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Did I say the action wasn't clear? It's just tooooo much poo poo going on. Especially in the finale. And BVS is so much worse. It's just noise and lights endlessly going off. I much preferred every action scene Snyder has done up until then. Even that insane Sucker Punch train battle.
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Jun 12, 2017 20:57
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CelticPredator posted:It is not very good. It's the worst action Snyder has ever done. *overlays Chariots of Fire song over a Friskies cat food commercial* "drat. That's...that's just the best action scene I've ever seen. It's beautiful." *bunches of floofy kittens clumsily slo-mo slide into a wall* "...pure visual storytelling." *sheds a tear at revelation of pure art*
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Jun 12, 2017 20:57
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I dunno, if they gave me enough to care about that cat, that scene could be rad.
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Jun 12, 2017 20:59
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CelticPredator posted:Did I say the action wasn't clear? It's just tooooo much poo poo going on. Especially in the finale. And BVS is so much worse. It's just noise and lights endlessly going off. I guess you didn't, but I couldn't tell what else "a visual nightmare of CGI" was supposed to be citing as a negative. Like, in that Faora gif there's not a shitload of distracting stuff in the background that makes the action hard to follow, or a shitload of distracting stuff in the foreground that makes the action hard to see, and the line of action itself is a pretty straightforward left-to-right thing whose timing effectively communicates the central character's speed and power... so what's the big deal? Surely you're not making the "ugh, so much CGI, what about PRACTICAL EFFECTS" complaint in a movie about guys who punch through airplanes.
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Jun 12, 2017 21:02
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khwarezm posted:
A slight quibble, Kaiser wanted to prevent Britain from entering the war and to a smaller extent Russia (even that was ambigious). But the dude was all for Serbia being attacked by Austria, to the point of promising to back them with military forces to forestall Russia. And his gallivanting, chauvinisitic efforts to make Germany a "great nation" set the stage for WWI. But also yeah the military brass and the German elite were hungry for a battle after militarization of the past decades. As far as the film, full of great parts that I'm enjoying remembering currently. Didn't cohere perfectly though which makes sense with the hasty last minute changes, but extremely enjoyable and I'm sure I'll be catching it plenty of times in the future.
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Jun 12, 2017 21:10
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Ferrinus posted:I guess you didn't, but I couldn't tell what else "a visual nightmare of CGI" was supposed to be citing as a negative. Like, in that Faora gif there's not a shitload of distracting stuff in the background that makes the action hard to follow, or a shitload of distracting stuff in the foreground that makes the action hard to see, and the line of action itself is a pretty straightforward left-to-right thing whose timing effectively communicates the central character's speed and power... so what's the big deal? It's competently put together, but when you've seen, say, Jackie Chan films that feature action sequences that appear more superhuman than a film about superhumans, the director is doing something wrong. Everything about the fight scenes in MoS and BvS were just so pedestrian. He tried to make animated style fight scenes translate to live action, and failed.
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Jun 12, 2017 21:26
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Davros1 posted:It's competently put together, but when you've seen, say, Jackie Chan films that feature action sequences that appear more superhuman than a film about superhumans, the director is doing something wrong. Everything about the fight scenes in MoS and BvS were just so pedestrian. He tried to make animated style fight scenes translate to live action, and failed. What I'm not seeing here is reference to any specific mistake or deficiency.
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Jun 12, 2017 21:28
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Ferrinus posted:What I'm not seeing here is reference to any specific mistake or deficiency. Well now, they're supposed to be more "superhuman" than Jackie Chan fight scenes. If Jackie Chan is more superhuman, then there is something wrong. I don't understand it either.
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Jun 12, 2017 21:37
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Davros1 posted:It's competently put together, but when you've seen, say, Jackie Chan films that feature action sequences that appear more superhuman than a film about superhumans, the director is doing something wrong. Either that, or Man of Steel and BvS are about humanizing the superhuman, and apparently wildly successful at it.
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Jun 12, 2017 21:42
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I like how Tony Zhou made one video essay contrasting Hong Kong and U.S. action cinema - which didn't even reference Snyder at all - but now it's just a feather in the cap 'explaining why something is bad,' rather than clarifying what one has to do with the other.
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Jun 12, 2017 21:50
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K. Waste posted:I like how Tony Zhou made one video essay contrasting Hong Kong and U.S. action cinema - which didn't even reference Snyder at all - but now it's just a feather in the cap 'explaining why something is bad,' rather than clarifying what one has to do with the other. Yeah. One of the key points in that video is about how Jackie Chan keeps action and reaction in the same shot. Which have made previous instances of people trying to apply that video to Snyder as criticism pretty funny, considering the guy's love for long tracking shots of continuous action.
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Jun 12, 2017 21:53
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Ferrinus posted:What I'm not seeing here is reference to any specific mistake or deficiency.
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Jun 12, 2017 21:58
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Sir Kodiak posted:Yeah. One of the key points in that video is about how Jackie Chan keeps action and reaction in the same shot. Which have made previous instances of people trying to apply that video to Snyder as criticism pretty funny, considering the guy's love for long tracking shots of continuous action. Don't forget wide angle lenses! Obviously, there are both aesthetic and thematic deviations that Zhou's essay supports. For instance: Chan combines production design with choreography so that his character, no matter how invulnerable, always appears to be the underdog. The closest Snyder has gotten to an underdog story is Sucker Punch.
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Jun 12, 2017 22:07
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I loving love Hong Kong action movies, but every action scene does not need to look like that. And without dudes like Sammy Hung and Yuen Biao and Donnie Yen playing the main characters getting that style of filming is almost impossible because you've got to cut often and use weird angles to obscure that it's stunt men doing everything and not actors because the actors can't do that poo poo.
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Jun 12, 2017 22:28
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Also, you probably can't do 450 takes of a stunt to get it so that it looks perfect.
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Jun 12, 2017 22:29
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Martman posted:"Pedestrian" + "failed" = "it's just bad" It's just so... boring. So generic. So unengaging. Completely uninspired. Totally amateurish. Entirely humdrum. Just boilerplate. Simply d(continues for several hours)
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Jun 12, 2017 22:29
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Fokker Eindeckers in use at the end of 1918? LoL okay. (Kidding. Movie rules, but only after they leave the island).
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Jun 12, 2017 22:59
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Ferrinus posted:It's just so... boring. So generic. So unengaging. Completely uninspired. Totally amateurish. Entirely humdrum. Just boilerplate. Simply d(continues for several hours) The "CGI NightmareTM" thing also roughly describes 90+% of all super hero films. Heroes fight villains, one or both are CG or else/also there is heavy use of CG in creating the effects, movie ends. I was going to start listing the Marvel/Sony/Fox examples but stopped at like 10 in a row. I don't understand singling out DC movies except that of course we have to, and some vague thing about "caring about the characters" negating the fact that the exact complaints happen everywhere. Guy A. Person fucked around with this message at 23:24 on Jun 12, 2017 |
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Jun 12, 2017 23:22
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To be fair, nearly every super hero/comic book movie ends with a really terrible fight. WW almost surpassed that but made the error of having Ares change outfits and become mundane. I got the point of the imagery, I just didn't like it nearly as much as I wanted to.
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Jun 12, 2017 23:25
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The only reason I don't apply the same criticisms to Guardians 2 is simply that the character work was so strong to me, that while it was super messy and kind of way over the top, I was invested in Peter and his father. That's the only reason why I give most big bombastic CGI filled insane endings a pass. And that's why, while the final battle to Wonder Woman was real lame, I still felt a small tinge of something because she was a fantastic character.
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Jun 12, 2017 23:33
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It might be difficult to portray Supermans raw power with practical effects.
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Jun 12, 2017 23:39
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Davros1 posted:It's competently put together, but when you've seen, say, Jackie Chan films that feature action sequences that appear more superhuman than a film about superhumans, the director is doing something wrong. Everything about the fight scenes in MoS and BvS were just so pedestrian. He tried to make animated style fight scenes translate to live action, and failed. Supreman has never actually been a good fighter. He's always just got by on raw power. Real people like Jackie Chan have to actually develop skill to be effective. Same is true in Man of Steel, he's never learned to fight, so he just flails around while he gets beat on by real soldiers.
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Jun 12, 2017 23:44
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movie really could have done without gal gadot breaking character and delivering a ten minute monologue on the moral righteousness of settlements in gaza
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Jun 13, 2017 00:28
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R. Guyovich posted:movie really could have done without gal gadot breaking character and delivering a ten minute monologue on the moral righteousness of settlements in gaza on the contrary, this is the best part
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Jun 13, 2017 00:32
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Zack Snyder's action scenes rule, I'm not sure how anyone comes to another conclusion, especially when the competition is poo poo like Civil War. Zack Snyder made Abbie Cornish not just a plausible action hero, but pushed her hard enough in training that she could perform one of the slickest on screen reloads I've seen. Wonder Woman is a notch below that, which is fine. Snyder has been doing elaborate action scenes in his films for 13 years now. He's had a long time to polish his style. Patty Jenkins has not. The movie was really good. I wish it had been a little longer, since everything up to the ball feels a bit rushed, since there's just so much to get through. Same issue as Captain America. I also like that immediately after we're told the armistice was engineered to be untenable by a man masquerading as a British diplomat, we smash cut to people waving British flags. Nationalism is alive and well, and that's Ares ultimate victory.
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Jun 13, 2017 00:37
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SAMEER: I wanted to be an actor, but I'm the wrong color. GAL GADOT: *tugs collar*
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Jun 13, 2017 00:59
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ungulateman posted:on the contrary, this is the best part it wasn't as exciting as that scene where scarlett johansson was shilling for sodastream
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Jun 13, 2017 01:25
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R. Guyovich posted:movie really could have done without gal gadot breaking character and delivering a ten minute monologue on the moral righteousness of settlements in gaza What?
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Jun 13, 2017 02:06
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Well, the amazons of Themiscyra are only earth's second most moral military.
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Jun 13, 2017 02:20
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Let's not derail this thread with an argument over Israel/Palestine.
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Jun 13, 2017 02:34
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Snowman_McK posted:What? Something something bringing political rhetoric into film, can't separate art from the artist, etc., etc. Charlz Guybon posted:Let's not derail this thread with an argument over Israel/Palestine. Yes, let's not do this please.
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Jun 13, 2017 02:35
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That post was funny you guys are numbnuts
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Jun 13, 2017 05:23
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This movie was okay at best.
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Jun 13, 2017 06:14
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Israel has done nothing wrong
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Jun 13, 2017 08:41
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R. Guyovich posted:movie really could have done without gal gadot breaking character and delivering a ten minute monologue on the moral righteousness of settlements in gaza On 2nd thought the Ancient Greeks were all about planting settler colonies in already populated areas, so maybe she'd be down with it. Magna Graecia did nothing wrong!
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Jun 13, 2017 09:43
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LMAO at people looking at the scene where Ares is blatantly manipulating the Lasso of Truth with his god powers and assuming he's telling the truth because he says so I think ending the film after ludendorf's death would make a much better story but I guess that wouldn't be morally clear and heroic enough Shoutouts to the scene where Wonder Woman ignores the World Engine to save Metropolis from Zod and then everyone dies though
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Jun 13, 2017 12:18
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Phylodox posted:I'm assuming you're talking about Gal Gadot's boobs. Aside from being a pretty creepy thing to say, she's not particularly flat-chested. Unless you're comparing her to how, like, Frank Cho draws Wonder Woman, but his style is almost entirely cheesecake. Gadot has ended up talking about her boobs on so many of the pressers she's been doing https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QA8pQMJrcNY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4aUSzq_EA1A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w1ziZIC6uwA Boob trolls 
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Jun 13, 2017 12:47
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Like Ghostbusters, this is merely an average movie. Gadot is not a good actress and not a good fit for WW. Gadot has no gravitas. She has three facial expressions, naive dopeyness, petulant "angry", and sad. I guess that is what you get when you cast a glorified extra from a lesser Fast and Furious movie. CGI was glaring in some places. Ares sucked completely. The General sucked and seemed to have no motivation besides "being EVILLLL". I think he even had a "bad guy laugh" moment at some point? Dr. Poison was ALMOST interesting, but they didn't do anything with her. Chris Pine was fine. His First Avengeresque sacrifice wasn't. Fight scenes, with the exception of the Dragonball Z end fight and anything to do with the sentient neon lasso, were pretty good.. I was also glad that they attempted to somewhat humanize the German soldiers at the end rather than keep them as faceless proto-Nazis that were only fit to be gunned down. It was the best movie in the Snyderverse so far, but that isn't saying much. Looking forward to Captain Marvel.
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Jun 13, 2017 20:45
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BobKnob posted:Looking forward to Captain Marvel. Yeah I can't wait for Marvel's first woman super hero after like 10 years either EDIT: wait did you mean Captain Marvel as in Shazam?? Maybe I was being pointlessly bitchy Guy A. Person fucked around with this message at 21:15 on Jun 13, 2017 |
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Jun 13, 2017 21:04
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Guy A. Person posted:EDIT: wait did you mean Captain Marvel as in Shazam?? Maybe I was being pointlessly bitchy I'm guessing MCU Captain Marvel. I've been reading Captain Marvel comics since the announcement of Brie Larson being cast, and was super excited to get into her books at the recommendation of some goons. But thus far my overall impression of the character has been lukewarm. Not a huge fan of the writing, but the art is alright. The character just doesn't affect me like Wonder Woman does. Brie Larson though  Hope the film presents Captain Marvel in a more compelling way.
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Jun 13, 2017 21:20
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