NBA Draft 2017: It's not "my pick."

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Sports Argument Stadium > NBA Draft 2017: It's not "my pick."

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Dejan Bimble posted:

Fultz is a fantastic shooter off the dribble

Lots of threes off the dribble as the pnr ball handler

http://fansided.com/2017/05/02/markelle-fultz-nba-draft-scouting/
He real good

I feel like Jonathan Isaac is the Dragan Bender of this year's draft

I'm seeing Terrance Ferguson mocked to Detroit, which makes sense as they're dying for 3p shooting. But there are so many other guys I like, even if they don't fit, there are much higher ceilings. Jarrett Allen could be the sort of competition to scare Drummond into playing well. Anuboby seems like he'll find a solid role somewhere and potentially be great, if he fixes his shot. The bottom of the first and top of the second have a ton of intriguing role players. It's a good year for the teams that got the throwaway 1st round pick from a contender

The Nets are going to give a max offer sheet to Kentavious Caldwell Pope who can't seem to consistently find his three point shot. That's a ton of money for a 3 and d guy who doesn't really have the three. But kent bazemore got it and he's kent bazemore. demarre caroll got a huge contract after tearing all his ligaments. Wings just cost more. I'm still working through video of the 10-40 guys to decide who the Pistons need to draft aside from trading up to get Edmond Sumner.

Goofy loving Givony has Donovan Mitchell to detroit at 12, despite Mitchell not being able to shoot threes and the Van Gundy system withering and dying without at least 3 credible 3p shooters on the floor at any given time.

I still think that Hartenstein has more potential than Lauri Markannen, even if Markannen is obviously better now. Hartenstein has moves and a touch, if he can make his threes, I shouldn't even type out that out, just make it an acronym IHCMH3 he'll be a more desirable player, because he's a pf and you won't need to find a rim protecting pf to pair with him, like you would with Markannen, and because his faux dirk one leg fadeaway and pop looks like an NBA signature move.

Those Fultz numbers are great.

I can't say you're wrong about Hartenstein being better than Markkanen because I haven't seen him play, but I strongly disagree that people are touting Markkanen because he has a move that looks like Dirk. His shooting is really, really objectively good (one of the best in the whole draft), he has a fast release, and he can score in the post, in the PnR, or off the dribble--he's the second best offensive player in the draft, so he'd be a lottery prospect even if he was like 6'4", 6'5". He's not like, Thomas Welsh, a catch and shoot guy who doesn't do anything else.

Rick fucked around with this message at 10:01 on May 14, 2017

# ? May 14, 2017 09:53

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# ? May 9, 2024 23:09

Dejan Bimble: Mar 24, 2008; we're all black friends; Plaster Town Cop

Rick posted:

Those Fultz numbers are great.

I can't say you're wrong about Hartenstein being better than Markkanen because I haven't seen him play, but I strongly disagree that people are touting Markkanen because he has a move that looks like Dirk. His shooting is really, really objectively good (one of the best in the whole draft), he has a fast release, and he can score in the post, in the PnR, or off the dribble--he's the second best offensive player in the draft, so he'd be a lottery prospect even if he was like 6'4", 6'5". He's not like, Thomas Welsh, a catch and shoot guy who doesn't do anything else.

Oh no, that's the opposite of what I meant, Hartenstein has the cloned Dirk move. He can pop and fade for a jumper on one leg or two, like Dirk, anywhere. Markkanen is just a good shooter from any spot. It's a shame he's not power forward sized, though the it's cheaper to pay a power forward who protects the rim as well as a median center and is mobile, than to pay a standard center to do the same job.

Although, Cousins and Olynyk have demonstrated how easy you can make your offense for a lot of possessions if your center can make threes, and also how you really die on the offensive boards if your center is in the corner.

# ? May 14, 2017 10:26

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Ah, okay I understand now. I think Markkanen's rebounding might actually be his worst ability that may not get any better, just because it seems like rebounding is foreign to him.

Oh yeah and like I have the same concerns about Issac. If you watch his highlights--awesome. But like I've seen highlights from games I watched and that was basically the only thing that he did the only game.

# ? May 14, 2017 10:32

MourningView: Sep 2, 2006; Is this Heaven?

Dejan Bimble posted:

Fultz is a fantastic shooter off the dribble

Lots of threes off the dribble as the pnr ball handler

http://fansided.com/2017/05/02/markelle-fultz-nba-draft-scouting/
He real good

I feel like Jonathan Isaac is the Dragan Bender of this year's draft

I'm seeing Terrance Ferguson mocked to Detroit, which makes sense as they're dying for 3p shooting. But there are so many other guys I like, even if they don't fit, there are much higher ceilings. Jarrett Allen could be the sort of competition to scare Drummond into playing well. Anuboby seems like he'll find a solid role somewhere and potentially be great, if he fixes his shot. The bottom of the first and top of the second have a ton of intriguing role players. It's a good year for the teams that got the throwaway 1st round pick from a contender

The Nets are going to give a max offer sheet to Kentavious Caldwell Pope who can't seem to consistently find his three point shot. That's a ton of money for a 3 and d guy who doesn't really have the three. But kent bazemore got it and he's kent bazemore. demarre caroll got a huge contract after tearing all his ligaments. Wings just cost more. I'm still working through video of the 10-40 guys to decide who the Pistons need to draft aside from trading up to get Edmond Sumner.

Goofy loving Givony has Donovan Mitchell to detroit at 12, despite Mitchell not being able to shoot threes and the Van Gundy system withering and dying without at least 3 credible 3p shooters on the floor at any given time.

I still think that Hartenstein has more potential than Lauri Markannen, even if Markannen is obviously better now. Hartenstein has moves and a touch, if he can make his threes, I shouldn't even type out that out, just make it an acronym IHCMH3 he'll be a more desirable player, because he's a pf and you won't need to find a rim protecting pf to pair with him, like you would with Markannen, and because his faux dirk one leg fadeaway and pop looks like an NBA signature move.

The DX mock doesn't take team into account yet.

# ? May 14, 2017 15:48

ButtWolf: Dec 30, 2004; by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

Metapod posted:

speaking of okc i hope they draft a backup pg that i can nod approvingly when he gets playing time

How would you feel about Evans? Im an OSU homer so Im for it.

# ? May 14, 2017 16:08

DeimosRising: Oct 17, 2005; �Hola SEA!

Dejan Bimble posted:

Oh no, that's the opposite of what I meant, Hartenstein has the cloned Dirk move. He can pop and fade for a jumper on one leg or two, like Dirk, anywhere. Markkanen is just a good shooter from any spot. It's a shame he's not power forward sized, though the it's cheaper to pay a power forward who protects the rim as well as a median center and is mobile, than to pay a standard center to do the same job.

Although, Cousins and Olynyk have demonstrated how easy you can make your offense for a lot of possessions if your center can make threes, and also how you really die on the offensive boards if your center is in the corner.

An even better example is Channing Frye on the teams that have used him correctly. His numbers roller coaster year to year because he's so incredibly effective but so limited. On Phoenix and Cleveland though, he just makes their offense unstoppable. You can't guard the rim from Nash/Amare/Lebron/Kyrie when your tallest guy has to be on the perimeter guarding a sentient willow tree

# ? May 14, 2017 17:19

Metapod: Mar 18, 2012

ButtWolf posted:

How would you feel about Evans? Im an OSU homer so Im for it.

i like how evans plays the game but i think his size will limit him in what he will be able to do so if we draft him i will be satisfied with the selection i wont have high hopes that he will be the backup ball handler that this team needs immediately

this draft kinda sucks for where okc is and what they need imo

# ? May 14, 2017 18:12

NickRoweFillea: Sep 27, 2012; doin thangs

How far is Giles falling? He has a great toolset but his injuries are the kiss of death

# ? May 14, 2017 19:19

Bush Did Outer Heaven: Jan 18, 2005; The Sweetest Payne

Rick posted:

I dunno I think from everything available on him he might be pretty bad. He was great high school talent but he looked like he couldn't compete with college players in team USA and then suddenly decided to go overseas after that which is a pretty big red flag to me. Not being able to get on the floor in Australia that has some of the worst basketball in the world is another big warning sign.

I see. Welp, time to go All In on Hamidou Diallo.

ButtWolf posted:

How would you feel about Evans? Im an OSU homer so Im for it.

If they could swap 21+Chicago and/or Boston's 2nd rounders for 28-30 and another high 2nd, I'd be pretty content taking a swing at a Jawun Evans or Frank Jackson along with a Diallo-type project. I agree with metapod that nobody at 21 is going to have much of an impact. The guys mocked to OKC (Rabb, Kennard, Kurucs) just seem so blah that I'd rather take a few swings later in the draft.

I also think it's pretty likely that Presti trades 21 for a veteran and all my reading about Terrance Ferguson et al. is wasted.

# ? May 14, 2017 19:21

Jota: May 6, 2003; uga-booga uga-booga

NickRoweFillea posted:

How far is Giles falling? He has a great toolset but his injuries are the kiss of death

He seems like he could really end up anywhere outside of the lottery, depending on if someone falls in love with his measurables. And he certainly could end up being a good pro, but I wouldn't want him in the first round just because there is so much risk with him. Like even beyond the injuries, he wasn't an incredibly skilled player anyway. It seemed like a lot of his offensive game revolved around his athleticism, which is understandable at his age, but it adds to the risk. Plus, he was dog poo poo for Duke and couldn't create for himself at all.

Maybe you're hoping he's like a poor man's Nerlens Noel? Except with way more serious injury issues and far worse defensive instincts.

Jota fucked around with this message at 20:17 on May 14, 2017

# ? May 14, 2017 20:13

El Gallinero Gros: Mar 17, 2010

Raps pick 23rd, any value whatsoever to be had there?

# ? May 14, 2017 20:44

Hand Row: May 28, 2001

Yes it is a deep draft, although 23rd might be right after a talent tier drop. Good news is there's a few mystery box options like the previously mentioned Giles who could push less boom or bust prospects down.

# ? May 14, 2017 20:58

pseudodragon: Jun 16, 2007

El Gallinero Gros posted:

Raps pick 23rd, any value whatsoever to be had there?

I don't know how much what number the pick is matters since the Masai list is so different than everyone else's anyways.

# ? May 15, 2017 00:04

Paul Zuvella: Dec 7, 2011

NickRoweFillea posted:

How far is Giles falling? He has a great toolset but his injuries are the kiss of death

It takes one team to believe he can stay healthy. If a team feels that way and are drafting 12 or so and onward then they probably should take him.

I for one think it would be a wasted pick, as there is almost no chance he stays healthy.

# ? May 15, 2017 03:26

Slowpoke!: Feb 12, 2008; ANIME IS FOR ADULTS

Paul Zuvella posted:

It takes one team to believe he can stay healthy. If a team feels that way and are drafting 12 or so and onward then they probably should take him.

I for one think it would be a wasted pick, as there is almost no chance he stays healthy.

Yeah but after a certain point these picks are mostly crapshots anyway. Giles will have more upside than a lot of guys after 12 or so. He was a potential #1 overall pick. My guess is he still goes in the late lottery.

# ? May 15, 2017 03:34

Declan MacManus: Sep 1, 2011; damn i'm really in this bitch

WhyteRyce posted:

Dejan, tell me about Jonah Bolden, can he play SF, and why a couple of posters elsewhere said he could sneak into the lottery

Like ex-UCLA Jonah Bolden?

# ? May 15, 2017 06:23

Kibner: Oct 21, 2008; Acguy Supremacy

The Ringer made a pretty cool draft summary site: http://nbadraft.theringer.com

# ? May 15, 2017 16:32

Redgrendel2001: Sep 1, 2006; you literally think a person saying their NBA team of choice being better than the fucking 76ers is a 'schtick'

a literal thing you think.

WhyteRyce posted:

Dejan, tell me about Jonah Bolden, can he play SF, and why a couple of posters elsewhere said he could sneak into the lottery

Looks like a versatile big 3 who can slide up to 4. Played overseas last year and was pretty good. I haven't seen him in the first round in any mock, but a few have him in the mid-2nd.

Are the other posters UCLA fans?

# ? May 15, 2017 16:33

euphronius: Feb 18, 2009

Kibner posted:

The Ringer made a pretty cool draft summary site: http://nbadraft.theringer.com

Nice

Looks good on mobile

# ? May 15, 2017 16:38

morestuff: Aug 2, 2008; You can't stop what's coming

I like the Marvin Williams comp for Isaac, but it's kind of uninspiring for a top-10 guy. I guess you'd be paying for upside in case he gets much better off the dribble

# ? May 15, 2017 16:59

Lockback: Sep 3, 2006; All days are nights to see till I see thee; and nights bright days when dreams do show me thee.

morestuff posted:

I like the Marvin Williams comp for Isaac, but it's kind of uninspiring for a top-10 guy. I guess you'd be paying for upside in case he gets much better off the dribble

"Longer Harrison Barnes" is a better "I hope" I think, though Marvin Williams would still be a pretty good pickup with a #6. Isaac is becoming my Timberwolves hopeful, as I think he could add much needed defense at the 3 and play some 4 alongside KAT or Dieng.

# ? May 15, 2017 17:07

EvanTH: Apr 24, 2004; i like to express my inner pain by being really boring on the phone
or just when i'm kickin it
that's me though
i'm kind of oddddddd

Isaac to the Knicks would be very cool

# ? May 15, 2017 17:16

morestuff: Aug 2, 2008; You can't stop what's coming

Lockback posted:

"Longer Harrison Barnes" is a better "I hope" I think, though Marvin Williams would still be a pretty good pickup with a #6. Isaac is becoming my Timberwolves hopeful, as I think he could add much needed defense at the 3 and play some 4 alongside KAT or Dieng.

All I'm going off is highlight YouTubes and DX stuff but he seems way more like a modern PF to me

# ? May 15, 2017 17:18

WhyteRyce: Dec 30, 2001

Redgrendel2001 posted:

Looks like a versatile big 3 who can slide up to 4. Played overseas last year and was pretty good. I haven't seen him in the first round in any mock, but a few have him in the mid-2nd.

Are the other posters UCLA fans?

I think people just trying to predict the next Thon Maker surprise pick

# ? May 15, 2017 17:44

MourningView: Sep 2, 2006; Is this Heaven?

morestuff posted:

All I'm going off is highlight YouTubes and DX stuff but he seems way more like a modern PF to me

Yeah I don't think he can defend NBA 3s, and almost everyone anymore is shifting tweener guys like that to the 4.

# ? May 15, 2017 18:20

IcePhoenix: Sep 18, 2005; Take me to your Shida

EvanTH posted:

Isaac to the Knicks would be very cool

They'd have to either jump the Wolves or hope the Wolves move up for that to happen, I think.

Or go back in time and not win on the last day of the season :v:

# ? May 15, 2017 18:23

kiimo: Jul 24, 2003

WhyteRyce posted:

I think people just trying to predict the next Thon Maker surprise pick

Thon Maker is full of surprises

# ? May 15, 2017 19:04

EvanTH: Apr 24, 2004; i like to express my inner pain by being really boring on the phone
or just when i'm kickin it
that's me though
i'm kind of oddddddd

IcePhoenix posted:

They'd have to either jump the Wolves or hope the Wolves move up for that to happen, I think.

Or go back in time and not win on the last day of the season

I've seen Isaac projected around 5-8

Losing that final game would've put us in the lottery I loving hate Mo N'Dour forever

# ? May 15, 2017 19:20

IcePhoenix: Sep 18, 2005; Take me to your Shida

EvanTH posted:

I've seen Isaac projected around 5-8

Losing that final game would've put us in the lottery I loving hate Mo N'Dour forever

Yeah, but I think most mocks are just ranking them and not factoring in team. I don't expect Thibs to pass on Issac if he's there with our pick unless someone falls out of the top three.

# ? May 15, 2017 20:04

NickRoweFillea: Sep 27, 2012; doin thangs

kiimo posted:

Thon Maker is full of surprises

Something that is unsurprising about him: the amount of Thons he can Make

# ? May 15, 2017 20:16

kiimo: Jul 24, 2003

Bless Thon Maker and all His Water. Bless the coming and going of Him, may His passing cleanse the world. May He keep the world for His people.

# ? May 15, 2017 20:23

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

I'm not really sure Issac is gonna be the guy who stands next to Towns or Porizingis to provide defense very quickly, although I guess there isn't that guy in the top 10 who's gonna do that anyway.

# ? May 15, 2017 21:39

Redgrendel2001: Sep 1, 2006; you literally think a person saying their NBA team of choice being better than the fucking 76ers is a 'schtick'

a literal thing you think.

Rick posted:

I'm not really sure Issac is gonna be the guy who stands next to Towns or Porizingis to provide defense very quickly, although I guess there isn't that guy in the top 10 who's gonna do that anyway.

Anunoby is probably the closest, but he's borderline top 10.

# ? May 15, 2017 21:44

WhyteRyce: Dec 30, 2001

I think the best thing for the league tomorrow is for the Sixers to get #1, the Kings to get #2, and uh, Dallas to get #3.

retweet if you agree with me

# ? May 15, 2017 21:51

Redgrendel2001: Sep 1, 2006; you literally think a person saying their NBA team of choice being better than the fucking 76ers is a 'schtick'

a literal thing you think.

WhyteRyce posted:

I think the best thing for the league tomorrow is for the Sixers to get #1, the Kings to get #2, and uh, Dallas to get #3.

retweet if you agree with me

If that happens, the Sixers also get the #4 and Sam Hinkie will enter into the final stage of his metamorphisis into a godking.

No one wants to play for Vivek or sit on the Boston bench for the whole year.

https://twitter.com/basketballtalk/status/864213325655162880

# ? May 15, 2017 21:53

EvanTH: Apr 24, 2004; i like to express my inner pain by being really boring on the phone
or just when i'm kickin it
that's me though
i'm kind of oddddddd

Isaac is from the Bronx why can't we have him :[

# ? May 15, 2017 21:56

Nissin Cup Nudist: Sep 3, 2011; Sleep with one eye open

We're off to Gritty Gritty land

WhyteRyce posted:

I think the best thing for the league tomorrow is for the Sixers to get #1, the Kings to get #2, and uh, Dallas to get #3.

retweet if you agree with me

It would actually be Kings #1, Sixers #2 and then the feed cuts to Hinkie yelling "TRUST THE PROCESS MOTHERFUCKERS"

# ? May 15, 2017 22:00

kiimo: Jul 24, 2003

I will be so sad if the Kings somehow get Josh Jackson. It's where Kansas players go to die.

# ? May 15, 2017 22:03

morestuff: Aug 2, 2008; You can't stop what's coming

Hornets get No. 1, take Frank Mason III

# ? May 15, 2017 22:11

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# ? May 9, 2024 23:09

WhyteRyce: Dec 30, 2001

gently caress you Vlade for putting me in a position to still try and be glad that the pick swaps activated because it means at least the Kings are moving up from #8.

# ? May 15, 2017 22:16

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