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Solkanar512 posted:And yet you think your issues with the police are so trivial that you have the luxury of forming a circular firing squad? That's loving stupid. Dude, you think the solution to state oppression by the police is watching a Destiny steam with a bunch of cops.
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May 23, 2017 16:46
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DevNull posted:Keep in mind that Erica also spend the last year complaining about bernie bros. Anyone that disagrees with her is a bernie bro. https://twitter.com/ericacbarnett/status/867050964368236544
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May 23, 2017 17:16
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DevNull posted:Anyone that disagrees with her is a bernie bro. Well, at least one person is.
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May 23, 2017 17:42
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I have no idea who will win Seattle mayor. Oliver seems like a long shot, considering she hasn't raised much money. McGinn has name recognition, but also lost to Murray last time around, and I feel people will unfairly blame him for Bertha's bullshit. Hasegawa will probably be the front runner and get all the endorsements / campaign contributions. He seems alright, but I'd definitely prefer Oliver.
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May 23, 2017 18:03
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seiferguy posted:I have no idea who will win Seattle mayor. Oliver seems like a long shot, considering she hasn't raised much money. McGinn has name recognition, but also lost to Murray last time around, and I feel people will unfairly blame him for Bertha's bullshit. Hasegawa will probably be the front runner and get all the endorsements / campaign contributions. He seems alright, but I'd definitely prefer Oliver. Oliver had raised the most money, with around $30k from small contribution. Then Jenny Durkan announced and raised $100k in under a week. Oliver has a shot, because a bunch of groups are getting behind her and are putting in a ton of ground work for her. Socialist Alternative helped gathered signatures to waive her filing fee, and will be door knocking in the future. If the DSA backs her and put in some work, it could really swing things. I think they are voting to endorse a candidate for mayor on May 31 or June 1.
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May 23, 2017 18:14
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Solkanar512 posted:Maybe Sawant shouldn't have tried to speak for Boeing machinists and engineers when she doesn't know the first thing about what they do or how their business works. lol I love that this still comes up
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May 23, 2017 18:17
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Teabag Dome Scandal posted:lol I love that this still comes up All of those idiot white men probably already hate her for not allowing a third giant sports arena in SODO. Even some liberal leaning friends of mine (including a Boeing mechanic!) hate pretty much any of the people (women) who stood in the way of getting a basketball team back. loving morons.
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May 23, 2017 19:33
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DevNull posted:Dude, you think the solution to state oppression by the police is watching a Destiny steam with a bunch of cops. Quote where I said that a Destiny stream was the complete and total solution of cops murdering people of color. Again, it's baffling to me that you think we have the luxury of a circular firing squad when it comes to these issues. Teabag Dome Scandal posted:lol I love that this still comes up DrNutt posted:All of those idiot white men probably already hate her for not allowing a third giant sports arena in SODO. Even some liberal leaning friends of mine (including a Boeing mechanic!) hate pretty much any of the people (women) who stood in the way of getting a basketball team back. loving morons. I don't understand why it's so hard for folks to understand that you don't speak on behalf of people you don't represent. That's rule one of being a good ally - you don't speak over people and you don't speak for people when you clearly don't understand what's going on. It doesn't matter if you're talking about civil rights, labor rights, tax policy or whatever. Sawant is just fine when she's talking about the minimum wage increases or support for the homeless but not when she's telling mechanics and engineers to just make planes on our own or convert the factory to making buses. And I get that nuance is difficult for you guys, but you can criticize her for that, support her for increasing the minimum wage or supporting the homeless and decry rear end in a top hat misogynists all at the same time.
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May 23, 2017 20:05
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Solkanar512 posted:Quote where I said that a Destiny stream was the complete and total solution of cops murdering people of color. Again, it's baffling to me that you think we have the luxury of a circular firing squad when it comes to these issues.
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May 23, 2017 20:08
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anthonypants posted:Did she really tell them to turn their swords into ploughshares? I can't confirm it, but I wouldn't doubt it in the slightest. I guess she isn't qualified on suggesting that workers should seize the means of production though.
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May 23, 2017 20:11
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Sawant's statement about workers being able to retool the factory for buses (or whatever) is wrong, but the core tenant of what she was thinking was right. Boeing has been slowly loving over its workers and taxpayers for some time. Both by union busting, corporate welfare, and automation. I would not be surprised to see the 787 line be moved 100% to South Carolina in 5 years or less. Workers in South Carolina are also realizing that the honeymoon is over, since they're realizing their pay sucks, and Boeing can get rid of people more easily with no union protection (although they'll refuse unionizing).
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May 23, 2017 20:26
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The Unlife Aquatic posted:Liberals will always sell out the left to move further right, because in the end they're more concerned with greasing the wheels of capitalism and respectability politics than helping people. I can take a fox, wolves hunt in packs and eat foxes as well so maybe me and the fox can work a deal. I feel like your metaphor needs some work.
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May 23, 2017 20:46
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I felt the SoDo Arena deal was fine, much better than the stupid Key Arena remodel idea which wants much more city money to gently caress up the area's traffic even more.
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May 23, 2017 20:59
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anthonypants posted:Did she really tell them to turn their swords into ploughshares? I love that just mentioning it got an immediate meltdown. You can't roll your eyes hard enough at people who can only pull this out of their pocket as some sort of legitimate critique of her and it happens every loving time. Trying to co-opt being an ally is pretty new and pretty gross though. Engineers are truly the most oppressed class. Teabag Dome Scandal fucked around with this message at 21:07 on May 23, 2017 |
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May 23, 2017 21:04
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Teabag Dome Scandal posted:I love that just mentioning it got an immediate meltdown. You can't roll your eyes hard enough at people who can only pull this out of their pocket as some sort of legitimate critique of her and it happens every loving time. Trying to co-opt being an ally is pretty new and pretty gross though. Engineers are truly the most oppressed class. You know, it's okay to like someone/something and still think they did a dumb thing.
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May 23, 2017 21:18
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Teabag Dome Scandal posted:I love that just mentioning it got an immediate meltdown. You can't roll your eyes hard enough at people who can only pull this out of their pocket as some sort of legitimate critique of her and it happens every loving time. Trying to co-opt being an ally is pretty new and pretty gross though. Engineers are truly the most oppressed class. So pointing out that she said a dumb thing, was great in other areas and didn't deserve the misogynistic rants thrown at her over the stadium now classifies as "having a meltdown"? Had she bothered to actual speak to someone who turns a wrench on an airplane, she'd learn very quickly that there are little things called "production certificates" that would kill any plan she had. The only co-opting in this situation was on her, not anyone else. anthonypants posted:Did she really tell them to turn their swords into ploughshares? Here's the quote for you (the rest of the conclusions by Yglesias are poo poo because he doesn't understand aerospace either). quote:“The only response we can have if Boeing executives do not agree to keep the plant here is for the machinists to say the machines are here, the workers are here, we will do the job, we don't need the executives. The executives don’t do the work, the machinists do,” she said. So not only does she not understand that the main product out of the factories in Everett and Renton are civilian aircraft, she also doesn't understand the aerospace is a highly regulated industry and the minute the workers just "take over" (somehow after subduing the armed guards I guess?) the FAA would pull their production certificates and you wouldn't be able to build or sell any aircraft. Any employee would be able to tell you this.
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May 23, 2017 21:37
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Well, that's why they would be building buses.
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May 23, 2017 21:50
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I'm sure making busses will keep all those workers employed and making a living wage. (it was a stupid thing to say by a good politician)
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May 23, 2017 21:52
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Solkanar512 posted:So pointing out that she said a dumb thing, was great in other areas and didn't deserve the misogynistic rants thrown at her over the stadium now classifies as "having a meltdown"? Ongoing meltdown at this point. But please continue bringing it up in the future as a betrayal of potential allies.
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May 23, 2017 22:17
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She needs more allies who DO know what they are talking about. Pretty easy solution.
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May 24, 2017 01:22
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Teabag Dome Scandal posted:Ongoing meltdown at this point. But please continue bringing it up in the future as a betrayal of potential allies. Screaming about meltdowns isn't going to help the loving cause my friend.
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May 24, 2017 01:29
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Solkanar512 posted:Screaming about meltdowns isn't going to help the loving cause my friend. Neither are you, which is kinda the broader point here.
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May 24, 2017 01:35
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Solkanar512 posted:So pointing out that she said a dumb thing, was great in other areas and didn't deserve the misogynistic rants thrown at her over the stadium now classifies as "having a meltdown"? Had she bothered to actual speak to someone who turns a wrench on an airplane, she'd learn very quickly that there are little things called "production certificates" that would kill any plan she had. The only co-opting in this situation was on her, not anyone else. I think you are beginning to understand how radical of change is needed for society. Also, understanding how the bureaucracy will be a road block is an important lesson to learn from previous revolutions. The armed guards are another important aspect. Some of them might side with the workers, other won't. Pretty much all of these are basic steps in a Marxist/Leninist style revolution.
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May 24, 2017 01:56
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I guess there is a racist professor at Evergreen who thinks that he should be able to be racist because he's a 'scientist' and a bunch of students got arrested trying to block him in his office or something today. http://www.afropunk.com/profiles/blogs/urgent-olympia-wa-students-reportedly-attacked-by-police-for quote:At Evergreen State College, a Day Of Absence was supposed to be an intentional day of caucusing to discuss intersectional issues organized by the school’s Director First Peoples Multicultural Advising Services, Rashida N. Love. A normal practice on campus for students, teachers, and staff of color, Love sent a detailed email to staff and faculty alerting them of the upcoming event, its intentions, and sign-up information for those choosing to participate. Doorknob Slobber fucked around with this message at 05:56 on May 24, 2017 |
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May 24, 2017 05:54
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You guys make it sound like boeing workers pretty much have to eat poo poo.
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May 24, 2017 05:56
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Freakazoid_ posted:You guys make it sound like boeing workers pretty much have to eat poo poo. We must crush the workers to help them, Comrade.
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May 24, 2017 07:40
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Freakazoid_ posted:You guys make it sound like boeing workers pretty much have to eat poo poo. I didn't realize it was us that hired armed guards to keep the workers in line.
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May 24, 2017 15:26
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Freakazoid_ posted:You guys make it sound like boeing workers pretty much have to eat poo poo. Theres a generational difference between older employees and new ones. Older employees talk about how great a company it is because they were treated well, are going to retire with a nice pension, etc. And younger employees are disillusioned with the company since they've seen the company attempt to strip away the benefits and try to move the work elsewhere. The machinists probably are more screwed because there's still not a lot of other manufacturing places up in the area. Office workers are usually free to leave for Microsoft or Amazon for higher pay, which is a trend that Boeing is failing to handle.
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May 24, 2017 16:01
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seiferguy posted:Theres a generational difference between older employees and new ones. Older employees talk about how great a company it is because they were treated well, are going to retire with a nice pension, etc. And younger employees are disillusioned with the company since they've seen the company attempt to strip away the benefits and try to move the work elsewhere. Before we get any further, can you provide proof of employment at Boeing? It sounds like you're trying to help by possibly being an ally and I need to know you aren't speaking over the engineers and machinists.
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May 24, 2017 16:22
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I get that you're joking but he's 110% spot on with his assessment.
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May 24, 2017 16:47
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seiferguy posted:The machinists probably are more screwed because there's still not a lot of other manufacturing places up in the area. Office workers are usually free to leave for Microsoft or Amazon for higher pay, which is a trend that Boeing is failing to handle. The machinists are getting screwed, but there will be jobs in the area. One of Boeing's strategies has been to outsource labor-intensive work to local subcontractors who, coincidentally, aren't IAM. So, the jobs will still exist - just with greatly reduced pay and benefits. This was a huge factor in all the 787 delays. Boeing corporate leadership treats manufacturing as a very expensive black box, and has a fiery hatred for unions. And, for all the talk about how the 787 is the composite plane of the future, lots of that composite work is done by people laying sheets of carbon fiber cloth out by hand. Boeing leadership bought all kinds of ridiculous promises from subcontractors - "we'll sell you this part for 20% less than your cost to build it, and deliver faster, too," based mostly on anti-union magical thinking. When all those promises fell apart, Boeing was way behind schedule and had to give away billions of dollars worth of free manufacturing R&D to the companies that screwed them, and convert an entire plant to bail out terminal fuckup contractors at Boeing's own expense. It's probably the second dumbest thing they've done out of pure anti-union spite. You can bet they'll try again. You could sell magic union-repelling rocks to Boeing, at a million dollars a pop. (The very dumbest will always be when they tried to gently caress over the engineers' union, under the assumption that a little engineering work stoppage wouldn't be too bad, without stopping to think that all the people who could legally sign off on finished planes for delivery were union. Massive unforced error that cost a staggering amount of money, got a struggling union to develop a sense of solidarity - and white collar picket lines are both cool and hilarious)
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May 24, 2017 17:58
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seiferguy posted:Theres a generational difference between older employees and new ones. Older employees talk about how great a company it is because they were treated well, are going to retire with a nice pension, etc. And younger employees are disillusioned with the company since they've seen the company attempt to strip away the benefits and try to move the work elsewhere. This is exactly what I notice from my dad (machinist 40 years) compared to some guys I went to highschool with who got jobs at Boeing in the last 5, for guys not going to college its still a great job just not nearly as good as it used to be. From what I can tell, or at least what has been told to me by countless old farts is Boeing went downhill once the acquired McDonnell Douglas and brought in a bunch of new lovely managers who brought their bad management practices with them. Before then a fair number of the managers and even executives etc. we're guys who worked there way up in the company and that changed a fair bit for ~modern~ Boeing. Jack2142 fucked around with this message at 18:28 on May 24, 2017 |
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May 24, 2017 18:17
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Jack2142 posted:This is exactly what I notice from my dad (machinist 40 years) compared to some guys I went to highschool with who got jobs at Boeing in the last 5, for guys not going to college its still a great job just not nearly as good as it used to be. From what I can tell, or at least what has been told to me by countless old farts is Boeing went downhill once the acquired McDonnell Douglas and brought in a bunch of new lovely managers who brought their bad management practices with them. Before then a fair number of the managers and even executives etc. we're guys who worked there way up in the company and that changed a fair bit for ~modern~ Boeing. Yup, the company has to keep squeezing workers to increase their profit margin just a little bit more. In the mean time, the CEO is pulling in $15 million a year. I wonder if the CEO is on the side of the workers, or the side of the share holders?
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May 24, 2017 18:30
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DevNull posted:Yup, the company has to keep squeezing workers to increase their profit margin just a little bit more. In the mean time, the CEO is pulling in $15 million a year. I wonder if the CEO is on the side of the workers, or the side of the share holders? Of course he is on the side of the shareholders. Boeing is run terribly and the management is dysfunctional as hell, according to my brother. But it is still well paid work and I hope the union can continue to hold out under Boeing's lovely behavior.
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May 24, 2017 18:34
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DrNutt posted:All of those idiot white men probably already hate her for not allowing a third giant sports arena in SODO. Whole gently caress load of maritime money / the port didn't want that stadium there either. It was never going to happen.
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May 25, 2017 06:29
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Peachfart posted:Of course he is on the side of the shareholders. Boeing is run terribly and the management is dysfunctional as hell, according to my brother. Don't forget spending $12+ billion on loving stock buybacks.
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May 25, 2017 11:18
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BrandorKP posted:Whole gently caress load of maritime money / the port didn't want that stadium there either. It was never going to happen. Try telling that to the idiots that prioritize having a basketball team over everything else.
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May 25, 2017 18:49
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Christ. http://katu.com/news/local/large-police-response-at-hollywood-transit-center loving magas.
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May 27, 2017 03:23
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https://twitter.com/psuvanguard/status/868276744830177281
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May 27, 2017 04:15
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My GF works Campus Safety dispatch there. I showed her that tweet and she's surprised because nothing like that has happened before but unsurprised because things have been steadily escalating. At this rate there'll be a Beer Hall Putsch by next summer.
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May 27, 2017 04:45
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