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Yo I absolutely loved the fights in that movie, felt really unique and fun. The movie hit this cool tone of serious but not. I loved the big emotional scene between Hank Pym and his daughter being ruined by Paul Rudd. The ending stuff with the step dad and mom didn't really do anything to make me like the stuff at the beginning, but the movie still owned anyway
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Jun 15, 2017 17:42
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I'm just glad that Ant-Man is one of the only Hollywood movies I can think of where the step-dad doesn't end up cut out of the family for no reason other than "Sorry, you can't be a real dad unless you are a BIOLOGICAL FATHER TO THIS EXACT CHILD no matter how much of a gently caress-up or monster his bio dad is." Every Hollywood producer must have been beaten or molested by their step-dads. Most of the time, the movies don't even try to justify it. It's just "Well, obviously you couldn't be a real father. I must leave you now."
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Jun 15, 2017 18:00
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I think 2012 is my favorite example of that.
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Jun 15, 2017 18:01
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2012 is a very good example. I also like in Liar, Liar that the "happy ending" is Jim Carrey's ex-wife stranding Max's incredibly supportive and kind step-dad in Boston and hijacking a plane. This guy also financially supported her and Max, was willing to adopt him, and put his career on hold to help Max with his hobbies and adjustment. Jim Carrey has never made his son a priority during his entire life, but his mom decides to give him a chance because "he's his real dad." The Step-Father's heinous crime? Being a psychiatrist.
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Jun 15, 2017 18:08
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:The Step-Father's heinous crime? Being a psychiatrist. Holy poo poo the step-father in the Santa Clause is also a psychiatrist. He's also not a terrible guy and while he doesn't get dunked on as hard as Elwes in Liar Liar he is still a pretty milquetoast punching bag. That is a weird trend.
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Jun 15, 2017 18:11
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:2012 is a very good example. The incredibly supportive stepdad in my friend Tim Allen's movie, can't recall the name exactly (The Father Christmas Contract?) was similarly a psychiatrist and coded as a villain for the crime of being nice and not a biological father.
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Jun 15, 2017 18:12
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Wait was Pierce Brosnan a psychiatrist in Ms Doubtfire?
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Jun 15, 2017 18:13
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The Hollywood agenda strikes again.
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Jun 15, 2017 18:14
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Happy Noodle Boy posted:The
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Jun 15, 2017 18:20
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Happy Noodle Boy posted:The Hollywood agenda strikes again. Oh it goes back way further than that. The evil stepmothers that you remember in all the classic fairy tales were originally just evil mothers in the old folk tales but when the Brothers Grimm were collecting the stories for publication they decided that this was an unacceptable reflection of good upstanding German motherhood and turned them into stepmothers. (Or so I've been told.)
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Jun 15, 2017 18:26
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Look, Cary Ewles couldn't do "the Claw" and for that he deserves to be stranded and abandoned. Simple. Also bummed about Snyder's movie being taken away and Whendonized but to be fair if he had given the studio what they asked for (a bullshit potato chip movie) then it wouldn't have happened.
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Jun 15, 2017 18:55
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:Look, Cary Ewles couldn't do "the Claw" and for that he deserves to be stranded and abandoned. Simple. Wow, harsh takes all around
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Jun 15, 2017 18:56
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:Also bummed about Snyder's movie being taken away and Whendonized but to be fair if he had given the studio what they asked for (a bullshit potato chip movie) then it wouldn't have happened. The funniest part is that there are no doubt people out there who unironically believe this.
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Jun 15, 2017 18:59
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Tezcatlipoca posted:Have you not seen Monster Squad??? If Monster Squad has taught us anything, it's that Wolfman has nards.
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Jun 15, 2017 18:59
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:Also bummed about Snyder's movie being taken away and Whendonized but to be fair if he had given the studio what they asked for (a bullshit potato chip movie) then it wouldn't have happened. I'm pretty sure the studio is not behind his daughter's death.
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Jun 15, 2017 18:59
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Didn't Whedon basically lose control over Avengers 2 because he wasn't giving Marvel the bullshit potato chip movie they wanted? At least that seems to be the way he tells it.
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Jun 15, 2017 19:00
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Schwarzwald posted:I'm pretty sure the studio is not behind his daughter's death. That would make a hell of a movie. Starring Ben Affleck as Zack Snyder
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Jun 15, 2017 19:01
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Al Borland Corp. posted:Didn't Whedon basically lose control over Avengers 2 because he wasn't giving Marvel the bullshit potato chip movie they wanted? At least that seems to be the way he tells it. No, it was the opposite. Whedon complained that Marvel was retconning some of his creative choices. He said that Marvel told him that he could do whatever he wanted, so it was upsetting to him that they let him make his movie, but are now undercutting his choices (Killing Coulson, saving all the civilians, Black Widow's romance and barren womb) after they let him make it. He was basically saying, "Why did they let me make it if they are just going to ignore it?" The only thing Marvel did with Ultron was make him cut the movie down to two and a half hours. Whedon said they told him he had total freedom and never told him what to do about Widow or Coulson, but then went and reversed/ignored those choices after he was done. Leon Trotsky 2012 fucked around with this message at 19:07 on Jun 15, 2017 |
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Jun 15, 2017 19:04
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Eh, I think Hollywood's had plenty of films about how the biological parents are bad and the adoptive parent is good. Maybe even as many as there are "stepparents are bad" movies
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Jun 15, 2017 19:06
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I don't feel like he gets to complain about Coulson since his resurrection was specifically to give his brother and sister-in-law a lead for their soon to be five season long TV show.
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Jun 15, 2017 19:08
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Schwarzwald posted:I'm pretty sure the studio is not behind his daughter's death. Of course not. Let me be more clear: if the rumors are true (and that's a huge IF) that Whedon is going to significantly overhaul Justice League and functionally retool it into a different movie with huge chunks rewritten and re-shot, then his daughter's death had little to do with that (Snyder simply would have been around to serve as producer/consultant when they took the movie away from him) As I understand it the process had already started before Snyder resigned, which means the studio didn't like Snyder's rough cut. Which means that they didn't get the Marvel-style "fizzy and fun" movie they wanted. Which, frankly, wouldn't surprise me. Snyder is an extremely serious guy and I've never thought he would be capable of aping Marvel's house style. Edit: To put it another way, "SNYDER HAD HIS CHANCE!" *eyebeams shoot out and turn everything into quips* Megaman's Jockstrap fucked around with this message at 19:15 on Jun 15, 2017 |
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Jun 15, 2017 19:09
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Al Borland Corp. posted:I don't feel like he gets to complain about Coulson since his resurrection was specifically to give his brother and sister-in-law a lead for their soon to be five season long TV show. Also, Joss Whedon co-wrote and directed the goddamn pilot of Agents of SHIELD. Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:The only thing Marvel did with Ultron was make him cut the movie down to two and a half hours. Whedon said they told him he had total freedom and never told him what to do about Widow or Coulson, but then went and reversed/ignored those choices after he was done. Coulson wasn't in (or even mentioned in) Ultron.
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Jun 15, 2017 19:15
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Timby posted:
Yes, but he was tying in his complaint that "nobody said anything" when I was making the movie and I had total creative freedom, but then they chose to undo my choice afterwards. Why let me do whatever I want if they are going to undo it? Kevin Feige said something in an interview after Ultron came out about Black Widow's romance/barren womb not being something they were really interested in keeping as part of the character going forward and never mention it in Civil War.
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Jun 15, 2017 19:21
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Agents of SHIELD is one of the better things to come out of the MCU, and they did a lot with Coulson's character, so I'm just gonna have to politely disagree with Mr. Whedon on this.
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Jun 15, 2017 19:22
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Also since Ultron they haven't shown Widow with or romantically interested in anyone else, and HE'S the one who wrote the Hulk sending himself into exile. They haven't contradicted him at all!
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Jun 15, 2017 19:27
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Al Borland Corp. posted:Also since Ultron they haven't shown Widow with or romantically interested in anyone else, and HE'S the one who wrote the Hulk sending himself into exile. They haven't contradicted him at all! The head of the film division did come out and kind of say, "Ehh... not a fan. Gonna ignore it going forward." Even if they didn't go out of their way retcon it in the movies, it's still pretty clear. He was also very salty about Coulson. Google brings up about a half dozen interviews where he says they shouldn't have brought him back, they told me it was okay to kill him, they didn't tell me they were bringing him back. He says that his only "directives from high" on Avengers 1 was that there had to be an infinity stone and an army of some kind at the end. For Avengers 2, they only things Marvel overruled him on were cutting a scene with Tom Hiddleston and making the movie no longer than 2:30. Whedon's gripe is basically, "Why did they let me do that and then take away the emotional punch of my choices afterwards?"
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Jun 15, 2017 19:31
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:Oh it goes back way further than that. The evil stepmothers that you remember in all the classic fairy tales were originally just evil mothers in the old folk tales but when the Brothers Grimm were collecting the stories for publication they decided that this was an unacceptable reflection of good upstanding German motherhood and turned them into stepmothers. (Or so I've been told.) The forest witch is also a stereotype for slavs.
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Jun 15, 2017 19:38
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Steve Yun posted:Eh, I think Hollywood's had plenty of films about how the biological parents are bad and the adoptive parent is good. Maybe even as many as there are "stepparents are bad" movies Feel free to name some.
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Jun 15, 2017 19:54
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Whedon's gripe is basically, "Why did they let me do that and then take away the emotional punch of my choices afterwards?" I was okay with it because bringing Coulson back wasn't done lightly. It was a major arc for his character in the first and second seasons, and had repercussions that effected the whole course of the show. It wasn't like they just said, "Nope, that was a fake-out, he never died!" Also, it's comics. If you bank on anyone staying dead forever, you're just asking to be disappointed.
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Jun 15, 2017 19:57
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Phylodox posted:I was okay with it because bringing Coulson back wasn't done lightly. It was a major arc for his character in the first and second seasons, and had repercussions that effected the whole course of the show. It wasn't like they just said, "Nope, that was a fake-out, he never died!" I'm fine with them bringing Coulson back. I don't agree with Whedon on Coulson or the Widow thing. I was just explaining his reasoning. It is kind of funny that apparently Marvel gave him essentially unlimited creative freedom and he was upset about it.
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Jun 15, 2017 19:59
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Phylodox posted:Agents of SHIELD is one of the better things to come out of the MCU, It's an incredibly low bar so this is entirely believable.
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Jun 15, 2017 20:07
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:He says that his only "directives from high" on Avengers 1 was that there had to be an infinity stone and an army of some kind at the end. I think the popularity of Civil War's airport battle and MoS' Smallville scenes suggests that it's easier to deliver a memorable battle with a smaller number of combatants vs the endings of Avengers 1+2. Like if Loki had shown up with 6 wacky warriors that had distinct looks and abilities for the heroes to pair off against, instead of the bug guys. Hopefully Thanos just has a few right-hand men types instead of more drones, like his Black Guild in the comics or whatever.
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Jun 15, 2017 20:08
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Whedon complained that Marvel was retconning some of his creative choices. He said that Marvel told him that he could do whatever he wanted, so it was upsetting to him that they let him make his movie, but are now undercutting his choices (Killing Coulson, saving all the civilians, Black Widow's romance and barren womb) after they let him make it. Wait, did they retcon Black Widow not being able to have kids? I feel like I missed something.
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Jun 15, 2017 20:09
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thrawn527 posted:Wait, did they retcon Black Widow not being able to have kids? I feel like I missed something. Kevin Feige was asked about it and basically said that Marvel doesn't consider that a defining aspect of her character and that her romance with The Hulk and barren womb weren't things they were going to be focusing on going forward.
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Jun 15, 2017 20:12
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Phylodox posted:Agents of SHIELD is one of the better things to come out of the MCU  Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:For Avengers 2, they only things Marvel overruled him on were cutting a scene with Tom Hiddleston and making the movie no longer than 2:30. Good for Marvel, because there are very few reasons for a movie to be two and a half hours long (or longer), and I don't think an Avengers movie qualifies.
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Jun 15, 2017 20:13
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Electromax posted:I think the popularity of Civil War's airport battle and MoS' Smallville scenes suggests that it's easier to deliver a memorable battle with a smaller number of combatants vs the endings of Avengers 1+2. Like if Loki had shown up with 6 wacky warriors that had distinct looks and abilities for the heroes to pair off against, instead of the bug guys. Hopefully Thanos just has a few right-hand men types instead of more drones, like his Black Guild in the comics or whatever. Not sure if this is a spoiler or not, but they already confirmed that the Black Order are in Infinity War. They are using the cast from the recent comic run and changing their origins to be his kids.
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Jun 15, 2017 20:14
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Phylodox posted:I was okay with it because bringing Coulson back wasn't done lightly. Also, the idea that Coulson dying was some meaningful emotional punch is a bit laughable.
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Jun 15, 2017 20:16
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Kevin Feige was asked about it and basically said that Marvel doesn't consider that a defining aspect of her character and that her romance with The Hulk and barren womb weren't things they were going to be focusing on going forward. Eh, not focusing on it doesn't really mean they're retconning it. The Hulk romance, sure, I guess, but only if she has kids are they retconning the can't have kids part. thrawn527 fucked around with this message at 20:18 on Jun 15, 2017 |
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Jun 15, 2017 20:16
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Sir Kodiak posted:Also, the idea that Coulson dying was some meaningful emotional punch is a bit laughable. He was cool.
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Jun 15, 2017 20:18
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CelticPredator posted:He was cool. Was he, though? thrawn527 posted:Eh, not focusing on it doesn't really mean they're retconning it. The Hulk romance, sure, I guess, but only if she has kids are they retconning the can't have kids part. If it never comes up again, they're arguably retconning that it was something that's important to her character, though that may be splitting hairs.
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Jun 15, 2017 20:21
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