fucked around with this message at 04:28 on May 6, 2017 |
# ? May 6, 2017 04:23 |
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resurgam40 posted:^^^ Without love it cannot be seen. Pukuku.
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# ? May 6, 2017 04:23 |
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MonsterEnvy posted:Kyrie got more attention in 4 then the other adults. Are yoy sure that wasn't the Krauss, Ange and the teens chapter? Kyrie didn't do that much other than sass Kinzo to be honest.
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# ? May 6, 2017 04:26 |
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Tired Moritz posted:Anime artstyle. I think George is supposed to be chubby but he has super kicks so idk. Old-school mittenhands art: Faces and eyes are still very similar.
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# ? May 6, 2017 04:25 |
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Okay, I see it now. Yup, I'm convinced.
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# ? May 6, 2017 04:29 |
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resurgam40 posted:There's also a lot of time and opportunity to change clothes, too, as they seem to get different shifts, and the island, I'm sure, has a lot of nooks and rooms for a clothing stash. I don't really see how complication of clothing is a factor, because A) anime art style and B) the devil's proof of a lot of clothing stashes and the unreliability of a lot of testimonies pretty much makes clothes-changing a free action. It's also worth considering that when we see one or the other, they may not literally be present. Remember, the story is allowed to lie to us as long as it's in the voice of a character. If Shannon thinks she's talking to Kanon, Kanon can obviously show up without a shift in wardrobe, but if Kanon responds through Shannon's voice while wearing Shannon's clothes, the story might show us Kanon even if the other character in the scene would have seen Shannon. I'm going to have to look through this whole loving thing again, aren't I?
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# ? May 6, 2017 04:34 |
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idonotlikepeas posted:Old-school mittenhands art: The Shannon=Kanon theory is looking very much canon. (thank you for posting seacats art, I will always unironically love seeing Ryukishi07's art.)
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# ? May 6, 2017 04:44 |
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idonotlikepeas posted:I don't think that's one of the rules. I think the rules are more about the starting conditions of the game and the personalities of the people involved. If you fully understand both the starting and ending conditions, you can create a number of different mysteries, with different culprits. It's absolutely impossible for the culprit to be Eva in some games and she's shown as at least one of the culprits in Episode Three, so I think there's at least some evidence for this. Let's define our terms here. When I say 'the culprit' I don't mean every person who killed someone in a given game. I mean Beatrice, the person to whom the giant pile of gold belongs, the person who signed Maria's grimoire, the person who wrote the bottle stories, the person who Battler sinned against, the person who sent fat stacks of cash to Nanjo and Kumasawa's next of kin, the person who gave the letter to Maria challenging the family to solve the epitaph, and the person who confronted Battler at the end of episode 4. The person the final question "Who am I?" refers to. If that person isn't the same across games, then there's no point to any of this.
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# ? May 6, 2017 04:46 |
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ZiegeDame posted:Let's define our terms here. When I say 'the culprit' I don't mean every person who killed someone in a given game. I mean Beatrice, the person to whom the giant pile of gold belongs, the person who signed Maria's grimoire, the person who wrote the bottle stories, the person who Battler sinned against, the person who sent fat stacks of cash to Nanjo and Kumasawa's next of kin, the person who gave the letter to Maria challenging the family to solve the epitaph, and the person who confronted Battler at the end of episode 4. The person the final question "Who am I?" refers to. Oh, I agree with all of that. Sayo is always the prime mover. That doesn't mean she murdered anyone, though. It's hard to say how we could have gotten to Battler's parents as the killers, because that timeline has not been presented yet. I could come up with scenarios that explain it, but they'd just be inventing things from whole cloth. You might say, I have a theory about the whodunnit based on some evidence, but not the howdunnit or the whydunnit yet. (I suspect the why part involves large stacks of cash.)
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# ? May 6, 2017 04:50 |
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idonotlikepeas posted:Oh, I agree with all of that. Sayo is always the prime mover. That doesn't mean she murdered anyone, though. It's hard to say how we could have gotten to Battler's parents as the killers, because that timeline has not been presented yet. I could come up with scenarios that explain it, but they'd just be inventing things from whole cloth. You might say, I have a theory about the whodunnit based on some evidence, but not the howdunnit or the whydunnit yet. (I suspect the why part involves large stacks of cash.) I'm glad that other people are having the same theory as me. I think there is another murderer at play here beyond someone wearing the mantle of Beatrice. The family conference before Battler got there was already a powder keg ready to detonate due to the suspicions of Kinzo's death. While I suspect that Eva's family and Rosa had their own plots how to corner Krauss into giving up the money, Battler having appeared for the first time in six years seems like a plot that Rudolf and Kyrie would have arranged. Essentially, everyone's guilty in their own way in the murders that followed.
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# ? May 6, 2017 05:04 |
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Battle Royale situation?
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# ? May 6, 2017 05:06 |
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Tired Moritz posted:Battle Royale situation? Eh, I think this is really only applicable very few times throughout the games. Though it does make me question how many of the murders were premeditated and which were just heat-of-the-moment stuff that ended poorly.
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# ? May 6, 2017 05:23 |
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Y'all have no idea how long I stared at their portraits before coming out with Shannon=Kanon=Beatrice.
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# ? May 6, 2017 06:00 |
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Qrr posted:Has she ever interacted with both of them in the same scene? If we see a person and Erika doesn't talk about them or interact with them, then we don't have evidence that they're there. We aren't seeing from her viewpoint. Erika has weird interactions. She's technically gone around and reviewed where everyone was at what time individually, but that's something we've never seen. I did find this interesting, however: ProfessorProf posted:"...Oh, sorry. Could you close that door for me?" How many people does it take to close a door?
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# ? May 6, 2017 06:38 |
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ZiegeDame posted:The Detective has never once seen Kanon's dead body. Episode 1?
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# ? May 6, 2017 07:09 |
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curiousCat posted:Episode 1? Nope. Read it again. Battler finds Kanon face-down in a pool of blood but explicitly alive, and he runs out of the room before actually examining him. That's the last time Battler sees Kanon. And on the subject Battler looking at dead bodies... If Kanon=Shannon, we must accept that a wig is involved. In episode 2 Battler grabs Shannon's head to peer directly into her brain hole. If she were wearing a wig, he'd probably have noticed. Which means Kanon's hair is the wig and neither appearance can be considered the real one. And in episode 4, all bodies are accounted for except Kanon's. If Shannon's body is Kanon's body, then who was talking to Battler on the balcony? Or did Shannon leave straight from that meeting, put the maid outfit back on, and then blow half her face off in the back yard? And if that's the case, where did the gun go? Cyouni posted:How many people does it take to close a door? It's a double door. And if they were already standing on either side...
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# ? May 6, 2017 07:51 |
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# ? May 15, 2024 02:44 |
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Tender Child Loins posted:A few years ago, I posted in a FYAD name change thread and Zach (I think) stuck me with this. I just haven't had a good idea for a name change, plus I can't justify spending the money to do it. vv I keep reading it as Tender Child Lions and thinking Sakutaro. Uu-uu.
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# ? May 6, 2017 07:53 |