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Oxyclean posted:There's no paid boost for RDM or SAM. oh drat, nevermind then I guess. I'll spend the meantime trying to BiS my monk, or as close to BiS as I can get so I can have an awesome SAM at 60
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May 23, 2017 18:42
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I would actually venture to guess that we'll see the percentage of people who main a healer have a small uptick due to the cleric stance change.
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May 23, 2017 18:44
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UHD posted:I was pretty set on running RDM for my dps needs but I still have a soft spot for black mage so I might just do both and decide after I've played them both a while. BLM is my main and I like it a lot, and the QoL changes look like it'll solve some of my frustrations so Im somewhat tempted to get it to 70 before worrying about RDM too much, and just move RDM up with some roulettes and whatever rather then burning myself out grinding it up.
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May 23, 2017 18:45
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If the new Cleric Stance were a toggle ability that increased your magic damage by 10% while decreasing healing potency by 20%, I think we would all be satisfied.
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May 23, 2017 18:45
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Mordiceius posted:There's also a difference between players who are honest healers due to laziness/stubbornness and those that are honest healers due to just being overall less skilled at no fault of their own. I think that's also a fair point. For people who play healers a lot Cleric Stance is a nonentity but for casual players it's a huge barrier on a job that already carries a lot of weight. Screwing up as a healer is a lot more likely to contribute to a party wipe than anything else in the game. The idea of trying to help, mistiming and being soley responsible for a wipe is something a DPS never has to worry about and while it's slower being an honest healer (or not using cleric stance and DPSing as some people do) is safer and doesn't cause that issue. It's easy to imagine how it's scary when you're discussing a role that already has to carry a lot of weight. (Even if said weight isn't actually that heavy once you know the mechanics.)
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May 23, 2017 18:46
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How many dumb text macros will there be for that level 70 pld ability?
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May 23, 2017 18:47
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strong bird posted:If the new Cleric Stance were a toggle ability that increased your magic damage by 10% while decreasing healing potency by 20%, I think we would all be satisfied. Luckily they did better.
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May 23, 2017 18:47
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strong bird posted:If the new Cleric Stance were a toggle ability that increased your magic damage by 10% while decreasing healing potency by 20%, I think we would all be satisfied. Not me, since it'd remain mandatory to slot and use but feel much more pointless to go to the trouble for. The worst kind of challenge is where your game experience barely changes but your game controls are needlessly complicated or cumbersome. Honestly, I'm hoping that the SB cleric stance remains at a paltry 5% bonus for 15 seconds out of 90, so that it isn't a mandatory take for healers that are trying to do their job well.
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May 23, 2017 18:49
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Hmm I just ran the numbers and it appears the number 5% is half of the number 10% is, and so I can't really quantify how it's better.
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May 23, 2017 18:49
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It's better because you don't need it anymore, duh.
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May 23, 2017 18:51
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strong bird posted:Hmm I just ran the numbers and it appears the number 5% is half of the number 10% is, and so I can't really quantify how it's better. -20% healing is twice the number that 10% is and it's negative too! That's like really bad! Drawback abilities are dumb imo.
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May 23, 2017 18:52
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Mordiceius posted:There's also a difference between players who are honest healers due to laziness/stubbornness and those that are honest healers due to just being overall less skilled at no fault of their own. Nobody cares what your wife thinks.
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May 23, 2017 18:53
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Ferrinus posted:Not me, since it'd remain mandatory to slot and use but feel much more pointless to go to the trouble for. The worst kind of challenge is where your game experience barely changes but your game controls are needlessly complicated or cumbersome. Especially if we have to burn a slot on Esuna now too.
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May 23, 2017 18:53
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 shield oath @ 30 now
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May 23, 2017 18:54
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strong bird posted:Hmm I just ran the numbers and it appears the number 5% is half of the number 10% is, and so I can't really quantify how it's better. It's better that it isn't mandatory. It's like how Black Mage would be a worse class if Blizzard 1 had 2,000 potency. Attorney at Funk posted:Especially if we have to burn a slot on Esuna now too. This is my biggest uncertainty about the new healer design.
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May 23, 2017 18:54
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I appreciate the turbo nerds coming out of the wood work to bitch and moan a bad mechanic (CS) is going away because they need to feel smug about being able to push a bad button.
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May 23, 2017 18:54
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Fister Roboto posted:Nobody cares what your wife thinks. Luckily, nobody cares what anyone in this thread thinks either.
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May 23, 2017 18:55
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Attorney at Funk posted:Especially if we have to burn a slot on Esuna now too. Yeah, I have to say that having to burn a slot on Esuna seems dumb to me. There are dungeons where you'll never ever need it I guess but it's so important for stuff that it might as well be mandatory. ... I wonder what that means for Scholar and Leeches? White Mage and Astrologian both get their Esuna-alike via leveling so it isn't a big deal but I wonder what will replace Leeches.
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May 23, 2017 18:56
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Ferrinus posted:It's better that it isn't mandatory. It's like how Black Mage would be a worse class if Blizzard 1 had 2,000 potency. It's a little annoying but in practice I don't think it'll be that bad because 1) Most cross-class slots were already either mandatory or super marginal anyway 2) Cleric Stance might be moving from column A to column B There were like two relevant cross-class abilities, and we're effectively losing one and gaining another, so there'd need to be 3 or 4 cool new ones for it to feel like a pinch.
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May 23, 2017 19:00
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Thumbtacks posted:shield oath @ 30 now And everyone who gets Haukke Manor with leveling roulette rejoices. (seriously)
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May 23, 2017 19:04
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Orcs and Ostriches posted:Even if new Cleric Stance's numbers go way up, I think you're losing way too much in other skills to take it. The healer role abilities look boss as hell, and there are still a few unknowns. As Sch I'll drop anything for more damage 
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May 23, 2017 19:06
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LethalGeek posted:I appreciate the turbo nerds coming out of the wood work to bitch and moan a bad mechanic (CS) is going away because they need to feel smug about being able to push a bad button. You play an anime catgirl MMO. You are a turbonerd.
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May 23, 2017 19:07
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TheNabster posted:Meanwhile making a mistake in Cleric stance at best wasted time and at worst wasted cooldowns. 5 seconds in alex normal when they're new is easily the difference between no big deal and everyone dead. Don't even get me started about actually challenging content. The *only* reason cleric stance fuckups don't cause wipes too regularly is that you have 2 healers in most harder fights and they'll rarely both gently caress up at the same time. Ferrinus posted:This means that healers had to play around tank busters and other big hits to some degree but mostly being good at using cleric stance felt identical to not having cleric stance at all. And this is exactly why being good at cleric stance felt good. You mostly don't know it's there, but when you gently caress it up and 3 people die, you really start to appreciate it. As I said, I won't miss it, it'll make my job far easier with lustrate back to where it was, but pretending it did nothing at all is super disingenuous. Truga fucked around with this message at 19:21 on May 23, 2017 |
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May 23, 2017 19:14
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Already hearing from WHMs about how the cleric change will relegate them to the dumpster in favor of all SCH all the time. I heard the same claims for Heavensward.
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May 23, 2017 19:18
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nuru posted:Already hearing from WHMs about how the cleric change will relegate them to the dumpster in favor of all SCH all the time. And they were Right.
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May 23, 2017 19:19
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nuru posted:Already hearing from WHMs about how the cleric change will relegate them to the dumpster in favor of all SCH all the time. WHM is getting a brand new flower mechanic where they gain the ability to boost their abilities in some as-of-yet-undescribed way as well as new actions we don't know anything about. It seems very premature to assume worthlessness.
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May 23, 2017 19:19
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on the plus side we have mini-crits now so that's fun
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May 23, 2017 19:20
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I'm still going to main astrologian 
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May 23, 2017 19:20
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LethalGeek posted:I appreciate the turbo nerds coming out of the wood work to bitch and moan a bad mechanic (CS) is going away because they need to feel smug about being able to push a bad button. All buttons are bad buttons. Tank stances are barely steps up from CS dancing. Combos are dumb because they can all be consolidated and averaged out. DPS cooldowns are just an exercise in pressing a button on cooldown (or lining them up on cooldown). Defensive cooldowns are choreographed and memorised and offer no real choice. Every combat mechanic in the game can be safely reduced, but every one raises the skill ceiling. CS being one of the only ones that carried actual risk was a net benefit to a lot of people. e: That said, I can imagine that encounter design will be shaken up with the change, and hopefully healer dps will be more expected. In no way do I expect honest healers are going to be magically contributing anything still, but the mid-group might see benefit. Orcs and Ostriches fucked around with this message at 19:33 on May 23, 2017 |
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May 23, 2017 19:28
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Thumbtacks posted:
Tank gently caress. edit: I have seen my typo, and elect to leave it as it is. I have made my decision, and you will respect it.
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May 23, 2017 19:30
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Fister Roboto posted:Nobody cares what your wife thinks. I agree with the wife, this will make me happier to play sch since i hated stance dancing. I also hated minuet  I am the casual, and i am coming for you. Run.
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May 23, 2017 19:32
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Hey, I might've missed someone posting it here but it looks like someone figured out what Blizzard IV is for: Umbral Hearts let you cast fire spells at their base cost rather than their doubled cost while in Astral Fire mode. Also this list of translated action now seems to include every caster role action plus some other stuff: https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comments/6cp8mg/new_skill_tooltips_translations/ If all caster dps now get the equivalent of Shroud of Saints, AND BLM gets Umbral Hearts, and Enochian never runs out naturally, then you could probably put together a preposterously long Astral Fire cycle.
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May 23, 2017 19:33
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Orcs and Ostriches posted:CS being one of the only ones that carried actual risk was a net benefit to a lot of people.
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May 23, 2017 19:34
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nuru posted:Already hearing from WHMs about how the cleric change will relegate them to the dumpster in favor of all SCH all the time. The cleric change isn't the reason why this might happen but without final balance checks in play and a proper picture of what everything actually does, there's nothing to go on to make claims like that. When it boils down to it, the preferred healers are the ones that will pump out the best damage and AST, which enables better DPS from everyone. There's no reason to believe that will or won't be SCH or WHM.
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May 23, 2017 19:35
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nuru posted:Already hearing from WHMs about how the cleric change will relegate them to the dumpster in favor of all SCH all the time. Abilities and game mechanics change but Players... Players never change.
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May 23, 2017 19:38
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All the red mage melee attacks seem to have really low potency, I wonder if they're off GCD or if we just don't know The Big Ones yet.
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May 23, 2017 19:39
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Josuke Higashikata posted:The cleric change isn't the reason why this might happen but without final balance checks in play and a proper picture of what everything actually does, there's nothing to go on to make claims like that. Even then people are still forgetting that 'best for speedruns' doesn't necessarily mean 'best for new content.' If White Mage's new abilities give extra safety and protection that will be a great boon when people are learning new mechanics or taking on whatever the new endgames are even if Scholar can do more DPS. Inevitably there is going to be a ~best in slot~ part composition but there's a significant difference between the optimal best composition and "i am worthless and dumpstered."
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May 23, 2017 19:39
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Countblanc posted:All the red mage melee attacks seem to have really low potency, I wonder if they're off GCD or if we just don't know The Big Ones yet. Dude imagine two black mages opening on a boss, but one stays in umbral ice just a little longer than the other so that they can toss the other a quick mana shift, and then by the time the second guy is at the end of his super-extended astral fire cycle the first guy has entered umbral and can toss his own mana shift back over.
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May 23, 2017 19:41
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Countblanc posted:All the red mage melee attacks seem to have really low potency, I wonder if they're off GCD or if we just don't know The Big Ones yet. That doesn't look like the full ability list. I imagine there's something else at play rather than a 130 potency gap closer. I thought I saw an gap creator ability too, so there might be just more combo work at play.
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May 23, 2017 19:42
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Thumbtacks posted:
NICE. Should've been this way at launch, but at least they corrected it.
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